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2012 CBA/Lockout talk, It's not looking good VI

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Old
12-09-2012, 06:11 AM
  #501
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Trying to digest the spin from both sides in this farcial dispute has my head spinning like a Serge Savard "spinarama".

Here is a tidbit from Larry Brooks' latest take on the current CBA snafu.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...Y15mlRCaikgfqO

"Do NOT mistake this recess in bargaining orchestrated by the NHL after the league’s third outright walkaway from talks in the last two months as anything other than what it is intended by the owners and the suits on Sixth Avenue.

For this is not a “cooling off” period. Anything but. This, rather, is a scripted gap meant to whip up dissent within the NHLPA rank-and-file and turn up the heat on Don Fehr. This is a stretch in which ownership and management mean to scare the players into a stampede to either overthrow or sidestep their elected leader
."

"Because anyone and everyone who can read can indeed see for themselves: The sides are thread-the-needle close to a deal. The league wants a 10-year CBA with an eight-year out clause. The union wants an eight-year CBA with a six-year out clause. The league wants five-year contract limits with seven-year limits for teams to sign their own players. The union wants eight-year limits to apply across the board.

That’s about it. A couple of split-the-difference items plus the issue of amnesty buyouts that arises because of what will be a steep drop in the cap for 2013-14 and because absent such a transition, there will be nearly 10 teams without the means to create cap space to complete their rosters.

This is what the league angrily stalked away from? Yes, this is what the league angrily stalked away from, on cue, as choreographed."

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12-09-2012, 08:27 AM
  #502
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cat400 View Post
Trying to digest the spin from both sides in this farcial dispute has my head spinning like a Serge Savard "spinarama".

Here is a tidbit from Larry Brooks' latest take on the current CBA snafu.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...Y15mlRCaikgfqO

"Do NOT mistake this recess in bargaining orchestrated by the NHL after the league’s third outright walkaway from talks in the last two months as anything other than what it is intended by the owners and the suits on Sixth Avenue.

For this is not a “cooling off” period. Anything but. This, rather, is a scripted gap meant to whip up dissent within the NHLPA rank-and-file and turn up the heat on Don Fehr. This is a stretch in which ownership and management mean to scare the players into a stampede to either overthrow or sidestep their elected leader
."

"Because anyone and everyone who can read can indeed see for themselves: The sides are thread-the-needle close to a deal. The league wants a 10-year CBA with an eight-year out clause. The union wants an eight-year CBA with a six-year out clause. The league wants five-year contract limits with seven-year limits for teams to sign their own players. The union wants eight-year limits to apply across the board.

That’s about it. A couple of split-the-difference items plus the issue of amnesty buyouts that arises because of what will be a steep drop in the cap for 2013-14 and because absent such a transition, there will be nearly 10 teams without the means to create cap space to complete their rosters.

This is what the league angrily stalked away from? Yes, this is what the league angrily stalked away from, on cue, as choreographed."
yes, but Fehr knows this too....

Bettman overacted if you ask me- NOT over reacted.

What you have now is this

Owners- will they allow Fehr even a dog treat let alone a bone

Fehr- he was hired to allow the players from not being railroaded and make the best deal he can (he was not hired to kill the season)

Fehr has to balance all this- owners glaring fire on one side, players AND THEIR UNPAID AGENTS getting antsy on the other. i'm sure he knows when to jump and its getting close but he still has time to the chagrin of ownership

What Fehr can do is take it to the last day and past New Years and screw up the owners plan of hockey in December and Christmas ticket sales etc...

They'll be hockey but will it be in place Christmas week and shopping time when people are going to spend and have money

Fehr has an offer- a pretty good one, but he aint going down easy and the owners would rather eat dirt than let this guy get to much more

THE DISLIKE IS REAL, THE THOUGHT OF THE SEASON DEAD ISN'T

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12-09-2012, 09:29 AM
  #503
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Originally Posted by DKH View Post
yes, but Fehr knows this too....

