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International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

Has Russia overtaken the #1 spot in World Hockey?

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Old
12-16-2012, 07:25 PM
  #826
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Originally Posted by True Hockey Fan View Post
Canada has unbelievable depth at almost every position. And you really can't say the same about team russia. Talk about depth, Russia is not even #2.
Then why don't you win all WC? If you say that Canada has almost equal 2 or 3 NT.
And if Russia is always not even #2, how could they win Canada in Olympic Turin? Did you forget about it? Was Russia weaker than Canada in Turin? It's interesting what excuses you will find. It's always fun to read them.


Last edited by od71: 12-16-2012 at 07:31 PM.
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12-16-2012, 07:25 PM
  #827
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Originally Posted by TollefsenFan View Post
Send a better team to the whc and win. Then u will climb on the ranking. Its like tests at school. It dosent help to be the smartest and most gifted guy in class, if u dnt do your homework.
How can we when a lot of our best players are usually playing integral parts for their club teams in pursuit of hockeys holy grail; widely regarded as the toughest trophy to win in all of pro sports?


When its a legit tournament, they'll be there..

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Old
12-16-2012, 07:25 PM
  #828
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Originally Posted by Meteor View Post
With a 2-0 US win, right?
Hey, even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in a while

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12-16-2012, 07:30 PM
  #829
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Originally Posted by od71 View Post
Then why don't you win all WC? If you say that Canada has almost equal 2 or 3 NT.
And if Russia is not even #2, how could they win Canada in Olympic Turin? Did you forget about it? Was Russia weaker than Canada in Turin? It's interesting what excuses you will find. It's always fun to read them.
I think an objective poll will tell you that Canada did have a better team in Turin.. However, anything can happen in a one game winner take all scenario..


The body of work speaks for itself... But being the best doesn't always guarentee victory in one game winner take all.


I'd bet my left nut that Canada beats any country best on best in a 7 game series. IMO, you'd be insane to bet against them.

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12-16-2012, 07:37 PM
  #830
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Originally Posted by TollefsenFan View Post
Send a better team to the whc and win. Then u will climb on the ranking. Its like tests at school. It dosent help to be the smartest and most gifted guy in class, if u dnt do your homework.
We don't care about the WHC, there is more important hockey going on at the time. IIHF rankings carry little to no weight here.

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12-16-2012, 07:37 PM
  #831
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Originally Posted by sparxx87 View Post
How can we when a lot of our best players are usually playing integral parts for their club teams in pursuit of hockeys holy grail; widely regarded as the toughest trophy to win in all of pro sports?


When its a legit tournament, they'll be there..
Then make it legit by sending your players to the WHC if the season is cancelled.

Quote:
Russia loves those tournaments though, they love the advantage.. How many gold medals did they rack up at the Olympics with all their best players playing against inferor competition due to most other countries best players being in the NHL?
Do you know how many Swedes, Czechoslovaks, Finns played in the NHL when USSR "racked up" its gold medals? Here, check it out yourself: http://www.quanthockey.com/TS/TS_Pla...ionalities.php

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12-16-2012, 07:39 PM
  #832
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Originally Posted by sparxx87 View Post
I think an objective poll will tell you that Canada did have a better team in Turin.. However, anything can happen in a one game winner take all scenario..


The body of work speaks for itself... But being the best doesn't always guarentee victory in one game winner take all.


I'd bet my left nut that Canada beats any country best on best in a 7 game series. IMO, you'd be insane to bet against them
.
1. I think the opposite. The final score is the only thing that matters.
2. Yes, I really want best on best in a 7 game series. I badly want it.

Somehow I agree, in one game anything can happen, like it was in Vancouver. But that's an excuse that doesn't count.

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12-16-2012, 07:47 PM
  #833
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Originally Posted by sparxx87 View Post
How can we when a lot of our best players are usually playing integral parts for their club teams in pursuit of hockeys holy grail; widely regarded as the toughest trophy to win in all of pro sports?


When its a legit tournament, they'll be there..
Cmon u got LOTS of strong forwards and Ds that never make the playoffs. Nash, Tavares, Duchene, O Reilly, RNH, Hall, Eric Staal, David Jones, Bergeron, Dallman (alot better than most russian Ds) and a bunch of others. It would take me all day to name em all. The problem is that they decline their invitation or isnt asked.

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12-16-2012, 07:50 PM
  #834
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Originally Posted by Kessly Snipes View Post
We don't care about the WHC, there is more important hockey going on at the time. IIHF rankings carry little to no weight here.
Well why are u complaining if u dosent care? Its like failing on a test, get mad and when someone confront u, u say that "I dnt care. I got more important stuff to think about"

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12-16-2012, 08:02 PM
  #835
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Originally Posted by TollefsenFan View Post
Well why are u complaining if u dosent care? Its like failing on a test, get mad and when someone confront u, u say that "I dnt care. I got more important stuff to think about"
I am not complaining about anything. Canada is the best hockey nation. And thats all there is to it.

