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Old
11-23-2012, 03:02 AM
  #126
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Originally Posted by RedWings19405 View Post
Pretty much this, the team was in last place and sputtered out of the gate. He came up stole the job and they sit atop the division. Small sample size, sure but he had a lot of promise coming out of the WJC last year. He has done nothing but back that up. The way his teammates light up about him and their swagger with him in net is noticeable.

Also even though he hasn't given up a lot, when he has let in bad goal or had a rough couple minutes he rights himself and plays like a goalie much older than 20. His angles, movement and rebound control are all encouraging signs. Not everyone else has to believe, but Red Wings fans are rightfully excited, especially with Howard's uncertain status as far as UFA and what he will cost.
His biggest asset is his goldfish brain. He lets in a stinker and it's like he forgot about it 10 seconds later. It's such an important thing for a guy like Mrazek to have because of the style he plays he's prone to let in a stinker or 2, but he rarely if ever lets it get to him. He's similar to Hasek in his mental makeup.

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11-23-2012, 03:21 AM
  #127
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His biggest asset is his goldfish brain. He lets in a stinker and it's like he forgot about it 10 seconds later. It's such an important thing for a guy like Mrazek to have because of the style he plays he's prone to let in a stinker or 2, but he rarely if ever lets it get to him. He's similar to Hasek in his mental makeup.
Or a more recent example I think of is Pavelec. Pavelec never seems to be worried about letting in a goal he should have had and he thrives with a large workload in games. And is an incredible athlete.

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11-23-2012, 03:49 AM
  #128
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What fun would the forum be if everyone thought "well, he was drafted 141 overall and he will be lucky to be a backup in the NHL someday?"
No its much more fun to ask people why other teams didnt draft this star -with any other prospect- when he's doing well.

Much more fun.

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11-23-2012, 03:55 AM
  #129
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Or a more recent example I think of is Pavelec. Pavelec never seems to be worried about letting in a goal he should have had and he thrives with a large workload in games. And is an incredible athlete.
Comparing hasek to pavelec is not something you should be doing.

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I always felt before Jimmy Howard that DRWs were below average at drafting goalies. I always thought of Jimmy Howard as a backup at best. Now he's arguably the top 5 goalie in the NHL and All-Star.
Yeah, that must be it squirt

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11-23-2012, 04:08 AM
  #130
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Comparing hasek to pavelec is not something you should be doing.
He wasn't doing that he was offering Pavelec as a more realistic guy than Hasek for Mrazek.

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11-23-2012, 07:15 AM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Frolov 6'3 View Post
No its much more fun to ask people why other teams didnt draft this star -with any other prospect- when he's doing well.

Much more fun.
He didn't really play a lot in his draft year.

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11-23-2012, 03:12 PM
  #132
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He didn't really play a lot in his draft year.
But he was excellent for Czech at the start of that season at Hlinka Cup in front of maybe 150 NHL scouts.

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11-23-2012, 03:12 PM
  #133
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Comparing hasek to pavelec is not something you should be doing.
Ummm, did you bother to read his post. He's not even in the slightest way comparing hasek to pavelec what-so-ever. Not even sure how you could possibly come up with that idea, his post isn't even that complicated. It's so simple a 1st grader could comprehend it.

He said Mrazek's is more similar in terms of worried about letting in a goal to pavelec. In fact the poster didn't even write Hasek's name in his post which makes your comment to him even more mind boggling.

Some people's hate towards DRWs org and their prospects is just right down hilarious!

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11-23-2012, 03:22 PM
  #134
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No its much more fun to ask people why other teams didnt draft this star -with any other prospect- when he's doing well.

Much more fun.
I don't know about that.... I'm still laughing at your comment about Mrazek being a 141 overall pick which CLEARLY means "he will lucky to be in the NHL as a backup someday".

Apparently Lundqvist and Tim Thomas didn't get YOUR memo...

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11-23-2012, 04:15 PM
  #135
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He didn't really play a lot in his draft year.
He played 30 games with a 3.00 GAA and .905 SV%. Probably more important he played in the playoffs.

Where he put up in 8 games a 2.39 GAA and .928 SV%.

