HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Vancouver Canucks
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The Luongo Thread - "Make it stop, make it stop!"

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-30-2012, 11:27 PM
  #476
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
Except Luongo really isn't.
He's not for the team receiving him, he would be a great acquisition.

However, from Vancouver's stand point, it's what he essentially is. You could bet if he was paid a lot less than he is right now he'd easier to hang on to.

Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-30-2012, 11:43 PM
  #477
kthsn
Registered User
 
kthsn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,728
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singh66 View Post
He's not for the team receiving him, he would be a great acquisition.

However, from Vancouver's stand point, it's what he essentially is. You could bet if he was paid a lot less than he is right now he'd easier to hang on to.
Luongo @ 5.3M isn't a salary dump. 3 years down the road he *might* be a salary dump but right now he's worth every penny of his contract.

You seem very confused as to why Gillis would deal Luongo.

kthsn is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:06 AM
  #478
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
Luongo @ 5.3M isn't a salary dump. 3 years down the road he *might* be a salary dump but right now he's worth every penny of his contract.

You seem very confused as to why Gillis would deal Luongo.
lol...you think cap hit alone defines Salary dump? Do you think good players are exceptions to a Salary dump?

You tell me one owner that would like to pay a goalie(who is now their back up) for the next 10 years at the money he's owed?

You are the one that seems very confused my friend.

If Luongo was paid 1 million dollars a year, he'd still be a Nuck, his salary is not what an owner would want to be on the hook for the next 10 years(or whenever he retires), considering his role. You have many people, both experts and fans that think there is far too much money tied up in the Canucks goaltending...they are looking to dump a salary.

Look at all the teams that can't even handle taking that type of salary back to have Luongo as a starter, what owner in their right mind would keep that for their back up?

Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:06 AM
  #479
ZenMaster*
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 555
vCash: 500
If there is a 48 game season, something tells me that Luongo isn't going to get traded until next off-season.

ZenMaster* is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:11 AM
  #480
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
If there is a 48 game season, something tells me that Luongo isn't going to get traded until next off-season.
Potentially, but does any team really need that type of distraction?

Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:15 AM
  #481
Nuckles
༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Sidebar
 
Nuckles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Burger King bathroom
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,830
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
If there is a 48 game season, something tells me that Luongo isn't going to get traded until next off-season.
It's a possibility.
But if Reimer struggles, I could see Burke panicking to fix the goalie problem and trying to acquire Luongo ASAP.

__________________

Richer's Ghost made my avatar
Nuckles is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:18 AM
  #482
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuckles37 View Post
It's a possibility.
But if Reimer struggles, I could see Burke panicking to fix the goalie problem and trying to acquire Luongo ASAP.
He should be trying to get Luongo ASAP because it's not everyday a world class goalie can be obtained. I also think Luongo can really help in Reimer's development(if he stays on the team).

I think a 48 game season just might be considered a 'write off' for many teams in the sense that they won't be held fully accountable for what happens because the season isn't normal by any means. That is why I think if the Leafs stick to Reimer and he struggles, they'll ride him out into the summer. I don't think Burke has to worry about his Job Security this season, next is a different discussion.

Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:19 AM
  #483
y2kcanucks
Cult of Personality
 
y2kcanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 46,785
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to y2kcanucks
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singh66 View Post
Potentially, but does any team really need that type of distraction?
Considering we won the President's trophy because of our goaltending last year, I would say keeping both goalies isn't such a bad idea.

__________________
http://www.vancitynitetours.com
y2kcanucks is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:26 AM
  #484
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Considering we won the President's trophy because of our goaltending last year, I would say keeping both goalies isn't such a bad idea.

There is one key intangible that's different though. Luongo was considered the starter for the wide majority of last season for the Canucks and the young up and coming star(which he is) Schneider could develop into one of the more promising goalies in the NHL. Luongo was the 'older brother' in the situation, and he was considered the #1 goalie. Now the 'older brother' has to take a backseat to the up and comer and it's a totally different scenario...especially the way the two are compensated. In any Canadian market it would spell goalie controversy, look at the Habs with Price and Halak that one off-season. It's just my opinion that you can't keep the competitive ego's out of two #1 starting goaltenders, they both want to take the reigns and I highly doubt a veteran takes the back seat.

I'm not here to troll at all, I just find it surprising that people can argue some things. Vancouver is a fantastic team, and I expect them to continue to be that way for a while. I just don't see it with Luongo, and I definitely am not the only one with that mentality.

Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:51 AM
  #485
NYVanfan
Registered User
 
NYVanfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 6,079
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singh66 View Post
There is one key intangible that's different though. Luongo was considered the starter for the wide majority of last season for the Canucks and the young up and coming star(which he is) Schneider could develop into one of the more promising goalies in the NHL. Luongo was the 'older brother' in the situation, and he was considered the #1 goalie. Now the 'older brother' has to take a backseat to the up and comer and it's a totally different scenario...especially the way the two are compensated. In any Canadian market it would spell goalie controversy, look at the Habs with Price and Halak that one off-season. It's just my opinion that you can't keep the competitive ego's out of two #1 starting goaltenders, they both want to take the reigns and I highly doubt a veteran takes the back seat.

I'm not here to troll at all, I just find it surprising that people can argue some things. Vancouver is a fantastic team, and I expect them to continue to be that way for a while. I just don't see it with Luongo, and I definitely am not the only one with that mentality.
Luongo/schneider 1A/1B >>> schneider+bozak/franson (or some other horrid return)
and it aint even close

NYVanfan is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:54 AM
  #486
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
Luongo/schneider 1A/1B >>> schneider+bozak/franson (or some other horrid return)
and it aint even close
Doesn't mean it has to be that trade either.

Your statement is also subjective. Who knows, maybe the depth that Franson and Bozak bring is enough to give the Canucks all they need to win the cup etc. Using two NHL bodies that are talented might be more important than a goalie that is sitting on the bench in the playoffs.

Franson and Bozak are good players, but I still expect the Canucks to get more.

Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 12:59 AM
  #487
Nuckles
༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Sidebar
 
Nuckles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Burger King bathroom
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,830
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYVanfan View Post
Luongo/schneider 1A/1B >>> schneider+bozak/franson (or some other horrid return)
and it aint even close
It's great insurance to have one of Luongo/Schneider on the bench in case the other gets injured, but having someone who will be playing every single game can be more valuable.

And I want to point out that if Bozak is the main NHL piece coming back, then we'd also probably be getting Kadri+, which we could then trade to another team to get an asset to help us now.

Nuckles is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:05 AM
  #488
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuckles37 View Post
It's great insurance to have one of Luongo/Schneider on the bench in case the other gets injured, but having someone who will be playing every single game can be more valuable.

And I want to point out that if Bozak is the main NHL piece coming back, then we'd also probably be getting Kadri+, which we could then trade to another team to get an asset to help us now.
Apparently that is the rumour floating around in TO, that it would be Bozak+Kadri going to vancouver. I am not in favour of giving up Kadri because I think he's got the tools to be a very good NHL player. It's just unfortunate that Colborne regressed after his wrist injury because it could have given us a lot more flexibility. However, I know to often get something of value you have to give up something of value.

There were other rumours that at first the Canucks wanted Schenn but the Leafs said no, and they just ended up swapping him for JVR.

I'd be willing to give the Canucks a 1st round pick in the package as long as it's top 3 or 5 protected.

MacArthur, Bozak, Franson and a pick IMO is still a good return. Although I wish you guys would just buy him out so we can get him and keep franson and bozak


For the record, I am one of those Leaf fans that actually hopes Vancouver gets something good back in the return. They are doing Toronto a MASSIVE favour giving them a goaltender like Luongo(if they do, of course).


Last edited by Wolfgang Krauser: 12-31-2012 at 01:11 AM.
Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:18 AM
  #489
Nuckles
༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Sidebar
 
Nuckles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Burger King bathroom
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,830
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singh66 View Post
Apparently that is the rumour floating around in TO, that it would be Bozak+Kadri going to vancouver. I am not in favour of giving up Kadri because I think he's got the tools to be a very good NHL player. It's just unfortunate that Colborne regressed after his wrist injury because it could have given us a lot more flexibility. However, I know to often get something of value you have to give up something of value.

There were other rumours that at first the Canucks wanted Schenn but the Leafs said no, and they just ended up swapping him for JVR.

I'd be willing to give the Canucks a 1st round pick in the package as long as it's top 3 or 5 protected.

MacArthur, Bozak, Franson and a pick IMO is still a good return. Although I wish you guys would just buy him out so we can get him and keep franson and bozak


For the record, I am one of those Leaf fans that actually hopes Vancouver gets something good back in the return. They are doing Toronto a MASSIVE favour giving them a goaltender like Luongo(if they do, of course).
I don't see the Canucks having any interest in MacArthur. He's an upcoming UFA and a 2nd/3rd line tweener (which we have plenty of already).

