HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The History of Hockey
The History of Hockey Relive great moments in hockey history and discuss how the game has changed over time.

Gary Roberts in his prime

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-29-2012, 01:22 AM
  #1
Puckgenius*
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: At the rink
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,558
vCash: 500
Gary Roberts in his prime

I was a big fan of Roberts and his hard nose, take no crap from anybody personality. He was underrated and one of the best leaders in the league. Remember what hes done for the Leafs franchise? I remember when he made a comeback from cancer, it was really something to see. He was a gritty, tough as nails power forward who always led by example and a great playoff performer. Wont forget the dominant Roberts-Sundin-Mogilny line.

What i want to know is, how did this guy never make Team Canada?

Puckgenius* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 01:32 AM
  #2
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,752
vCash: 593
He had some bad timing and Canada always have other options to turn to. Look at that freak 1990-91 season of his, look at that fully missed 1996-97 season. In 1998 and 2002 he was't as good any more so they went with someone else. When it comes to the World Championships i see that he did qualify for the playoffs really many times during his career, maybe it's not for everyone to go straight from a playoff loss to Europe the next day. Maybe Team Canada at that stage was looking just for really elite players to fill out their roster with(That only being the case during the second half of Garys career of course).

That being said, it's like when i'm sometimes thinking about Ron Francis and Adam Oates never getting there.(In Francis case, a single World Championship)


Last edited by Darth Yoda: 11-29-2012 at 01:41 AM.
Darth Yoda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 02:05 PM
  #3
albertGQ
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 514
vCash: 500
He fought cancer? I didn't know that and I was a huge Flames fan during Roberts tenure here

albertGQ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 02:40 PM
  #4
JoeMalone
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 114
vCash: 500
It wasn't cancer, it was serious neck injury.

JoeMalone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 03:22 PM
  #5
Vincent Vega
GGTK
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,756
vCash: 500
You're both right, it was neck cancer.

Vincent Vega is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 03:29 PM
  #6
JackSlater
Registered User
 
JackSlater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,792
vCash: 500
Roberts played for Canada at the 1986 WJC. As far as best on best tournaments go, he was just never good enough to be a realistic consideration. Healthy issues made him even less likely. Canada always had better scorers to choose from, and he wasn't exactly an elite defensive role player either. If he wanted to play at the World Championships in a year like 1992 I'm sure Canada would have taken him.

JackSlater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 06:16 PM
  #7
vadim sharifijanov
Registered User
 
vadim sharifijanov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 8,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackSlater View Post
Roberts played for Canada at the 1986 WJC. As far as best on best tournaments go, he was just never good enough to be a realistic consideration. Healthy issues made him even less likely. Canada always had better scorers to choose from, and he wasn't exactly an elite defensive role player either. If he wanted to play at the World Championships in a year like 1992 I'm sure Canada would have taken him.
well, not any of the actual canada cup/olympic years. but if there had been a best on best tournament the summer of '92, i can't imagine they wouldn't have taken roberts.

he was the highest goal scoring canadian-eligible player in the league (weirdly, the other guys in the top five were all team USA guys-- hull and kevin stevens finished ahead of roberts, roenick tied him, lafontaine was fifth). yzerman was #6 and he was a distant 8 goals behind roberts, robitaille 9 goals behind.

that would have been a year where you almost had to have put robitaille on the team too, even if it was keenan picking. but oates probably doesn't make the cut yet again.

in terms of LW, you'd have probably gone with roberts (50 goals/200 PIMs), robitaille, claude lemieux (career 40 goal season), and then a converted center or a guy who played center and wing (say, damphousse). i mean, roberts had 38 even strength goals, behind only hull in his last 70 goal year and three goals ahead of the next guy (stevens).

for a brief spell, roberts was one of the best power forwards in the game. behind kevin stevens and, when healthy, neely. but at that point he was above shanahan and nolan, who were both still emerging, and i'd put that brief peak roberts up there with the second tier of power forwards of the 90s, alongside peak tocchet, behind guys like shanny, nolan, tkachuk, neely, and stevens. everything went right for him, and he led the league in shooting percentage with an anomalous 27%. but when a guy in a roll like that, you put him on team canada (see: iginla in '02).

