HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Business of Hockey
The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, and NHL revenues.

NHL Willing to Negotiate with NO Linkage

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-11-2005, 05:00 PM
  #51
Munchausen
Full Time A-hole
 
Munchausen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Stuck in traffic
Posts: 5,330
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digger12
Waitaminute...why is there even a shred of optimism around here, I thought that was only prevalent on mondays?

Did I miss a memo or something?
Yes you did. It was agreed for practical reasons that formerly scheduled Delusion Day (Monday) would be swapped with Suicide Day (Friday). It was more convenient for everybody.

Munchausen is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:05 PM
  #52
Digger12
Registered User
 
Digger12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Defending the border
Posts: 14,495
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchausen
Yes you did. It was agreed for practical reasons that prior scheduled Delusion Day (Monday) would be swapped with Suicide Day (Friday). It was more convenient for everybody.
:lol

Damn...I've got to start loosening up that junk filter on Outlook. No wonder I've been getting quizzical stares all day. Must've been the black armband and hair shirt.

Digger12 is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:08 PM
  #53
davidwii
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 53
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 TO MTL
I thought about the same thing, maybe the deal is the first portion of whatever deal is reached has no linkage, and then when profits are healthier, linkage is established at whatever %, that's partnership, and fair both ways

Absolutely....I agree.

davidwii is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:27 PM
  #54
ladybugblue
Registered User
 
ladybugblue's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Edmonton, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,426
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedgreen
i thought the whole time this would come down to a cap minus linkage. revenues are too unpredictable to base contracts on. how do you set up the league on numbers you dont know are going to happen? then take back money from the players when they dont? just doesnt hold up, imo. either a cap with no linkage, or a strict luxury tax.
The NFL does why not the NHL??

ladybugblue is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:40 PM
  #55
CarlRacki
Registered User
 
CarlRacki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,423
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ladybugblue
The NFL does why not the NHL??
The PA - if they're not using the whole linkage issue as a smokescreen - is likely concerned that revenue increases in the NHL aren't the sure thing they are in the NFL.
Over the long term, I'd venture to say they're wrong, but if they're not willing to ake the risk, they won't get any reward either.

CarlRacki is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:42 PM
  #56
WickedBruinsGirl
06.15.11
 
WickedBruinsGirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: loge 19 ♥
Country: United States
Posts: 14,083
vCash: 500
Did anybody get a chance to see the interviews?

WickedBruinsGirl is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:46 PM
  #57
dolfanar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Like a midget at a urinal, I'm going to have to stay on my toes.
Posts: 2,948
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlRacki
The PA - if they're not using the whole linkage issue as a smokescreen - is likely concerned that revenue increases in the NHL aren't the sure thing they are in the NFL.
Over the long term, I'd venture to say they're wrong, but if they're not willing to ake the risk, they won't get any reward either.
Hardly. 10 years from now, IF there is a hockey resurgence and owners are making money hand over fist, the players will whine and complain and strike, possibly costing the better part of ANOTHER season so they can get linkage.

You know 100 years from now, if hockey still exists as a pro sport, what will people think when they look back on the record books and see 75 years of stable season, after stable season and then come upon 1994 and 2005? 48 game season? 28 game season? Strike after strike... bleh.

dolfanar is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:47 PM
  #58
ChiHawks468
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Aurora, IL
Country: United States
Posts: 175
vCash: 500
If anyone watched/ is watching the interviews, can you give those of us who can't a recap please?

Thanks in advance.

ChiHawks468 is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:47 PM
  #59
Volcanologist
Habitual User
 
Volcanologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Kessel Apocalypse
Country: Germany
Posts: 20,279
vCash: 500
I don't believe it. Linkage is central to their vision of the finances.

Volcanologist is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:50 PM
  #60
Egil
Registered User
 
Egil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 8,832
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DR
From my perspective, the linkage wasn’t even the worst part of the NHL's offer.

