HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New Jersey Devils
Notices

News from Around the League - Part XXXV - I'll see you in court!

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-06-2012, 07:39 AM
  #326
CerebralGenesis
Registered User
 
CerebralGenesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 23,530
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Classic Devil View Post
I like that system. It would kill the Parise/Kovalchuk/Suter/Luongo/etc contracts.
I like it too. At 27 and losing a player is developing him and losing all of the years on the peak and down the other end. Not gonna lie, they seem super close.

CerebralGenesis is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 07:39 AM
  #327
NJDevs26
Moderator
Status quo
 
NJDevs26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 22,537
vCash: 500
Outlawing backdiving/variance and limiting signing bonus kills the monstrosity contracts too, without term limits.

On paper I like the 5-7 difference because in theory it gives an advantage to teams retaining their own players, but in reality it's just going to lead to the farcical 'sign and trades' that the NBA has so that the player can get his 7-year deal, especially without the ability to overpay the way you do in the NBA with their soft cap.

NJDevs26 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 07:51 AM
  #328
Richer's Ghost
Moderator
awww summertime
 
Richer's Ghost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: photoshop labor camp
Country: United States
Posts: 47,518
vCash: 425
How about put a negotiation clause that at the expiration of the next CBA each party must have a federal mediator assigned to each side and a third neutral will oversee it all if a new agreement is not reached by the start of the pre-season and they alone will negotiate the terms of the agreement with guidance from the two sides and their legal counsel. After 10 days the mediators will draft a final agreement and it will stand as a working agreement to keep the season going unless the NHLPA and Owners can reach a subsequent agreement that would supercede the mediated working agreement to avoid a work stoppage.

No Stoppage Clause.

__________________

Ball pits are just toilets filled with brightly colored balls instead of water.
Richer's Ghost is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 08:23 AM
  #329
manilaNJ
Optimism: Unwavering
 
manilaNJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: New Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 5,268
vCash: 500
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl-l...ners_proposal/

Quote:
But tension between the two sides has run high at times.

At one point the owners threatened to take the offer off the table, indicating they were frustrated with the lack of flexibility on the players side, who have been waiting for the owners to make the kind of move they did last night.

According to sources close to the negotiation it was Buffalo Sabres goalie Ryan Miller who lost his temper briefly, which seemed to encourage further dialogue, although at another point Boston Bruins hard line owner Jeremy Jacobs threatened to leave the negotiation. At that point a more moderate group of owners including the Pittsburgh Penguins' Ron Burkle and the Tampa Bay Lightning's Jeff Vinik agreed to keep the negotiation going.
I guess this is where all the negative vibes came from last night. But it's positive, at this point, that no one did storm out and that negotiations proceeded despite high tempers.
They're onto something, finally.

Edit to add:
Katie Strang ‏@KatieStrangESPN
#CBA One source characterized yesterday's session as "bizarre," and said two sides closer in some ways, further apart on others


Last edited by manilaNJ: 12-06-2012 at 08:28 AM.
manilaNJ is online now  
Old
12-06-2012, 09:20 AM
  #330
apice3*
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Middletown, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 18,520
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Outlawing backdiving/variance and limiting signing bonus kills the monstrosity contracts too, without term limits.

On paper I like the 5-7 difference because in theory it gives an advantage to teams retaining their own players, but in reality it's just going to lead to the farcical 'sign and trades' that the NBA has so that the player can get his 7-year deal, especially without the ability to overpay the way you do in the NBA with their soft cap.
Right but that would benefit teams losing their stars. Teams wouldn't be left empty handed.

It could also prevent a Minnesota situation this year. Would they be able to sign Parise and Suter to max contracts while giving up assets for each of them?

