HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > National Hockey League Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
National Hockey League Talk Discuss NHL players, teams, games, and the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

How about them Caps

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-27-2012, 05:28 PM
  #1
Schalkenullvier*
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: tief im westen
Country: Germany
Posts: 4,590
vCash: 500
How about them Caps

What do they need to do to be succesful? Obviously you can just say that they went as far as ever post-lockout with last year's defensive system, but I don't think that is right. In my opinion, they were just as far away from the cup, if not more, as in the boudreau coached free-flowing times. What kind of system will Oates implement? Offensive, defensive, hybrid?

Did they make a (knee-jerk) mistake by trying to get more defensive after the Montreal series in 2010?

Some people will probably say that Ovi was they key to that offensive juggernaut and he's not what he used to be, but he's still a 40 goal guy. Him and Backstrom and Johanson and Laich and especially Ribeiro should make a very dangerous top 6 that should be one of the best scoring units in the league if they are set free to do their thing.

So what do you think, which system is more likely to bring succes to the caps, offensive juggernaut or relentless trapping?

Schalkenullvier* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 05:33 PM
  #2
mapes
Registered User
 
mapes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Halifax
Posts: 22,546
vCash: 500
In b4 "more Canadians"

Their problem is they have a bunch of inconsistent players. When they are on, they can compete with the best but Backs and Semin (obv gone now) come and go. Green has been hurt and whatnot, AO has fallen off. They have the talent to compete though

mapes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 07:25 PM
  #3
Bleedred
Dainius Zubrus
 
Bleedred's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Seminole Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 35,915
vCash: 500
Good luck to the Caps, as I have no ill will towards them or disliking at all. Though I myself, and many other Devils fans were not happy for the two years Adam Oates was an assistant for us. Our PP stunk for much of the time, and there was a point where we gave up 12 shorthanded goals early last season in less than two months.

If Ovi can get back to where he was before last year, and Holtby is nearly on the level he was last playoffs, and Oates is decent, I can see them being dominant.

Bleedred is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 08:16 PM
  #4
AfroThunder396
Lou's Secret Sauce
 
AfroThunder396's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamburg, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 22,895
vCash: 500
In my opinion, I honestly think Ovechkin is a bad leader and brings a poor locker room culture to the team.

People think he's a good leader because he's intense and hits people, but that's not what being captain is all about. I think he's got a rock star mentality and is more concerned about being cool and popular than he is about winning.

He's an incredibly talented player but I don't think he has the intangibles to lead his team to a championship.

AfroThunder396 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 08:32 PM
  #5
saskriders
ColinGreening's#1fan
 
saskriders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Calgary/Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,517
vCash: 500
Better D and a new captain (Backstrom maybe)

saskriders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 08:40 PM
  #6
leeaf83
HFBoards Sponsor
 
leeaf83's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,935
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to leeaf83 Send a message via Yahoo to leeaf83
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfroThunder396 View Post
In my opinion, I honestly think Ovechkin is a bad leader and brings a poor locker room culture to the team.

People think he's a good leader because he's intense and hits people, but that's not what being captain is all about. I think he's got a rock star mentality and is more concerned about being cool and popular than he is about winning.

He's an incredibly talented player but I don't think he has the intangibles to lead his team to a championship.

I get that he was under a bigger microscope last year but there was plenty of evidence of him quitting on Boudreau and Hunter. No doubt he dominates when he feels like it but he got caught going through the motions far too much.

Semin is unbelievably soft, I see him getting contained in the playoffs for most of his career.

With Green, it really depends how gutsy the other coach is; plenty put defensive forwards against him but some with guts realize it's a great matchup for their top line due to his poor defense.

leeaf83 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 09:08 PM
  #7
jack mullet
@jackmullethockey
 
jack mullet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Baxter, MN
Country: United States
Posts: 498
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by saskriders View Post
Better D and a new captain (Backstrom maybe)
taking the "C" off of Ovi is a sure fire way to divide a team. he has the "C", and he will until he is playing on another team.

jack mullet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 09:16 PM
  #8
Elever
Hth
 
Elever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,493
vCash: 500
I expect them to become the new Sharks. In fact they already are in a way though last season their regular season performance fell off a bit (just like the Sharks). They're the Eastern conference Sharks when it comes to talent leading to great performances in the season but not enough grit or "intangbiles" or whatever you wanna call it for the playoffs.