- the NHL's ability to eliminate arbitration

- the 24% rollback

- the signing deadline

- arbitration deferal

- elimination of group 5 and 6 free agency

Just to name 5.

DR

Elimination of arbitration is the league telling the players we don't like arbitration, and will be negotiated out. I also believe it was used to tip the players as to what age the league would go on the UFA age.

The league is NOT going to negotiate away what the players gave it, that is the players job. The league put it back to the original offer from the players, and are probably willing to reduce that amount. But the players are driving the rollback bus, not the owners.

Signing deadline should be replaced with forced arbitration at the start of training camp. The player would have walkaway rights to go play in Europe, the team to make the player a UFA. But the idea behind it is sound, as holdouts are CLEARLY detrimental to the team, the player, and the league. Eliminating them would make for a healthier league. I think the owners put that in to tell the PA we want to deal with RFA holdouts in the CBA, as the current system for that didn't work for anyone.

Arbitration Deferal is IMHO a neutral thing. The owners specific implemetation was slanted to them, but the idea of it is sound, and could EASILY be tweaked to a neutral device. The ability to defer arbtration off a BAD season is just as powerful to a player as it is to an owner that has a player who has had 1 really good year.

Group V free agency had about 2 players a year, as it requires 10 years of service before the player would normally become a UFA, WHILE being paid less than the league average. If the UFA age became 28 for example, it would be impossible to become a group V free agent. Even at 29 it would be difficult, as very few players enter the league at 18 and are paid less than the league average 10 years later. Eliminating this is irrelevent to the PA.

Group VI free agency applies to fringe NHLers over the age of 25. Waiver rules normally allow these players to move to a different team if their current club is. Not a big deal, and certainly not a concern for MOST of the NHLPA membership.

Egil is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 05:52 PM
  #61
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 109,415
vCash: 5700
$47M cap. That's what I think. I would be happy with that.

GKJ is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 06:47 PM
  #62
Scoogs
Registered User
 
Scoogs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,034
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Scoogs
As far as the NHLPA "not going to pick up the phone", I think that is utter ********.

We've said and known all along that Bob was a deadline hunter. Here is his deadline. He has just over 48 hours, if not less.

Scoogs is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 06:54 PM
  #63
OlliMackBjugStud
OlliMacBjugStrome
 
OlliMackBjugStud's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,641
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
$47M cap. That's what I think. I would be happy with that.
dont hold your breath ... a hard cap, no linkage, probably means no floor too.

NHL wont be interested in a hard cap anything more than 36 or 37m.

dr

OlliMackBjugStud is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 07:11 PM
  #64
Phil333
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: New York City
Country: United States
Posts: 997
vCash: 500
So if this is true, when do you think we will hear something? By tomorrow evening?

Phil333 is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 07:40 PM
  #65
tradetalker24
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 39
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil333
So if this is true, when do you think we will hear something? By tomorrow evening?

If what is true? Noone said an agreement was in place

tradetalker24 is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 07:42 PM
  #66
NewBreed19
Guest
 
Country:
Posts: n/a
vCash:
Quote:
Originally Posted by tradetalker24
If what is true? Noone said an agreement was in place
He meant if the pa will contact the nhl with this idea in mind.

 
Old
02-11-2005, 07:43 PM
  #67
dolfanar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Like a midget at a urinal, I'm going to have to stay on my toes.
Posts: 2,948
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil333
So if this is true, when do you think we will hear something? By tomorrow evening?
Aside from rumours, I personally think that the next official news will be a season cancellation announcenment (10 to 1 for) or an agreement in principal for a new CBA (10 to 1 against), and not til Monday at the earliest....

dolfanar is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 07:44 PM
  #68
tradetalker24
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 39
vCash: 500
i think the NHLPA didnt negotiate the trigger points because they would rather present their offer because they like it more.If they are stuck negotiating they cant propose a new offer. If the NHL HATES the NHLPA proposal then maybe they will have time to change the trigger points

tradetalker24 is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 08:21 PM
  #69
bleedgreen
Moderator
 
bleedgreen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: colorado
Posts: 10,555
vCash: 500
i think they're going to play. yep, i said it.

