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Isles to Brooklyn 2015 Part III **Preseason Game v Devils 9-21-13

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Old
06-20-2013, 05:38 PM
  #901
Dutch Frost
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Originally Posted by HawksIsles View Post
Now I understand why max capacity for hockey will only be 14K+.
Pretty much all seats left of the left blueline will be badly obstructed
Cant wait for the "CANT SEE ****" CHANTS!!!!

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06-20-2013, 06:18 PM
  #902
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch Frost View Post
Cant wait for the "CANT SEE ****" CHANTS!!!!
In for one "I followed this team from the Dumpiseum and all I got was this horrible sight-line" t-shirt

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06-20-2013, 07:30 PM
  #903
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The reason none of the NVC proposals are no more than 13,000+ seats is that this is only a renovation of the existing structure. Not a new structure.
In order to hold luxury suites a lot of current sections will be lost and there will be no more space to add seating.

As far as Barclays goes. Beggars cant be choosers. If you have lemons got to figure a way to make lemonade.
Possible improvements:
1. Oviously first is center the scoreboard
2.center the rink as much as possible. This is very doable though it wont increase seating it will be a more symmetrical arena.

3.Add rotational chairs in some angular sections such as 4 and 24.

Lets get creative and bounce creative ideas on possible improvements.

Remember:scinics, critics and snarks never built a thing.They build themselves up by critizing putting down because they have no balls, brains or imagination.

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06-20-2013, 07:37 PM
  #904
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Originally Posted by davidd View Post
The reason none of the NVC proposals are no more than 13,000+ seats is that this is only a renovation of the existing structure. Not a new structure.
In order to hold luxury suites a lot of current sections will be lost and there will be no more space to add seating.

As far as Barclays goes. Beggars cant be choosers. If you have lemons got to figure a way to make lemonade.
Possible improvements:
1. Oviously first is center the scoreboard
2.center the rink as much as possible. This is very doable though it wont increase seating it will be a more symmetrical arena.

3.Add rotational chairs in some angular sections such as 4 and 24.

Lets get creative and bounce creative ideas on possible improvements.

Remember:scinics, critics and snarks never built a thing.They build themselves up by critizing putting down because they have no balls, brains or imagination.
Hear! Hear! Great first post! And welcome aboard "misspelled David"

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06-20-2013, 08:08 PM
  #905
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The reason none of the NVC proposals are no more than 13,000+ seats is that this is only a renovation of the existing structure. Not a new structure.
In order to hold luxury suites a lot of current sections will be lost and there will be no more space to add seating.

As far as Barclays goes. Beggars cant be choosers. If you have lemons got to figure a way to make lemonade.
Possible improvements:
1. Oviously first is center the scoreboard
2.center the rink as much as possible. This is very doable though it wont increase seating it will be a more symmetrical arena.

3.Add rotational chairs in some angular sections such as 4 and 24.

Lets get creative and bounce creative ideas on possible improvements.

Remember:scinics, critics and snarks never built a thing.They build themselves up by critizing putting down because they have no balls, brains or imagination.
Ok, take the end with no seats and build double-decker luxury boxes against the glass. Could easily get two rows of 5 or 6 stacked on top of each other I would think. Would be the coolest boxes in the league. Could build them so you just wheel them in in modular fashion, attach them, then wheel them back out when done.

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Old
06-20-2013, 08:36 PM
  #906
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Originally Posted by davidd View Post
The reason none of the NVC proposals are no more than 13,000+ seats is that this is only a renovation of the existing structure. Not a new structure.
In order to hold luxury suites a lot of current sections will be lost and there will be no more space to add seating.

As far as Barclays goes. Beggars cant be choosers. If you have lemons got to figure a way to make lemonade.
Possible improvements:
1. Oviously first is center the scoreboard
2.center the rink as much as possible. This is very doable though it wont increase seating it will be a more symmetrical arena.

3.Add rotational chairs in some angular sections such as 4 and 24.

