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Red Sox/MLB 2012 Thread Part XX-Time for Rebuilding

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Old
12-01-2012, 03:40 PM
  #676
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Originally Posted by UNB Bruins Fan View Post
Any interest in adding Reynolds...he was non-tendered by Baltimore...would bring some power (and a ton of strikeouts) to the line-up...and by all accounts he plays decent D at first.
Yes, but beyond his power, he doesn't offer much offensively. I personally would be focused on guys that are willing to take a 1-2 year deal, and from there, try to pick the most talented guys. A platoon of him and Pena would be pretty productive at first. Not average wise, but that'd be a power bat every day, no matter who is starting.

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12-01-2012, 04:44 PM
  #677
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Reynolds would be like two salty's in the line-up not bad, when he gets hot he can be the best power hitter for 2 weeks then strikout for two weeks, but I would like his swing in fenway.

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12-01-2012, 06:38 PM
  #678
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john lannan and jair jurrjens?

if lannan is good, he's ******.

and they might as well just send jurrjens a sack of money to be injured. ever since he reinjured his knee in 2011, he's been terrible.

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12-01-2012, 06:43 PM
  #679
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All of these options suck. They don't have the pitching to compete this year. Trade Lester for a top prospect that is close, try and be ready for 14.

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12-01-2012, 07:44 PM
  #680
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In terms of Rizzo, he was a more complete player.

Comparing Sands and Meyers to him is mute. PCL does inflate averages. But everyone saw characteristics in Rizzo that didn't negate the inflated average in the PCL.


Sands has to prove himself. But the main thing is this. Would I trade Lester for Meyers and the answer is no.

We have a comparison player and that's Sands. Meyers could be a great player. Or he can be Lastings Milledge. I'll take pitching right now over a prospect at this junction.

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12-01-2012, 08:27 PM
  #681
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alexspeier: Cherington on whether Sox would trade One of 4 identified starters: 'We're in perhaps a different situation than we've been in the past......We have to be open-minded. Lost 93 games...Building best team for 2013 that doesn't get in way of building a great team for a long time'
I like that. Hopefully Jon likes KC

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12-01-2012, 08:32 PM
  #682
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This conversation is all based on if Lester can grain his form which remains to be seen. If he can't then that trade is a no brainer and the Sox would be stupid not to explore it.

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12-01-2012, 08:47 PM
  #683
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Originally Posted by Mione134 View Post
In terms of Rizzo, he was a more complete player.

Comparing Sands and Meyers to him is mute. PCL does inflate averages. But everyone saw characteristics in Rizzo that didn't negate the inflated average in the PCL.


Sands has to prove himself. But the main thing is this. Would I trade Lester for Meyers and the answer is no.

We have a comparison player and that's Sands. Meyers could be a great player. Or he can be Lastings Milledge. I'll take pitching right now over a prospect at this junction.
Points aren't mute, they are moot.

And Sands is more likely than Myers to be Milledge....but I get it...you want our guys on the team. Just say that.

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12-01-2012, 11:13 PM
  #684
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Whoever thinks Lester is getting traded for an OF prospect is clearly not thinking straight.

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12-01-2012, 11:27 PM
  #685
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Originally Posted by Bruwinz37 View Post
Points aren't mute, they are moot.

And Sands is more likely than Myers to be Milledge....but I get it...you want our guys on the team. Just say that.
The only problem with myers is that he doesn't bring anything to the table aside from his bat. also with a high strikeout rate theres no guarantee that he won't become wily mo pena. I don't think sands is an answer either and he is more likely to bust then myers but if i was going to trade jon lester, a #2 starter who had a down year, I would want a sure thing. A player who is not just an elite offensive prospect, but also an elite defensive prospect. Myers hasn't had a true position his entire minor league career, bouncing from catcher to all the spots in the OF. I'd want a prospect who was either a high end pitching prospect or a high end CF/SS. someone like billy hamilton from Cincy, or one of the 2 big time pitchers from pitt, (cole, tallion).

