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Leafs ranked 20th by Hockey's Future.

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12-09-2012, 07:19 PM
  #76
LEAFANFORLIFE23
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these rankings make absolutely no sense. for a couple reasons first being they were ranked 18th last year, they added 2 1st round quality talents in Rielly and Finn who was projected as a top 20 pick yet somehow after adding 2 1st round quality talents we drop 2 spots? no that is not realistic.

2nd the marlies have gone from a team full of has beens and never weres to an AHL championship caliber club led by the likes of talented young guns in gardiner kadri frattin scrivens with a couple of vets like ranger and acouin sprinkled in.

throw in the junior ranks where biggs, percy, the previously mentioned Rielly and Finn and currently developing and 20th is way to low. 12-15th would be accurate

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12-09-2012, 07:29 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post
Let's try to keep things in perspective.

People were singing Burkie's virtues when HF rated them #6 and #9.

Now that HF rates them #20, the same people claim that it means nothing.

Maybe the emperor's new clothes are not that pretty...

HF's ratings are opinions.

Feel free to disagree.

But don't laud the merits of someone based on that opinion, and then turn around 1-2 years later and claim that opinion is worthless.
Okay.

1. Why do you make random appearances here?

2. I didn't "sing Burke's virtues" when we were placed that high before. I acknowledged it as something positive but I wasn't using it as my reasoning for why Burke is a good GM or anything like that.

When I first came to this website I didn't know too much about prospects and was quite naive, I've learned a lot in the (almost) 3 years I've been a member of these boards.

At that time, yeah I was guilty of overrating some of our prospects and putting too much stock into these rankings.

Obviously, since then I've realized that rankings prospects in general and teams prospect pools is highly subjective and everyone has different rankings. The only thing that most people can agree are the teams that have the absolute best prospect pools; teams like Edmonton, NYI, and Minnesota for example. Once you get past those top-tier prospect pools, it becomes a complete crapshoot and rankings very greatly.

That's why I don't take HF rankings seriously anymore because I've learned these things over time and I've realized that teams with what seem to be like pretty poor prospect pools can still come away with some decent players later on. Hell, even the Leafs have come out with some decent players like Kulemin, Stalberg, Reimer, Gunnarsson and Frattin from what was perceived as "dark age" for Leafs drafting and development.

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12-09-2012, 07:30 PM
  #78
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Once you get past those top-tier prospect pools, it becomes a complete crapshoot and rankings very greatly.
vary*

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Old
12-09-2012, 07:37 PM
  #79
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In the last draft the Leafs drafted Rielly and Finn. The organization had a terrific 2012' draft.

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12-09-2012, 07:42 PM
  #80
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Although our prospect pool is not above average, and I would have liked it to be top 10 with how we've finished in the last couple years, but I think our pool is better than last year just by including Rielly.

The problem with this team over the years is lack of franchise, game changing talent, we have the potential of having Rielly be that guy.

We need more draft picks like him. Its too bad MLSE will never accept a full rebuild, because I just don't see us getting anywhere, we should trade Kessel and Phaneuf for prospects and build around Rielly if he turns out to be a franchise player.

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12-09-2012, 07:44 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Darkness View Post
Although our prospect pool is not above average, and I would have liked it to be top 10 with how we've finished in the last couple years, but I think our pool is better than last year just by including Rielly.

The problem with this team over the years is lack of franchise, game changing talent, we have the potential of having Rielly be that guy.

We need more draft picks like him. Its too bad MLSE will never accept a full rebuild, because I just don't see us getting anywhere, we should trade Kessel and Phaneuf for prospects and build around Rielly if he turns out to be a franchise player.
He just turned 25. What prospect are we going to get that's better than he is? Re-sign him.

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12-09-2012, 07:55 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
He just turned 25. What prospect are we going to get that's better than he is? Re-sign him.
I would trade him at the draft to see if we can get a package of a high(ish) first round pick, and a prospect. Maybe to a team like the Islanders for a Strome +top 15 pick if they want to pair up Tavares with a winger.