Also I found the whole Hamrlik/Brouwer/Neuvirth thing to be hilarious.

Elever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:03 PM
  #9
Stop Winnin
TANK ON BOYS
 
Stop Winnin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Buffalo
Posts: 8,842
vCash: 500
Ovechkin doesn't strike me as a good leader.

That's not to say he doesn't show up in the playoffs, because he's been good in them, I just don't think he's the right guy to lead a team to the promised land if that makes sense.

Stop Winnin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:14 PM
  #10
um
Registered User
 
um's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,591
vCash: 500
people who think ovechkin isn't a good leader probably don't watch the caps very often. ovechkin is by far the best leader on the team, and dont say backstrom or brooks f'ing laich

um is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:17 PM
  #11
Nighthock
**** the Kings...
 
Nighthock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Reno, NV
Country: United States
Posts: 15,980
vCash: 500
win ...

Nighthock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:35 PM
  #12
hockeydoug
Registered User
 
hockeydoug's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Country: United States
Posts: 1,649
vCash: 500
With all the recent and previous comments from Caps players about the negotiations and each other, I can't wait to watch that circus show hit the ice.

hockeydoug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:36 PM
  #13
sobrien
RAFFLCOPTER
 
sobrien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: South Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 7,165
vCash: 555
....grow? They already have immense talent, and now have Forsberg and Wilson waiting in the wings (literally) to go along with Kuznetsov. Green is still relatively young, as well as Carlson and Alzner, plus their goalies. They SHOULD be one of the top 3 teams in the East soon via prospect growth alone.

sobrien is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 10:39 PM
  #14
MastuhNinks
Registered User
 
MastuhNinks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: The Iron Throne
Posts: 4,773
vCash: 500
I feel like the Caps could be easily overlooked going into next season, but they have a very strong team. Aside from the obvious juggernauts (Rangers/Pens/Flyers/Bruins), I feel they're the strongest in the East and could be a surprise team in the playoffs. Especially if they somehow convince Kuznetsov to come over. I know '5th strongest in the Conference' isn't a huge compliment, but it's hard to place them above those other teams.

MastuhNinks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 11:05 PM
  #15
WarriorOfGandhi
Was saying Boo-urns
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Country: Scotland
Posts: 14,262
vCash: 500
the Caps, in my opinion, are a team that have all their best players peaking at the wrong time. Their best forwards are older than their best defensemen who are older than their goalies. By the time their goalies and defensemen are in their primes, their forwards will have peaked (it looks like AO and possibly Backstrom already have). If AO and Backs were 18 instead of 25, the Caps would have a consistent playoff team now and a sure contender in 3-5 years. Instead it looks like they blew their load in 2009 and will just spin their wheels for awhile longer.

WarriorOfGandhi is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 11:07 PM
  #16
Kershaw
 
Kershaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Country:
Posts: 25,519
vCash: 500
Get rid of Ovechkin and replace him with a superstar center or defender. 9.8 for a 60-70pt forward is very bad for the cap. As long as that albatross is there for 9 more yrs, Caps will continue to be mediocre.

Kershaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 11:13 PM
  #17
caps4cup
Dynasty
 
caps4cup's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 4,833
vCash: 500
I'd say the Canadiens playoff series had a lot to do with it. They were so dominant that whole year, and even against Montreal although they lost. But they had Theodore in net most of the year, and a defensive core consisting of Green, Morrisonn, Poti, Schultz, Erskine, and Sloan. Everyone said it was the way they played that caused all the goals against. But look at their goalies and D core. It obviously wasn't their style that caused the goals against. Theodore sucked and stil does. Three of the above Defensemen are currently not full time players in the NHL. Another (Schultz), shouldn't be, but is because he was signed to a 3mil contract. And Poti was a #4 at best and is or probably will retire due to injuries.

They could easily play that run and gun style with Holtby, Green, Alzner, Carlson, Orlov, Schultz (ugh...), and Hamrlik.

Now I'm not saying that this style works for everyone, but the Caps had and I believe still do, the right personnel to play a mostly offensive orientated game. They were so dominant playing that way. Other players said they feared being blown off the rink when they were playing against the Caps (can't find the source, but it was some player...).

