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Luongo: the continuing saga ...

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Old
12-07-2012, 09:51 AM
  #901
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Originally Posted by PavelBure10 View Post
I don't know how many threads there has been on a eventual Luongo trade, but I've read them all and I can't wait until the actual trade is made. Ofcoarse with our luck the trade will be made, and a asteroid will hit the earth preventing anyone from ever knowing. I can see it right now, in the year 2206 some other version of the human being, will pick up the piece of paper that Gillis wrote the real Luongo trade on. It will read Luongo for..........well the other half of the Lou trade will be burnt away from fire. We may never know.
So around the time Luongo's contract expires?

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12-07-2012, 09:55 AM
  #902
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
With the potential for decertification eliminating the cap, Luongo's value would arguably go up.
Going to start asking for Kessel again?

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12-07-2012, 09:55 AM
  #903
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Originally Posted by PavelBure10 View Post
I don't know how many threads there has been on a eventual Luongo trade, but I've read them all and I can't wait until the actual trade is made. Ofcoarse with our luck the trade will be made, and a asteroid will hit the earth preventing anyone from ever knowing. I can see it right now, in the year 2206 some other version of the human being, will pick up the piece of paper that Gillis wrote the real Luongo trade on. It will read Luongo for..........well the other half of the Lou trade will be burnt away from fire. We may never know.
Me too!

I cant wait to make a Luongo back to Vancouver thread! Just waiting for the right timing.

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12-07-2012, 09:57 AM
  #904
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
With the potential for decertification eliminating the cap, Luongo's value would arguably go up.
If this happens...the league is screwed. So it won't matter what you think Luongo's value is. Every players contract is wiped out....that will make for nothing but a big cluster****.

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12-07-2012, 09:57 AM
  #905
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Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
Right, its conceivable to see gillis dowgrading gardiner to kadri, i suppose

Kadri, bozak, frattin, 1st

The 1st will certainly be a downgrade from the #5 OA, but i could see Gillis settling there too

Again, i can understand if leaffans dont like the price, but imo, given what gillis has said, logic dictates a price in this area, or he will hold
Who knows? That same report that said Gillis asked for the 5th overall, Gardiner, Bozak, etc, went on to say that new trade talks included with Bozak being a centrepiece. Leafs would add more, but adding Kadri and a 1st is a big, big stretch.

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12-07-2012, 10:02 AM
  #906
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Originally Posted by TheLeastOfTheBunch View Post
Who knows? That same report that said Gillis asked for the 5th overall, Gardiner, Bozak, etc, went on to say that new trade talks included with Bozak being a centrepiece. Leafs would add more, but adding Kadri and a 1st is a big, big stretch.
Yeah, it'll be something like Bozak and a 2nd.

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12-07-2012, 10:10 AM
  #907
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Originally Posted by TheLeastOfTheBunch View Post
Who knows? That same report that said Gillis asked for the 5th overall, Gardiner, Bozak, etc, went on to say that new trade talks included with Bozak being a centrepiece. Leafs would add more, but adding Kadri and a 1st is a big, big stretch.
Sure, no shortage of speculation on both sides.
My only point is that that asking price is the closest thing to non-speculation we have

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12-07-2012, 10:12 AM
  #908
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Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
Sure, no shortage of speculation on both sides.
My only point is that that asking price is the closest thing to non-speculation we have
I've never disagreed that Gillis posted that asking price. The discussion begins with are any GM's nuts enough to meet it.

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12-07-2012, 10:37 AM
  #909
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
There's no new rumours, however I recall that although Edmonton fans were split on whether or not they should acquire Luongo at this point, valuewise Hemsky + MPS made sense. Maybe Edmonton management feels the same about how they should proceed, maybe not. I do think Toronto is still the front runner though.
That depends on how you define split. This poll done at the end of last season had 83% against pursuing RL. I think there may have been a more recent poll too , with similar numbers but I can't find it atm. There are not a lot of Edmonton fans interested in picking up RL, unless the trade cost is quite low.

Edit: found the other poll. 65/35 against.

And valuewise, you may think Hemsky + Paajarvi is fair for RL, but I don't. Not with that contract.

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12-07-2012, 10:42 AM
  #910
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Don't you all think desertification would be kinda cool?? It would be like an NHL apocalypse. I think Vancouver would have no problem signing players. Rated the best city in North America to live in. Great hockey city and our owners are rich as ***** and huge fans and would most likely go over 100 million in salaries. On a serious note.

To Washington
Luongo and Tanev

To Vancouver
Green and Johansson.

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12-07-2012, 11:09 AM
  #911
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Originally Posted by Nuck This View Post
Don't you all think desertification would be kinda cool?? It would be like an NHL apocalypse. I think Vancouver would have no problem signing players. Rated the best city in North America to live in. Great hockey city and our owners are rich as ***** and huge fans and would most likely go over 100 million in salaries. On a serious note.

To Washington
Luongo and Tanev

To Vancouver
Green and Johansson.
I know you didn't do that on purpose, but it's still awesome.

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12-07-2012, 11:17 AM
  #912
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Gillis' original asking price isn't necessarily the minimum he would take.
what has Gillis done to make you think he would accept anything less?