I'd hate to see the red sox trade away jon lester and get someone back who doesn't have a bat that translates to MLB. at least with hamilton you are getting good defense and plus plus baserunning in the worst case scenario.

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12-01-2012, 11:30 PM
  #686
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Originally Posted by Mione134 View Post
In terms of Rizzo, he was a more complete player.

Comparing Sands and Meyers to him is mute. PCL does inflate averages. But everyone saw characteristics in Rizzo that didn't negate the inflated average in the PCL.


Sands has to prove himself. But the main thing is this. Would I trade Lester for Meyers and the answer is no.

We have a comparison player and that's Sands. Meyers could be a great player. Or he can be Lastings Milledge. I'll take pitching right now over a prospect at this junction.
That's where we differ. If it was a top pitching prospect for a top position prospect, I wouldn't make that deal. But I don't see the Red Sox competing next season and maybe the season after that. It could be 2015 before they are a true threat for the world series. At that point Lester could walk. Rather than burn the two years of his value having him pitch on your bad team, why not trade him to another team and get 6 years of value out of a top prospect that can contribute when your team is contending.

I guess my question to you is, is it Myers in particular that you don't want them to trade Lester for, or a prospect in general? Or do you not want them to trade Lester at all (aside from the obvious trades like in a deal for Felix or some other ridiculously good, but off limits player)?

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12-01-2012, 11:35 PM
  #687
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Originally Posted by Twisted Tales View Post
Whoever thinks Lester is getting traded for an OF prospect is clearly not thinking straight.
Why is that?

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12-01-2012, 11:41 PM
  #688
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http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...rting-pitcher/

Ouch!! So either they know they can't get more than 1 pitcher in Free Agency, are going to trade a position player(s) for pitching, or they are going to trade a starting pitcher. Maybe Lester will be traded?

If Lester is traded I wouldn't do it for Myers. It better be some MLB ready prospects, an OF, or a 1st baseman. I'm iffy on Myers because I have to ask myself why he is being shopped if KC won't even come close to the Playoffs for some time? Since Myers is controlled for 6 years, why doesn't KC rebuild with him?

C'mon guys what's with all the Jerry Sands hate ? I say that price was less to pay rather than giving a starting pitcher (Lester) for Myers, a player you guys are comparing with Sands. We got him in a package for a utility man (Punto), a chicken eating beer drinking out of shape pitcher (Beckett), and a power hitter that lost all his power that year (Gonzalez). Although I can't guarantee he'll be the answer for us in the OF or at 1st base, I can guarantee we'll see "The Sandman" make his debut this season

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12-01-2012, 11:51 PM
  #689
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Maybe the keep Lester people can be more condescending and dismissive.

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12-01-2012, 11:57 PM
  #690
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Originally Posted by Hazi View Post
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...rting-pitcher/

Ouch!! So either they know they can't get more than 1 pitcher in Free Agency, are going to trade a position player(s) for pitching, or they are going to trade a starting pitcher. Maybe Lester will be traded?

If Lester is traded I wouldn't do it for Myers. It better be some MLB ready prospects, an OF, or a 1st baseman. I'm iffy on Myers because I have to ask myself why he is being shopped if KC won't even come close to the Playoffs for some time? Since Myers is controlled for 6 years, why doesn't KC rebuild with him?

C'mon guys what's with all the Jerry Sands hate ? I say that price was less to pay rather than giving a starting pitcher (Lester) for Myers, a player you guys are comparing with Sands. We got him in a package for a utility man (Punto), a chicken eating beer drinking out of shape pitcher (Beckett), and a power hitter that lost all his power that year (Gonzalez). Although I can't guarantee he'll be the answer for us in the OF or at 1st base, I can guarantee we'll see "The Sandman" make his debut this season
I hope the only Sandman we see this year is Mariano shutting us down.

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12-02-2012, 12:23 AM
  #691
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Originally Posted by Hazi View Post
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...rting-pitcher/

Ouch!! So either they know they can't get more than 1 pitcher in Free Agency, are going to trade a position player(s) for pitching, or they are going to trade a starting pitcher. Maybe Lester will be traded?

