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Blue Bombers 2013 Season Thread (next game: 08/05 @ BC)

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Old
07-21-2013, 06:15 PM
  #826
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Originally Posted by wpgallday1960 View Post
I have to agree with burmi08. Mack has upgraded the team st every position except QB. And that may get him fired.
In a QB driven league that makes sense.

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07-21-2013, 06:21 PM
  #827
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Originally Posted by Burmistrov08 View Post
We should have won in 1993 as we were the better team.
On paper and during the season. But we had a glass quarterback (Dunigan) that had a bad history of getting injured and was often injured for Grey Cup games. Didn't really want him in town the same as Pierce because we never seem to have a backup that can take over.

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07-21-2013, 08:22 PM
  #828
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Originally Posted by Puckschmuck View Post
The competency issue IS the management issue which is doing squat to resolve our issues. This tells me point blank they don't give a rat's ass about Bomber fans, and to me that is a combination split/slap in the face of my loyalty to this team.
I believe the powers that be "above the GM" do not have the necessary talent to hire quality people to run their football operations and everything else is fruit of the poison tree. You believe they don't care I think they do however I think we overlap on the fact that they are not getting the job done and its time for change at the top.

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07-21-2013, 08:35 PM
  #829
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Originally Posted by Burmistrov08 View Post
15 years ago and beyond people didn't attend football games and Winnipeg was $6,000,000 in debt. We won the Grey Cup in 1984, 1988 and 1990. In a 7 year period we won 3 Grey Cups yet the team was $5,500,000 in debt by 2000! Explain that to me!!!! Winnipeg had its highs with 14-4 and 13-5 seasons and lows of 4-14 and 3-15 seasons. It all balanced out and Winnipeg was still an above .500 team! We had Grey Cup appearances in 1992 and 1993 which was on par with the average. We should have won in 1993 as we were the better team.

So why if Winnipeg was a contending franchise for 8 of the 10 years was Winnipeg $5,500,000 in debt and having attendances around 20,000 a game?

Why was Winnipeg 14-4 and 13-5 in back to back seasons yet Winnipeg Stadium didn't have 20,000 season ticket holders or sell out the stadium regularly? We were THE BEST TEAM in the East Division 3 straight years yet this massive debt came to fruition.
Good post and interesting question.

As I recall Winnipeg was not alone and the CFL in general was in trouble 20 years ago. It would be interesting to map the bombers turn of fortunes with the overall rising tide of the CFL brand popularity. Friday night football and TSN deserve allot of the credit for making the CFL cool to a new generation of fans.

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07-21-2013, 08:35 PM
  #830
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I believe the powers that be "above the GM" do not have the necessary talent to hire quality people to run their football operations and everything else is fruit of the poison tree. You believe they don't care I think they do however I think we overlap on the fact that they are not getting the job done and its time for change at the top.
I agree with you to a certain extent, however I truly believe they are all incompetent slobs that don't have the intellect or ability to put together a winning team if their lives depended on it. And because they appear only to be concerned with lining their wallets with the hard-earned money of us disgruntled fans, they do not care one iota of this team's performance. What we see is what we get.

It's all poison to me.

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07-21-2013, 09:50 PM
  #831
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Good post and interesting question.

As I recall Winnipeg was not alone and the CFL in general was in trouble 20 years ago. It would be interesting to map the bombers turn of fortunes with the overall rising tide of the CFL brand popularity. Friday night football and TSN deserve allot of the credit for making the CFL cool to a new generation of fans.
That's true that TSN was the CFL's savior. I just find it so peculiar how people say they won't support the team unless they start winning yet historically the statement the furthest thing from the truth. Even in the Winnipeg Jets 1.0 we had the most exciting player in the NHL in Teemu Selanne in the early 90's yet we couldn't even average 14,000 people. Winnipeggers as a whole need to be so grateful that we have a NHL franchise playing in one of the newest arenas (How many teams have newer arenas?), a CFL franchise with the newest 25000 seat venue in Canada in over 25 years, and an affordable baseball club that plays in a new ball park. Winnipeg isn't going to go through a population boom, we have a frigid winter climate, the murder capital of Canada and the smallest population out of all the NHL franchises playing in the smallest arena. People making threats to stop support any of our three sporting organizations will only lead to them leaving.

