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Jan 6/13: CBA reached to end the Lockout. Rejoice! (Post#783)

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01-02-2013, 10:34 AM
  #651
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Originally Posted by Cocoa Crisp View Post
And with it, the player's biggest playing chip. The endgame is nigh. There will be a shortened season. Book it. It's just a shame that it cost half a season and good deal of fan goodwill to get there.
They really need to write a clause into the next CBA that forces them to sign a deal prior to the start of the following season or it's automatically cancelled in October. There is no legitimate excuse for not negotiating all summer, these *******s need a nuclear deterrent.

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01-02-2013, 10:35 AM
  #652
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I wonder what time they will meet today? Yesterday's meeting kept getting delayed and delayed - wonder if the same occurs again.

Sounds like some fairly significant areas have been agreed upon - the only thing that has been mentioned as a bone of contention at this stage is pensions (doesn't mean that's not just the tip of the iceberg, but still)

Today is also the deadline to file the DOI. Perception is that if the PA opts not to file it, that a deal is close.
Yeah. apparently it was delayed yesterday due the NHL making a counter proposal to the Unions response. Bettman was quoted saying they moved on some areas and stood firm on others...so at least there is progress.


EDIT - just saw the proposed changes to the playoff structure. Seriously...WTF???


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01-02-2013, 11:21 AM
  #653
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They really need to write a clause into the next CBA that forces them to sign a deal prior to the start of the following season or it's automatically cancelled in October. There is no legitimate excuse for not negotiating all summer, these *******s need a nuclear deterrent.
The problem as I see it is that they have no incentive to negotiate until it really hurts both of them - the very real possibility of a lost season. Until that point, it's like neither side was making a real attempt to reach an agreement for fear that it would reveal their flank and they'd be gored by the other side. It's a dangerous mix of bravado, mistrust, and worst of all not really knowing what you want and what the other guy can concede.

Probably the best solution - very unlikely to happen - is to replace Gary Bettman and re-define the role of the commissioner. Right now, GB is essentially the united face of the owners. Another commissioner could just as easily serve as an impartial arbitrator between the PA and the League. Apparently MLB is set up more like that and they've been able to avoid extended work stoppages as a result.

It would require the two sides to trust enough that they settle on the right person for the job. That would take some doing.

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01-02-2013, 11:37 AM
  #654
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Originally Posted by Cocoa Crisp View Post
The problem as I see it is that they have no incentive to negotiate until it really hurts both of them - the very real possibility of a lost season. Until that point, it's like neither side was making a real attempt to reach an agreement for fear that it would reveal their flank and they'd be gored by the other side. It's a dangerous mix of bravado, mistrust, and worst of all not really knowing what you want and what the other guy can concede.

Probably the best solution - very unlikely to happen - is to replace Gary Bettman and re-define the role of the commissioner. Right now, GB is essentially the united face of the owners. Another commissioner could just as easily serve as an impartial arbitrator between the PA and the League. Apparently MLB is set up more like that and they've been able to avoid extended work stoppages as a result.

It would require the two sides to trust enough that they settle on the right person for the job. That would take some doing.
Yes, but if they both decide that the season will be lost if a CBA isn't negotiated by the beginning of October then they should have the incentive to work through the summer instead of the fall/winter and save themselves from their own stupidity.

They (both sides) just have to agree to make it an automatic mechanism to cancel the season in its entirety if a CBA isn't negotiated prior to Oct 4th or 6th or whatever. That way they can play chicken all they like during the summer and will be fully aware of the "drop dead" date ahead of time.

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01-02-2013, 07:21 PM
  #655
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https://twitter.com/Real_ESPNLeBrun/...394304/photo/1

lol, Dreger looks pissed.

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01-02-2013, 07:38 PM
  #656
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I for one, as a season's ticket holder, am overjoyed that there will be no more than a 48 game season. wish they would do that every year.

Does anyone know where I can go to get a reasonable analysis where each side stands and of the difference between the 2 parties right now

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01-02-2013, 08:12 PM
  #657
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Lockout, you better ****ing end!I started catching up on Supernatural!

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01-02-2013, 08:31 PM
  #658
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First 50/50, make-whole, contract length, now pension plans.

There are lots of hills to die on.

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01-02-2013, 08:34 PM
  #659
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2:30 left before this thing is all but guaranteed...

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01-02-2013, 08:48 PM
  #660
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lol #Dregerface

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01-02-2013, 11:20 PM
  #661
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Man this is nerve wracking, are they going to file or not? It's pretty much come down to this for whether we have a season or not.

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01-02-2013, 11:22 PM
  #662
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Man this is nerve wracking, are they going to file or not? It's pretty much come down to this for whether we have a season or not.
Doesn't really matter if they file or not...they can still negotiate a deal.

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01-02-2013, 11:26 PM
  #663
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Doesn't really matter if they file or not...they can still negotiate a deal.
Yeah I know, they can still negotiate a deal, and also if they don't file it now they can always re-apply later. But with the NHL season cancellation deadline so close this will tell us how good the negotiations are really going right now. To file would antagonize the league and risk all the current progress.

