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Mario Lemieux moves into $20-million Mont Tremblant home

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Old
11-25-2012, 07:51 PM
  #51
Kane One
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Quote:
Originally Posted by illpucks View Post
Mario's new house is the Best looking House I have ever seen in my life
Derek Jeter's mansion in Tampa Bay tops that, IMO.



Still, that's a beautiful house.

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11-25-2012, 07:51 PM
  #52
Twilight Sparkle
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I don't even know why we're talking about his house...

He's not a majority owner and he's not even close to the richest in the NHL.

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11-25-2012, 07:53 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Twilight Sparkle View Post
I don't even know why we're talking about his house...

He's not a majority owner and he's not even close to the richest in the NHL.

If people keep posting in the thread, the topic continues. If people aren't interested in the thread, they can ignore it.

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11-25-2012, 07:55 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
If people keep posting in the thread, the topic continues. If people aren't interested in the thread, they can ignore it.
I think we're just trying to figure out what the point was in the first place. Was it just to show Mario bought a new home and therefore we'll be seeing real estate topics on the business board whenever a player or owner buys a new home or was there something more to this?

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11-25-2012, 08:04 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
Kukla's Korner had this tidbit up this morning, as Lemieux moves into his 'second' home.

The original article:
Pittsburgh Penguins owner Mario Lemieux recently took possession of a new $20-million home in Mont Tremblant, Quebec's high end ski resort town.
The 15,000 square feet sprawling, Swiss castle-style mansion about 145 km north of Montreal has 23 rooms as well as 10 bathrooms.
The castle, which is made of stone and wood, is located on a piece of land close to Tremblant's golf course and ski hills. The castle also features a triple garage and a double garage, has an in-ground swimming pool and an outdoor tennis court with a heated floor....
"It's not the time to talk about my personal affairs," Lemieux told QMI Agency through a spokesman with the Penguins organization.
...
The Tremblant home will remain his second residence, however, as the Penguins' owner also has a home in the Pittsburgh area.
http://www.torontosun.com/2012/11/24...tremblant-home


Out of curiosity, I decided to look up Lemieux's career earnings, which from 1989 - 2005 totaled $48,926,829. Missing are the five seasons prior to that (1984 being his first NHL season). However, his was paid roughly $2.0, 2.17, and 2.34 MM the first three years for which we have data. Let's assume it was $1 MM/yr for three of those years, and $2 MM/yr for two: $7 MM
www.hockeyzoneplus.com/search/salaries-search.cgi?template=nhl-salaries-search-detail.htm&dbname=NHL-Salaries-test.txt&key2=2199&action=searchdbdisplay

His Pittsburgh home has a tax valuation of roughly $2-3 MM, per Zillow.com.


I think he needs to let Crosby and Malkin use the home whenever they wish. Prior to their arrival, Pittsburgh's valuation was $140-150 MM, iirc. After getting the taxpayers of Pennsylvania to build the team the Consol Energy Center for $321 MM.* (Forbes notes that the Pens control all the arena events.)
From Wiki
:
On to Forbes:
Franchise valuation for Pittsburgh - $264 MM

The team was acquired by Burkle and Lemieux in 1999 for $107 MM.

Now, this is where it gets interesting. It's noted what Lemieux was contractually set to get above, however the Pens ownership was a mess during Lemieux's career. Some of that money above was deferred and paid out as a stake in the franchise:

In 1999, Mario was owed $32.5m, so the $20m above was converted to equity, $5m was paid out in cash. [Deduct $7 MM from lifetime earning above.]


$48.9 - 20 - 7 = $21.9 MM cash earnings, + 7 MM from my estimate, thus $28.9 MM


Moral of the story:

If you can get players to keep giving back on their salaries and take hometown discounts, plus convince tax payers to pay for your $320 MM arena = Cha ching.
Ever heard of a mortgage?

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11-25-2012, 08:16 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by KaylaJ View Post
I think we're just trying to figure out what the point was in the first place.
Its an issue of "timing & optics'". As I stated earlier, good for Lemieux, richly deserving of such luxuries, however, in light of the league in speaking as a single voice through Gary Bettman that the owners are losing their shirts, presumably on behalf of mid-sized on the cusp franchises like the Penguins.... well, if the answer to your question as to why the thread was created with $20M worth of obvious staring you in the face isnt obvious enough, then I dont know what to tell you.