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07-21-2013, 09:57 PM
  #832
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Originally Posted by Puckschmuck View Post
I agree with you to a certain extent, however I truly believe they are all incompetent slobs that don't have the intellect or ability to put together a winning team if their lives depended on it. And because they appear only to be concerned with lining their wallets with the hard-earned money of us disgruntled fans, they do not care one iota of this team's performance. What we see is what we get.

It's all poison to me.
You forget that these incompetent slobs have turned a franchise $5,500,000 in debt into a team with $6,500,000 in surplus and a new stadium to play in. Do you think we would have a new stadium if this franchise wasn't profitable? I can not imagine the government justifying any funding to pay for a venue that isn't able to prove it will be successful and be able to generate enough tax revenue to re-coop the cost.

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07-21-2013, 09:58 PM
  #833
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Originally Posted by Burmistrov08 View Post
You forget that these incompetent slobs have turned a franchise $5,500,000 in debt into a team with $6,500,000 in surplus and a new stadium to play in. Do you think we would have a new stadium if this franchise wasn't profitable? I can not imagine the government justifying any funding to pay for a venue that isn't able to prove it will be successful and be able to generate enough tax revenue to re-coop the cost.
No they didn't
Lyle Bauer did

And it all went for **** the exact second he left for Calgary

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07-21-2013, 10:06 PM
  #834
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No they didn't
Lyle Bauer did

And it all went for **** the exact second he left for Calgary
1) He wasn't the heart and soul of their financial gains although was probably the most important individual employed by the team responsible for it.
2) He resigned from the Stampeders so I am sure you hope he comes back here.

What I find funny is people say get rid of the BOG yet the beloved Trevor Kennard and Bob Cameron are on it.


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Old
07-21-2013, 11:03 PM
  #835
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Originally Posted by ManOnASilverMountain View Post
No they didn't
Lyle Bauer did

And it all went for **** the exact second he left for Calgary
Indeed. Whatever profit was made will be short lived with these fools at the helm. And it will be the fans who suffer in the end.

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07-21-2013, 11:13 PM
  #836
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Indeed. Whatever profit was made will be short lived with these fools at the helm. And it will be the fans who suffer in the end.
You don't get it. When Lyle Bauer left it wasn't like there was HUGE change. We still had a BOG when he was running the show. Most of them are the same people who run the show now. Lyle Bauer wasn't this teams savior.

And what makes you feel the fans deserve better? Like I said earlier the team was a combined 29-9 from 1993 to 1994 yet they didn't sell 20,000 seat tickets. They didn't sell out the stadium each game. Why is it you feel the fans deserve better when the team spent a lot of money to bring in Matt Dunigan which brough results, records, etc, yet the fans did not show their appreciation.

Please explain this one for me Puckschmuck.

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07-21-2013, 11:29 PM
  #837
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Originally Posted by Burmistrov08 View Post
You don't get it. When Lyle Bauer left it wasn't like there was HUGE change. We still had a BOG when he was running the show. Most of them are the same people who run the show now. Lyle Bauer wasn't this teams savior.

And what makes you feel the fans deserve better? Like I said earlier the team was a combined 29-9 from 1993 to 1994 yet they didn't sell 20,000 seat tickets. They didn't sell out the stadium each game. Why is it you feel the fans deserve better when the team spent a lot of money to bring in Matt Dunigan which brough results, records, etc, yet the fans did not show their appreciation.

Please explain this one for me Puckschmuck.
So then what exactly are you getting at? That us fans deserve a crappy product simply because we didn't have 100% support for every single year the Bombers have been in existance? You seem to be defending those at the helm and then telling fans like myself I don't deserve to have a successful team because of something that happened 20-ish years ago. If that is what you are saying, sorry I don't buy into that ********.

Your stance on this perplexes me.

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Old
07-22-2013, 08:15 AM
  #838
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I worked for Jim Bell more than 25 years ago. One of the classiest people I have ever met in my life. Just a genuine nice guy. At that time we went to a few Bomber/Jets games together.

It was easy to know way back then the passion Jim had for the Bombers and for the CFL.

Funny thing, when Jim was the "interim" boss of the Big Blue - things happened to be going quite well...
Agreed with everything you say here. I know him and his family and he is one of the most genuine people I know and truly cares for the team. The way he was outed out of his "interim" position was a travesty too. "Thanks for the hard work in things going well, we're gonna put someone else in charge."