I threw this idea around months ago. It makes the most sense to eliminate backdiving contracts.

apice3* is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 09:24 AM
  #331
apice3*
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Middletown, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 18,520
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richer's Ghost View Post
How about put a negotiation clause that at the expiration of the next CBA each party must have a federal mediator assigned to each side and a third neutral will oversee it all if a new agreement is not reached by the start of the pre-season and they alone will negotiate the terms of the agreement with guidance from the two sides and their legal counsel. After 10 days the mediators will draft a final agreement and it will stand as a working agreement to keep the season going unless the NHLPA and Owners can reach a subsequent agreement that would supercede the mediated working agreement to avoid a work stoppage.

No Stoppage Clause.
Judging by the willingness to let the lockout go on this long, I doubt either side really cares about a future lockout.

apice3* is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 09:27 AM
  #332
NJDevs26
Moderator
Status quo
 
NJDevs26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 22,537
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by apice3 View Post
Right but that would benefit teams losing their stars. Teams wouldn't be left empty handed.

It could also prevent a Minnesota situation this year. Would they be able to sign Parise and Suter to max contracts while giving up assets for each of them?

I threw this idea around months ago. It makes the most sense to eliminate backdiving contracts.
Miami did with LeBron and Bosh, got them both for very close to max deals because of sign and trades. That doesn't usually give back much to the teams though, first rounders are worthless in the NBA unless they're not lottery protected so the equivalent would be a third or fourth rounder in the NHL.

NJDevs26 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 09:28 AM
  #333
Jersey Man
Mad Dog
 
Jersey Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 14,213
vCash: 500
this whole thing is a joke. divas having temper tantrums is all i can make out of this.

Jersey Man is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 09:53 AM
  #334
apice3*
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Middletown, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 18,520
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Miami did with LeBron and Bosh, got them both for very close to max deals because of sign and trades. That doesn't usually give back much to the teams though, first rounders are worthless in the NBA unless they're not lottery protected so the equivalent would be a third or fourth rounder in the NHL.
The difference between an NBA max contract and a standard FA contract is only one year, and injuries are less frequent than the NHL. Players aren't really forced into re-signing with a team so the trade price in a sign-and-trade is fairly low.

In the NHL, the difference will be 2 years and with players getting injured all the time, the demand for a sign-and-trade would be higher. It kind of forces the hand of the player: you want to leave? fine. Enjoy less guaranteed money. If you want that money, you better convince your suitor to match our asking price.

Besides, I'd rather have Minnesota's 3rd rounder right now than nothing at all. I'd also be pretty bitter towards the whole situation so if Minnesota wouldn't offer more than what I truly wanted, I'd tell Parise to piss off and enjoy his 5 year deal.

Also, in the NBA you can win with those 3 super stars because the NBA only uses 8-10 players a game, with 4-5 players getting the bulk of those minutes, and the league is about 8 teams deep. In the NHL, you need significant minutes out of MINIMUM 16 players and contributions from all 19 in the playoffs.

TL;DR - Two totally different sports. I believe it'll work even better in the NHL than the NBA, from an owner's standpoint.

apice3* is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 10:54 AM
  #335
britdevil
Tea with milk...
 
britdevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Internets.
Posts: 18,836
vCash: 500
What a joke this has become.

Just get on with it...

britdevil is online now  
Old
12-06-2012, 11:38 AM
  #336
Sir Fenwick Corsi
N U M B E R S
 
Sir Fenwick Corsi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 3,446
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by britdevil View Post
What a joke this has become.

Just get on with it...
Oh, its definitely a joke alright, but this has been a joke from the very damn start.

I just can't feel positive about this league. At all. One of two things will result from these most recent meetings. It'll either all blow up in typical NHL fashion, or they'll finally settle and we'll be rewarded an injury riddled **** product.

The ignorance that fans will need to have to actually stomach this business is what really pisses me off more than anything.

Sir Fenwick Corsi is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:18 PM
  #337
onefatsurfer
I speak in code
 
onefatsurfer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Jersey Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 9,211
vCash: 500
LOL, they want the mediators back. And there we are, back where we started

onefatsurfer is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:50 PM
  #338
NJDevs26
Moderator
Status quo
 
NJDevs26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 22,537
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by onefatsurfer View Post
LOL, they want the mediators back. And there we are, back where we started
Classic Fehr stall tactic again, now this is really doomed. He wants to destroy the owners and the players are dragging each other down the cliff.