Lets get creative and bounce creative ideas on possible improvements.

Remember:scinics, critics and snarks never built a thing.They build themselves up by critizing putting down because they have no balls, brains or imagination.
Want advice from a cynic? How about realizing these facts:

The seats are already steep. The upper mezzanine areas will have a good view on one side and no/very limited view of the circles back. Center the rink and both ends of the arena will have obstructed viewing and only the side and some of the corners of the arena will have full view of the ice.

A suggestion to make the seats steeper to allow full viewing on both sides came up with me. The seats are already quite steep I see, so making them steeper to allow both sides good viewing makes a potential danger for seniors and children a danger for everyone and a threat for seniors and children.

Knocking the wall down and expanding the arena is the only fix, unless the NHL will allow a shorter rink.

Just call the move to Brooklyn what it is:

stupid. Shortsighted. Not well thought out.


The horse shoe, after one considers the monumental costs of fixing the arena to make it bigger, buying land to make the extension and retrofitting the framework and so on will cost more than plans to build a new arena on LI. Yes, demolishing and making improvements on the Barclays will cost more than building a new arena on LI. Anyone who wants to debate this, I'm all ears.

We just have to live with it or hope Prokorov and Ratner get sh**faced and sign something stupid one summer to fix the mess.

Or Ratner makes the Coliseum seat 16,000 plus and we move back.

I'm just wondering why it took so many so long to think about how awful the building's layout is in BK. It's been discussed.

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Old
06-21-2013, 12:18 AM
  #907
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We all thought with the move to Brooklyn the Isles would be able to attract star players....not with an arena looking like that though

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06-21-2013, 12:52 AM
  #908
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^Players dont care what the arena looks like, as long as the lockerroom is modern. Thats why new arenas make the team more attractive.

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06-21-2013, 02:11 AM
  #909
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Originally Posted by Dutch Frost View Post
Cant wait for the "CANT SEE ****" CHANTS!!!!
I had to laugh at that....awesome.

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Old
06-21-2013, 02:13 AM
  #910
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Look at the bottom left of the screen here. Those seats in the first few rows are going to have to completely TURN AROUND to see the play in the corner near them. Thats awful. Fans are going to pay money to have to turn around to see whats happening behind them?
The fans in the obstructed areas can look at the scoreboard videotron when play is in the near zone....

....if they can see the scoreboard on the other end of the ice.

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Old
06-21-2013, 02:14 AM
  #911
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They are just colors, who cares.

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Old
06-21-2013, 02:33 AM
  #912
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They are just colors, who cares.
I do. Want the Yankees in orange and teal? Giants in red and gold? Raiders in hot pink and silver? {actually, I'd love that one just to irritate thugs/gangstas}

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Old
06-21-2013, 06:57 AM
  #913
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Originally Posted by davidd View Post
The reason none of the NVC proposals are no more than 13,000+ seats is that this is only a renovation of the existing structure. Not a new structure.
In order to hold luxury suites a lot of current sections will be lost and there will be no more space to add seating.

As far as Barclays goes. Beggars cant be choosers. If you have lemons got to figure a way to make lemonade.
Possible improvements:
1. Oviously first is center the scoreboard
2.center the rink as much as possible. This is very doable though it wont increase seating it will be a more symmetrical arena.

3.Add rotational chairs in some angular sections such as 4 and 24.

Lets get creative and bounce creative ideas on possible improvements.

Remember:scinics, critics and snarks never built a thing.They build themselves up by critizing putting down because they have no balls, brains or imagination.
One thing would just be to raise the scoreboard up to the ceiling like they do during circuses (man, was that a setup line) and install a large HD video screen that can come down over the curtain where the unused upper sections are behind the one goal. Football and baseball get along fine without a scoreboard over the playing surface. Make it an indoor version of the Dallas Cowboys big screen and turn a negative into a positive. And you'd be killing two birds with one stone by adding a one of a kind amenity while visually removing the unsightly void above and behind the goal. That also happens to be the end where the stage is during concert setups, so having a huge HD screen available over the stage is a natural.