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07-22-2013, 02:20 PM
  #839
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Originally Posted by Puckschmuck View Post
So then what exactly are you getting at? That us fans deserve a crappy product simply because we didn't have 100% support for every single year the Bombers have been in existance? You seem to be defending those at the helm and then telling fans like myself I don't deserve to have a successful team because of something that happened 20-ish years ago. If that is what you are saying, sorry I don't buy into that ********.

Your stance on this perplexes me.
No, I just don't buy into the statement of "the fans deserve better". People are calling for Joe Mack's head yet he has done a great job restocking the cupboards full of CANADIANS. When he took the helm in 2010 this team had THE worst non-import depth by a long stretch in the CFL. He turned a receiving corps that was its achilles heel into a formidable force by finding needles in the haystack such as Greg Carr who bolted unprofessionally but was replaced with the Most Outstanding Rookie in Chris Matthews. He drafted Canadian starters in Kito Poblah, Cory Watson, and Jade Etienne. He found Clarence Denmark who makes the big plays when asked upon. Tyson Pencer is a potential ratio changer and if he gets his health in order could be the best player taken in the 2012 draft. With the exception of QB he has upgraded this team at almost every position since joining. RB/K/DT/DE all have been strong points for this team as of late.

People call for the head of Tim Burke after 14 games coached. 5-9 is nothing to write home about, but what he has preached is professionalism and discipline which is something this team was lacking. He comes with a resume of 3 straight years of having the best defense as the defensive coordinator. Winnipeg went through the stretch where they were paying Doug Barry, Mike Kelly and Paul LaPolice's salary at the same time. I don't know any other person who is not a HC already in the CFL that I would want running this team.

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07-22-2013, 02:25 PM
  #840
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So then what exactly are you getting at? That us fans deserve a crappy product simply because we didn't have 100% support for every single year the Bombers have been in existance? You seem to be defending those at the helm and then telling fans like myself I don't deserve to have a successful team because of something that happened 20-ish years ago. If that is what you are saying, sorry I don't buy into that ********.

Your stance on this perplexes me.
What about 2 years ago when the team was like 6-0 or 7-0 to start the season. The team deserved better as in (selling the remainder of available game tickets for the remainder of the season) yet that didn't come to fruition as attendance dropped to around 25,000 people by the end of the season.

I am not supporting management. I just feel that fans need to take a look in the mirror and realize they are hypocrits by stating that fans deserve better than the BOG or GM or Coach we have when we as fans didn't praise what we preach.

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07-22-2013, 03:19 PM
  #841
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Originally Posted by Burmistrov08 View Post
What about 2 years ago when the team was like 6-0 or 7-0 to start the season. The team deserved better as in (selling the remainder of available game tickets for the remainder of the season) yet that didn't come to fruition as attendance dropped to around 25,000 people by the end of the season.

I am not supporting management. I just feel that fans need to take a look in the mirror and realize they are hypocrits by stating that fans deserve better than the BOG or GM or Coach we have when we as fans didn't praise what we preach.
What?

They sold out that entire season. Their average attendance for that season was actually over 100% due to temporary seating.

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07-22-2013, 04:16 PM
  #842
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What?

They sold out that entire season. Their average attendance for that season was actually over 100% due to temporary seating.
That's true but by the end of the season their attendance dropped to 27.600. What I meant was that they started out so well and couldn't sell out EVERY game.

http://stats.cfldb.ca/team/winnipeg-blue-bombers/2011/

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07-22-2013, 04:27 PM
  #843
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Originally Posted by Burmistrov08 View Post
What about 2 years ago when the team was like 6-0 or 7-0 to start the season. The team deserved better as in (selling the remainder of available game tickets for the remainder of the season) yet that didn't come to fruition as attendance dropped to around 25,000 people by the end of the season.

I am not supporting management. I just feel that fans need to take a look in the mirror and realize they are hypocrits by stating that fans deserve better than the BOG or GM or Coach we have when we as fans didn't praise what we preach.
So what exactly is it that I'm being a hypocrite about and am supposed to practice? You also neglect to realize that most teams don't sell out in this league (at least in a consistent manner), and yet we are at the top of attendance as of late (but I guess that means nothing to you since we are nothing but hypocrites in your eyes) Are you chirping at the other teams fanbases about their supposed hypocracy when their team sucks and they want to see improvement? If not, you should be. You seem very concerned about this issue, strangely. You come off as having a real chip on your shoulder towards the fanbase, claiming that we have no right to complain about anything. Well, again, that is your personal opinion, and I disagree with you. And sorry, you do seem to be apologetic and sympathetic towards the management in your posts; which helps to explain your stance on this.

