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2013 Draft: Stop winnin for MacKinnon, or Do Meth for Seth?

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05-01-2013, 02:29 PM
  #701
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So unless JR goes completely off the board, we're going to grab a solid player (likely forward), yeah? Future 1st/2nd liners?

If so, don't care who we grab of the three, so long as he doesn't go Paradis on the situation.

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05-01-2013, 02:38 PM
  #702
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Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
So unless JR goes completely off the board, we're going to grab a solid player (likely forward), yeah? Future 1st/2nd liners?

If so, don't care who we grab of the three, so long as he doesn't go Paradis on the situation.
All 3 players we are talking about project as 1st line forwards. Monahan would likely be an elite 2nd line C on the Canes.

For reference, Monahan is a much better player than Jordan Staal coming out of the Draft. He would have been top-3 last year and at least top-5 the year before.

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05-01-2013, 07:09 PM
  #703
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The thing that I love about Monahan is that he can do so many things well. Yeah, maybe he only peaks as an elite #2 center, but he is absolutely the prototype for that role. Moreso than Jordan Staal, who is more of a PF type and not the most natural center. JMO.

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05-01-2013, 11:46 PM
  #704
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If we draft Monahan, who to my limited understanding is the solid two-way forward type, is it safe to assume he'll play the 3rd line center role?

If so, where does that leave Skinner?

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05-01-2013, 11:47 PM
  #705
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Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
If we draft Monahan, who to my limited understanding is the solid two-way forward type, is it safe to assume he'll play the 3rd line center role?

If so, where does that leave Skinner?

Toronto?

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05-02-2013, 12:01 AM
  #706
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Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
If we draft Monahan, who to my limited understanding is the solid two-way forward type, is it safe to assume he'll play the 3rd line center role?

If so, where does that leave Skinner?
I would see more of a 2a-2b situation with J. Staal moving to a wing spot. His size and strength would be more of an advantage there.

Tlusty-Staal-Semin
Staal-Monahan-cheap FA or rookie
Dwyer-Skinner-Ruutu

Good depth and blend of playing styles, solid defensive conscience on all lines, and multiple faceoff options. I have Rask in mind for that second line wing. If he's not ready then put Ruutu on the second line and Nash on the third.

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05-02-2013, 12:11 AM
  #707
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This whole "Skinner at Center" experiment is a farce in my estimation. I think they realized that his crippling lack of chemistry with Jordan was short circuiting that entire line and needed an excuse to move him. He'll be back on the wing if or when we get another option that is better suited for that role.

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05-02-2013, 12:42 AM
  #708
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This whole "Skinner at Center" experiment is a farce in my estimation. I think they realized that his crippling lack of chemistry with Jordan was short circuiting that entire line and needed an excuse to move him. He'll be back on the wing if or when we get another option that is better suited for that role.
You may be right, but it sounds to me from things he has said that he feels more comfortable in the middle. Maybe it's a better natural fit for him. If nothing else, it keeps him off the boards, forces him to share the puck a little bit more and lets him use his lateral speed in both directions. It's a tough matchup for third-pair D which could be potential for some serious quick-strike capability.

I can see reasons not to do it, but if you want to build a good third scoring line, center is the logical place to start and he is far and away the best option currently.

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05-02-2013, 02:08 AM
  #709
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Skinner has chemistry with no one (except Cole)... If that doesn't change he should be moved... If he can't

1) play with Estaal
2) play with Jstaal
3) play 3rd line center

then he legitimately is not of high value to the team

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05-02-2013, 02:36 AM
  #710
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I just want to see Florida inexplicably take Monahan, and Tampa forced to pass on McKinnon because he's a center, so we can see Poile sitting at his table having this reaction:

Why would TBL pass on McKinnon just because he's a center? Yzerman has said he's drafting BPA not need.

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05-02-2013, 08:57 AM
  #711
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I think he's been a center most of his playing life, and is inevitable to be playing there. Jr said it himself multiple times during the first two years, that skinner playing wing was just get him adjusted and minimize how hard they leaned on him. They expected him to be center. Maybe they had changed their views as he's slowed down, but trying him there smacks of at least acknowledging that this was the original intent and just checking in on how realistic it is now. You can't deny his skating lends itself to the position, he's a better playmaker from there, and he very naturally went to good spaces on the ice on both ends. He's a puck hound, and that can make him a good defensive center - at least as good as required.

He's a center and was drafted as such, we're the ones who pushed him to wing. If we had let him stay in juniors and played in the minors he would've been a center all along.

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05-02-2013, 09:28 AM
  #712
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Skinner at center just makes us even more shallow at wing. I mean ridiculously shallow. One of our top prospects Victor Rask is a center too. Not to mention Nash.

Even mediocre production out of Dalpe & Boychuk should make them locks for this team, if even by default. We have noone else!!

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05-02-2013, 10:13 AM
  #713
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The guy they draft will likely be a forward so either he, Skinner or one of the Staals can move to wing if need be. Always better to have too many centers than not enough IMO.

I also honestly think Nash is better suited right now as a 4th line center as he doesn't have enough offense, but he needs to add some strength. I like his instincts as he's usually in a good spot defensively, but get's knocked off the puck too often so needs to get stronger. If there are injuries, he can then slide up as needed.

