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2013 Draft: Stop winnin for MacKinnon, or Do Meth for Seth?

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05-08-2013, 01:06 PM
  #826
Jussijuice
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Originally Posted by wallym View Post
Perusing through, any other year (aside from '07) these guys would be right in the same spot they are now. Maybe a little lower in the good ones.

There are a lot of good players in this draft. But I'd say the "depth" comes from the guy you get at 10-15 likely being almost as good as the guy you can get at #5. Not that there are a large number of elite prospects.
This simply isn't true.

MacKinnon and Drouin are Tavares/Crosby level prospects.

Barkov, Monahan, Lindholm, and Nichushkin are all in the RNH, Landeskog, Huberdeau, Yakupov, Galchenyuk, Seguin, Hall, etc. range.

There is a huge drop-off after 7. 10-15 are nowhere remotely close in talent.

I don't see what you mean in response to my post. Compare Landeskog or Staal and Monahan's stats, scouting reports, and measurables and they are nearly identical on average. Can cherry pick outliers if you like, but doesn't make it true.

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05-08-2013, 01:47 PM
  #827
DaveG
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I think that you're stretching the talent level a bit here.

MacKinnon and Drouin aren't on that elite tier of prospects that Tavares/Crosby/Ovechkin were at.

That said, they would have certainly been the #1 pick in any of the other drafts aside from maybe the Stamkos one.

Likewise Monahan and Barkov likely would have had at least one in the top 5, and more often then not both, aside from the 06 draft. In a few of the drafts (2005, 2007, 2011, 2012) they would have been #2 and 3 off the board.

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05-08-2013, 01:48 PM
  #828
wallym
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Originally Posted by Jussijuice View Post
This simply isn't true.

MacKinnon and Drouin are Tavares/Crosby level prospects.

Barkov, Monahan, Lindholm, and Nichushkin are all in the RNH, Landeskog, Huberdeau, Yakupov, Galchenyuk, Seguin, Hall, etc. range.

There is a huge drop-off after 7. 10-15 are nowhere remotely close in talent.

I don't see what you mean in response to my post. Compare Landeskog or Staal and Monahan's stats, scouting reports, and measurables and they are nearly identical on average. Can cherry pick outliers if you like, but doesn't make it true.
From what I've read, Jordan and Monahan are very similar. Except Jordan was 6'4" 210, and didn't have questions about his skating.

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05-08-2013, 02:22 PM
  #829
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Originally Posted by wallym View Post
From what I've read, Jordan and Monahan are very similar. Except Jordan was 6'4" 210, and didn't have questions about his skating.
He is a bit smaller at 6'2", 195 but that is still nice size. I don't really see the knock on his skating, he isn't explosive but he is a strong skater that is hard to knock off the puck.

Monahan's offensive game far better than Jordan's in his Draft year. Monahan has a pro level wrist shot, excellent vision and playmaking skills, a great saucer pass, and he is deadly on the PP. He was 6th in PP Goals and 15th in overall scoring in the OHL despite being on a team that went 16-46 and missing 10 games due to suspension.

Perhaps most importantly, his intangibles are through the roof. He is a natural leader and gives his all every shift.

Barkov doesn't really need to be defended. He is one of the youngest player in this Draft and still put up the best numbers for a Draft eligible in a Euro Pro league since Daniel Sedin.

He was perhaps the best player in the entire Finnish Elite League last year and was outplaying NHLers like Mikko Koivu during the lockout.

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05-08-2013, 02:37 PM
  #830
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I will be happy if Barkov slips to 5th....but not expecting it.

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05-08-2013, 02:51 PM
  #831
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Maybe an easier discussion is trying to pick out NHL comparables. People have mentioned Eric Staal with Monahan, but that's pretty much nonsense. A smaller weaker skating Eric Staal isn't really anything like Eric Staal.

So who?

Barkov sounds a bit like Kopitar, possibly, if everything works out for him?

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05-08-2013, 03:02 PM
  #832
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I'm thinking Toews lite with Monahan and I'm really warming up to the idea of picking him at #5 and rolling something like this next year:

Tlusty-Staal-Semin
Skinner-Monahan-Dalpe
Bowman-Staal-Ruutu
Wallace-Nash-Dwyer

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05-08-2013, 03:06 PM
  #833
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Barkov - Joe Thornton - nearly the same

Monahan - Jonathan Toews or Rod Brind'Amour - high-end offensive skills, playmaking Center, intangibles at elite level, all very "clutch" high motor guys

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05-08-2013, 03:29 PM
  #834
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Originally Posted by Chicago Made Punk View Post
I'm thinking Toews lite with Monahan and I'm really warming up to the idea of picking him at #5 and rolling something like this next year:

Tlusty-Staal-Semin
Skinner-Monahan-Dalpe
Bowman-Staal-Ruutu
Wallace-Nash-Dwyer
If these were lines I think the 2nd and 3rd would be swapped. No way Jordan becomes the 3rd line center (as much as I have become a proponent of having him there)

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05-08-2013, 03:35 PM
  #835
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Originally Posted by CanesAvs16 View Post
If these were lines I think the 2nd and 3rd would be swapped. No way Jordan becomes the 3rd line center (as much as I have become a proponent of having him there)
In terms of TOI, I think Jordan would spend more time out there than Monahan, even at ES. Calling one 2nd and the other 3rd or one 2A and one 2B doesn't worry me much.