That is plenty to go on, although it should be pointed out he was being tracked by the Wings before he ever came over. The scouts along with Jiri Fischer that mine the Czech Republic and Slovakia knew this guy before he ever showed up in the OHL and were high on him.

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11-23-2012, 08:38 PM
  #136
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I am one who doesn't think he is done. He has improved a lot over the last year or so. The problem for him is that Mrazek has already passed him. Curiously even with this group of management the Wings have promoted some goalies. Osgood made it quite young as did Cheveldae. Howard really wasn't that great before he came up. Had he been real good I don't know that the stall tactics would have happened. Mrazek certainly doesn't look like a guy you bury in the minors for a long term. This year and next is probably all he will have to do before he is the regular backup.
For me it just feels everytime I watch Mccollum (which granted isn't very much, 4 games at most?) he seems be lacking in fundamentals that you expect most goalies to have solid and down pat by his age. You're right though, Mzraek has surpassed him because he has this "star power" headliner on him since the WJC, Mccollum never really showed that to us at any point in time.

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11-23-2012, 08:50 PM
  #137
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but at the same time, I wouldn't blame Mrazek for 2/3 goals he let in tonight and McCollum has played in front of that same D. That D hasn't done either of them many favors.

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11-23-2012, 09:42 PM
  #138
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I thought Mrazek looked 'okay' tonight...the one goal definitely wasn't his fault when that dope Brendan Smith completely screened him.

Seems like he has definitely cooled off since a hot first couple games. Save percentages of .900 SV%, .853 SV%, and .893 SV% in his last 3 starts.

The chances of him actually becoming better than Jimmy Howard are quite slim in my eyes. Not sure why Howard continually gets underrated but if you watched the Wings', especially in the 1st half of the season you'd know that he was basically the MVP of the team. He did struggle in the latter half of the year after his injury. Still I'd say he is anywhere from 8-15 as far as goalie rankings depending on if perhaps he was effected by the injury last year and wasn't just cooling off after a red hot start.

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11-23-2012, 09:50 PM
  #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RomersWorld View Post
I thought Mrazek looked 'okay' tonight...the one goal definitely wasn't his fault when that dope Brendan Smith completely screened him.

Seems like he has definitely cooled off since a hot first couple games. Save percentages of .900 SV%, .853 SV%, and .893 SV% in his last 3 starts.

The chances of him actually becoming better than Jimmy Howard are quite slim in my eyes. Not sure why Howard continually gets underrated but if you watched the Wings', especially in the 1st half of the season you'd know that he was basically the MVP of the team. He did struggle in the latter half of the year after his injury. Still I'd say he is anywhere from 8-15 as far as goalie rankings depending on if perhaps he was effected by the injury last year and wasn't just cooling off after a red hot start.
He struggled with that hand after Kesler broke his fingers. Smith did screen the goalie for two goals tonight, lucky for Wings/Griffins fans the second one was the game winner. The second and third goal weren't his fault and he stood on his head in the third after that 3rd period goal to win. He is really good at changing momentum always a great goalie trait. I personally think he will be better than Howard and that isn't a dig on Howard. It is how high I am on Mrazek, he is much stronger as far as the top of the net and a great puck handler. Jimmie has him down low and I don't expect him to pass him there.

The Griffins need to stop asking Mrazek to bail them out as much as he does. I get they are confident in him but he is facing a lot of glorious chances the last three games. Really his numbers are quite impressive considering the quality of the chances the last three games.

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11-23-2012, 10:20 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by RomersWorld View Post
I thought Mrazek looked 'okay' tonight...the one goal definitely wasn't his fault when that dope Brendan Smith completely screened him.
Lol, that "dope" is better than any prospect Chicago has by a longshot

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11-23-2012, 10:35 PM
  #141
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Lol, that "dope" is better than any prospect Chicago has by a longshot
He's probably still angry from when Smith knocked out Ben Smith cold and kicked that other Blackhawks *** in a fight. What a dope

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11-23-2012, 10:52 PM
  #142
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Lol, that "dope" is better than any prospect Chicago has by a longshot
Holy relax...just that Smith has bad defensive awareness and it constantly shows...twice tonight that resulted in two goals. And that is great but I'll take Toews and Kane over Smith .... oh wait...even though they are like the same age as Smith, they have been in the NHL for 5 seasons and won the Cup. I'd also easily take Leddy over Smith as well but even though he is 2 years younger than Smith...he is an NHLer.