If the Canucks cant get Lupul as the main piece coming back, I think they'll get Bozak, Kadri, Franson, and a 2nd (or a good prospect).
Then flip Kadri and the draft pick/prospect for a top 6 forward.

Nuckles is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:27 AM
  #490
kthsn
Registered User
 
kthsn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,728
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singh66 View Post
You have many people, both experts and fans that think there is far too much money tied up in the Canucks goaltending...they are looking to dump a salary.
A Luongo/Schneider tandem is 15% of the cap. Any Canuck fan can see this is historically not an issue.

Luongo is being moved because we have the depth to move an elite player, thinking it's a pure salary dump is unfounded - there are many other viable options to shed salary for the '13/14 season.

It's also strange how you consider Luongo the backup if he where to stay, the potential of a Schneider/Luongo 1/1A situation cannot be overlooked. They have shown a willingness to put egos aside to help win and are very good friends.


Last edited by kthsn: 12-31-2012 at 01:34 AM.
kthsn is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:42 AM
  #491
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
A Luongo/Schneider tandem is 15% of the cap. Any Canuck fan can see this is historically not an issue.

Luongo is being moved because we have the depth to move an elite player, thinking it's a pure salary dump is unfounded - there are many other viable options to shed salary for the '13/14 season.

It's also strange how you consider Luongo the backup if he where to stay, an educated opinion would surely see the potential of the best 1/1A situation.
Regardless of the goaltenders talents, one goalie will be the back up. One goalie will play more games than the other and be the goalie to be leaned on in crunch time.

http://www.thehockeynews.com/article...as-backup.html

Luongo is being moved because it's simply not feasible nor logical to have your backup goaltender(as of right now) to be consuming that much cap-space. This idea that you trade Luongo because you have the depth to move an elite player is a farce. This isn't the same of having two #1 centre's or defencemen, that despite everything they will BOTH still play every game together. This is about having too much money sitting on the bench while more immediate help could be more useful.

It is what it is, Luongo's salary and no trade clause are a big reason why he was still a Canuck prior to the CBA expiration.


Last edited by Wolfgang Krauser: 12-31-2012 at 01:48 AM.
Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 01:58 AM
  #492
kthsn
Registered User
 
kthsn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,728
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singh66 View Post
It is what it is, Luongo's salary and no trade clause are a big reason why he was still a Canuck prior to the CBA expiration.
You're definitely confused about the cap.

Luongo @ 5.3 this year (not a 60M cap) is great insurance in a 48 game schedule. He provides great backup play in a compact schedule for a team that relies on goalies. Eddie Lack isn't ready so the Canucks absolutely need 2 goalies this season.

Luongo @ 5.3 in '13/14 in a 60M cap world should definitely be traded. I don't see the rush to do that now. In fact Luongo/Schneider at 15% of the cap even if one must be sitting every game is still a much better use of talent then say Komisarek as a 6/7 Dman.

Luongo @ 5.3 >>>> Bozak/Franson/Tweener at 5.3M this upcoming season. Yes, even if he just sits on the bench the entire time.

kthsn is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:06 AM
  #493
kthsn
Registered User
 
kthsn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 2,728
vCash: 500
Courtesy of Silverback91. Luongo/Schneider is doable on a 60M cap.

D.Sedin - H.Sedin - Burrows
Higgins (@2.5M) - Kesler - Kassian
Jensen* - Schroeder - Hansen
Volpatti - Lappierre - Weise
Ebbett

Hamhuis - Bieksa
Garrison - Tanev
Edler (@4.6M) - Joslin
KConn*

Luongo
Schneider

Ballard/Booth traded or amnestied. *=rookie

kthsn is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:11 AM
  #494
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,107
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singh66 View Post
Apparently that is the rumour floating around in TO, that it would be Bozak+Kadri going to vancouver. I am not in favour of giving up Kadri because I think he's got the tools to be a very good NHL player. It's just unfortunate that Colborne regressed after his wrist injury because it could have given us a lot more flexibility. However, I know to often get something of value you have to give up something of value.

There were other rumours that at first the Canucks wanted Schenn but the Leafs said no, and they just ended up swapping him for JVR.

I'd be willing to give the Canucks a 1st round pick in the package as long as it's top 3 or 5 protected.