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12-09-2012, 08:05 PM
  #83
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so after missing the playoffs each and every damn year we still have **** prospect pool and are off a fifth last finish.

ya keep telling yourself Burke and Nonis aren't one of the worst performing managers in the league.

i can't stand this team.

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12-09-2012, 08:15 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post


Then why are you on a hockey discussion Board ?
do i go to other hockey team forums and talk about their players? i dont give a **** about their team


all i care is the Leafs with other Leaf fans
all that matters... why do u care what a i uno Boston Bruin fan thinks about Kessel?

the hell

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Old
12-09-2012, 08:17 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Darkness View Post
I would trade him at the draft to see if we can get a package of a high(ish) first round pick, and a prospect. Maybe to a team like the Islanders for a Strome +top 15 pick if they want to pair up Tavares with a winger.
Kessel was the 6th leading scorer with Tyler ****ing Bozak as his centre. It makes zero sense to try to trade him for a prospect that won't be as good.

Honestly, people don't get how good Kessel is. We haven't had a player like in in years.

You do everything you can to re-sign him to a long-term deal.

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12-09-2012, 08:18 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by charliolemieux View Post
It wasn't just Detroit. Chicago had me scratching my head too. Aparently Jimmy Hayes (*another 23yr old) former Leafs prospect is a part of why they are in the top 10. From the little blurb the wrote he might be the Hawks #6 prospect.

What? He was barely staying up on the 4th line when the Hawks had a ton of injuries..
You`re late to the party there, I mentioned that a page before you talked about it.

Slow in your old age

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12-09-2012, 08:18 PM
  #87
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All teams in the NE Leafs Division are considered to have stronger prospect pools than the Leafs by Hockey Futures.

Ottawa (#4)
Montreal (#8)
Buffalo (#13)
Boston (#19)
Toronto (#20)

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12-09-2012, 08:23 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
All teams in the NE Leafs Division are considered to have stronger prospect pools than the Leafs by Hockey Futures.

Ottawa (#4)
Montreal (#8)
Buffalo (#13)
Boston (#19)
Toronto (#20)
half of the these teams in our division are already playoff teams and the rest are closer and have better prospects as well.

how the hell did they manage to get those prospects while being a competitive playoff team while the Leafs are always one of the worst teams in the league?

Ohhhhh. Right. These teams have managers and coaches who know what the **** they are doing!!!

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12-09-2012, 08:23 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by LeafOfBread View Post
Okay.

1. Why do you make random appearances here?

2. I didn't "sing Burke's virtues" when we were placed that high before. I acknowledged it as something positive but I wasn't using it as my reasoning for why Burke is a good GM or anything like that.

When I first came to this website I didn't know too much about prospects and was quite naive, I've learned a lot in the (almost) 3 years I've been a member of these boards.

At that time, yeah I was guilty of overrating some of our prospects and putting too much stock into these rankings.

Obviously, since then I've realized that rankings prospects in general and teams prospect pools is highly subjective and everyone has different rankings. The only thing that most people can agree are the teams that have the absolute best prospect pools; teams like Edmonton, NYI, and Minnesota for example. Once you get past those top-tier prospect pools, it becomes a complete crapshoot and rankings very greatly.

That's why I don't take HF rankings seriously anymore because I've learned these things over time and I've realized that teams with what seem to be like pretty poor prospect pools can still come away with some decent players later on. Hell, even the Leafs have come out with some decent players like Kulemin, Stalberg, Reimer, Gunnarsson and Frattin from what was perceived as "dark age" for Leafs drafting and development.
1. I like talking about hockey.

2. Well said. You're getting wiser and that's a good thing.

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12-09-2012, 08:24 PM
  #90
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Now the haters are going to play the sky is falling card because of this...

Our AHL team is a contender that went to the finals last year. We drafted Rielly and Finn in the first two rounds (Fantastic). As mentioned, there are some odd choices of teams with "Top Prospects" like Chicago and Detroit.

Shouldn't the Islanders be a cup favourite by now?

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12-09-2012, 08:27 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
half of the these teams in our division are already playoff teams and the rest are closer and have better prospects as well.

how the hell did they manage to get those prospects while being a competitive playoff team while the Leafs are always one of the worst teams in the league?