And to the other guy, Smith only cheap shotted Ben Smith because Ben Smith kept embarrassing Brendan Smith in a rookie tournament. He seriously burned Brendan Smith like every time because Smith kept trying to out muscle him. Brendan Smith just seems a little "slow" to me when I watch him play. He makes bad mistakes in the d-zone all the time directly leading to goals.

Oh yeah, that fight with Shaw that everyone brings up but they never mention that the Wings' were already down to 5 defensemen. Smith won the fight over the guy he was 4 inches taller than, but Detroit was stuck with just 4 defensemen and then Kane scored and the Hawks won. Just like when he fought tonight in the 3rd period of a 3-3 game and removed himself for 5 minutes for no reason. He just does stupid things much too often and that is why he finds himself in the AHL as a 23 year old.

Not sure why anytime I bring up a Detroit prospect then like a million Wings' fans attack me like rabid dogs.


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11-23-2012, 10:59 PM
  #143
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When did this happen? Lids played all games two seasons ago; Flip this season. White missed 5 games, Franzen 6 and 7 games. All teams suffer injuries like that, many/most much worse.

Source that he was in Vezina conversation? And what point? Till All Star game, maybe but that's not big enough sample size for me. And he still played most games against one of the best D ever and top two defensive forwards
If he's talking about the period I think he's talking about, there was a point two years ago when Zetterberg (Separated Shoulder), Cleary (Separated Shoulder), Franzen (Torn ACL), Helm (Can't remember what it was, but it was minor), Filppula (Broken Wrist), Kronwall (Torn MCL), Rafalski (Flu), and Ericsson (Deep bone bruise) were all out at the same time. (I think it was for something like two weeks at least)

It happened this year as well, though Howard was out as well for most of that stretch.

And yes, Howard was one of the guys in the running for Vezina up until the All-Star game, which is when he broke his finger. Then I think he pulled his groin after that and was out for another few weeks.

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No, average starting goalie.

I'd have

Price
Quick
Rinne
Lundqvist
Halak
Schneider
Luongo
Kiprusoff
Thomas
Miller

all of those above him at this point. Then some like Ward, Hiller, Lehtonen, Smith are around wash for me.

top 10-15 goalie for me makes him avg starting goalie. We'll see next season is he better than that.
Quick/Rinne/Lundqvist are the top three without a doubt, in my opinion. You can remove Thomas as he's likely done, and honestly I don't think Schneider has done enough to be up there. (Hasn't even played a season as a starter) Miller, IMO, had a down season. I'd put him above Howard, so I agree with you there. Halak, to me, is very streaky.

I'd honestly consider putting Howard in the same group as Kipper/Luongo/Ward. Don't get me wrong, when Luongo is on his game there's almost none better, but there are a lot of times when he's not on his game.

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edit. and what Henkka pointed out. Only one season. He needs to prove himself more (to be an elite goalie). Smith had elite season too, last year, arguably Elliott too. Before last year, many thought they were not even legit starters.
Howard has had two good seasons...

And while I realize that all the "Howard is a product of Detroit's defense" fanboys will pounce on this, I believe Smith is a product of the Phoenix's system of play. Look at how Bryzgalov has done since leaving Phoenix. Look at how Smith was before he got there.

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Originally Posted by jenkins tremblay View Post
Not to continually derail a thread on Mrazek, who is quite worthy of discussion, but....


After 4 years in Grand Rapids, not many people thought Howard would crack the nhl. But he did.

After being named backup in '09, not many people thought he would become a quality starter. Calder finalist.

After having his success written off as a product of the defense in front of him, he makes the all-star team and is arguably the team mvp.

I see a pattern forming, and i wouldnt bet against JH
Hell, most people were ready to lynch him after that overseas game versus St. Louis.