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07-22-2013, 04:29 PM
  #844
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Originally Posted by Burmistrov08 View Post
That's true but by the end of the season their attendance dropped to 27.600. What I meant was that they started out so well and couldn't sell out EVERY game.

http://stats.cfldb.ca/team/winnipeg-blue-bombers/2011/
So then are you one of those people who believe we shouldn't have had a second NHL team because our attendance wasn't 100% for the 17 years of their stay in Winnipeg, and we shouldn't say anything resembling a complaint regarding management or the team? Based on your commentary regarding Bomber fans, I'm led to believe this is how you feel.

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07-22-2013, 05:13 PM
  #845
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Anyone know why attendance was so low at Friday's game? I was in the endzone and both endzones had a ton of room.

I don't think they should have made it this big anyways. I think they should have went the MTS route and made it just big enough. 28,000 I think was a good size.

Is it the parking, people are still worried about? And holding off?
The product on the field?
Or the prices? I paid $44 for endzone tickets. Doesn't seem too bad, yet endzones were about half full.

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07-22-2013, 05:24 PM
  #846
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Anyone know why attendance was so low at Friday's game? I was in the endzone and both endzones had a ton of room.
The attendance was about 31.5K out of 33K, so it was hardly a "low" attendance. "Low" attendance would be found in places like BC, Montreal and Toronto. Winnipeg is still at the top of the league in attendance.

And yes, I was at the game Friday.

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07-22-2013, 05:36 PM
  #847
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Anyone know why attendance was so low at Friday's game? I was in the endzone and both endzones had a ton of room.

I don't think they should have made it this big anyways. I think they should have went the MTS route and made it just big enough. 28,000 I think was a good size.

Is it the parking, people are still worried about? And holding off?
The product on the field?
Or the prices? I paid $44 for endzone tickets. Doesn't seem too bad, yet endzones were about half full.
I think there's still some sticker shock with those endzone prices. They were what, $20 last season? Granted you are closer to the action in the new stadium, but they're still endzone seats. I was sitting in the cheapest part of the stadium up in the 200 level, and got a great view of the entire field.

They might have to consider an adjustment to the pricing scheme.

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07-22-2013, 06:35 PM
  #848
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Originally Posted by Burmistrov08 View Post
No, I just don't buy into the statement of "the fans deserve better". People are calling for Joe Mack's head yet he has done a great job restocking the cupboards full of CANADIANS. When he took the helm in 2010 this team had THE worst non-import depth by a long stretch in the CFL. He turned a receiving corps that was its achilles heel into a formidable force by finding needles in the haystack such as Greg Carr who bolted unprofessionally but was replaced with the Most Outstanding Rookie in Chris Matthews. He drafted Canadian starters in Kito Poblah, Cory Watson, and Jade Etienne. He found Clarence Denmark who makes the big plays when asked upon. Tyson Pencer is a potential ratio changer and if he gets his health in order could be the best player taken in the 2012 draft. With the exception of QB he has upgraded this team at almost every position since joining. RB/K/DT/DE all have been strong points for this team as of late.

People call for the head of Tim Burke after 14 games coached. 5-9 is nothing to write home about, but what he has preached is professionalism and discipline which is something this team was lacking. He comes with a resume of 3 straight years of having the best defense as the defensive coordinator. Winnipeg went through the stretch where they were paying Doug Barry, Mike Kelly and Paul LaPolice's salary at the same time. I don't know any other person who is not a HC already in the CFL that I would want running this team.


Wow I dont usually jump, just browse......but Joe Mack and the BOG have proven time and time again that they are either incompetent at the initial hiring process of coachs and GMs or when giving a contract extension. The most glaring example would be Lapolice, extending his contract for two years in the spring and firing him in the summer in this perfect example either Mack and the BOG were incompetent when they did the extension or when they did the firing either way it cost a community owned team 500,000 smackers and no one is accountable!!!!!!! there sure should be some accountability for a 500,00 screw up and it should include more than just getting fired, Im sure the BOG have good intensions but business wise that means nothing.

