HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Business of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, NHL revenues, relocation and expansion.

Mark Spector: Reflecting on bad decisions

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-20-2012, 06:07 AM
  #76
Tekneek
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,955
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliffy1814 View Post
Worse yet, if all owners show restraint, then it's collusion.
It is only collusion if they conspire together to accomplish that. If each team can make their own economic case, before a court/arbitrator, then there is no collusion.

Tekneek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 01:21 PM
  #77
Riptide
Moderator
 
Riptide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Yukon
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,997
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tekneek View Post
It is only collusion if they conspire together to accomplish that. If each team can make their own economic case, before a court/arbitrator, then there is no collusion.
Except that the appearance of collusion is just as bad as actual collusion. Guaranteed the PA would file charges if a top UFA indicated he wanted a 12+ year deal, and every team said we won't go past 6-7.

__________________
I've been looking for trouble... but trouble hasn't been cooperating!
Riptide is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 01:38 PM
  #78
Riptide
Moderator
 
Riptide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Yukon
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,997
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Context, content, manners.
Then don't answer. Whatever.

Quote:
Not sure why that matters tbh, but you may want to count again, and you may want to use your fingers this time.
Really? You point to Bettmans track record of lockouts, but want to ignore Fehr's track record. Okaaayy.

Quote:
Weve been over this before, and Im not much for repeating myself, but when the options are we take and you give or you give and we take, its awful hard to get excited about negotiating.
If the players are *****ing that the owners are not offering them anything... then get to the damn table and ASK for something. So far they're asking that the NHL guarantee their existing contracts (something they've never had before due to escrow). If they want something else, then they need to ask for it. To date we've never heard of them asking for anything. They just keep saying no.


Quote:
This is pretty rich coming from you, but really you seem to be pro nhl, so how am I putting words in your mouth? That's the jist of the situation. The players are responsible for accepting the outrageous contracts the owners are offering them, or conversely, for rejecting the contracts they think dont give them what they feel they are worth and could probably get elsewhere.
There's a huge difference between being pro NHL, and saying it's all the players fault for "accepting the outrageous contracts the owners are offering them". You're also conveniently ignoring the fact that the players and their agents play a huge part in those contracts.

And this lockout isn't really about the players contracts (although there needs to be some changes there), and more about the overall player share that the NHLPA receives, and how the each side wants that implemented. All those contracts do is increase every players escrow hit which only pisses off the players.

Riptide is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 01:56 PM
  #79
I am the Liquor
Fire Mact
 
I am the Liquor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Sunnyvale
Country: Canada
Posts: 35,546
vCash: 1271
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riptide View Post
Then don't answer. Whatever.
Whatever is right.

Pfffft.

Quote:
Really? You point to Bettmans track record of lockouts, but want to ignore Fehr's track record. Okaaayy.
Bettman's track record and past history is directly relevant to what is happening now. Players have dealt with this guy before. Fehr's record in baseball, which you got wrong btw, and the player's willingness to hire him, is an indication of how fed up the players are with Bettman's tactics.


Quote:
If the players are *****ing that the owners are not offering them anything... then get to the damn table and ASK for something. So far they're asking that the NHL guarantee their existing contracts (something they've never had before due to escrow). If they want something else, then they need to ask for it. To date we've never heard of them asking for anything. They just keep saying no.
Oh, so they are in fact, negotiating then.

Make up your mind.

That doesnt change the fact that the owners have offered them a choice to either chop off a thumb, or their fingers. Wonder why they arent jumping at that? Btw, the players have indicated that they are willing to talk.

Quote:
There's a huge difference between being pro NHL, and saying it's all the players fault for "accepting the outrageous contracts the owners are offering them". You're also conveniently ignoring the fact that the players and their agents play a huge part in those contracts.
Really? What's the difference? Why dont you break it down for me?

Quote:
And this lockout isn't really about the players contracts (although there needs to be some changes there), and more about the overall player share that the NHLPA receives, and how the each side wants that implemented. All those contracts do is increase every players escrow hit which only pisses off the players.
So the owners need to lock the players out so they can fix their own mistakes?

Sounds about right.

I am the Liquor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 02:05 PM
  #80
CerebralGenesis
Registered User
 
CerebralGenesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 24,016
vCash: 500
Didn't know that no one can make mistakes, and yes the last CBA has apparently become a big one despite the players making record salaries.

I dunno bout the players because I still think a majority are left in the dark as they have always been by the NHLPA, but the NHLPA is currently listening to negotiations but submittin g the same proposal 5 times over doesn't really indicate a willingness to negotiate in good faith. The players are indeed willing to talk, they've done plenty of it. Just few of it has been constructive and those who have said it have disappeared from the media quickly.

CerebralGenesis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-20-2012, 04:15 PM
  #81
Riptide
Moderator
 
Riptide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Yukon
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,997
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Whatever is right.

Pfffft.
LOL.

Is it really that hard to actually answer a question?

Quote:
Oh, so they are in fact, negotiating then.

Make up your mind.

That doesnt change the fact that the owners have offered them a choice to either chop off a thumb, or their fingers. Wonder why they arent jumping at that? Btw, the players have indicated that they are willing to talk.
And the NHL has agreed to do so - just not under the structure the PA wants. The NHL has asked for other things (contractual), and the PA instead of negotiating, as decided to tell them to **** off. So no, they're not negotiating.

Yes the NHL is taking (there's no doubt about it). However the players have the chance to try and get something in return for what they're giving up... and instead of even trying, they're sticking their head in the sand saying we'll just take our ball and go home.

Quote:
So the owners need to lock the players out so they can fix their own mistakes?

Sounds about right.
The NHL locked out the players because there was no CBA in place. They were looking for changes as they feel their player costs are too high. The players instead are demanding fixed dollar amounts plus raises.

Riptide is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:25 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.