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11-23-2012, 11:14 PM
  #144
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Holy relax...just that Smith has bad defensive awareness and it constantly shows...twice tonight that resulted in two goals. And that is great but I'll take Toews and Kane over Smith .... oh wait...even though they are like the same age as Smith, they have been in the NHL for 5 seasons and won the Cup. I'd also easily take Leddy over Smith as well but even though he is 2 years younger than Smith...he is an NHLer.

And to the other guy, Smith only cheap shotted Ben Smith because Ben Smith kept embarrassing Brendan Smith in a rookie tournament. He seriously burned Brendan Smith like every time because Smith kept trying to out muscle him. Brendan Smith just seems a little "slow" to me when I watch him play. He makes bad mistakes in the d-zone all the time directly leading to goals.

Oh yeah, that fight with Shaw that everyone brings up but they never mention that the Wings' were already down to 5 defensemen. Smith won the fight over the guy he was 4 inches taller than, but Detroit was stuck with just 4 defensemen and then Kane scored and the Hawks won. Just like when he fought tonight in the 3rd period of a 3-3 game and removed himself for 5 minutes for no reason. He just does stupid things much too often and that is why he finds himself in the AHL as a 23 year old.

Not sure why anytime I bring up a Detroit prospect then like a million Wings' fans attack me like rabid dogs.
would you also take Abdelkader over Saad?

I mean....he's an NHLer!

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11-24-2012, 03:26 AM
  #145
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Originally Posted by RomersWorld View Post
Holy relax...just that Smith has bad defensive awareness and it constantly shows...twice tonight that resulted in two goals. And that is great but I'll take Toews and Kane over Smith .... oh wait...even though they are like the same age as Smith, they have been in the NHL for 5 seasons and won the Cup. I'd also easily take Leddy over Smith as well but even though he is 2 years younger than Smith...he is an NHLer.

And to the other guy, Smith only cheap shotted Ben Smith because Ben Smith kept embarrassing Brendan Smith in a rookie tournament. He seriously burned Brendan Smith like every time because Smith kept trying to out muscle him. Brendan Smith just seems a little "slow" to me when I watch him play. He makes bad mistakes in the d-zone all the time directly leading to goals.

Oh yeah, that fight with Shaw that everyone brings up but they never mention that the Wings' were already down to 5 defensemen. Smith won the fight over the guy he was 4 inches taller than, but Detroit was stuck with just 4 defensemen and then Kane scored and the Hawks won. Just like when he fought tonight in the 3rd period of a 3-3 game and removed himself for 5 minutes for no reason. He just does stupid things much too often and that is why he finds himself in the AHL as a 23 year old.

Not sure why anytime I bring up a Detroit prospect then like a million Wings' fans attack me like rabid dogs.
We get it you don't like the Wings... Making stuff up doesn't help gain followers. Smith is a top prospect for a reason. You mention defensive gaffs, Leddy has yet to be a plus player in any level of pro hockey, anytime I turn on a Hawks game there is a breakaway where he looks dumb founded as he fishes the puck out of his own net.

There can be are things that aren't great about Smith, he has reckless moments in his game, but slow is really reaching. He has a ton of talent and a mean streak. Will he become the player a lot Wings fans hope for? That remains to be seen, but there is a reason talent evaluators are high on him and usually the first things out of their mouth is his speed. So you can not like him because he is a Wings player and has a hard history with the Hawks organization but try to keep your critcism logical. I don't like Morin or Beach, doesn't mean I pretend either player doesn't have gifts and they aren't near the level prospect you are running down here.

By the way that fight did lead to a loss, it was a bad time to go. Wasn't thrilled when he went tonight, more so because he needs to learn he should only trade with highend guys. Mrazek had already been run hard once and he had enough of the net drive, it was message sending exercise. If the guy doesn't want to get it handed to him by a taller person, you probably shouldn't take the first couple shots before he gets gloves off. It isn't like he picked that one Shaw went and he responded.

By the way since it seems you watched the game tonight, who was that really slow guy that bust past four people in the neutral zone to provide the game winning screen? He is 23 and in the AHL because the Wings have put him back there with options (Babcock has publicly stated he made the team two years in a row) so he wouldn't look as defensively inept as Leddy when he got to the NHL. Right now he finds himself in the AHL because there is no season, he finished last year in the NHL. Maybe we should start saying Leddy finds himself in the AHL right now too, like Smith isn't already penciled in for a role in Detroit as soon as this thing ends.