If Lester is traded I wouldn't do it for Myers. It better be some MLB ready prospects, an OF, or a 1st baseman. I'm iffy on Myers because I have to ask myself why he is being shopped if KC won't even come close to the Playoffs for some time? Since Myers is controlled for 6 years, why doesn't KC rebuild with him?

C'mon guys what's with all the Jerry Sands hate ? I say that price was less to pay rather than giving a starting pitcher (Lester) for Myers, a player you guys are comparing with Sands. We got him in a package for a utility man (Punto), a chicken eating beer drinking out of shape pitcher (Beckett), and a power hitter that lost all his power that year (Gonzalez). Although I can't guarantee he'll be the answer for us in the OF or at 1st base, I can guarantee we'll see "The Sandman" make his debut this season
From what I recall, Morales was actually a very effective starter last season. Why not have him give it a shot? This doesn't mean they are going to come to spring training with 5 starters. I would hope they bring a lot of guys in, and pick the best of the bunch to head north with.

I understand wanting MLB ready prospects in one regard, that is that they are more of a sure thing, because they are already at the level they need to get be at to be successful. But in the Red Sox situation, although the uncertainty is risky, having a guy that's ready right now, is not an absolute necessity, since again, they aren't ready to compete now. As long as the prospects they are getting are ready by 2014/2015, that is perfect.

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12-02-2012, 05:55 AM
  #692
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I hope the only Sandman we see this year is Mariano shutting us down.
Don't close your mind to Jerry Sands. He's not perhaps the stud his PCL numbers suggest, but he's got the talent to break out if he can put it together at the big league level.

If we think we're not competing in 2013, I have no problem with spending the first 60 games or so finding out if we have something there. It's a better bet than Mauro Gomez.

BTW I wouldn't read too much into telling Morales to prepare to be a starter. The Red Sox like to have about 9 SP options going into Spring Training, and since Morales was a more than adequate starter last year, "putting him in the mix" in the spring fits their MO perfectly, even if all he's going to be next year in reality is an MR.

I would not be surprised if Andrew Miller and Alfredo Aceves also have been told to prepare to make starts in case the situation comes up. The team is in "keep your options open" mode.

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12-02-2012, 06:03 AM
  #693
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I hope the only Sandman we see this year is Mariano shutting us down.
So you would rather see Rivera notching another save against Boston instead of seeing Sands playing for Boston ???? Are you sure that you are a Red Sox fan ????

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12-02-2012, 07:10 AM
  #694
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hazi View Post
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...rting-pitcher/

Ouch!! So either they know they can't get more than 1 pitcher in Free Agency, are going to trade a position player(s) for pitching, or they are going to trade a starting pitcher. Maybe Lester will be traded?

If Lester is traded I wouldn't do it for Myers. It better be some MLB ready prospects, an OF, or a 1st baseman. I'm iffy on Myers because I have to ask myself why he is being shopped if KC won't even come close to the Playoffs for some time? Since Myers is controlled for 6 years, why doesn't KC rebuild with him?

C'mon guys what's with all the Jerry Sands hate ? I say that price was less to pay rather than giving a starting pitcher (Lester) for Myers, a player you guys are comparing with Sands. We got him in a package for a utility man (Punto), a chicken eating beer drinking out of shape pitcher (Beckett), and a power hitter that lost all his power that year (Gonzalez). Although I can't guarantee he'll be the answer for us in the OF or at 1st base, I can guarantee we'll see "The Sandman" make his debut this season
The current issue of Baseball America prospect report is on the AL Central and after reading the Royals overview and prospects it makes 100% sense to me why the Royals HAVE contacted Boston.

Myers accoriding to multiple scouts (not to be confused with know-it-all baseball fans like me) project him as an above average RF with a strong arm, Crazy but the comparisoins of Reddick in the field shone thru here. Does not have the quickness to play CF, third in a pinch, forget catching- he's a RF.

