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09-10-2013, 10:47 AM
  #176
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Plus, we broke. Over budget. Klesla for Sgarbossa and call it an off-season.

Pits Lats, Sgar, and Miele against each other for that top six spot.

Then Brule, Yip, and Brown against each other for that bottom six spot.

Makes for a good camp and leaves us with options.

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09-10-2013, 11:30 AM
  #177
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I'd rather have Brule in the top six than Sgarbossa or Miele. I might even prefer him up there to Latendresse.

Projected over an 82-game season, Brule's stint in Phoenix would have been 12 goals and 22 assists. That's not anything gaudy, but keep in mind:

44.6% OZS
11:33 ATOI (1:05 of which on the PP)
Most frequent linemates were Raffi Torres (37.7%), Kyle Chipchura (34.4%) and Daymond Langkow (26.1%)

Give him more easy minutes and better linemates, and I'd say he's a lock for 20 goals. If he finds chemistry with anyone, he could hit 30.

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09-10-2013, 11:41 AM
  #178
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Originally Posted by PhoPhan View Post
I'd rather have Brule in the top six than Sgarbossa or Miele. I might even prefer him up there to Latendresse.

Projected over an 82-game season, Brule's stint in Phoenix would have been 12 goals and 22 assists. That's not anything gaudy, but keep in mind:

44.6% OZS
11:33 ATOI (1:05 of which on the PP)
Most frequent linemates were Raffi Torres (37.7%), Kyle Chipchura (34.4%) and Daymond Langkow (26.1%)

Give him more easy minutes and better linemates, and I'd say he's a lock for 20 goals. If he finds chemistry with anyone, he could hit 30.
Brule is without a doubt better than Miele, not sure about Latendresse who's shown he can score but he has work ethic issues and on a Tipp team not sure that will work, so I think that Brule is the better choice.

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09-10-2013, 12:52 PM
  #179
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That's an awfully small sample size, Pho. I like Brule a lot, but I'm not willing to pencil him in as the twelfth forward, let alone in the top six.

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09-10-2013, 01:00 PM
  #180
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That's an awfully small sample size, Pho. I like Brule a lot, but I'm not willing to pencil him in as the twelfth forward, let alone in the top six.
Oh, for sure. But it's worth considering that he made the most of very limited opportunities, and given everything else Brule brings to the table, I don't see how Latendresse is a better option.

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09-10-2013, 01:59 PM
  #181
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Plus, we broke. Over budget. Klesla for Sgarbossa and call it an off-season.

Pits Lats, Sgar, and Miele against each other for that top six spot.

Then Brule, Yip, and Brown against each other for that bottom six spot.

Makes for a good camp and leaves us with options.
Only issue I have with this is Sgarbossa hasn't proven anything at an NHL level, and Brule has. Why trade a solid shutdown defenseman for a piece who would likely be beat out of a job by Brule? We can find other useful ways to trade Klesla and still stay under the budget. Maybe package him with a defensive prospect and/or a draft pick and get a decent proven piece back.

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09-10-2013, 04:36 PM
  #182
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Only issue I have with this is Sgarbossa hasn't proven anything at an NHL level, and Brule has. Why trade a solid shutdown defenseman for a piece who would likely be beat out of a job by Brule? We can find other useful ways to trade Klesla and still stay under the budget. Maybe package him with a defensive prospect and/or a draft pick and get a decent proven piece back.
He's waiver exempt with a two way contract. He wins a spot or goes back down. It's that flexibility that makes him appealing in the first place.

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09-10-2013, 04:39 PM
  #183
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Oh, for sure. But it's worth considering that he made the most of very limited opportunities, and given everything else Brule brings to the table, I don't see how Latendresse is a better option.
He's a better option because a couple of years ago he scored 25 goals in a season. Everything beyond ability to score goals is irrelevant, in my opinion.

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09-10-2013, 05:48 PM
  #184
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He's a better option because a couple of years ago he scored 25 goals in a season. Everything beyond ability to score goals is irrelevant, in my opinion.
Why is everything else irrelevant?