MacArthur, Bozak, Franson and a pick IMO is still a good return. Although I wish you guys would just buy him out so we can get him and keep franson and bozak


For the record, I am one of those Leaf fans that actually hopes Vancouver gets something good back in the return. They are doing Toronto a MASSIVE favour giving them a goaltender like Luongo(if they do, of course).
You have that wrong, the leafs were offering Schenn at the draft, Gillis countered with:

Bozak, 5OA, Gardiner, Frattin

This has been pretty widely reported.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:24 AM
  #495
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
No, I am not confused with anything even remotely regarding to the cap.

What I am confused about his how you can't see why Luongo's salary(not cap) and term is a huge reason he's not on the list of many teams.

No one said that having Luongo apart of your franchise doesn't mean you won't be able to ice a team due to salary-cap restrictions, so I really don't know why there was a need to post a mock line-up...

Luongo's salary(not cap) could be used in other and better ways to help the Canucks. It seems that even you understand that Luongo will have to be moved in the next few months due to his salary(not cap). Even though I find Luongo's cap-hit acceptable, I don't think it's ideal for my potential back-up goaltender, his salary is also not something I expect an owner to happily pay on the bench.

No one in their right mind expects Luongo to be a Canuck start the season, the man himself didn't think either(lol).

Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:25 AM
  #496
Wolfgang Krauser
LETS BURN IT UP
 
Wolfgang Krauser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,809
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by racerjoe View Post
You have that wrong, the leafs were offering Schenn at the draft, Gillis countered with:

Bozak, 5OA, Gardiner, Frattin

This has been pretty widely reported.
My apologizes, good call! That's a huge over payment for the Leafs. I believe if I recall right(now lol) that Burke wanted to make that deal even bigger? By adding pieces like Kesler?

Wolfgang Krauser is online now  
Old
12-31-2012, 02:39 AM
  #497
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 2,107
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Singh66 View Post
My apologizes, good call! That's a huge over payment for the Leafs. I believe if I recall right(now lol) that Burke wanted to make that deal even bigger? By adding pieces like Kesler?
I am not going to pretend to know what Burke wanted, besides Lui, but that was what Gillis asked for from the leafs. So if you wanted Kesler... just started adding more to that, and a lot more.

I actually pretty much can't see the Canucks trading Kesler especially to the leafs.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 03:43 AM
  #498
PG Canuck
Moderator
 
PG Canuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Prince George, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,591
vCash: 2178
Quote:
Originally Posted by kthsn View Post
Courtesy of Silverback91. Luongo/Schneider is doable on a 60M cap.

D.Sedin - H.Sedin - Burrows
Higgins (@2.5M) - Kesler - Kassian
Jensen* - Schroeder - Hansen
Volpatti - Lappierre - Weise
Ebbett

Hamhuis - Bieksa
Garrison - Tanev
Edler (@4.6M) - Joslin
KConn*

Luongo
Schneider

Ballard/Booth traded or amnestied. *=rookie
Luongo/Schneider is doable under a 60M cap with that roster, but at what point do you actually want to roll with that roster? What makes you think Jensen/Kassian can just step right in and produce? What makes you think AV all of a sudden let's young guys step into large roles? Too many questions with that roster. Likely easier to deal one of Luongo/Schneider.

PG Canuck is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 04:06 AM
  #499
McLlwain
Trevor Forever
 
McLlwain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Cologne/Germany
Country: Germany
Posts: 917
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PG Canuck View Post
Luongo/Schneider is doable under a 60M cap with that roster, but at what point do you actually want to roll with that roster? What makes you think Jensen/Kassian can just step right in and produce? What makes you think AV all of a sudden let's young guys step into large roles? Too many questions with that roster. Likely easier to deal one of Luongo/Schneider.
In a 60mil cap world there's most likely no way around letting young guys step into big roles. What other way is there to fill the holes?
And since this will go for every big spender team it might not be such a big disadvantage. If you have decent prospects in the pipeline, that is.

McLlwain is offline  
Old
12-31-2012, 07:15 AM
  #500
Christina Woloski
Registered Something
 
Christina Woloski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Narnia
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,553
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cogburn View Post

Just another epiphany from me on an unrelated note. I think think that Hansen is ready for a top six role, and we should be putting our focus into a solid two-way 2nd line center as a centerpiece for Luongo. Higgins and Hansen have great chemistry, and moving Hansen to 2RW with Kesler, as Hansen has shown playmaking skill, and Higgins just seems to compliment Kesler in general, we have a slightly weaker second line, and finding a playmaker that is strong enough defensively to play with Raymond (or Kassian, or hopefully Jensen) and Booth, and we have a terrifying line up.


yep. i agree! hansen is due and has the ability

Christina Woloski is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:55 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.