Bettman overacted if you ask me- NOT over reacted.

What you have now is this

Owners- will they allow Fehr even a dog treat let alone a bone

Fehr- he was hired to allow the players from not being railroaded and make the best deal he can (he was not hired to kill the season)

Fehr has to balance all this- owners glaring fire on one side, players AND THEIR UNPAID AGENTS getting antsy on the other. i'm sure he knows when to jump and its getting close but he still has time to the chagrin of ownership

What Fehr can do is take it to the last day and past New Years and screw up the owners plan of hockey in December and Christmas ticket sales etc...

They'll be hockey but will it be in place Christmas week and shopping time when people are going to spend and have money

Fehr has an offer- a pretty good one, but he aint going down easy and the owners would rather eat dirt than let this guy get to much more

THE DISLIKE IS REAL, THE THOUGHT OF THE SEASON DEAD ISN'T
I hope you are correct. Got home from a week of vacation and had hope there would be better news and a sesaon...

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Old
12-09-2012, 10:50 AM
  #504
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Thank you. It's fun.

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12-09-2012, 11:30 AM
  #505
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As bleak as it seemed Thursday following emotional press conferences in NYC, both sides are pushing their leaders to get back to the table.

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Old
12-09-2012, 11:53 AM
  #506
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Judging by comments of many players ,, No they do not
Then their agents are not doing their jobs. Or the players for that matter.

When it comes to money it literally pays to know exactly what is in a contract & the rules/laws that are applicable to it.

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12-09-2012, 12:30 PM
  #507
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Then their agents are not doing their jobs. Or the players for that matter.

When it comes to money it literally pays to know exactly what is in a contract & the rules/laws that are applicable to it.
Oh they know. As do their agents.

They just want to maximize their earnings and who wouldn't like a CBA that on some teams sees all 12 regular forwards making upwards of 1million a year? If you're a player of course you're going to fight for that, league health be damned.

You have a very short time to earn your money in the NHL so a CBA that forces GM's to sign longer deals at very high rates guaranteeing players a very very desirable and sizeable income regardless of a lack of performance or injuries is very advantageous to both. This whole process is all about the benjamins for both sides, but the players and agents quickly become the bad guys as their greed, unlike the owners, doesn't help the league in any way shape or form. The owners proved during the last lockout that their greed does.

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12-09-2012, 01:33 PM
  #508
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Hope the NHLPA union decertifies (sp?)


Bring on the scabs .....hopefully!!!


Last edited by TP: 12-09-2012 at 02:39 PM. Reason: mod
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12-09-2012, 02:27 PM
  #509
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http://vimeo.com/55149830

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12-09-2012, 02:31 PM
  #510
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Originally Posted by zylos45 View Post
Hope the NHLPA union decertifies (sp?)

Bring on the scabs .....hopefully!!!
WHAT scabs? Seriously, what hockey player with any sort of talent is going to be a scab player? You think they could rustle up enough for a league, and that people would pay money to see them play?


Last edited by TP: 12-09-2012 at 02:39 PM. Reason: mod
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12-09-2012, 02:36 PM
  #511
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Originally Posted by zylos45 View Post
Hope the NHLPA union decertifies (sp?)

Bring on the scabs .....hopefully!!!
That's the worst possible thing that could happen.


Last edited by TP: 12-09-2012 at 02:38 PM. Reason: mod
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12-09-2012, 03:07 PM
  #512
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Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
WHAT scabs? Seriously, what hockey player with any sort of talent is going to be a scab player? You think they could rustle up enough for a league, and that people would pay money to see them play?
The first ones that has debts that none of us are privy to. We see what the income is......but not the output.

No different than when the other leagues open up business .

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12-09-2012, 04:27 PM
  #513
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Hahahahaha....

Seguin centering Kane and Marchand.... Good Lawd..... On and off the ice they would terrorize.
The bar bills would make mike richards and jeff carter jealous.