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09-10-2013, 07:06 PM
  #185
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Well, in my opinion, the intangibles Brule brings (this is exclusively in the top six, by the way) are irrelevant. I don't care if he hustles more, passes better, can win face-offs or is very good defensively. All of Doan, Ribeiro, Boedker, Hanzal, and Vrbata are adequate to excellent defensively and play with a good amount of hustle. These are smart players that play the right way. The one thing I want to see in that top six is another guy (besides Vrbata and I suppose Doan) that is able to finish off Mike Ribeiro chances effectively. I think Guillaume Latendresse is well suited for this task. He's got very good positioning, and and excellent shot selection to choose from. The guy can score goals well and in a variety of ways. It's really all he can do and basically every other area leaves you wanting. To me, that's fine. The only thing I want from him is to get open, accept passes, and bury chances. It is my opinion that Latendress is a much better fit for this purpose than is Gilbert Brule. I like Brule and I want him on the team. I am just excited about the prospect of Latendresse on Ribeiro's line.

If you meant the Czech line, rather than the Ribs line, than that's a slightly different story. If I've got Lats and Doan on the Ribs line, than I want Boedker on the Czech line. I'm not pushing him down in favor of Brule. I think Boedker's better suited for it.

The good news is that there is room for both.

Latendresse-Ribeiro-Doan
Boedker-Hanzal-Vrbata
Korpikoski-Vermette-Moss
Klinkhammer-Chipchura-Brule
Bissonnette

If Brule proves capable of being a more effective offensive threat and earns better linemates, than I'd trade Moss and call up Brown or Yip. Saves money.

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09-10-2013, 09:58 PM
  #186
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If your just looking for someone to catch and shoot Brule is very good in that aspect. His shot from in his draft year was one of the main reasons some even preferred him to Crosby. Ribiero has stated he loves to play with right handed triggermen as well. I kind of find them to be similar in a way. They were both highly touted at one point and injuries have kind of ruined their careers to date. Both are extremely talented and could end up in either spot but I prefer Brule at this point. Probably do to his for checking ability. I see his speed creating more chances on that top line.






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09-10-2013, 10:04 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by rt View Post
The good news is that there is room for both.

Latendresse-Ribeiro-Doan
Boedker-Hanzal-Vrbata
Korpikoski-Vermette-Moss
Klinkhammer-Chipchura-Brule
Bissonnette
That would be a 4th line to be reckoned with.

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09-10-2013, 11:44 PM
  #188
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If your just looking for someone to catch and shoot Brule is very good in that aspect. His shot from in his draft year was one of the main reasons some even preferred him to Crosby. Ribiero has stated he loves to play with right handed triggermen as well. I kind of find them to be similar in a way. They were both highly touted at one point and injuries have kind of ruined their careers to date. Both are extremely talented and could end up in either spot but I prefer Brule at this point. Probably do to his for checking ability. I see his speed creating more chances on that top line.





But as with Boedker, I don't think Brule's speed would be a good asset to a Ribeiro line, much less a Ribeiro - Doan pairing - both don't really play a "speed" game, and in general, speed usually belongs best with speed.

Not to say that if Brule produces he won't get an opportunity for Top 6 minutes given Tippett's reward system. Again, the nice thing about Brule is that his skill/grit allows him to basically play on any line. But as of now, I'm with RT and would rather give Latendresse first dibs with Ribeiro at 1LW and start Brule back at his old position at 4RW, and then go from there.

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09-11-2013, 02:37 AM
  #189
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That's an awfully small sample size, Pho. I like Brule a lot, but I'm not willing to pencil him in as the twelfth forward, let alone in the top six.
He struggles to play more than scrap minutes at the NHL level. Ther seems to be a general like and hope amongst Coyotes fans but he's a filler player. I would've rather seen them sign Steckel but that would be me with the same logic.

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09-11-2013, 11:21 AM
  #190
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He struggles to play more than scrap minutes at the NHL level. Ther seems to be a general like and hope amongst Coyotes fans but he's a filler player. I would've rather seen them sign Steckel but that would be me with the same logic.
I have the same general like and hope. I believe it is possible he becomes a top six player, it's just that he's never been one at the NHL level and it's tough to pencil him in there as a result. Latendresse on the other hand has played in that role and flourished in it (save for injuries) in the past. For that reason, it's easier to pencil him in.

