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NHL Lockout XXVI: 57 Hockey Channels (And Nothin' On)

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Old
12-10-2012, 09:49 PM
  #101
LickTheEnvelope
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The PA must really want the 8 year deals instead of 5 year deals since they just gave up about $150 mil over the weekend.

Interesting since it barely affects any of them...

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12-10-2012, 09:50 PM
  #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrie22 View Post
that cbc poll dissagree's with you
It may, but without knowing how many people participated it's pretty much just fluff.

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12-10-2012, 09:50 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Barrie22 View Post
that cbc poll dissagree's with you
The CBC poll tells me that people are giving up paying attention until it comes back, not that people won't care.

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12-10-2012, 09:51 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Barrie22 View Post
that cbc poll dissagree's with you
not really. i doubt it will have much relationship to what happens when hockey starts up again. not only won't hockey take a hit...but i wouldn't be surprised if we see at least one more team in canada in the next couple of years.

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Old
12-10-2012, 09:51 PM
  #105
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The negotiating committee looks to me like one of the tools used by companies to engage employees. You never select the totally unengaged or the totally invested, rather you select those who tend to follow the leaders rather than follow the bottom group, but lack the skill and confidence to take a stand. You take them onto the committee, praise their involvement and tell them how important their role will be to the team and the overall well being of the company and how they too will share in the added benefits. These become the strongest proponents of whatever program you are trying to implement, as they are not the top employeess and try even harder because they don't what to disappoint either their peers or the manager that chose them.

What they never ever realize is that they were chosen because they could be manipulated easiest to the hidden agenda of the managements new program and that their enthusiasm and commitment makes the totally uninterested employeee support them too. The best employees never need such peer motivation, but the middle and lower ends do.

This is the first time I ever saw the complete list and this was exactly my first thought. They teach this strategy to management. If you can get the average to provide support, the below average will also raise their support, the above average is always supportive.

This list is full of underdog, team players, but they hardly strike me as leaders or the guys that will mold the best deal for the players. But they will follow the lead of whoever is in charge and promote their message.

When the training fails to result in positive results, bring in the best employees to support, motivate and restore to this group their sense of importance to the end result, so that they keep positive and do not drop to the unengaged side

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12-10-2012, 09:52 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope View Post
The PA must really want the 8 year deals instead of 5 year deals since they just gave up about $150 mil over the weekend.

Interesting since it barely affects any of them...
It follows their whole senseless endeavor.

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12-10-2012, 09:53 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrie22 View Post
that cbc poll dissagree's with you
Because fans never vote on emotion or anger.

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12-10-2012, 09:58 PM
  #108
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You missed the point. Players complained publicly about Linden and the PA. The myth of a huge silent majority is just that: a myth.
Fehr was hired by the players. They knew they were getting a hardliner when they hired him. You can forget the argument that Fehr has taken over the NHLPA. The players wanted him and the players got him, for better or worse.
Hard liners led by Eric Lindros and Ian Pulver hired Fehr. They orchestrated the firing of Paul Kelly without the knowledge of most of the PA membership.

The hard liners of the PA wanted Fehr because they wanted a war against the NHL.

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12-10-2012, 10:07 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Boltsfan2029 View Post
It may, but without knowing how many people participated it's pretty much just fluff.
Fringe fans and kids will certainly be less interested. It will effect the NHLs bottom dollar.

Especially in markets in the states where there's heaps of other options.

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:09 PM
  #110
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http://nesn.com/2009/08/kelly-firing...l-never-learn/

This was 3 years ago. Very telling.

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12-10-2012, 10:15 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanwest View Post
You missed the point. Players complained publicly about Linden and the PA. The myth of a huge silent majority is just that: a myth.
Fehr was hired by the players. They knew they were getting a hardliner when they hired him. You can forget the argument that Fehr has taken over the NHLPA. The players wanted him and the players got him, for better or worse.
Fehr took the job on the condition that he be given the final say (or however you want to say it) so that, like the poster aprevious mentioned, no midnight takeovers would be possible behind his back.

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12-10-2012, 10:15 PM
  #112
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I'm confused by the PA.

From looking over the offers in October when they started the 2 sides were about $800 million apart but the PA offer wasn't linked so it's hard to tell.

The next offer from the PA on Nov 21st they linked to revenues and requested the make whole be $400 mil or so, but by that time had lost about $275 mil in salaries for this season (at 50/50 level...).