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11-25-2012, 08:21 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
Edit: I don't support the idea whatsoever that governments should build arenas for billionaires and their recreational hobbies. I don't care if it also benefits players. That doesn't change my view on it one iota. If Lemieux is a beneficiary to this extent, then it's obscene.



I wished to highlight his career earnings vs current spending.

I also think it would be safe to say that the Penguins aren't one of the teams in the red.

Oh, and Malkin and Crosby both deserve top salaries, but took hometown discounts. Really generous of them.
so I trust you are against Detroit spending any cash on Mike Illitch then....

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11-25-2012, 08:24 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
The credit available to cities and government for municipal projects is being used, which is legal but in some views, not the reason bonds were created. Ultimately, in the case of shortages or defaults, the taxpayer is left holding the bill:


Read more: http://triblive.com/x/pittsburghtrib...#ixzz2DGdBlbiQ

Edit: I stand corrected on the funding details. Over the life of the bond, the state will receive repayment for the cost of the arena. I do stand by the portion that its taxpayer credit and risk that is being used to make it possible, noting the market crash of 2008 made things more expensive, hence the risk being passed on to taxpayers.
if the state would have selected Isle of Capri, Consol would have been 100% privately financed....

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11-25-2012, 08:25 PM
  #59
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Nobody is saying owner's are losing their shirts. NHL owner's are most likely making a nice amount with their main businesses, and are still making some money from arena events.

Several hockey teams aren't making money though, and the owners seem to want to change this. Seems like they want the league to be generally profitable. Doesn't sound terrible to me.

What I don't get is why people think that just because people are rich, or that they make money in other areas of their portfolios, that they should just shut up and take the losses from their hockey teams because it all evens out. Not a single poster here would be okay with that were the rolls reversed.

To me it just makes solid business sense to want to make the league generally profitable for as many teams as possible, while maintaining parity. Cutting costs increases profitability, increasing revenue sharing helps the bottom teams be sustainable.

Honestly, what's not to like here?

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11-25-2012, 08:30 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
Its an issue of "timing & optics'". As I stated earlier, good for Lemieux, richly deserving of such luxuries, however, in light of the league in speaking as a single voice through Gary Bettman that the owners are losing their shirts, presumably on behalf of mid-sized on the cusp franchises like the Penguins.... well, if the answer to your question as to why the thread was created with $20M worth of obvious staring you in the face isnt obvious enough, then I dont know what to tell you.
That's understandable, but construction on this home was started in 2009.

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11-25-2012, 08:31 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Killion View Post
... absolutely. Even if Pittsburgh's breaking even or losing a bit, the increase in overall franchise valuation combined with the rest of the businesses operations & holdings would provide the kind of collateral & leverage one might require in obtaining credit lines well beyond the $20M he dropped on whats clearly not some run of the mill A-Frame Viceroy or Lindal Cedar Homes pre-fab dealeo.... hammered together over a weekend. Sid the Kid up there hammering down shingles on the roof. Resting on concrete block foundations. An outhouse. No electricity. Propane power. Backup Honda generator....
The $20m number has been being thrown around a lot, and 99% of places that have been posting this article are using the same source word-for-word. You can tell when everybody had the mansion listed as 1,500 sq ft (yeah, that's slightly bigger than my apartment.) Why is this important? Because this article from 2010 is saying Mario's mansion is worth "around 10m": http://fr.canoe.ca/infos/quebeccanad...09-040201.html

Quote:
$4 million have already been invested in the project, according to data available at the Hotel de Ville de Mont-Tremblant.

Once completed, the huge house worth at least $10 million.
While "at least $10 million" and "worth $20 million" are technically true (at least 10m is 20m), it is not necessarily accurate. The $10 million figure at least has a point of reference. Aside from a press release, where is this $20m figure coming from? Do we even know if this is accurate?