Lastly, after seeing some glipses of how effective the 2nd line can be when Jared was on it (and no, he's not the answer), I really think a big, banger with some offensive ability on the 2nd line with Staal and Ruutu would be the way to go. Incredibly hard to play against. If Welsh develops more, he might be that guy, but if not, they should look at the UFA market to fill that roll.

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05-02-2013, 11:48 AM
  #714
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Originally Posted by FlyingSquirrels View Post
Skinner at center just makes us even more shallow at wing. I mean ridiculously shallow. One of our top prospects Victor Rask is a center too. Not to mention Nash.

Even mediocre production out of Dalpe & Boychuk should make them locks for this team, if even by default. We have noone else!!
I'm sure we will see one of those two starting the season on the canes... the question is can either one of them prove they finally belong here.

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Originally Posted by Boom Boom Anton View Post
The guy they draft will likely be a forward so either he, Skinner or one of the Staals can move to wing if need be. Always better to have too many centers than not enough IMO.

I also honestly think Nash is better suited right now as a 4th line center as he doesn't have enough offense, but he needs to add some strength. I like his instincts as he's usually in a good spot defensively, but get's knocked off the puck too often so needs to get stronger. If there are injuries, he can then slide up as needed.

Lastly, after seeing some glipses of how effective the 2nd line can be when Jared was on it (and no, he's not the answer), I really think a big, banger with some offensive ability on the 2nd line with Staal and Ruutu would be the way to go. Incredibly hard to play against. If Welsh develops more, he might be that guy, but if not, they should look at the UFA market to fill that roll.
Agreed. I enjoyed watching the second line the last few games. I think this type of guy is exactly what they need, and keep Skinner on the third line, for now.

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05-02-2013, 11:53 AM
  #715
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Originally Posted by Boom Boom Anton View Post
The guy they draft will likely be a forward so either he, Skinner or one of the Staals can move to wing if need be. Always better to have too many centers than not enough IMO.

I also honestly think Nash is better suited right now as a 4th line center as he doesn't have enough offense, but he needs to add some strength. I like his instincts as he's usually in a good spot defensively, but get's knocked off the puck too often so needs to get stronger. If there are injuries, he can then slide up as needed.
Yeah, I'd move to Jordan to wing and not look back. Even giving him a partial pass for this year, I still the same limitation as a C that he displayed in Pitt - below average vision, limited playmaking, little creativity, average hands, etc. He fills the bill so well as a power wing though.

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05-02-2013, 12:09 PM
  #716
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Originally Posted by Sasha Cares View Post
Skinner has chemistry with no one (except Cole)... If that doesn't change he should be moved... If he can't

1) play with Estaal
2) play with Jstaal
3) play 3rd line center

then he legitimately is not of high value to the team
That's my line of thinking. If he can't play in the top 6 effectively, and his 3rd line center role might be filled by the upcoming draft, it's better to shop him.

Hell, even if the draft doesn't pan out as expected, I'd shop him. Makes zero sense to pay any 3rd liner 5 million. Shop him, and find another 3rd liner for much cheaper.

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05-02-2013, 12:24 PM
  #717
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Skinner doesn't create enough nor play enough defense to be a 2nd line center. I don't want a poor defensive $5 mil center on my 3rd line either.

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05-02-2013, 12:37 PM
  #718
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Why are we acting like a 20 year old who is horrible defensively is going to remain horrible defensively forever?

Most of the players in Skinner's draft class aren't even in the NHL yet, and Skinner is going to stagnate in development? Specifically, in one of the teachable/affected by effort parts of the game?

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05-02-2013, 12:40 PM
  #719
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Originally Posted by Highway to Cap Hell View Post
Why are we acting like a 20 year old who is horrible defensively is going to remain horrible defensively forever?

Most of the players in Skinner's draft class aren't even in the NHL yet, and Skinner is going to stagnate in development? Specifically, in one of the teachable/affected by effort parts of the game?
But if he's being led by such a lazy skater who leads by example as a captain in Eric Staal, how's he supposed to know to fix his issues?

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05-02-2013, 12:54 PM
  #720
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Why are we acting like a 20 year old who is horrible defensively is going to remain horrible defensively forever?

Most of the players in Skinner's draft class aren't even in the NHL yet, and Skinner is going to stagnate in development? Specifically, in one of the teachable/affected by effort parts of the game?
Agreed. Not to equate them or imply this is Skinner's path but I'm reminded somewhat of how Yzerman started as a one dimensional player before maturing into a good two-way player and then a Selke winner.

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05-02-2013, 02:29 PM
  #721
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Does Skinner really give anyone the feeling that he'll be anything but a mediocre defend for his career?

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05-02-2013, 02:30 PM
  #722
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Agreed. Not to equate them or imply this is Skinner's path but I'm reminded somewhat of how Yzerman started as a one dimensional player before maturing into a good two-way player and then a Selke winner.
I don't think Skinner can do that... He had limitations with size and history of concussions

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05-02-2013, 02:47 PM
  #723
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Tlusty-Staal-Semin
Skinner-Monahan-(Dalpe?)
Bowman-Staal-Ruutu
Wallace-Nash-Dwyer

Seems pretty simple to me.

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05-02-2013, 02:55 PM
  #724
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No way we are paying a 3C $6mil... You can chalk that up as a NO

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05-02-2013, 02:57 PM
  #725
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Yeah, paying anyone on the 3rd line more than a couple million doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense.

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