I agree with OTH that it would take major structural improvements to really SOLVE the issues, so I think as you said they need to get creative to add some seats (500-1000) and mask the visual weirdness.

edit: BTW, by "large HD video screen" I mean something that's proportionate to the width of the rink. Maybe like 50-ish feet (over an 85 foot wide rink). That would be pretty cool.


Last edited by doublechili: 06-21-2013 at 07:00 AM. Reason: add clarification
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Old
06-21-2013, 10:45 AM
  #914
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Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
Want advice from a cynic? How about realizing these facts:

The seats are already steep. The upper mezzanine areas will have a good view on one side and no/very limited view of the circles back. Center the rink and both ends of the arena will have obstructed viewing and only the side and some of the corners of the arena will have full view of the ice.

A suggestion to make the seats steeper to allow full viewing on both sides came up with me. The seats are already quite steep I see, so making them steeper to allow both sides good viewing makes a potential danger for seniors and children a danger for everyone and a threat for seniors and children.

Knocking the wall down and expanding the arena is the only fix, unless the NHL will allow a shorter rink.

Just call the move to Brooklyn what it is:

stupid. Shortsighted. Not well thought out.


The horse shoe, after one considers the monumental costs of fixing the arena to make it bigger, buying land to make the extension and retrofitting the framework and so on will cost more than plans to build a new arena on LI. Yes, demolishing and making improvements on the Barclays will cost more than building a new arena on LI. Anyone who wants to debate this, I'm all ears.

We just have to live with it or hope Prokorov and Ratner get sh**faced and sign something stupid one summer to fix the mess.

Or Ratner makes the Coliseum seat 16,000 plus and we move back.

I'm just wondering why it took so many so long to think about how awful the building's layout is in BK. It's been discussed.
Agree

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Old
06-21-2013, 12:28 PM
  #915
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Wow some of you guys have awesome ideas on fixes and renovations of Barclays. Maybe someone can start a new thread. I dont know how. I like the big screen idea and mobile suites.
The seats cant be made any steeper though that's for sure. Ive been there and its already scary steep.

That being said, there is some great solutions and opportunities here and they can be communicated to the people in charge. Eventually there will be enough stink that Barclays will have no choice but to make changes/improvements.

Nassau Coliseum request for proposals are interior and exterior renovations not a new stadium. The reason they cant make it a 16,000 seat arena is that they have to work with the existing structure. In order to make the renovated coliseum profitable luxury suites are needed.
In order to add these suites a lot of existing seating sections have to be replaced. This is the reason most of the proposals have 13,000+ seating capacity. The more seats, the less profit. The less profit the less likely any company will want to renovate.

I too cant figure out why they just didn't propose for a new arena.

The reason there isnt a new Coliseum and the reason Barclays center is the way it is, is some self-interested politicians &
NYMBYS. Barclays was slated to be a 20,000 seat first class stadium. Years of litigation and the 2008 crash took their toll. Forest city stock dived from almost 40/share to $10. Its a miracle anything got built at all. If it wasnt for a russian billionare jumping in at the last minute there would be no Nets or Islanders in New York.

Take a look at what could have been.


Below: Original 20,000 Seat Design of Barclays Center Bowl including Hockey configuration.




Original Barclays Center Ghery Design with ice skating rink on the roof.


In development, politics as in life there is always a struggle between those who want to build, try new things and those who feel power by crushing visions,stopping them.

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Old
06-21-2013, 12:39 PM
  #916
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Originally Posted by davidd View Post
Wow some of you guys have awesome ideas on fixes and renovations of Barclays. Maybe someone can start a new thread. I dont know how. I like the big screen idea and mobile suites.
The seats cant be made any steeper though that's for sure. Ive been there and its already scary steep.

That being said, there is some great solutions and opportunities here and they can be communicated to the people in charge. Eventually there will be enough stink that Barclays will have no choice but to make changes/improvements.