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11-24-2012, 04:46 AM
  #146
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I don't know about that.... I'm still laughing at your comment about Mrazek being a 141 overall pick which CLEARLY means "he will lucky to be in the NHL as a backup someday".

Apparently Lundqvist and Tim Thomas didn't get YOUR memo...
You are laughing ? It shouldnt get any crazier.

I'm more realistic than your 'potential star in the making'. How many elite goaltenders does the NHL really have ? Should I send you my memo of goalies who were promising but never accomplished anything ? Of course its much more fun to think we have another Lundqvist or Thomas in the making. Meanwhile I get it.

But please keep laughing and come back to me within a few years. The odds are in my favour.

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11-24-2012, 11:43 AM
  #147
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This is just gonna be too easy...

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Originally Posted by RomersWorld View Post
Not sure why anytime I bring up a Detroit prospect then like a million Wings' fans attack me like rabid dogs.
Probably because you say stupid stuff like this:

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Originally Posted by RomersWorld View Post
Holy relax...just that Smith has bad defensive awareness and it constantly shows...twice tonight that resulted in two goals. And that is great but I'll take Toews and Kane over Smith .... oh wait...even though they are like the same age as Smith, they have been in the NHL for 5 seasons and won the Cup. I'd also easily take Leddy over Smith as well but even though he is 2 years younger than Smith...he is an NHLer.
Sorry Smith didn't get drafted to a garbage team. (I'll give you credit for the Leddy trade even though Minnesota's staff doesn't have half a briain amongst them all)

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Originally Posted by RomersWorld View Post
And to the other guy, Smith only cheap shotted Ben Smith because Ben Smith kept embarrassing Brendan Smith in a rookie tournament. He seriously burned Brendan Smith like every time because Smith kept trying to out muscle him. Brendan Smith just seems a little "slow" to me when I watch him play. He makes bad mistakes in the d-zone all the time directly leading to goals.
It's cute that you think Brendan had any malicious intent. Maybe if Ben had kept his head up and hadn't flipped out once he realized what was going on he would've been fine.

Not quite as cute as the fact that you like to pretend Ben is somehow superior to Brendan, even though Brendan, the defender, has better offensive statistics than Ben, the forward, in the NHL and NCAA, and nearly as good in the AHL. That's just sad... And Ben is 24. (And yes, I'm fully aware defensive stats mean more for a defender, but if anybody described Smith as a defensive defenseman they're an idiot)

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Oh yeah, that fight with Shaw that everyone brings up but they never mention that the Wings' were already down to 5 defensemen. Smith won the fight over the guy he was 4 inches taller than, but Detroit was stuck with just 4 defensemen and then Kane scored and the Hawks won.
You have a really odd recollection of things. You make it sound like Smith went off wailing on Shaw. You're right, Shaw is four inches shorter than him, and maybe if he thought about that before he went off sucker punching Smith multiple times, he wouldn't have gotten his ass handed to him.

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Originally Posted by RomersWorld View Post
He just does stupid things much too often and that is why he finds himself in the AHL as a 23 year old.
Right, that's the reason. It's not because Detroit had guys like Lidstrom/Rafalski/Kronwall/Stuart already there.


Last edited by Wingsfan2965*: 11-24-2012 at 11:50 AM.
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11-24-2012, 12:21 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by Frolov 6'3 View Post
You are laughing ? It shouldnt get any crazier.

I'm more realistic than your 'potential star in the making'. How many elite goaltenders does the NHL really have ? Should I send you my memo of goalies who were promising but never accomplished anything ? Of course its much more fun to think we have another Lundqvist or Thomas in the making. Meanwhile I get it.

But please keep laughing and come back to me within a few years. The odds are in my favour.
It seems you may have missed the key word here.

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11-24-2012, 08:17 PM
  #149
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And now Brendan Smith is "slow" holy **** what a laugh

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11-24-2012, 08:24 PM
  #150
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Mrazek not playing tonight, needed a day off.

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