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Ryan O'Reilly Signs With Magnitogorsk (2-yr deal)

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01-14-2013, 05:12 PM
  #826
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Originally Posted by Foppa2118 View Post
Why do you guys keep talking about the numbers like that even matters at this point? What has he proven to say its my way or the highway at 21, and sign a two year deal in Russia that forces the team to match it?????

That's all that needs to be said.
Its a business... the Avs had plenty of time to sign him... before the lockout, or during the season. The guy played three years making less than 1 million.

Now he is suposed to take whatever the avs offers him, just because he is 21?? Was he suposed to wait without a contract and without payment until the lockout was over???

The guy signed a lucrative deal, some one thinks he is worth 4M, if the Avs think he is not worth it, they can trade him.

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01-14-2013, 05:14 PM
  #827
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Wait we still aren't signing long-term deals past 4 years? I thought they were just waiting for the new CBA before doing long-term deals.

We're screwed if that's true. Brian Burke is a GM who doesn't sign long-term deals....look at how far that got him with Toronto.

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01-14-2013, 05:16 PM
  #828
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Originally Posted by Avsboy View Post
Stastny: Don't get me started on Stastny. He's a 2nd line center at this point.
Duchene: 2nd line center.
PAP: Inflated stats. Terribly worried about him.
McGinn: Who?
Landeskog: Not too worried about this bad boy!
Jones: I like Jones but he has a lot to prove.

No elite talent. Good point. Three players (Stastny, Duchene, Landeskog) would make a BAD first line/GREAT second line. Downie is not a top 6 player. Hejduk....well he better return to form if RoR doesn't resign because at his best he's a top line talent. Show this top 6 to any fan in the league and they will wonder where the offense will come from.

And this doesn't touch on the D. Johnson and the Pylons.

How does RoR make a difference? Lack of elite talent is overcome by depth. If he isn't there we need to trade him for either a proven no.2/no.3 center or a top 4 defenseman. (A real top 4 defenseman, not a 'Sacco top 4 defenseman' like Zanon)
Ummm.... I'm not sure you know what a top 6 player is. An average top 6 wing will have around 35-45 points (center will be around 40-45 and be solid defensively. On a good number of teams Downie would be a second line player, the same with Jones, PAP, and McGinn. Landeskog, Duchene, and Stastny would be 1st line players on probably 10-15 teams.

The Avs will be fine on offense with or without ROR, I expect about 2.6 goals per game which will be around 15th in the league. The question will be if they can get the goals against to around 2.5.

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01-14-2013, 05:20 PM
  #829
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Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
Ummm.... I'm not sure you know what a top 6 player is. An average top 6 wing will have around 35-45 points (center will be around 40-45 and be solid defensively. On a good number of teams Downie would be a second line player, the same with Jones, PAP, and McGinn. Landeskog, Duchene, and Stastny would be 1st line players on probably 10-15 teams.

The Avs will be fine on offense with or without ROR, I expect about 2.6 goals per game which will be around 15th in the league. The question will be if they can get the goals against to around 2.5.
Downie has had one good season worthy of top 6. Jones and PAP are top 6 players, but are not very good. McGinn is too unproven. Landy, Duchene and Stastny would be top line players on precisely 10-15 teams - the bottom-halfers.

Avs will be around average, low average without RoR on offense. Their D is lousy. Overall without offensive depth Avs lose one of their biggest advantages.

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01-14-2013, 05:21 PM
  #830
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Avs management would be to give that to the 3rd center on our depth chart, with only one 50pt season under his belt where they have all the leverage.
A third line center who played much better than the first line center who is making $6.6M/yr. Also, a third line center who was arguably our best player last season.

Jordan Staal didn't have any 50 point seasons and was the third line center for the Pens when he signed a 4 year, $16M extension. That's fine if you guys disagree but again, I think that is a very reasonable contract for O'Reilly and for the Avs.

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01-14-2013, 05:24 PM
  #831
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I strongly disagree that O'Reilly hasn't "earned" $4M/year for a long term deal. He's 21, plays great shutdown defense and has shown enough offense to make it a very fair salary. I'd sign him for an 8 year deal for $4M/year in an instant if I could. I think O'Reilly is as safe as they come, barring can't miss players.

It's when people start talking about $5M/year I think it's a bit too much. That's salary I could see for a third contract, but not a second contract.

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01-14-2013, 05:24 PM
  #832
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Sorry if this was mentioned already but where did he play? He doesn't show on Mag's scoring stats or any others I can find. Was he still hurt?

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01-14-2013, 05:24 PM
  #833
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Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
The question will be if they can get the goals against to around 2.5.

Only if time travel could bring back Hasek from 1993-98.