NJDevs26 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:52 PM
  #339
Scottyk9
Goals? Please!
 
Scottyk9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: East Rutherford, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 24,885
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Scottyk9
Quote:
Originally Posted by onefatsurfer View Post
LOL, they want the mediators back. And there we are, back where we started
Not at all the mediators told the NHL and NHLPA bring us back when you make some progress and feel the time is right.

Is the time right is the only question left.

Scottyk9 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 01:59 PM
  #340
Blackhawkswincup
Global Moderator
 
Blackhawkswincup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chicagoland
Country: United States
Posts: 100,800
vCash: 340
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Classic Fehr stall tactic again, now this is really doomed. He wants to destroy the owners and the players are dragging each other down the cliff.
False

The stars/hardliners are pushing the rest of union off

If this NHL offer went to vote I have no doubt it would be approved by majority ,, Problem is that Fehr and his minions will never allow it


Last edited by Blackhawkswincup: 12-06-2012 at 02:20 PM.
Blackhawkswincup is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 02:03 PM
  #341
onefatsurfer
I speak in code
 
onefatsurfer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Jersey Shore
Country: United States
Posts: 9,211
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
False

The stars/hardliners are pushing the rest of union off

If this NHL offer went to vote I have no doubt it would be approved by majority ,, Problem is that Fehr and his minions will never allow it
I still don't understand why the majority even allows the stars to push them around. The second that games are cancelled, the majority loses. Only the stars can possibly make back what they've lost from the cancelled games.

Probably because they're all morons who have been groomed to be athletes and not think about anything else.

onefatsurfer is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 02:08 PM
  #342
apice3*
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Middletown, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 18,520
vCash: 500
ill be in devils attendance the day the league is back. Its not ignorance. I watch the sport for entertainment, not fan appreciation. Nascar treat their fans like gold. Doesnt mean its fun to watch.

I wish the league treated us better, but it wont really bother me once the game is back honestly.

apice3* is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 02:09 PM
  #343
NJDevs26
Moderator
Status quo
 
NJDevs26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 22,537
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
False

The stars/hardliners are pushing the rest of union off

If this NHL offer went to vote I have no doubt it would be approved by majority ,, Problem is that Fehr and his minions will never allow it
Maybe they need the mediators for themselves lol. I didn't think it was possible to detest anyone more than Bettman, but at least he's only sunk one sport. Fehr's going for the double play. This ain't 1970 and the reserve clause, folks.

NJDevs26 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 02:13 PM
  #344
NJDevs26
Moderator
Status quo
 
NJDevs26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 22,537
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by apice3 View Post
ill be in devils attendance the day the league is back. Its not ignorance. I watch the sport for entertainment, not fan appreciation. Nascar treat their fans like gold. Doesnt mean its fun to watch.

I wish the league treated us better, but it wont really bother me once the game is back honestly.
I'm contractually obligated to be there, and in time I'll be able to shelve all this nonsense but I ain't going to lie, right now I can't picture being excited for Opening Night the way I was even two days ago.

I'll be back but I'm seriously thinking of selling one of my two seats for Opening Night to get my money back and just no-showing with my ticket. A symbolic gesture to be sure, but I gotta do something at this point. I'm tired of all these jack***** right now.

NJDevs26 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 02:33 PM
  #345
Sir Fenwick Corsi
N U M B E R S
 
Sir Fenwick Corsi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 3,446
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by apice3 View Post
ill be in devils attendance the day the league is back. Its not ignorance. I watch the sport for entertainment, not fan appreciation. Nascar treat their fans like gold. Doesnt mean its fun to watch.

I wish the league treated us better, but it wont really bother me once the game is back honestly.
You do have to be ignorant. I'm not judging anybody for it, just saying.

Think about it. Yeah, the NHL provides the highest level of hockey (kinda ironic statement huh?) People enjoy it. I get it. But to continue doing that, you have to completely put aside all the negative ******** associated with this league. And there is A LOT of it.