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09-11-2013, 12:07 PM
  #191
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He struggles to play more than scrap minutes at the NHL level. Ther seems to be a general like and hope amongst Coyotes fans but he's a filler player. I would've rather seen them sign Steckel but that would be me with the same logic.
Plainly untrue. I'd agree Brule got scrap minutes in Phoenix (to the extent that they were minimal, though not necessarily easy), but he didn't struggle in them; he flourished, and I'd argue he deserved more. He also had a very productive year in Edmonton in 09-10.

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I have the same general like and hope. I believe it is possible he becomes a top six player, it's just that he's never been one at the NHL level and it's tough to pencil him in there as a result. Latendresse on the other hand has played in that role and flourished in it (save for injuries) in the past. For that reason, it's easier to pencil him in.
I don't think anybody is penciling Brule in as a top six player, but speaking personally, I think he's much more likely to win that job than Latendresse or Miele or anybody else currently in the mix (if Maloney brings in someone else, that would obviously change the calculus).

With regard to Latendresse, he's been given plenty of opportunities, but he's "flourished" in all of one season, when he scored 27 goals (on 18.8% shooting, 4.8 percentage points higher than his career average). Safe to say that year was kind of a fluke. As well, all of his peripheral stats, pretty much every year, paint a picture of a player who is virtually useless if he's not scoring goals (which seems to be almost all of the time). He's also fairly injury prone, which means that even if he does impress enough in camp to earn the job, you still need to make sure you've got someone else ready to step in if he misses more than half the season again.

Brule has obviously had a fairly rocky career to this point as well, but he showed me enough in his 33 games as a Coyote—both on the stat sheet and on the ice—to make me very optimistic about his prospects.

He's somehow played even less than Latendresse since then, and that's obviously a big red flag, and I'm not putting any more stock into "I've got all my off-ice issues straightened out and I'm ready for a rebound" than I do into the "I'm the healthiest I've ever been" line Latendresse is peddling. Brule is also no stranger to injuries himself. But with all that in mind, I see a much higher ceiling and a much higher floor with Brule.

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09-11-2013, 12:19 PM
  #192
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But as with Boedker, I don't think Brule's speed would be a good asset to a Ribeiro line, much less a Ribeiro - Doan pairing - both don't really play a "speed" game, and in general, speed usually belongs best with speed.

Not to say that if Brule produces he won't get an opportunity for Top 6 minutes given Tippett's reward system. Again, the nice thing about Brule is that his skill/grit allows him to basically play on any line. But as of now, I'm with RT and would rather give Latendresse first dibs with Ribeiro at 1LW and start Brule back at his old position at 4RW, and then go from there.
I agree with you that those two don't play a speed game, but speed is never a bad thing to have on any line. Ribeiro played with Ovechkin last year, and that guy can fly. I just don't like the idea of adding a slower guy to an already slow line. Yeah they can slow it down when they have the puck but what happens when they need to play defense. All I was saying, was that from a catch and shoot perspective, Brule is just as good as Lats but he provides another weapon to that line with his skating ability. He's fine on either line though. I just hope he'll make the team.

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09-11-2013, 12:59 PM
  #193
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I agree with you that those two don't play a speed game, but speed is never a bad thing to have on any line. Ribeiro played with Ovechkin last year, and that guy can fly. I just don't like the idea of adding a slower guy to an already slow line. Yeah they can slow it down when they have the puck but what happens when they need to play defense. All I was saying, was that from a catch and shoot perspective, Brule is just as good as Lats but he provides another weapon to that line with his skating ability. He's fine on either line though. I just hope he'll make the team.
No, I agree, Ribs did well with Ovy. But he also produced with playing with guys like an aging Mike Modano/Jere Lehtenin and Brendan Morrow as wingers - and they're anything but fast either. I guess the point is that as long as he plays with finishers, he'll produce.

For me, Lats isn't actually all that slow - his foot speed is decent, he just has poor conditioning. From what I've seen thus far I think he's better suited to being on Ribs LW than Boedker or Brule. But who knows, maybe one of the latter two can find chemistry.

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