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01-14-2013, 05:27 PM
  #834
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Sorry if this was mentioned already but where did he play? He doesn't show on Mag's scoring stats or any others I can find. Was he still hurt?
http://www.khl.ru/players/20611/

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01-14-2013, 05:27 PM
  #835
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Sorry if this was mentioned already but where did he play? He doesn't show on Mag's scoring stats or any others I can find. Was he hurt?
Comrade O'Reilly is on the KHL site.

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01-14-2013, 05:27 PM
  #836
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Originally Posted by Avs_19 View Post
A third line center who played much better than the first line center who is making $6.6M/yr. Also, a third line center who was arguably our best player last season.

Jordan Staal didn't have any 50 point seasons and was the third line center for the Pens when he signed a 4 year, $16M extension. That's fine if you guys disagree but again, I think that is a very reasonable contract for O'Reilly and for the Avs.
Stastny had a revolving door of wingers, O'reilly had the benifit of keeping chemistry with landeskog all year. With Duchene healthy I bet ROR's numbers would dip back down.

Jordan Staal signed a bridge deal similar to what O'reilly may settle for with the avs. 4 years at 3.5. How did that deal work out for staal and the pens though?

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01-14-2013, 05:29 PM
  #837
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Originally Posted by Avsboy View Post
Downie has had one good season worthy of top 6. Jones and PAP are top 6 players, but are not very good. McGinn is too unproven. Landy, Duchene and Stastny would be top line players on precisely 10-15 teams - the bottom-halfers.

Avs will be around average, low average without RoR on offense. Their D is lousy. Overall without offensive depth Avs lose one of their biggest advantages.
I'd argue 3 seasons in a row Downie has been at a top 6 level. Last year 75 games 41 points. 10-11 57 games 32 points (~46 point pace over 82 games). 09-10 79 games 46 points. He has been a solid 40+ point player while being a very good agitator.

PAP is a very solid top 6 player, he will make his money on the PP though. Probably best setup man on the team besides Stastny. He will make the second PP unit very dangerous.

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01-14-2013, 05:32 PM
  #838
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Originally Posted by Avsboy View Post
Stastny: Don't get me started on Stastny. He's a 2nd line center at this point.
Duchene: 2nd line center.
PAP: Inflated stats. Terribly worried about him.
McGinn: Who?
Landeskog: Not too worried about this bad boy!
Jones: I like Jones but he has a lot to prove.

No elite talent. Good point. Three players (Stastny, Duchene, Landeskog) would make a BAD first line/GREAT second line. Downie is not a top 6 player. Hejduk....well he better return to form if RoR doesn't resign because at his best he's a top line talent. Show this top 6 to any fan in the league and they will wonder where the offense will come from.

And this doesn't touch on the D. Johnson and the Pylons.

How does RoR make a difference? Lack of elite talent is overcome by depth. If he isn't there we need to trade him for either a proven no.2/no.3 center or a top 4 defenseman. (A real top 4 defenseman, not a 'Sacco top 4 defenseman' like Zanon)
McGinn-Staz-Jones were absolutely playing like a first line once they got together. Duchene's playing very well overseas and PAP did impressively well without JT last year to, given he's another player like Mueller and Fleischman who's a strong passer and playmaker, I'm excited to see what he and Dutchy can do. Then we've still got Downie, who's a very good sandpaper guy for a scoring line as he's a strong passer as well and Landy. That's still a strong top 6, with some good wingers left for the third line.

Defensively we were an average team last year despite forward issues, Hejda needing a couple months to get his head out of his ass, EJ getting hurt and Varly going through his first season as a starter and his first season here. We're gunna be a solid defensive team because we've got a great goalie tandem, our forwards play two ways and they do it well, and our defensemen are good in their own zone. We'll struggle for goals, if we don't have Radar there to let us roll 3 lines and just wear teams out, but Staz and Duchene and gifted offensive centers with a bunch of wingers to mix and match into dangerous lines.


Last edited by Frenchy: 01-14-2013 at 07:52 PM. Reason: false start , as i can see
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Old
01-14-2013, 05:34 PM
  #839
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You are comparing RFA and UFA contracts. He hasn't been playing long enough in an important enough role to warrant this big of a contract. Dumb thing is, if he signed a smaller deal and showed progression hed play himself into an even bigger contract.
So, PAP, a career minor league player with one decent, and one good year gets his deal with the Avs and most now want to move ROR over money. If the goal is really to win a Cup, who would you rather roll with. The PAP signing has a 50-50 chance of blowing up in the Avs' collective faces. ROR is exactly the kind of player you build cup winning teams with. Surely there is a deal to be made here. If the Avs' mngmnt. is going to make a leap of faith and overpay a little this is the type of guy to roll the dice with. PAP, not so much. Guess we'll see.