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12-07-2012, 11:18 AM
  #913
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
That depends on how you define split. This poll done at the end of last season had 83% against pursuing RL. I think there may have been a more recent poll too , with similar numbers but I can't find it atm. There are not a lot of Edmonton fans interested in picking up RL, unless the trade cost is quite low.

Edit: found the other poll. 65/35 against.

And valuewise, you may think Hemsky + Paajarvi is fair for RL, but I don't. Not with that contract.
I can't speak for every Oil fan or the exact split, only what people talked about here.
From this thread:http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...=luongo+hemsky

Quote:
Originally Posted by OilGuns
Exactly, and I'm sure that shows that that[Hemsky]'s what the oilers would be willing to give up and maybe a first +. That said some Canucks will feel that anything but one of the big five and picks would be necessary, and Oiler fans will be laughing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Soundwave
Schultz would the fifth guy of the core group, yeah.

For Luongo I'd be open to Hemsky or MPS + a 1st (2013 or 2014 *but* it would be the Oilers choice) only with the pre-condition that his family (ahem wife) is OK with a harder brand of Canadian winter, lol.

Not all Oiler fans will agree with me on this though. I think he will end up in Toronto when all's said and done.
I mean, it's not like Hemsky's on a sweetheart deal himself. Or even playing up to his cap hit.(which Luongo is, and likely will for the next 5ish years.)

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12-07-2012, 11:21 AM
  #914
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what has Gillis done to make you think he would accept anything less?
Nothing. What has Gillis done to make you think he is absolutely against lowering his asking price like Howson with Nash?

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12-07-2012, 11:23 AM
  #915
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Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
I can't speak for every Oil fan or the exact split, only what people talked about here.
From this thread:http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh...=luongo+hemsky





I mean, it's not like Hemsky's on a sweetheart deal himself. Or even playing up to his cap hit.(which Luongo is, and likely will for the next 5ish years.)
Yup you can always find some posters that will support an idea. But the majority of HFOil aren't interested in RL for the price Vancouver fans want.

I think Hemsky will surprise many with his bounce back season. He's finally healthy and will be feeding a pure sniper in Yakupov. I don't expect his 2 year deal to be bad one. RL may play like a 5M+ goalie now, and probably for a few more years. But it's years 6-10 I am worried about. RL's contract is way worse than Hemsky's.

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12-07-2012, 11:29 AM
  #916
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Yup you can always find some posters that will support an idea. But the majority of HFOil aren't interested in RL for the price Vancouver fans want.

I think Hemsky will surprise many with his bounce back season. He's finally healthy and will be feeding a pure sniper in Yakupov. I don't expect his 2 year deal to be bad one. RL may play like a 5M+ goalie now, and probably for a few more years. But it's years 6-10 I am worried about. RL's contract is way worse than Hemsky's.
It has been explained though that Luongo does not have a NMC(and can therefore be buried in the minors), can be traded to a cap floor team for the later part of his contract as a veteran backup to bring them to the cap floor while only making a fraction of that in actual salary, and will most likely retire before then anyways.

There are numerous loopholes in the way Luongo's contract is structured so that it does not turn into an albatross. There's a reason why owners made these contracts in the first place.

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12-07-2012, 12:09 PM
  #917
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Originally Posted by seanlinden View Post
What is your justification for seeking such an ubsurd price?

So far, the best offer you've laid claim to is Little/Antropov/2nd for Luongo/Ballard.

Even if that's a deal that makes sense for the Jets, that's really the baseline to be working off of.... and that's not a deal that the Leafs should be prepared to match.
I honestly havent even discussed Luongo to the Jets because I personally don't see it.

The absurd price actually falls somewhere in between where our GMs had been discussing.
(Schenn/JVR vs Bozak + Gardiner + Reilly + Frattin).

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12-07-2012, 12:16 PM
  #918
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say what you want about the individual sources, but it was corroborated by Cox and Botchford ...so that's more real IMO than anything we've heard since. Also, there were more stories early in the summer that Gillis' price was too high from places like Chicago and Florida ...so I think it's more likely than anything else we've heard that there was truth to that high asking price from Gillis. Again, I am not advocating whether it's fair or not, just that it's far more substantiated than the myriad speculations since (Kadri/Bozak, whatnot)

Since then, Gillis has been quoted as saying he's ok going with both goalies if need be. This is also a fact.

So, speaking with the closest approximation to fact versus speculation (again, understanding that my point is not entirely the former, but by far the closest thing to), what exactly make everyone think that Gillis has dropped his price and is interested in assorted Leaf spare parts, dumps and 'protected' picks?

I see nothing but wishful thinking that indicates this.

again, to reiterate to the point of nausea -- I am not interested in speculative appraisals of value. It really doesnt matter a damn if I think he's worth the crown jewels and you think he's worth a bag of pucks. Going off everything that's been reported from the guy who's selling the asset, the vast majority of speculation here is a wishful thinking. I'm sorry, but I don't see any other interpretation.