As people discussed a young line that could take advantage of other third lines and defensive pairings, Skinner-Monahan-Dalpe sounds promising. I would like to see someone step up and take that spot from Bowman, though.

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05-08-2013, 03:36 PM
  #836
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I've learned that it's easiest to not try to compare players. Doesn't get your hopes up for no reason.

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05-08-2013, 03:37 PM
  #837
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I'm warming up a little to the idea of Monahan. Getting a really good young 3C with a Brind'Amour type future is strong returns on a 5th pick.

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05-08-2013, 03:41 PM
  #838
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago Made Punk View Post
I'm thinking Toews lite with Monahan and I'm really warming up to the idea of picking him at #5 and rolling something like this next year:

Tlusty-Staal-Semin
Skinner-Monahan-Dalpe
Bowman-Staal-Ruutu
Wallace-Nash-Dwyer
Wonder where I seen something like that posted a page ago...

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05-08-2013, 03:45 PM
  #839
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Originally Posted by Chicago Made Punk View Post
I'm thinking Toews lite with Monahan and I'm really warming up to the idea of picking him at #5 and rolling something like this next year:

Tlusty-Staal-Semin
Skinner-Monahan-Dalpe
Bowman-Staal-Ruutu
Wallace-Nash-Dwyer
I like Rask-Staal-Ruutu as the 2a line. Rask plays a good 2 way game and could take over Center from Jordan with experience. Better playmaker than Bowman to pair with two shooters.

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05-08-2013, 03:47 PM
  #840
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Think CBJ would take our 2nd (35thOV) + McBain for there 1st (From NYR or LAK) to move up for Fucale?

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05-08-2013, 03:48 PM
  #841
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanesAvs16 View Post
If these were lines I think the 2nd and 3rd would be swapped. No way Jordan becomes the 3rd line center (as much as I have become a proponent of having him there)
Its a 1a, 1b and 1b2, and 3rd line. LOL.

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05-08-2013, 03:48 PM
  #842
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If these were lines I think the 2nd and 3rd would be swapped. No way Jordan becomes the 3rd line center (as much as I have become a proponent of having him there)
That would most likely suffice in accordance to JR's line of thinking(no pun intended). In that case, I prefer Ruutu on the left side and Dwyer on the right because that is the checking line, right? Bowman fits the bill, but declined a lot last year. Perhaps, he steps it up during his contract year?

I'm also strongly contemplating the 5th overall pick. I've never been a big fan of Lindholm from watching him at the WJC, but the scouting report lists him as the best candidate for Skinner's center IMO. Good skating, great vision, awesome defensive positioning, Norwegian(See Skins & Fins.) With all this talk about needing a playmaking center, I'm surprised he's not in the conversation.

I still think that Barkov and Nich are the top talents outside the top 3, but I have full confidence in our scouting staff.

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05-08-2013, 03:52 PM
  #843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Misfit Semin View Post
Think CBJ would take our 2nd (35thOV) + McBain for there 1st (From NYR or LAK) to move up for Fucale?
Not sure, honestly there seem to be 3 goalies worth drafting in the top 2 rounds in Fucale, Jarry, and Comrie, so even if we strike out on Fucale we may still get a solid goalie.

That said, Fucale is the only one that has shown to be top round material, due to injury (Comrie) or playing time (Jarry) for the others.

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05-08-2013, 03:54 PM
  #844
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Originally Posted by Misfit Semin View Post
Think CBJ would take our 2nd (35thOV) + McBain for there 1st (From NYR or LAK) to move up for Fucale?
Better players to be had at 16th than Fucale. I'd rather have Ryan Pullock, kid has a 100+ mph shot and solid defensive game.

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05-09-2013, 10:48 AM
  #845
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why would we give an 18 y/o our second line at all?

hes 18 guys. we shouldnt be counting on whoever the pick is to do more than maybe make the team. you know we'll force it so even if he isnt ready we'll be using him. if monahan is developed enough to be the third line center consistently this coming year, its a minor miracle.

estaal needed two years to develop. we cant use skinner as a measuring stick. drawing up imaginary lineups for this coming season based on an 18 y/o's assumed abilities in the nhl is asinine. the 03 draft needed a couple of years to assert itself. this isnt that draft. the overhyping is getting out of control.

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05-09-2013, 09:11 PM
  #846
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I saw someone compare Monahan to Brind'amour..... sold!
Now I hope we take him: He instantly becomes Mon'Amour.

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05-10-2013, 05:23 AM
  #847
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I was just looking at draft profiles. This Cole Cassels is Andrew's kid?! Holy **** I feel old.

Would we be looking at him later on? Profile says he's a good playmaker but plays a two-way game with grit. Projects as a third-liner.

He throws some fisticuffs here, takes a while to get going but wait for it.



Last edited by Roboturner913: 05-10-2013 at 05:43 AM.
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05-10-2013, 11:02 AM
  #848
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If we can grab that Cassels guy, we could have Tlusty, Monahan, Rask, Cassels down the middle next year. I like it!

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05-10-2013, 11:08 AM
  #849
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you can never have too many centers

Especially when you're talking about people who won't be in the NHL for another 3-4 years. Who knows what will happen by then.

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05-10-2013, 11:56 AM
  #850
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you can never have too many centers

Especially when you're talking about people who won't be in the NHL for another 3-4 years. Who knows what will happen by then.
No way. I mean the Kings suffer so much because they have Carter, Kopitar, Richards, and Stoll. Just a terrible way to operate a franchise.

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