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01-14-2013, 05:37 PM
  #840
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O'Reilly won't be getting 5x4M from this management, and rightfully so.

If we're giving him 4M per year then I want it for 7 years.

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01-14-2013, 05:38 PM
  #841
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A brief update from our Friendly Leafs Fan Smitty10

He played shinny with O'Reilly's uncle again today, but didn't have much to report other than that O'Reilly's dad IS planning to go to Russia (as we all know) to watch Ryan and Cal play. So Papa O'Reilly's tweet is definitely open to interpretation as far as which "son" he was referencing.

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01-14-2013, 05:42 PM
  #842
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If it was up to me I would either sign ROR for 8 years at 4-5m, 3 years at 3.5m, or trade him for a young top pairing defensemen like Kulikov or Yandle.

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01-14-2013, 05:43 PM
  #843
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Originally Posted by S3rkie View Post
Stastny had a revolving door of wingers, O'reilly had the benifit of keeping chemistry with landeskog all year. With Duchene healthy I bet ROR's numbers would dip back down.

Jordan Staal signed a bridge deal similar to what O'reilly may settle for with the avs. 4 years at 3.5. How did that deal work out for staal and the pens though?
Am I missing something? That deal worked out great for Staal and the Pens. When Staal wanted to play with his brother and didn't want to be the third line center anymore, the Pens traded him to Carolina for a very good player (Sutter) and Staal still got paid. We don't have a Crosby or Malkin and Stastny might not even be on the team when O'Reilly's next contract expires. O'Reilly wanting to play with his brother wouldn't be an issue either unless he wants to spend the rest of his career in the KHL, AHL, or some other league in Europe.

But we're getting off topic here. I just brought up Staal because you said a player with one 50 point season shouldn't be getting $4M/yr over 4-5 years.

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01-14-2013, 05:44 PM
  #844
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Originally Posted by Orwell1984 View Post
So, PAP, a career minor league player with one decent, and one good year gets his deal with the Avs and most now want to move ROR over money. If the goal is really to win a Cup, who would you rather roll with. The PAP signing has a 50-50 chance of blowing up in the Avs' collective faces. ROR is exactly the kind of player you build cup winning teams with. Surely there is a deal to be made here. If the Avs' mngmnt. is going to make a leap of faith and overpay a little this is the type of guy to roll the dice with. PAP, not so much. Guess we'll see.
How is it likely to blow up in the avs faces when he's exactly the type of player who Duchene has excelled with, who we also didn't happen to have any of?

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01-14-2013, 05:48 PM
  #845
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I'm not comparing the contracts and saying O'Reilly should get that because those guys did. I know Jones/Parenteau were UFAs where as O'Reilly is a RFA. I'm just saying I think 4 years, $16M would be a good deal for O'Reilly.

Some people seem to be under the impression that he must sign a two year deal just because other Avs' RFAs have done that. Look at what other RFAs around the league have signed for. Seguin has had one good season and just got $6M per year. O'Reilly and his agent aren't stupid.
The difference between Tyler Seguin and Ryan O'Reilly couldn't be bigger.

O'Reilly had a career year last year. Seguin is just getting started.

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01-14-2013, 05:50 PM
  #846
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The difference between Tyler Seguin and Ryan O'Reilly couldn't be bigger.

O'Reilly had a career year last year. Seguin is just getting started.
Oh. Okay. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

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01-14-2013, 05:51 PM
  #847
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A brief update from our Friendly Leafs Fan Smitty10

He played shinny with O'Reilly's uncle again today, but didn't have much to report other than that O'Reilly's dad IS planning to go to Russia (as we all know) to watch Ryan and Cal play. So Papa O'Reilly's tweet is definitely open to interpretation as far as which "son" he was referencing.
That tweet was for RoR to get more leverage. Each side thinks they have leverage over the other, with RoR thinking Avs want him badly enough and Avs thinking he would want to come back to the NHL in time for the season to start. If the offer doesn't change before the season starts, the two parties will continue like this into the season, waiting for the other to blink. There's no way RoR puts his tail between his legs and within a week agrees to whatever has already been offered.

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01-14-2013, 05:53 PM
  #848
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People turning on ROR already. Sad.

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01-14-2013, 05:54 PM
  #849
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How is it likely to blow up in the avs faces when he's exactly the type of player who Duchene has excelled with, who we also didn't happen to have any of?
Easy, if he doesn't put up the kind of points he did last year, he doesn't do much else. Must have s**t himself when the Avs' dropped that offer in his lap 5 mins. after free agency began.

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01-14-2013, 05:55 PM
  #850
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People turning on ROR already. Sad.
it sure is, question is management?

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