Sometimes you just get unlucky or the other team gets a God-like performance (Halak) and you lose. But they panicked because it was 3 straight years of playoff disappointment. And now its been 2 straight years after of the same old same old, just much more boring games to watch for the fans, and to play for the players.

The sad thing is if Halak wasn't so amazing that series, the Caps easily could've put up Philly-like offensive numbers against the Pens, with about a third of the goals against. And this thread probably wouldn't exist right now if they would've won that series. Oh well, just hoping that Oates lets the team be creative and play offense again. They're not gonna win unless they play towards the strength of the team.

caps4cup is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-27-2012, 11:26 PM
  #18
WingedWheel1987
Ken Holland's office
 
WingedWheel1987's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: GPP Michigan
Posts: 8,667
vCash: 500
I really don't know what more they can do. Nothing they do turns into a trip to the Finals. I find it hard to believe the core isn't good enough. You could argue that they simply go from one extreme to another so it just creates another problem that they aren't built to overcome.

The defense first mantra is the right way to go but they still end up losing 2-1 instead of 5-4. I think Washington really needs to find the right coach. They have yet to find that and I don't know who the right guy is. The core is still very young so fortunately they haven't squandered a chance at a cup with the current team. I really believe a good coach is the missing link that will fit the pieces together. I don't know if Adam Oates is the right guy. Hopefully he is.

I am a fan of Detroit, but i always support Washington during their playoffs if they aren't facing Detroit. Unfortunately I wouldn't be surprised if Ovy ends his career cupless. Sone players just don't get the breaks or are missing that one player that never arrives.

WingedWheel1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-28-2012, 08:39 AM
  #19
Jules Winnfield
Top 6 wing please...
 
Jules Winnfield's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 6,219
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by QuietCompany View Post

Also I found the whole Hamrlik/Brouwer/Neuvirth thing to be hilarious.
Can someone recap this?

Jules Winnfield is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-28-2012, 08:45 AM
  #20
gifted88
Dante the poet
 
gifted88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Guelph, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,357
vCash: 500
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=636123

"He said he hopes to bring a style to the Caps similar to that used by the Devils and Kings."

gifted88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-28-2012, 10:03 AM
  #21
irunthepeg
THE ONE WHO KNOCKS
 
irunthepeg's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: The Peg, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,695
vCash: 825
Quote:
Originally Posted by caps4cup View Post
I'd say the Canadiens playoff series had a lot to do with it. They were so dominant that whole year, and even against Montreal although they lost. But they had Theodore in net most of the year, and a defensive core consisting of Green, Morrisonn, Poti, Schultz, Erskine, and Sloan. Everyone said it was the way they played that caused all the goals against. But look at their goalies and D core. It obviously wasn't their style that caused the goals against. Theodore sucked and stil does. Three of the above Defensemen are currently not full time players in the NHL. Another (Schultz), shouldn't be, but is because he was signed to a 3mil contract. And Poti was a #4 at best and is or probably will retire due to injuries.

They could easily play that run and gun style with Holtby, Green, Alzner, Carlson, Orlov, Schultz (ugh...), and Hamrlik.

Now I'm not saying that this style works for everyone, but the Caps had and I believe still do, the right personnel to play a mostly offensive orientated game. They were so dominant playing that way. Other players said they feared being blown off the rink when they were playing against the Caps (can't find the source, but it was some player...).

Sometimes you just get unlucky or the other team gets a God-like performance (Halak) and you lose. But they panicked because it was 3 straight years of playoff disappointment. And now its been 2 straight years after of the same old same old, just much more boring games to watch for the fans, and to play for the players.

The sad thing is if Halak wasn't so amazing that series, the Caps easily could've put up Philly-like offensive numbers against the Pens, with about a third of the goals against. And this thread probably wouldn't exist right now if they would've won that series. Oh well, just hoping that Oates lets the team be creative and play offense again. They're not gonna win unless they play towards the strength of the team.
That last line is exactly how I feel. They're built to be offensive-oriented. The thing is all they needed is a bit more consistency from everyone and they would have beat the Habs. They just have to find exploits when facing defensive systems and make sure their offense is better than their opponent's defense (seems kind of obvious, but I seriously think they could make it work).