Nassau Coliseum request for proposals are interior and exterior renovations not a new stadium. The reason they cant make it a 16,000 seat arena is that they have to work with the existing structure. In order to make the renovated coliseum profitable luxury suites are needed.
In order to add these suites a lot of existing seating sections have to be replaced. This is the reason most of the proposals have 13,000+ seating capacity. The more seats, the less profit. The less profit the less likely any company will want to renovate.

I too cant figure out why they just didn't propose for a new arena.

The reason there isnt a new Coliseum and the reason Barclays center is the way it is, is some self-interested politicians &
NYMBYS. Barclays was slated to be a 20,000 seat first class stadium. Years of litigation and the 2008 crash took their toll. Forest city stock dived from almost 40/share to $10. Its a miracle anything got built at all. If it wasnt for a russian billionare jumping in at the last minute there would be no Nets or Islanders in New York.

Take a look at what could have been.


Below: Original 20,000 Seat Design of Barclays Center Bowl including Hockey configuration.




Original Barclays Center Ghery Design with ice skating rink on the roof.


In development, politics as in life there is always a struggle between those who want to build, try new things and those who feel power by crushing visions,stopping them.
Interesting, I totally forgot about that period of scaling back and doubt if it would even get done. solid post

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06-21-2013, 01:15 PM
  #917
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Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
Want advice from a cynic? How about realizing these facts:


Just call the move to Brooklyn what it is:

stupid. Shortsighted. Not well thought out.
What was the alternative?
Voters had said no to a new Coliseum. The only thing I can think of was to signing a shorter term lease in the hope something gets done on Nassau. However the Isles where in a very weak position to negotiate.
Not everybody can have Kate Upton as their wife or girlfriend. A lot of you guys know you have to make due with what you have .
Because you cant have Kate Upton are you going to marry your hand?
True the Barclays is an ugly duckling but The Islanders are no spring beauty either.

In this age of entitlements its hard to understand that beggars cant be choosers. Just make the best with what you have. Be pro active and creative and you will get further than you imagined.

In the end of the day nobody's home is ideal but a home is a home.


Like that Rolling Stones song goes " You cant always get what you want"
http://youtu.be/tKeSRsy2l9E


Last edited by davidd: 06-21-2013 at 01:24 PM.
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Old
06-21-2013, 01:23 PM
  #918
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What was the alternative?
Voters had said no to a new Coliseum. The only thing I can think of was to signing a shorter term lease in the hope something gets done on Nassau. However the Isles where in a very weak position to negotiate.
Not everybody can have Kate Upton as their wife or girlfriend. A lot of you guys know you have to make due with what you have .
Because you cant have Kate Upton are you going to marry your hand?
True the Barclays is an ugly duckling but The Islanders are no spring beauty either.

In this age of entitlements its hard to understand that beggars cant be choosers. Just make the best with what you have. Be pro active and creative and you will get further than you imagined.

In the end of the day nobody's home is ideal but a home is a home.


Like that Rolling Stones song goes " You cant always get what you want"
The question looms, though.....do we cut and run in 2012 for Brooklyn knowing it's a four door car with legroom fit for amputees in the back or do we try the last two years to continue the fight?

Politicians, Murray, Ratner, whoever....the mess is all on the foot of one loser who can't and will not work with anyone.

Charles B Wang.

So...we have a shack, at least we can sleep in it, but I prefer the ugly 4 bedroom home with the high taxes to the cheaper hovel with a nice food court.

Nothing can be done....but we can now judge the move more each passing day as stupid. And I'll recall fondly Bettman's promise that no historic teams will be allowed to move on his watch.....well before the "you almost lost your team" drivel when we rushed to sign in Brooklyn.

Just hope for the best and try not to sit in the obstructed QUARTER of the building.

More cash, MAYBE more spending. Remember, we still have Wang so I say he'll only spend the first two or three years than go cheap again when we relocate.