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12-16-2012, 08:09 PM
  #836
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Originally Posted by bach View Post
What you're suggesting is ducking competition, which is a terrible analogy.
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Originally Posted by craigcaulks View Post
Everyone knows the NHL plays playoff games in May so Canada can avoid playing in the WHC.
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Originally Posted by daver View Post
Canada: You want to go? Name the time and place.

IIHF: Last week
Plenty of Canadian players are available in May. Over half the league is off. Yet the Canadian players don't show up, the Europeans do. No excuses, you ducked the competition and not only did the IIHF give you a time and place for your B-C team to prove your excuses right, you failed to deliver.

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12-16-2012, 08:32 PM
  #837
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Originally Posted by od71 View Post
Then why don't you win all WC? If you say that Canada has almost equal 2 or 3 NT.
And if Russia is always not even #2, how could they win Canada in Olympic Turin? Did you forget about it? Was Russia weaker than Canada in Turin? It's interesting what excuses you will find. It's always fun to read them.
Canada won the most important tournament in Vancouver with a smash 7-3 victory over Russia in QF, we don't need make exuses.

Since 2010, Russia has been better than Canada at WC, that's a fact.

But what I see, this is all about Russia-Canada. But what about other nations ? If we're talking about last 3 tournaments(whc), the Czech republic has more medals (3) then Russia (2), and they've finished two times ahead of them.

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12-16-2012, 08:50 PM
  #838
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Originally Posted by True Hockey Fan View Post
Canada won the most important tournament in Vancouver with a smash 7-3 victory over Russia in QF, we don't need make exuses.

Since 2010, Russia has been better than Canada at WC, that's a fact.

But what I see, this is all about Russia-Canada. But what about other nations ? If we're talking about last 3 tournaments(whc), the Czech republic has more medals (3) then Russia (2), and they've finished two times ahead of them.
sparxx87 made an excuse about Turin.
In one game can happen everything as sparxx87 said. You remember PO Pittsburgh vs Philadelphia last season? Pens won one game 10:1 but lost in 6 games. That's why I want best on best 7 series.

If we're talking about last 5 tournaments(whc), the Russia has more medals (4) (three of them are gold) then Czech republic (2), and they've finished three times ahead of them. Canada just 2 medals. Not too much for the nation that has "2 or 3 almost equal NT teams"
As for the Czech, I remember times when they won gold 3 times in a row. It was a very strong team

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12-16-2012, 09:12 PM
  #839
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Lets hold he world championships in North America more than once every 50 years and see if that helps the popularity of the tournament.

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12-16-2012, 09:32 PM
  #840
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
Lets hold he world championships in North America more than once every 50 years and see if that helps the popularity of the tournament.
Honestly, you'd just have to get TSN hyping it more regardless of where it's played.

It's like the U20s, nobody cared about it, then TSN realized it needed some Christmas programming, now its a huge deal in Canada...but not really anywhere else. The level of play in the WJHC is worse than the ECHL but people still tune in and love it - I do respect the intensity though. There's really not much reason why the U20s should be valued so much more than a U17 or U18 win.

The reality is, like most posters on this board, I am a huge hockey fan. I watch over 90 hockey games a year, often more than 130, and probably somewhere around 30 live (including mostly NHL, some AHL, and some WHL), yet I usually do not watch any games of the World Championship, even if Canada is playing in the finals (for that matter, I haven't been watch the WJHC for about three years now).

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12-16-2012, 09:44 PM
  #841
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Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
Honestly, you'd just have to get TSN hyping it more regardless of where it's played.

It's like the U20s, nobody cared about it, then TSN realized it needed some Christmas programming, now its a huge deal in Canada...but not really anywhere else. The level of play in the WJHC is worse than the ECHL but people still tune in and love it - I do respect the intensity though. There's really not much reason why the U20s should be valued so much more than a U17 or U18 win.

The reality is, like most posters on this board, I am a huge hockey fan. I watch over 90 hockey games a year, often more than 130, and probably somewhere around 30 live (including mostly NHL, some AHL, and some WHL), yet I usually do not watch any games of the World Championship, even if Canada is playing in the finals (for that matter, I haven't been watch the WJHC for about three years now).
QTF. I, too, never cared about WJHC until only a few years ago, when Malkin and Ovechkin were on the same team. I believe 2008 WHC had more attention than usual, plus, I believe the tournament was pushed back a week compared to its regular scheduling, in order to accomodate more NHL players. Holding it in North America more often would definitely raise the level of attention it gets outside of Europe.