Ohhhhh. Right. These teams have managers and coaches who know what the **** they are doing!!!
I guess Montreal disagrees. They fired everyone.

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12-09-2012, 08:30 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
Now the haters are going to play the sky is falling card because of this...

Our AHL team is a contender that went to the finals last year. We drafted Rielly and Finn in the first two rounds (Fantastic). As mentioned, there are some odd choices of teams with "Top Prospects" like Chicago and Detroit.

Shouldn't the Islanders be a cup favourite by now?
nothing to do with hate. just common freakin sense. anyone who has some realizes that after being one of the absolute worst hockey teams in the NHL for the past few years a team should have really good prospects.

Toronto hasn't got good prospects compared to other teams in the league and in the division and are STILL ONE OF THE WORST NHL TEAMS!

AHL teams don't mean ****. I watch the Leafs and not some terrible washed up players who can't even make a pass.

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12-09-2012, 08:31 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Aplayaz2000 View Post
i dont really give a **** what other fan boys have to say about the Leafs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aplayaz2000 View Post
do i go to other hockey team forums and talk about their players? i dont give a **** about their team


all i care is the Leafs with other Leaf fans
all that matters... why do u care what a i uno Boston Bruin fan thinks about Kessel?

the hell
Sorry. From your initial post I got the impression that you didn't care about others fans' opinions.


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Old
12-09-2012, 08:32 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
I guess Montreal disagrees. They fired everyone.
At least they've made the playoffs this century.

And now they have much better prospects.

And an NHL goalie.

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12-09-2012, 08:32 PM
  #95
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look at me. i'm defending the canadiens because people can't accept how bad the stupid leafs managers are.

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12-09-2012, 08:33 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
nothing to do with hate. just common freakin sense. anyone who has some realizes that after being one of the absolute worst hockey teams in the NHL for the past few years a team should have really good prospects.

Toronto hasn't got good prospects compared to other teams in the league and in the division and are STILL ONE OF THE WORST NHL TEAMS!

AHL teams don't mean ****. I watch the Leafs and not some terrible washed up players who can't even make a pass.
Prospects aren't all that it's about. Otherwise, there's some bad teams that should be contenders by now.

They were the second youngest NHL team last season and were in a playoff spot for two-thirds of the season. And their cap situation is terrific.

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12-09-2012, 08:34 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
At least they've made the playoffs this century.

And now they have much better prospects.

And an NHL goalie.
They really don't. Stop putting so much into HF rankings.

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12-09-2012, 08:35 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
nothing to do with hate. just common freakin sense. anyone who has some realizes that after being one of the absolute worst hockey teams in the NHL for the past few years a team should have really good prospects.

Toronto hasn't got good prospects compared to other teams in the league and in the division and are STILL ONE OF THE WORST NHL TEAMS!

AHL teams don't mean ****. I watch the Leafs and not some terrible washed up players who can't even make a pass.
It`s actually quality hockey. Pretty much every team has 2+ players playing for their farm team that would be in the NHL if there wasn`t a lockout. At first before the season started I was skeptical but watching the AHL games you hardly miss NHL action.

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Old
12-09-2012, 08:36 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by RogerRoeper View Post
Prospects are all that it's about. Otherwise, there's some bad teams that should be contenders by now.

They were the second youngest NHL team last season and were in a playoff spot for two-thirds of the season. And their cap situation is terrific.
who cares.

who cares.

who cares

They came in fifth last. Then the Leafs were ninth last. Then they were second last. Then seventh last. Then fifth last.

THat means you are definitely one of the worst teams in the entire NHL. ANd that means you should have better prospects than most of the NHL.

BUt here we are with a **** team and **** prospects and people actually like the management!!!! It's bat **** crazy I tell ya!!!!

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12-09-2012, 08:38 PM
  #100
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They really don't. Stop putting so much into HF rankings.
YA they do!

Every scouting publication tells you the same information too.

Montreal has better prospects than Toronto.

For every good prospect you seem to think Toronto has Montreal has that and more, so please don't take your own opinion too seriously because there are way better hockey people making the judgments on prospects than some poster on hfboards.com.

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