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12-09-2012, 09:07 PM
  #514
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Still think this guy ends up a Bruin one day...

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/blog/ey...ogizes-to-fans

Nice to hear things like this over the Upshalls, Prusts and BizNasty's for the world... We have to remember that Kane I'm sure reps the majority...
And he's the guy with the attitude issues? Nice to see an interview like that from a player with none of the political connotations we've been fed to date, seemed a pretty honest moment there Especially nice to see from one as high profile and with as much to lose from the process as Kane. Makes you remember some of these guys have a foot or two on solid ground here in the real world.

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12-09-2012, 09:18 PM
  #515
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Still think this guy ends up a Bruin one day...

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/blog/ey...ogizes-to-fans

Nice to hear things like this over the Upshalls, Prusts and BizNasty's for the world... We have to remember that Kane I'm sure reps the majority...
Kane has easily been the most pleasent Hawk this lockout

He has done nothing to make fans hate him and has stayed out of media attention outside of charity work

Complete opposite of Toews who has shown himself to be nothing more then an idiot ,, Though Monty and Bolland clearly the biggest losers on Hawks in this lockout. Bolland going into Chelios like threat was an absolute gutless thing

At end of day ,, Kane just wants to enjoy life and play hockey

Toews and some other high paid hockey players have taken the opposite path and alienated alot of people with idiotic remarks and constant hardline message

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12-09-2012, 09:46 PM
  #516
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WHAT scabs? Seriously, what hockey player with any sort of talent is going to be a scab player? You think they could rustle up enough for a league, and that people would pay money to see them play?
Oh silly Artemis

Bet my fully loaded yugo that there are more than a few that would for a paycheck. Also, I know they aren't as good as paille, but some decent players that never made the show would play just to pull on an NHL sweater....once!


The NHLPA is a joke. The owners make this league. If the Scab Bruins sign Billy Tibbets I won't be the only sucker in Boston wearing a Tibbet's #18 jersey.

#Jacobs

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12-09-2012, 09:55 PM
  #517
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Oh silly Artemis

Bet my fully loaded yugo that there are more than a few that would for a paycheck. Also, I know they aren't as good as paille, but some decent players that never made the show would play just to pull on an NHL sweater....once!


The NHLPA is a joke. The owners make this league. If the Scab Bruins sign Billy Tibbets I won't be the only sucker in Boston wearing a Tibbet's #18 jersey.

#Jacobs
You think there are enough talented players out there, non-NHL, to ice an entire league, that people would pay NHL prices to see?

Yeah, OK. Enjoy.

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12-09-2012, 10:53 PM
  #518
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You think there are enough talented players out there, non-NHL, to ice an entire league, that people would pay NHL prices to see?

Yeah, OK. Enjoy.
You could dress 23 chimpanzees in Maple Leaf sweaters and you'd still get a sold out building nightly. They might even win a few more games. You could completely swap out every Boston Bruin and every Montreal Canadian with hobos and people would still rail for blood when the two met. Same with the Rangers... those places are strong hockey markets and you'll continue to see fan interest in those places regardless of if you dressed an entire AHL team. Those are the teams that account for the majority of the leagues revenue anyway, and they'll always draw a crowd. Players come and players go but people keep on rooting for their favorite team.

It's why the players are the inevitable losers in this situation. They need the NHL owners far far more then the NHL owners need them.

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12-10-2012, 12:52 AM
  #519
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You could dress 23 chimpanzees in Maple Leaf sweaters and you'd still get a sold out building nightly. They might even win a few more games. You could completely swap out every Boston Bruin and every Montreal Canadian with hobos and people would still rail for blood when the two met. Same with the Rangers... those places are strong hockey markets and you'll continue to see fan interest in those places regardless of if you dressed an entire AHL team. Those are the teams that account for the majority of the leagues revenue anyway, and they'll always draw a crowd. Players come and players go but people keep on rooting for their favorite team.