EDIT -- tempered it a bit ...im POd after tonight's news
Let me preface this with the fact that I think a deal will get done and neither fanbase will be 100% happy with what they gave up. From the HFboards perspective I also think that most of the posts have been heavily biased and a handful have been realistic. That said:

1) Of course Gillis is going to try and ask for the world for Lou. I would expect nothing less in the beginning.

2) Gillis is quoted as saying he is willing to go with both goalies just like Burke is quoted as saying he's going with Scrivens and Reimer. NOT. GOING. TO. HAPPEN. There is a reason why these two potential trading partners in this deal came out publically saying this...it's called POSTURING.

Truth is only Gillis know's what the market is willing to pay for Lou. When the deal happens, the value will be known.

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12-07-2012, 12:19 PM
  #919
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
If this happens...the league is screwed. So it won't matter what you think Luongo's value is. Every players contract is wiped out....that will make for nothing but a big cluster****.
But it would be glorious for those of us who love trade deadline day and the free agent signing period!!!

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12-07-2012, 12:26 PM
  #920
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But it would be glorious for those of us who love trade deadline day and the free agent signing period!!!
Well, speaking from the standpoint of a fan of one of the richest teams, decertification wipes out the salary cap so.....that could be fun.

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12-07-2012, 12:32 PM
  #921
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Originally Posted by CellarDweller0 View Post
Let me preface this with the fact that I think a deal will get done and neither fanbase will be 100% happy with what they gave up. From the HFboards perspective I also think that most of the posts have been heavily biased and a handful have been realistic. That said:

1) Of course Gillis is going to try and ask for the world for Lou. I would expect nothing less in the beginning.

2) Gillis is quoted as saying he is willing to go with both goalies just like Burke is quoted as saying he's going with Scrivens and Reimer. NOT. GOING. TO. HAPPEN. There is a reason why these two potential trading partners in this deal came out publically saying this...it's called POSTURING.

Truth is only Gillis know's what the market is willing to pay for Lou. When the deal happens, the value will be known.
I will be totally honest here....IF,and i now think the season is killed, but if there is a 48 game season, i'd rather NOT trade for Luongo. This team has more issues than goal and 48 games might not be enough to overcome them. There will be issues with guys getting into game shape, learning the new coaches system etc etc. So, if the chance is there that we don't make the playoffs anyway, then i'd rather keep our assets and run with Reimer and what happens happens.

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12-07-2012, 12:46 PM
  #922
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Originally Posted by Liferleafer View Post
I will be totally honest here....IF,and i now think the season is killed, but if there is a 48 game season, i'd rather NOT trade for Luongo. This team has more issues than goal and 48 games might not be enough to overcome them. There will be issues with guys getting into game shape, learning the new coaches system etc etc. So, if the chance is there that we don't make the playoffs anyway, then i'd rather keep our assets and run with Reimer and what happens happens.
As a Canucks fan I feel the same way. Short season gives a lot of chance for a goalie to break down due to a compressed schedule, I'd want to platoon Luongo and Schneider and ride the hot goalie in the playoffs.

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12-07-2012, 12:46 PM
  #923
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Well, speaking from the standpoint of a fan of one of the richest teams, decertification wipes out the salary cap so.....that could be fun.
Do you really think that the owners would go Wild West on us, and spend infinite dollars, after all the time they've spent working on cost certainty?

If they decertify, I would bet that the Salary Caps and guidelines the NHL set in play would be much lower and more restrictive than they are offering now.

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12-07-2012, 12:51 PM
  #924
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That depends on how you define split. This poll done at the end of last season had 83% against pursuing RL. I think there may have been a more recent poll too , with similar numbers but I can't find it atm. There are not a lot of Edmonton fans interested in picking up RL, unless the trade cost is quite low.

Edit: found the other poll. 65/35 against.

And valuewise, you may think Hemsky + Paajarvi is fair for RL, but I don't. Not with that contract.
Thank you!. Vancouver fans seem to think that his contract is a positive attribute, when clearly it's not. It's nice to see another teams fans agreeing with "common" sense.

RL is an allstar goalie, but no team in their right mind will pay (asset wise) for what he is worth on the ice because his contract is way too debilitating.

Vancouver's management aren't going to find it easy trying to pan off their redundant player. It was mentioned earlier that the cap will no doubt go down (after CBA is resolved) and that will put many teams in a position where they will have to jettison off salary. Not many teams will be in a position to add that substantial of a contract, if any. And the cap floor teams that might have the room, the odds are Luongo doesn't waive to play for any of them (unless of course Florida has a change of heart).

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12-07-2012, 12:53 PM
  #925
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Do you really think that the owners would go Wild West on us, and spend infinite dollars, after all the time they've spent working on cost certainty?

If they decertify, I would bet that the Salary Caps and guidelines the NHL set in play would be much lower and more restrictive than they are offering now.
If they decertify, it wipes out the CBA (and all that goes with it including the cap) and means it's every man for himself. And as far as the owners going wild west....are these the same owners who a month before they started screaming "MAX 5 YEAR DEALS!!!" were handing out 6-14 year deals for over 100 million dollars? Ya...pretty safe to say the rich guys will buy there way to a cup.

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