As said, I don't think Ovechkin will lose the C unless they're trading him now but I think making him captain was the wrong choice. Let him play his offensive game and have some other guy be the leader.

irunthepeg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-28-2012, 10:30 AM
  #22
Lshap
Moderator
 
Lshap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,752
vCash: 500
As with most talented teams, there's no magical fix to take them to the top. They have the right pieces, they just need the usual brew of chemistry and luck to bounce them to a Cup final, plus two big X-factors.

As far as Ovi, there are different styles of leaders. Ovi leads by example -- intense, prideful, aggressive example. No need to change captains. With Backstrom, Laich, Ribiero and character guys like Chimera, Brouwer and Ward, the Caps have enough leaders by example and enough offensive depth.

The X-factors are Goalie and Coach. Holtby became my favourite player in the playoffs and I'd love to see the kid become a steady, top-10 goalie. As we've seen, the right guy in nets can carry you far. All Washington needs now is a coach who bridges the gap between Boudreau's fire-at-will strategy and Hunter's defensive-shelling. If Oates can shut down the other team without shutting down his own, they'll go far.

Lshap is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-28-2012, 10:37 AM
  #23
fedfed
Moderator
@FedFedRMNB
 
fedfed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Moscow City
Country: Russian Federation
Posts: 3,829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by saskriders View Post
Better D and a new captain (Backstrom maybe)
Dale Hunter and Bruce Boudreau thought so, but the reality is that you need to trade pretty much the whole team to make it work. If they start to play "all D" like in the last two years, their offense suffers.

fedfed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-28-2012, 10:39 AM
  #24
mapes
Registered User
 
mapes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Halifax
Posts: 22,546
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tortorella View Post
Get rid of Ovechkin and replace him with a superstar center or defender. 9.8 for a 60-70pt forward is very bad for the cap. As long as that albatross is there for 9 more yrs, Caps will continue to be mediocre.
Not sure if serious..

mapes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-28-2012, 10:43 AM
  #25
Bourne Endeavor
Moderator
HFBoards: Night's Watch
 
Bourne Endeavor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Country: Canada
Posts: 25,771
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by caps4cup View Post
I'd say the Canadiens playoff series had a lot to do with it. They were so dominant that whole year, and even against Montreal although they lost. But they had Theodore in net most of the year, and a defensive core consisting of Green, Morrisonn, Poti, Schultz, Erskine, and Sloan. Everyone said it was the way they played that caused all the goals against. But look at their goalies and D core. It obviously wasn't their style that caused the goals against. Theodore sucked and stil does. Three of the above Defensemen are currently not full time players in the NHL. Another (Schultz), shouldn't be, but is because he was signed to a 3mil contract. And Poti was a #4 at best and is or probably will retire due to injuries.

They could easily play that run and gun style with Holtby, Green, Alzner, Carlson, Orlov, Schultz (ugh...), and Hamrlik.

Now I'm not saying that this style works for everyone, but the Caps had and I believe still do, the right personnel to play a mostly offensive orientated game. They were so dominant playing that way. Other players said they feared being blown off the rink when they were playing against the Caps (can't find the source, but it was some player...).

Sometimes you just get unlucky or the other team gets a God-like performance (Halak) and you lose. But they panicked because it was 3 straight years of playoff disappointment. And now its been 2 straight years after of the same old same old, just much more boring games to watch for the fans, and to play for the players.

The sad thing is if Halak wasn't so amazing that series, the Caps easily could've put up Philly-like offensive numbers against the Pens, with about a third of the goals against. And this thread probably wouldn't exist right now if they would've won that series. Oh well, just hoping that Oates lets the team be creative and play offense again. They're not gonna win unless they play towards the strength of the team.
I have been saying this since the Montreal series. For whatever reason, Washington seems to have lost all confidence. Never before have I witnessed a team so abruptly overhaul their entire identity into some pseudo-hybrid that frankly, isn't one at all. Halak's god showing utterly crushed him. You could see it by their response. So many times the Caps, in particular Ovie and Semin, rocketed the puck in damn near disbelief they could not score.

Montreal beat them by capitalizing on frustration and exposing the holes in both their style and defense. An "run 'n' gun" team will allow a significantly higher ratio of goals against, sometimes burning themselves but the lack of consistency is what did them in. Vancouver is not without comparison. "Run 'n' gun" simply has easily exploitable holes if you aren't consistent.

Bourne Endeavor is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:48 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.