It's why the players are the inevitable losers in this situation. They need the NHL owners far far more then the NHL owners need them.
I like the Bruins players but I would absolutely love to see the 500+ whiney spoiled brats from the other 29 teams put out of work by lesser hockey talent.

Even though I don't want to pay what I currenty am for replacement players if JJ drops my ticket price I will gladly support them and be down.

The players can play in the KHL or start their own league.


Basically this has dragged out far enough. If Bettman and Jacobs want to take the next step its OK with me. Cheap playoff hockey this year sounds good to me I'll go out drinking and sit in my loges for it if its affordable.

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12-10-2012, 12:55 AM
  #520
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You think there are enough talented players out there, non-NHL, to ice an entire league, that people would pay NHL prices to see?

Yeah, OK. Enjoy.
You're gonna watch. You might complain but since you are such a big hockey fan I bet you'll be able to name most of the "scrubs" who are Bruins players and will likely have your favorites.

Sad but true Arty..

Would be AWESOME to see some of the mouthy punks like Roy and Prust get blackballed from the NHL too.

50 game season, ticket prices dropped in half for ST holders, playoff hockey. I AM DOWN! I bet a ton of players leave he union immediately anyways and you end up watching mostly NHLers. Owners will make plenty too since beers will prob stay the same.

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12-10-2012, 01:46 AM
  #521
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I am actually more positive about everything now than I have been at any point (I thought up until a few weeks ago we would have no season). I think the next time they get in the room together they will get a deal done.

That said, if they don't and the season gets canned I think it could be a very different league when/if we ever see hockey again. Decertification will certainly change things. You know Fehr will go after the cap if they cancel the season. The NHL will likely go after guaranteed contracts. Could see teams fold it up. Others relocate.

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12-10-2012, 01:47 AM
  #522
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Scabs(doesnt have to be fighters but there is plenty of talent to be found) can and would work.

Hire cheap players to contracts. Lower Ticket prices accordingly. Root for your team.

I'll cheer for whoever wears a Bruins Jersey. I'm not a bandwagon fan like the people on here who say "OMG SCABS CANT WORK I NEED CHARA AND LUCIC!!!".

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12-10-2012, 02:44 AM
  #523
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Scabs(doesnt have to be fighters but there is plenty of talent to be found) can and would work.

Hire cheap players to contracts. Lower Ticket prices accordingly. Root for your team.

I'll cheer for whoever wears a Bruins Jersey. I'm not a bandwagon fan like the people on here who say "OMG SCABS CANT WORK I NEED CHARA AND LUCIC!!!".
The problem would become how to take the "Bruins" seriously when Chara, Bergy,Seguin etc are elsewhere and Trent Whitfield and Joe Schmo are wearing the B.

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Old
12-10-2012, 04:11 AM
  #524
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The problem would become how to take the "Bruins" seriously when Chara, Bergy,Seguin etc are elsewhere and Trent Whitfield and Joe Schmo are wearing the B.

Not really. The team would be half prospects like Spooner and Knight, and then guys like Mottau or Exelby who have played in the NHL but the phone calls from NHL teams have stopped and they are on the periphery.

The rosters wouldn't look that bad when you add in the fact that at least half of the players union would jump ship immediately and join teams.

If it happens I would just like to see players who ran their mouth blackballed.

I am not pro owner but if they want to give me a cheaper product and stick it to the whiney ungrateful players that is fine by me.

Most of these guys are just stupid kids who have spent 5 hours a day their entire lives in hockey rinks and should be working for minimum wage or close.


The players could have taken a deal last week and given the fans hockey before Christmas. It was more important that they let Fehr win a PR battle. I'd love to see Jacobs and friends screw them hard. Make a maximum salary in the new NHL something like 2-3 mil.

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12-10-2012, 06:14 AM
  #525
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Hey, people that would be happy with scab hockey, go watch the AHL. There is your level of play.

That league would do well.......

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