Quote:
Originally Posted by WTFMAN99 View Post
You are looking at his NHL salary but keep in mind he man probably got endorsements....probably some nice money off of the interest on his money in the bank as well lol.
I know Mario was paid an estimated $1 million for his deal with Nike Hockey.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/story?id=1647814
Quote:
The deal made headlines when it was announced in January 2001: Mario Lemieux, who had just returned to the NHL after a three-year absence, would sign a groundbreaking endorsement deal as the signature athlete for Nike brand hockey equipment.

It was a bit of an odd sight at first, one of the greatest players ever to play the game donning the famous -- but still relatively young and unproven in hockey circles -- Nike swoosh. The head-to-toe deal required Lemieux to use customized versions of the company's skates, gloves, stick and helmet for the remainder of his playing career, in exchange for a reported $1 million.
Mario eventually switched from Nike to CCM in 2003 and I'm sure he wasn't wearing their gear for free. Also MLX skates, which Mario had started in 2009 was bought out by Easton-Bell in 2011.
http://prostocknation.wordpress.com/...-acquires-mlx/
Quote:
Easton-Bell Sports, Inc. – a leading designer, developer and marketer of branded sports equipment and accessories under the Easton, Bell, Giro, Riddell and Blackburn brands – today announced its largest and most aggressive commitment in skate innovation through its recent purchase of MLX Skate’s technology. The newly created Easton Speed Institute will combine MLX’s innovative skate insights with Easton’s design and engineering prowess, leading to a new skate concept expected to be in market for the 2013 hockey season.


Last edited by iamjs: 11-25-2012 at 08:39 PM.
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11-25-2012, 08:35 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by edog37 View Post
so I trust you are against Detroit spending any cash on Mike Illitch then....
Yes. I don't care which team, and truth be told, Detroit (city) has better things to do with the little bit of money they have.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KaylaJ View Post
That's understandable, but construction on this home was started in 2009. If it was so important than why are we just now bringing it up?
Because it was posted on KK today? Ask the reporter who picked up the story.

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11-25-2012, 08:35 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Sundinisagod View Post
Imagine a business owner locking his players out of work to force them to take paycuts, while at the same time buying himself a 20 million dollar summer home.

They say timing is everything.
...or that the house has been in the works since 2009.

It's not like 66 was cruising around back in Montreal one day, saw this newly built mansion and decided to drop "$20 million" in cash on it. It was being built for the past four years.

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11-25-2012, 08:37 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
Its an issue of "timing & optics'". As I stated earlier, good for Lemieux, richly deserving of such luxuries, however, in light of the league in speaking as a single voice through Gary Bettman that the owners are losing their shirts, presumably on behalf of mid-sized on the cusp franchises like the Penguins.... well, if the answer to your question as to why the thread was created with $20M worth of obvious staring you in the face isnt obvious enough, then I dont know what to tell you.
I'm sure you have a Bettman quote supporting this claim.

A link will do fine.

Oh, dragging out a Bettman claim that some franchises lose money won't be enough, for obvious reasons.

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11-25-2012, 08:46 PM
  #65
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Yes. I don't care which team, and truth be told, Detroit (city) has better things to do with the little bit of money they have.
What does public funding of arenas have to do with Mario's crib? Glad to see you aren't being hypocritical as well. At least in the Pens case, they went out & tried to get a privately financed arena, but ran up against corruption with the state...

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11-25-2012, 08:56 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by KaylaJ View Post
If it was so important than why are we just now bringing it up?
... if you go back to page one, the thread starters original post, you'll find a link to an article that appeared in one of todays papers/on-line sources. Ergo; topical, timely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iamjs View Post
...While "at least $10 million" and "worth $20 million" are technically true (at least 10m is 20m), it is not necessarily accurate. The $10 million figure at least has a point of reference. Aside from a press release, where is this $20m figure coming from? Do we even know if this is accurate?
... check the link as mentioned above, but yes, that valuation could be off by a country mile. Custom built homes like Lemieuxs' in resorts, be it Tremblant or Whistler, Aspen or Park City etc can often be artificially and incorrectly appraised. Construction costs are high, site preparation (though that site his house sits on doesnt look terribly challenging, at least now) can be beyond expensive, lots backing onto golf courses or ski in ski out, million dollar view and or lakefront commanding big bucks. Location. Then it depends on the interior appointments of course. If that home was in Whistler, $20M range for sure. Tremblant, not so sure.