i just want to be the one who got it right. me and eklund, we called it someones gotta be optimistic. i think they are still blowing smoke, aint over yet.

bleedgreen is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 09:01 PM
  #70
vanlady
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 810
vCash: 500
I saw both interviews, Saskin's reaction was very telling, he got upset when the host told him the Daly was willing to accept a cap with no linkage. As Saskin put it, it would be nice if the NHL told the PA that and not the media. He also said that the NHL put something in writing making him beleive the triggers were not negotiable. Don't know which one of them is lying but Saskins anger seemed to be very real

vanlady is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 09:12 PM
  #71
Munchausen
Full Time A-hole
 
Munchausen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Stuck in traffic
Posts: 5,330
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanlady
He also said that the NHL put something in writing making him beleive the triggers were not negotiable.
What a load of BS. If this is his honest take on the matter, this guy should get fired on the spot. It was in writing so he didn't bother to ask? Wow we really have the cream of negotiators here to settle this thing.

Munchausen is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 09:18 PM
  #72
snakepliskin
Registered User
 
snakepliskin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Wilmington NC
Country: United States
Posts: 1,898
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Munchausen
What a load of BS. If this is his honest take on the matter, this guy should get fired on the spot. It was in writing so he didn't bother to ask? Wow we really have the cream of negotiators here to settle this thing.
INCOMPTENT!! these guys don't want to make any deal DD-DAy TUESDAY!

snakepliskin is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 09:35 PM
  #73
Leafer4Life
Go Leafs Go!
 
Leafer4Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Owen Sound,Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,188
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Leafer4Life Send a message via Yahoo to Leafer4Life
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanlady
I saw both interviews, Saskin's reaction was very telling, he got upset when the host told him the Daly was willing to accept a cap with no linkage. As Saskin put it, it would be nice if the NHL told the PA that and not the media. He also said that the NHL put something in writing making him beleive the triggers were not negotiable. Don't know which one of them is lying but Saskins anger seemed to be very real
Did they ask Daly about the so called comment he made?!?!?!?

Leafer4Life is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 09:36 PM
  #74
vanlady
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 810
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MOEBEAGLE
Where are you getting this daly info from? Have search several hockey sites and nothing about this was found.
Daly and Saskin were interviewed on the Score today.

www.thescore.com

vanlady is offline  
Old
02-11-2005, 09:45 PM
  #75
cleduc
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,799
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanlady
I saw both interviews, Saskin's reaction was very telling, he got upset when the host told him the Daly was willing to accept a cap with no linkage. As Saskin put it, it would be nice if the NHL told the PA that and not the media. He also said that the NHL put something in writing making him beleive the triggers were not negotiable. Don't know which one of them is lying but Saskins anger seemed to be very real
1) Here's the article from Phily.com on Bettman's news conference after he made his proposal where he told them the triggers were negotiable:
http://www.philly.com/mld/philly/spo...y/10860047.htm

2) The following day, yesterday, Daly said the same thing to the media.

If Saskin didn't grasp it in the original meeting, convince us that the NHLPA wasn't listening to the NHL news conferences - which they always followed this week for "rebuttal".

3) The two parties are in negotiation of a collective bargaining agreement. There was nothing stopping the NHLPA from going ahead to present their own concept of triggers in a counter proposal whether they anticipated the NHL liking them or not to demonstrate good faith should it come under review by the NLRB.

Saskin is full of crap on this point. The fact remains that any form of reasonable triggers lock the NHLPA in to stand behind their proposal. We all know by now that the NHLPA doesn't want that - probably because those triggers will expose all the smoke within the Dec 9th proposal = it won't work effectively to control labour costs.

EDIT: one other thing .. that offer to negotiate a cap with no linkage by the NHL is ancient and has been stated repeatedly. It isn't "news".

cleduc is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:12 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.