Yeah, it's okay that the league treats its paying customers like **** and operates like a bush league. Who cares? That's perfectly fine as long as I get my hockey! Well **** that noise. If you can honestly sit through 3 work stoppages and not feel slighted in the least, well more power to you. No way I can be that forgiving. Not after all of the money I spent on these divas the last 18 years. These dickheads should all be part of a soap opera at this point.

Point is, as much a I love hockey and the Devils, I'd literally have to be dead to not be offended by how they have treated the fans, arena and team employees, local businesses and the sport through all of this. It's disgraceful and it takes away from what makes you love the game in the first place. And I'll be thinking about it every damn time I see an NHL related product (game, clothing, etc.)

Sir Fenwick Corsi is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 02:46 PM
  #346
BenedictGomez
1995/2000/2003
 
BenedictGomez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: PRNJ
Country: United States
Posts: 26,249
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nona weisbaum View Post
Point is, as much a I love hockey and the Devils, I'd literally have to be dead to not be offended by how they have treated the fans, arena and team employees, local businesses and the sport through all of this. It's disgraceful and it takes away from what makes you love the game in the first place. And I'll be thinking about it every damn time I see an NHL related product (game, clothing, etc.)
I'm pretty much there. I'm the sort who is either at or watching at home almost every Devils game of the season. I miss maybe 3 to 5 games per years due to travel or non-missalbe engagement. And I honestly dont care. I'll watch (from TV) the first game back, but I can already tell I'm not going to watch every Devils game this season, I'm just sick of the NHL's stupidity and the Union's greed.

I think I'm at the same place where the serious MLB fans were back in the 90s, it took baseball a LONG time to recover from that (some folks say MLB still hasn't fully recovered). I have no idea what to expect, but if I'm any sort of an indicator this will not be like the last lockout when NHL attendance was record setting as soon as play resumed.

BenedictGomez is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 02:55 PM
  #347
Getzo5
The Punisher
 
Getzo5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Presov, SVK
Country: Slovakia
Posts: 21,973
vCash: 500




Holy LOL I lost it.

Getzo5 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 03:20 PM
  #348
njdevils1982
Chico for HOF!!!
 
njdevils1982's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: North of Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,182
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingman77 View Post
@_TyAnderson: BREAKING: With a glass of water on it, Podium now has more Cups than the Vancouver Canucks and Buffalo Sabres. #podiumwatch
eat that sabres.

njdevils1982 is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 03:20 PM
  #349
Richer's Ghost
Moderator
awww summertime
 
Richer's Ghost's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: photoshop labor camp
Country: United States
Posts: 47,518
vCash: 425


might have to just move directly to NHL14 at this point...

Richer's Ghost is offline  
Old
12-06-2012, 04:51 PM
  #350
apice3*
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Middletown, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 18,520
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nona weisbaum View Post
You do have to be ignorant. I'm not judging anybody for it, just saying.

Think about it. Yeah, the NHL provides the highest level of hockey (kinda ironic statement huh?) People enjoy it. I get it. But to continue doing that, you have to completely put aside all the negative ******** associated with this league. And there is A LOT of it.

Yeah, it's okay that the league treats its paying customers like **** and operates like a bush league. Who cares? That's perfectly fine as long as I get my hockey! Well **** that noise. If you can honestly sit through 3 work stoppages and not feel slighted in the least, well more power to you. No way I can be that forgiving. Not after all of the money I spent on these divas the last 18 years. These dickheads should all be part of a soap opera at this point.

Point is, as much a I love hockey and the Devils, I'd literally have to be dead to not be offended by how they have treated the fans, arena and team employees, local businesses and the sport through all of this. It's disgraceful and it takes away from what makes you love the game in the first place. And I'll be thinking about it every damn time I see an NHL related product (game, clothing, etc.)
So you're telling me that if hockey comes back and the Devils make the Cup finals, you won't be excited for it?

apice3* is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:03 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.