Interesting inf & links on the rest as well. Thanks.

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11-25-2012, 09:01 PM
  #67
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Player makes so much money that when his team goes bankrupt, he is able to own it and be his own boss. 6 years later, he buys a big house.

Conclusion = owners are making too much money


Last edited by Killion: 11-25-2012 at 09:18 PM. Reason: Not reqd';
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11-25-2012, 09:02 PM
  #68
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I don't understand how you can use this as a topic against the owners in regards to the lockout.

Owners are rich and own big houses.

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11-25-2012, 09:11 PM
  #69
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i think it would feel weird living in a house that big (lol...maybe too much condo living for me )

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11-25-2012, 09:11 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
His Pittsburgh home has a tax valuation of roughly $2-3 MM, per Zillow.com.
yeah, that's the value, not what he paid when he bought the place 20 years ago. The amount he paid was about half of what you listed.

Removing personal info for obvious reasons (not that a simple google search couldn't find it)


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11-25-2012, 09:14 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
I'm sure you have a Bettman quote supporting this claim.
... quotes "with links" that has Gary claiming the very CBA he crafted & designed & signed was a triumph of will & cost certainty; trumpets record NHL revenues; then out of the other side of his mouth tells us its all an unsustainable mirage, teams simply cant continue on on this road to wrack & ruin as he pockets the keys to the locks? Quotes like that? Enough of those on the record to stage a Freudian vs Jungian Field Day of Olympian proportions.

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11-25-2012, 09:31 PM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Killion View Post
... quotes "with links" that has Gary claiming the very CBA he crafted & designed & signed was a triumph of will & cost certainty; trumpets record NHL revenues; then out of the other side of his mouth tells us its all an unsustainable mirage, teams simply cant continue on on this road to wrack & ruin as he pockets the keys to the locks? Quotes like that? Enough of those on the record to stage a Freudian vs Jungian Field Day of Olympian proportions.
So basically you attribute a completely bizarre view to Gary Bettman and won't substantiate your claim in any way?

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11-25-2012, 09:33 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by edog37 View Post
What does public funding of arenas have to do with Mario's crib? Glad to see you aren't being hypocritical as well. At least in the Pens case, they went out & tried to get a privately financed arena, but ran up against corruption with the state...
You mean, Rendell.

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11-25-2012, 09:48 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by edog37 View Post
What does public funding of arenas have to do with Mario's crib? Glad to see you aren't being hypocritical as well. At least in the Pens case, they went out & tried to get a privately financed arena, but ran up against corruption with the state...

Now that's very fair.

What was the corruption that derailed the private deal? I'd guess something to do with the casinos and licenses?

The axe I'm grinding is about the Marlins Syndrome, because that's up there with Jerry Jones of Dallas Cowboys/ have no shame in getting public money to make the experience for paying customers to Jerry's pockets that much more lucrative.

I actually like Lemieux, for the most part. He fought back, and I think he's one of the greatest to ever play. I'm happy that the misfortune of playing for a bankrupt team worked out for him in the long run, that the deferred salary was actually made up to him. He did a lot put that team on the NHL map.

In fact, it may not be fair to pick on him in this context because the Pens may be among the moderates in the NHL, recognizing that they're doing well enough that it just may not be worth the losses so far. (I don't know where they stand in reality, other than the blurb about Snider.)

The axe is about the current pro sports model. It seems that its never enough. Publicly subsidized arenas, or outright publicly built stadiums and arenas, lockouts to get more off the players, expansion fees for the simple reason to expand because you can collect a fee. Just makes me wonder why I even watch. When is enough enough for some of these guys? Watching the Glendale mess for the last three years, whereby the only way teams can even be considered viable is if cities and govts give them even more money? It's just off kilter.

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11-25-2012, 09:57 PM
  #75
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I don't know how you can construe talking about Lemieux's fortune, the bulk of it earned as a player, as being anti-owner.

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