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12-16-2012, 10:50 PM
  #842
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The level of play in the WJHC is worse than the ECHL but people still tune in and love it...
What?

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12-16-2012, 11:10 PM
  #843
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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Plenty of Canadian players are available in May. Over half the league is off. Yet the Canadian players don't show up, the Europeans do. No excuses, you ducked the competition and not only did the IIHF give you a time and place for your B-C team to prove your excuses right, you failed to deliver.
You just can't seem to grasp that Canadian and American players don't care about the WHC. It is a non-issue for most of them after a long 82 game season.

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12-16-2012, 11:12 PM
  #844
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Originally Posted by Kessly Snipes View Post
You just can't seem to grasp that Canadian and American players don't care about the WHC. It is a non-issue for most of them after a long 82 game season.
My brain is quite good at grasping. It's a great excuse, it's still ducking.

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12-16-2012, 11:17 PM
  #845
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Originally Posted by Kessly Snipes View Post
You just can't seem to grasp that Canadian and American players don't care about the WHC. It is a non-issue for most of them after a long 82 game season.
You are just afraid to be beaten once again

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12-16-2012, 11:29 PM
  #846
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Originally Posted by od71 View Post
You are just afraid to be beaten once again
How am I afraid of anything?

Players who grew up not caring about something play 82 games + playoffs for some, have no emotional reason to go. Since playing for your country is purely an emotional choice, it is pointless for them.

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12-16-2012, 11:32 PM
  #847
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Canadians do care about the WC. They don't like to talk about it, but they ALL Know about it very well and they know how Canada does. I remember packed pubs and bars last time Canada made the finals in 09, and that was during daytime. 2008 was the biggest hype I've seen for WC in Canada. Come on, the number #1 hockey crazy country in the world doesn't care how their National team performs on a world stage?

Players care too, but they treat Hockey Canada and playing for the country like a business, to an extent ("is it good for my career?" comes before "is it good for my country"), the same way Hockey Canada treats them. Just look at the pressure they put on 18,19 year old kids to keep a tradition going. Hockey Canada is a brand with product (Crosby, Olympics). Russian National Hockey team is a social project and FHR doesn't make a profit, they make enough to cover SOME expenses. It's a fundamental cultural difference between the hockey nations.

Just to be clear, I don't think that Hockey Canada is better or worse, but I do think that each approach is appropriate for the country. But "not caring" is not the right way to describe it, because it's not quiet true.


Last edited by Fulcrum: 12-16-2012 at 11:40 PM.
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12-16-2012, 11:36 PM
  #848
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Canadians do care about the WC. They don't like to talk about it, but they ALL Know about it very well and they know how Canada does. I remember packed pubs and bars last time Canada made the finals in 09, and that was during daytime. 2008 was the biggest hype I've seen for WC in Canada. Come on, the number #1 hockey crazy country in the world doesn't care how their National team performs on a world stage?

Players care too, but they treat Hockey Canada and playing for the country like a business, to an extent, the same way Hockey Canada treats them. Just look at the pressure they put on 18,19 year old kids to keep a tradition going. Hockey Canada is a brand with product (Crosby, Olympics). Russian National Hockey team is a social project and FHR doesn't make a profit, they make enough to cover SOME expenses. It's a fundamental cultural difference between the hockey nations.
We care enough to catch highlights on TSN in passing. Where I have already planned my WJ schedule over a month in advance.

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12-16-2012, 11:56 PM
  #849
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Originally Posted by Fulcrum View Post
Canadians do care about the WC. They don't like to talk about it, but they ALL Know about it very well and they know how Canada does. I remember packed pubs and bars last time Canada made the finals in 09, and that was during daytime. 2008 was the biggest hype I've seen for WC in Canada. Come on, the number #1 hockey crazy country in the world doesn't care how their National team performs on a world stage?
Meh, I don't know. In all honesty, a lot of my friends here follow the NHL quite closely, especially the Oilers, but when it was time for the WC last year, no one was really interested in it or knew much about it beyond knowing it's going on.

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12-16-2012, 11:59 PM
  #850
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Canadians do care about the WC. They don't like to talk about it, but they ALL Know about it very well and they know how Canada does. I remember packed pubs and bars last time Canada made the finals in 09, and that was during daytime. 2008 was the biggest hype I've seen for WC in Canada. Come on, the number #1 hockey crazy country in the world doesn't care how their National team performs on a world stage?
Made the Finals? Lots of sports get viewership if we are on the edge of winning. Were the bars packed for the round robin? [/rhetorical]

The Olympic gold medal game drew TEN TIMES the viewers that the WC Final in Canada did. The word "care" and the WC is relative. I don't really care about womens soccer or tennis, but I'll watch a final.

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