What he is though is a future #3 hitter in the batting order who can hit for both average and power, and projects to be a very good on base player. He is right-handed big time pull hitter. B-I-N-G-O and why the Red Sox would be interested

FROM THE ROYALS VIEW

in the 6+ years Drayton Moore has been GM they have been the WORST team in baseball developing starting pitchers and its not looking any better. He is on the HOT seat right now.

The Royals have developed a number of good young hitters and there second best prospect is a legit CF who they just paid 7 M bonus two years ago far and away the biggest ever. They also have Alex Gordon signed long term in left, and another top prospect in top group who is targeted for RF.

This makes a lot of sense when you see what each team is. Ellsbury is gone likely sooner rather than later, and Myers can play right now according to scouts.

Boston believe it or not thanks to the Dodgers has a handful of pretty good young arms- power arms, be it Doubront, Dela Rossa, Webster, Barnes, Britton, Ranaudo on and on

if the Red Sox can be patient then a Lester+ for Myers+ deal makes a lot of sense

If they are going to trade Lester or entertain it I would also explore a deal for Trumbo who already is a legit power hitter in his mid 20's....that aside, Myers is logical when you break down the organizations and just as much where the GM is in KC, and where the Red Sox are as an organization.

Farrell did slip and say KC contacted Boston

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12-02-2012, 11:42 AM
  #695
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Don't close your mind to Jerry Sands. He's not perhaps the stud his PCL numbers suggest, but he's got the talent to break out if he can put it together at the big league level.

If we think we're not competing in 2013, I have no problem with spending the first 60 games or so finding out if we have something there. It's a better bet than Mauro Gomez.

BTW I wouldn't read too much into telling Morales to prepare to be a starter. The Red Sox like to have about 9 SP options going into Spring Training, and since Morales was a more than adequate starter last year, "putting him in the mix" in the spring fits their MO perfectly, even if all he's going to be next year in reality is an MR.

I would not be surprised if Andrew Miller and Alfredo Aceves also have been told to prepare to make starts in case the situation comes up. The team is in "keep your options open" mode.
I think Cherrington will end up signing Napoli and maybe a lefty to Platoon there so I doubt he makes an appearance unless there is an injury.

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So you would rather see Rivera notching another save against Boston instead of seeing Sands playing for Boston ???? Are you sure that you are a Red Sox fan ????
Yes..they don't have the pitching to compete this year and I hope they lose as many games as possible so they can draft a stud. 2014 is the year that I would aim for to become contenders again.

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12-02-2012, 11:49 AM
  #696
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I see little to lose with getting Sands into the mix in the first 50 games or so and see if we have something. I actually doubt the Sox will finalize on Napoli unless they think he can catch 40 games and play DH for another 40.

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12-02-2012, 12:09 PM
  #697
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I see little to lose with getting Sands into the mix in the first 50 games or so and see if we have something. I actually doubt the Sox will finalize on Napoli unless they think he can catch 40 games and play DH for another 40.
If anything, I'd say it's more likely that they play Sands a lot after the first 50-60 games. Then, once it's clear (standings-wise) that they aren't for real this year, they will get him in there on a regular basis. Maybe he capitalizes, and we luck out. It's not so much that I think he won't be successful, but rather that in comparison to Myers, I don't think he's the same caliber.

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12-02-2012, 01:34 PM
  #698
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Sands and Myers? Sands is a 1B, Myers is a COF. I don't see how they're in competition.

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12-02-2012, 01:41 PM
  #699
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Don't get me wrong, if trading Lester will make us better now or in the future, I'm all for that, as long as the Sox know how to make their starting rotation better than last year's and without Lester. I think it's possible through Free Agency or whether we trade Salty or Ellsbury for pitching, but we'll see.

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12-02-2012, 01:43 PM
  #700
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I see little to lose with getting Sands into the mix in the first 50 games or so and see if we have something. I actually doubt the Sox will finalize on Napoli unless they think he can catch 40 games and play DH for another 40.
THey're really going to assume Ortiz doesn't play 40 games?Obviously injury is unpredictable, but why resign him for 13million a year to have him play 120 games.

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