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01-02-2013, 11:36 PM
  #664
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Originally Posted by RandV View Post
Yeah I know, they can still negotiate a deal, and also if they don't file it now they can always re-apply later. But with the NHL season cancellation deadline so close this will tell us how good the negotiations are really going right now. To file would antagonize the league and risk all the current progress.
It shouldn't antagonize them, its just business...just like the NHL filing suit against the PA. Didn't hear any complaints from the PA about it really.

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01-02-2013, 11:40 PM
  #665
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Is the midnight EST disclamer of interest a legal deadline or simply the NHLPA's own self-imposed deadline? Could they still file it in the next few days?

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01-03-2013, 12:17 AM
  #666
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Is the midnight EST disclamer of interest a legal deadline or simply the NHLPA's own self-imposed deadline? Could they still file it in the next few days?
I think it was self-imposed.
I would think that unless things go really, really, really south they won't file.

I thought today was Tuesday and was like WTF THEY WONT MEET TOMORROW??!?!?!?
But then realized Thursday is tomorrow lol

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01-03-2013, 12:25 AM
  #667
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Originally Posted by Cromulence View Post
Is the midnight EST disclamer of interest a legal deadline or simply the NHLPA's own self-imposed deadline? Could they still file it in the next few days?
Looks like they need to re-vote if they still want to file.

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun
NHLPA did not file disclaimer but will ask players for authorization again to do so if talks don't "soon" produce a deal

Brennan Klak ‏@nhlupdate
How soon could a re-vote come? Well, the NHL's deadline was January 11, and the last vote took five days, January 5? Saturday? Not sure


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01-03-2013, 12:46 AM
  #668
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I think it was self-imposed.
I would think that unless things go really, really, really south they won't file.

I thought today was Tuesday and was like WTF THEY WONT MEET TOMORROW??!?!?!?
But then realized Thursday is tomorrow lol
It was self imposed. Basically Dreger just said that they have heard that the Disclaimer is not off the table. If they don't like what happens at tomorrow's meeting, they'll expedite the disclaimer.

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01-03-2013, 01:32 AM
  #669
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love how they give fans all these ridiculous self imposed and soft deadlines to string fans along

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01-03-2013, 01:54 AM
  #670
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Also they can vote again on the disclaimer if need be. They have the votes so that's a formality. The 48 game minimum season falls into the same 'soft deadline' category. The math doesn't even add up for an evenly balanced schedule that is 48 games.

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01-03-2013, 02:11 AM
  #671
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cocoa Crisp View Post
The problem as I see it is that they have no incentive to negotiate until it really hurts both of them - the very real possibility of a lost season. Until that point, it's like neither side was making a real attempt to reach an agreement for fear that it would reveal their flank and they'd be gored by the other side. It's a dangerous mix of bravado, mistrust, and worst of all not really knowing what you want and what the other guy can concede.

Probably the best solution - very unlikely to happen - is to replace Gary Bettman and re-define the role of the commissioner. Right now, GB is essentially the united face of the owners. Another commissioner could just as easily serve as an impartial arbitrator between the PA and the League. Apparently MLB is set up more like that and they've been able to avoid extended work stoppages as a result.

It would require the two sides to trust enough that they settle on the right person for the job. That would take some doing.
That will never happen.

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01-03-2013, 11:53 AM
  #672
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That will never happen.
I agree with you and it's unfortunate. Instead we'll have to get used to these marathon showdowns that precipitate 11th hour talks.

Look at what they're currently hashing out: pensions and caps. It's like they don't know what they want because they don't know what the other guy is after. It goes to the core of what I'm getting at: all of talks and negotiations in the offseason and during the lockout were nothing but kabuki theater. Both sides knew they weren't really serious because there wasn't an impetus to be serious.

It's a disgraceful way to run a league.

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01-03-2013, 02:06 PM
  #673
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Regarding next years cap issue: it really pisses me off how the NHL is willing to screw teams like Vancouver and other big market teams who's fans support them, and catering to the small market teams like Phoenix and Florida who's fans don't support them. It's garbage!

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01-03-2013, 02:16 PM
  #674
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Regarding next years cap issue: it really pisses me off how the NHL is willing to screw teams like Vancouver and other big market teams who's fans support them, and catering to the small market teams like Phoenix and Florida who's fans don't support them. It's garbage!
The power in the league wishes to promote a singular vision. And that is, an NHL that is truly spread throughout the major TV markets in the United States, including the south.

And that is a fundamentally flawed vision, IMO.

And once the league does get back in business, which I believe will be announced next week, we'll see how the southern markets respond. I am betting with even lower attendance and lower TV ratings. And they won't come back near as quickly as last time.

The problem is that the vision does not include reality.

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01-03-2013, 02:27 PM
  #675
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The power in the league wishes to promote a singular vision.
If that were the case I think we'd be in much better shape. IMO the problem with the league is they don't have a singular vision, just a bunch of teams looking out for themselves.

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