As for Mack upgrading at every position is suggest you have rose colored glasses and
his lack lustre win loss record would back that up......ooh wait maybe were in a 5 year rebuild in that case lets extend Mack for five more years

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07-22-2013, 09:30 PM
  #849
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The attendance was about 31.5K out of 33K, so it was hardly a "low" attendance. "Low" attendance would be found in places like BC, Montreal and Toronto. Winnipeg is still at the top of the league in attendance.

And yes, I was at the game Friday.
Still looked empty. However, I thought capacity was 35k, so that's not too bad. Still, for second game in the brand new stadium, I expected it to be difficult to get tickets.

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Originally Posted by Hank Chinaski View Post
I think there's still some sticker shock with those endzone prices. They were what, $20 last season? Granted you are closer to the action in the new stadium, but they're still endzone seats. I was sitting in the cheapest part of the stadium up in the 200 level, and got a great view of the entire field.

They might have to consider an adjustment to the pricing scheme.
Possibly, I haven't gone to a game in a long time, so wasn't sure of pricing. THe one endzone is also family zone, so I'm not sure if non family people stayed away because of that. It even says no beer in the one section.

I didn't mind the $44 price tag, little expensive, but once or twice a year, I don't think it's a big deal. Plus for children it's $22, which I thought was nice. View was pretty good from there, but was no action in our side.

On another note, it was freezing in there.

And yet another note, concession lines took forever. We ate when we got there, and must have been in line for a good 20minutes. There's like burger, fries, onion rings. Why on earth are they not being mass produced knowing people are going to be ordering these? They should have been flying out of the kitchen. Growing pains, maybe, but still should be common sense, when you have a menu of 3-4 hot items... they are going to sell... get them ready.

And on Mack topic, he needs to go, for the one reason of re-signing Pierce. This guy couldn't stay healthy when we had him, and when he was healthy, he wasn't even good!


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07-22-2013, 10:23 PM
  #850
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Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Burmistrov08
You forget that these incompetent slobs have turned a franchise $5,500,000 in debt into a team with $6,500,000 in surplus and a new stadium to play in. Do you think we would have a new stadium if this franchise wasn't profitable? I can not imagine the government justifying any funding to pay for a venue that isn't able to prove it will be successful and be able to generate enough tax revenue to re-coop the cost.
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Originally Posted by ManOnASilverMountain View Post
No they didn't
Lyle Bauer did

And it all went for **** the exact second he left for Calgary
I don't buy Lyle Bauer's influence. I think it was more a culture shift. People didn't spend as much money on stuff like tickets back then. People didn't stay living with their parents into their mid-late 20s back in the 80s and early 90s like they did going into the 2000s. The amount of younger fans at Bomber games is probably much higher than it was back then. Let alone the fact that TSN started paying more for broadcast rights, and it helped bring a 'cool' factor to the CFL that definitely wasn't there in 1990. Plus the general incompetence of the league certainly didn't help sell tickets. Who's gonna buy season tickets for an organization that may declare bankruptcy and fold? For all the credit Saskatchewan gets for the strength of their brand, they had to have telethons in 1987 and 1997 just to keep the team afloat. Plus the long term NFL loan helped the league gain a quick buck and actually USE that cash to make some money for themselves. I think a lot of hows and whys the team was bleeding money 25 years ago has more to do with the overall culture of the country rather than any unique market situations.

Lyle Bauer may have help tighten the books, but any disciplined bean counter could do that. All I remember from the Bauer era was personnel blunders. Promoting Brendan Taman over Dave Ritchie, Taman was largely responsible for the lack of quality Canadians which was touched upon elswhere here. Firing Ritchie mid season and replacing him with Joe Daley. Extending Doug Berry's contract then firing him and replacing him with his buddy Mike Kelly (who was a great OC with Matt Dunigan, abysmal OC without--but you know, he BLEEDS Blue and Gold ) who got fired the second Bauer left. During Paul LaPolice's first season, the organization was paying for THREE head coaches. He almost got into a fistfight with David Asper on the sidelines. From 2004-2009 the Bombers had FOUR head coaches. Ritchie (fired 04), Daley (fired 05), Berry (fired 08) and Mike Kelly (fired 09). Blech. I despise Lyle Bauer.

I'd really like to see a coach get a good three or four years, rather than getting fired midway through the season following a Grey Cup appearance.

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