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06-21-2013, 01:38 PM
  #919
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A lot of what you say is true and you make a lot of good points.
Its important to remember nothing is forever.
In my opinion the more support and the more successful the Isles are in Brooklyn, the more leverage they will have in the future. Either for a new stadium/breaking the lease. or major renovations. If the Nassau stadium vote had happened in the 80's when the Isles where at their peak instead I think it would have passed.
Abandoning them once they move isn't very constructive. Just my opinion.

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06-21-2013, 02:11 PM
  #920
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A lot of what you say is true and you make a lot of good points.
Its important to remember nothing is forever.
In my opinion the more support and the more successful the Isles are in Brooklyn, the more leverage they will have in the future. Either for a new stadium/breaking the lease. or major renovations. If the Nassau stadium vote had happened in the 80's when the Isles where at their peak instead I think it would have passed.
Abandoning them once they move isn't very constructive. Just my opinion.
And this is an old point totally valid.

If the referendum vote were held in better times, with a better government in Nassau, with a better team......it gets done. But the vote comes when $21,000 property tax bills are not uncommon, business is scared of local, state and FEDERAL governing, spending is out of control, agencies are monitoring the County, etc. Yada. Yada. Yada.

So the Isles are going from a dump to a mess. A nicer mess. Time for the fans to demand the renovations be considered to bring them back, but.....we haven't played one game in the horseshoe.

I hope there's time for the discontent to be voiced and the need for a new arena to be vocalized. It's just seeming to be one stupid move after another with this friggen team.

But, for the record, I'm not jumping ship. Not even if they moved. Too many decades invested in my team to just up and quit.

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06-21-2013, 02:30 PM
  #921
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Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
And this is an old point totally valid.

If the referendum vote were held in better times, with a better government in Nassau, with a better team......it gets done. But the vote comes when $21,000 property tax bills are not uncommon, business is scared of local, state and FEDERAL governing, spending is out of control, agencies are monitoring the County, etc. Yada. Yada. Yada.

So the Isles are going from a dump to a mess. A nicer mess. Time for the fans to demand the renovations be considered to bring them back, but.....we haven't played one game in the horseshoe.

I hope there's time for the discontent to be voiced and the need for a new arena to be vocalized. It's just seeming to be one stupid move after another with this friggen team.

But, for the record, I'm not jumping ship. Not even if they moved. Too many decades invested in my team to just up and quit.
These pics have given me hope that the level of abomination in Brooklyn may be so appalling that an early return to Nassau becomes possible.

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06-21-2013, 02:42 PM
  #922
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These pics have given me hope that the level of abomination in Brooklyn may be so appalling that an early return to Nassau becomes possible.
I'm thinking probable.

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06-21-2013, 02:51 PM
  #923
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This thread title should be changed to 'Yomark should consider renovations...'

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06-21-2013, 03:05 PM
  #924
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Haven't seen this much misguided whining since Crosby.

When the dopey republicans killed the Lighthouse project and when nassau voters didn't want to pay 58 dollars a year for a new arena everything NYI including uniforms, logo, fans and name was fair game to change. Can't have it both ways.

To wonder where new fans will come from and to think only diehards will follow is comical. Marketing solves most of that. Being easily accessible to more people solves the rest. Being competitive is the icing on the cake. The move to Brooklyn is designed to have a new fan base. If there were so many local diehards the team never would've moved.
Don't you think that people who live in Brooklyn are already aware that there is a hockey team in Nassau county? The team moves a few miles to the west and all of a sudden we have to rebrand the team and get new fans. The people in Brooklyn should be happy that the New York Islanders (a team with a great history) are moving in to their borough. That in itself should be enough to get them to go to a game. A logo/color change is NOT necessary.

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06-21-2013, 03:05 PM
  #925
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This thread title should be changed to 'Yomark should consider renovations...'
but we don't want the black and white jerseys Yomark wants.

I asked my dog. He says they'd suck in black and white. He wishes he could see orange and blue, for full disclosure.

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