vadim sharifijanov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 06:31 PM
  #8
Darth Yoda
Registered User
 
Darth Yoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grovebranch's Crease
Country: Sweden
Posts: 2,752
vCash: 593
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackSlater View Post
Roberts played for Canada at the 1986 WJC. As far as best on best tournaments go, he was just never good enough to be a realistic consideration. Healthy issues made him even less likely. Canada always had better scorers to choose from, and he wasn't exactly an elite defensive role player either. If he wanted to play at the World Championships in a year like 1992 I'm sure Canada would have taken him.
I dont know if he even was invited to a possible camp in 1991. If he had that very well could have meant exit for a guy like Geoff Courtnall if Team Canada only knew what season Roberts was about to have. Of course Canada won anyhow and that's pretty much the case more times as well.

Darth Yoda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 06:46 PM
  #9
JackSlater
Registered User
 
JackSlater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,792
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by vadim sharifijanov View Post
well, not any of the actual canada cup/olympic years. but if there had been a best on best tournament the summer of '92, i can't imagine they wouldn't have taken roberts.

he was the highest goal scoring canadian-eligible player in the league (weirdly, the other guys in the top five were all team USA guys-- hull and kevin stevens finished ahead of roberts, roenick tied him, lafontaine was fifth). yzerman was #6 and he was a distant 8 goals behind roberts, robitaille 9 goals behind.

that would have been a year where you almost had to have put robitaille on the team too, even if it was keenan picking. but oates probably doesn't make the cut yet again.

in terms of LW, you'd have probably gone with roberts (50 goals/200 PIMs), robitaille, claude lemieux (career 40 goal season), and then a converted center or a guy who played center and wing (say, damphousse). i mean, roberts had 38 even strength goals, behind only hull in his last 70 goal year and three goals ahead of the next guy (stevens).

for a brief spell, roberts was one of the best power forwards in the game. behind kevin stevens and, when healthy, neely. but at that point he was above shanahan and nolan, who were both still emerging, and i'd put that brief peak roberts up there with the second tier of power forwards of the 90s, alongside peak tocchet, behind guys like shanny, nolan, tkachuk, neely, and stevens. everything went right for him, and he led the league in shooting percentage with an anomalous 27%. but when a guy in a roll like that, you put him on team canada (see: iginla in '02).
Yes, the problem was just that he never approached that play in the years of big tournaments. If 1992 Roberts could show up for the 1996 World Cup team, he makes it over several.

JackSlater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-29-2012, 06:52 PM
  #10
MS
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 11,850
vCash: 500
Roberts' time as an elite international-class player was very short (3 seasons from 1991-94) and there wasn't a major international tourney in those three off-seasons. If NHL players had been allowed at the 1992 and 1994 Olympics he would have had a very strong chance of selection for both.

He was basically injured full-time from 1994-97 and then was just nowhere near Team Canada quality after his comeback.

MS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2012, 02:31 PM
  #11
Fire Julien
Registered User
 
Fire Julien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Bergen
Country: Norway
Posts: 17,183
vCash: 1340
Major cheap-shot artist, so he lost every ounce of respect amongst the heads of Hockey Canada.

Fire Julien is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2012, 02:50 PM
  #12
Eisen
Registered User
 
Eisen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Eugene
Country: Germany
Posts: 6,331
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caballo Blanco View Post
Major cheap-shot artist, so he lost every ounce of respect amongst the heads of Hockey Canada.
I never heard that before.

Eisen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2012, 05:49 PM
  #13
Big Phil
Registered User
 
Big Phil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,012
vCash: 500
Honestly, is he a worse choice than Shayne Corson in (pick em) 1991 or 1998? I don't think he is. Roberts already had a 72 point season in 1990 and while he dropped a bit in 1991 it wasn't as if Keenan was picking an all skill team. He chose a lot of pluggers and grinders over the likes of Yzerman, Oates, Sakic, etc. I'd say by 2002 he was too old and would have looked out of place although he did have that wonderful playoff in 2002. But I don't think he looks out of place in 1998. 1996 he was basically retired (temporarily) with his neck. In 1991 he would have looked fine on there. I mean, Russ Courtnall somehow cracked that team. You know one thing about Roberts, he would play 110%.

Big Phil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2012, 06:15 PM
  #14
vadim sharifijanov
Registered User
 
vadim sharifijanov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 8,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
Honestly, is he a worse choice than Shayne Corson in (pick em) 1991 or 1998? I don't think he is. Roberts already had a 72 point season in 1990 and while he dropped a bit in 1991 it wasn't as if Keenan was picking an all skill team. He chose a lot of pluggers and grinders over the likes of Yzerman, Oates, Sakic, etc. I'd say by 2002 he was too old and would have looked out of place although he did have that wonderful playoff in 2002. But I don't think he looks out of place in 1998. 1996 he was basically retired (temporarily) with his neck. In 1991 he would have looked fine on there. I mean, Russ Courtnall somehow cracked that team. You know one thing about Roberts, he would play 110%.
roberts could have played an energy role in '91, for sure. but corson and courtnall could do that and play excellent defense.

to me, the really confusing thing about '91 is he goes out of his way to grab pat burns guys-- even takes a very unproven desjardins-- but leaves carbonneau at home.

vadim sharifijanov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2012, 06:18 PM
  #15
TheDevilMadeMe
Global Moderator
 
TheDevilMadeMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Brooklyn
Country: United States
Posts: 37,796
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
Honestly, is he a worse choice than Shayne Corson in (pick em) 1991 or 1998? I don't think he is. Roberts already had a 72 point season in 1990 and while he dropped a bit in 1991 it wasn't as if Keenan was picking an all skill team. He chose a lot of pluggers and grinders over the likes of Yzerman, Oates, Sakic, etc. I'd say by 2002 he was too old and would have looked out of place although he did have that wonderful playoff in 2002. But I don't think he looks out of place in 1998. 1996 he was basically retired (temporarily) with his neck. In 1991 he would have looked fine on there. I mean, Russ Courtnall somehow cracked that team. You know one thing about Roberts, he would play 110%.
Corson was a much better penalty killer than Roberts though, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vadim sharifijanov View Post
roberts could have played an energy role in '91, for sure. but corson and courtnall could do that and play excellent defense.
I guess this is the reasoning.

Quote:
to me, the really confusing thing about '91 is he goes out of his way to grab pat burns guys-- even takes a very unproven desjardins-- but leaves carbonneau at home.
I guess because Carbs was a center. They seemed to be okay picking grinding wingers but they wanted centers who could create offense. Just a guess based on looking at the selections over time.

TheDevilMadeMe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-30-2012, 08:52 PM
  #16
Big Phil
Registered User
 
Big Phil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,012
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Corson was a much better penalty killer than Roberts though, right?
I guess, if that was Keenan's tipping point

Big Phil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-01-2012, 02:13 AM
  #17
I Hate Chris Butler
Backlund Fan Club
 
I Hate Chris Butler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Saskatchewan
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,021
vCash: 50
Roberts didn't make Team Canada because there were always better options. You can argue that he might've been a bigger physical presence than Theo Fleury in 2002, but that would be a bit of a stretch. Maybe over Nolan? But Nolan had 66 points that year IIRC.

I Hate Chris Butler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-01-2012, 09:49 AM
  #18
Marotte Marauder
Registered User
 
Marotte Marauder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,569
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caballo Blanco View Post
Major cheap-shot artist, so he lost every ounce of respect amongst the heads of Hockey Canada.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisen View Post
I never heard that before.
I recall him as a brutal hack as well and was glad injuries finally got the better of him.

Marotte Marauder is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:34 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.