The one last week that they tried to counter on the CBA term and contract lengths cost them another $130 mil or so in games being cancelled and might cost more if the owners do not keep the safe offer on the table.

As of right now the players have lost about all the $$$ difference I can see between the original offers already...

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:18 PM
  #113
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Reading that NESN article wow. NHLPA probably started this lockout 3 years ago.

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:19 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
Fehr took the job on the condition that he be given the final say (or however you want to say it) so that, like the poster aprevious mentioned, no midnight takeovers would be possible behind his back.
That was exactly my point. That's why the players hired him.

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:20 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryHabs View Post
http://nesn.com/2009/08/kelly-firing...l-never-learn/

This was 3 years ago. Very telling.
Oh my goodness....

I will admit, that at the time that the last Lockout ended, I was so thrilled to have hockey back, that I didn't pay much attention to the things that were going on with the Union, even though I had heard/read the headlines of everything that happened from when the last lockout ended until now.

But I never knew the details of the whole story...That's just entirely sickening!

It really just makes me sick reading that and now I'm expected to continue cheering for players when hockey comes back? (I mean at the end of the day, I root for my team not individual players)

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:23 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by RockLobster View Post
Oh my goodness....

I will admit, that at the time that the last Lockout ended, I was so thrilled to have hockey back, that I didn't pay much attention to the things that were going on with the Union, even though I had heard/read the headlines of everything that happened from when the last lockout ended until now.

But I never knew the details of the whole story...That's just entirely sickening!

It really just makes me sick reading that and now I'm expected to continue cheering for players when hockey comes back? (I mean at the end of the day, I root for my team not individual players)
The NHLPA is a mess and that article makes it clear. They don't care for the sport at all, it's all about money. With Paul Kelly at the helm, we would have had a full season.

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:24 PM
  #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryHabs View Post
Reading that NESN article wow. NHLPA probably started this lockout 3 years ago.
Yep it does, did the audit ever become public or is that what the twitter argument is always about between Walsh and whoever?

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:27 PM
  #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryHabs View Post
http://nesn.com/2009/08/kelly-firing...l-never-learn/

This was 3 years ago. Very telling.
Should be required reading for #theplayers . I can't believe that a civil relationship with your negotiating partner was viewed as a NEGATIVE!

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12-10-2012, 10:27 PM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryHabs View Post
http://nesn.com/2009/08/kelly-firing...l-never-learn/

This was 3 years ago. Very telling.
You don't bring in Fehr by accident. They knew what they were doing. The NHL knew what they were doing. It was always going to be a fight. Lockout, strike, it didn't matter, it was going to be a fight, and a potentially devastating one, either way.

They have to be willing to go further than the owners. For the players, at this point, to have not wasted everyone's time, and especially their own(since careers are short), they have to win. Or at least feel like they won, but that may not even be enough. Whatever the cost, whatever that ends up meaning.

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Old
12-10-2012, 10:29 PM
  #120
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More Jarret Stoll, "It hasn’t been handled well on both sides, that’s why we are where we are."

https://twitter.com/JoshRimerHockey/...39782982111232

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12-10-2012, 10:30 PM
  #121
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The comments made by Stoll lead me to believe that there are far more within the NHLPA that thinks like him.

https://twitter.com/JoshRimerHockey
Quote:
More Jarret Stoll, "It hasn’t been handled well on both sides, that’s why we are where we are."

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12-10-2012, 10:31 PM
  #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryHabs View Post
http://nesn.com/2009/08/kelly-firing...l-never-learn/

This was 3 years ago. Very telling.
Oh god. It's actually really scary going back and reading this after 3 years. This article pretty much foreshadowed the future.

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12-10-2012, 10:31 PM
  #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryHabs View Post
http://nesn.com/2009/08/kelly-firing...l-never-learn/

This was 3 years ago. Very telling.
For every Allan Walsh out there tweeting the link to the P&R article, I wish there were a few guys shoving this article in the NHLPA's face.

I'd love to hear what Prust, Bisonnette, Cole, Gorges, Upshall, Versteeg (and co, etc) would have to say after reading that. Most of them probably don't even know who Paul Kelly is.

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12-10-2012, 10:39 PM
  #124
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Hargrove, Penny, Pink, Pulver and Lindros represent the old guard of the NHLPA, one that was confrontational, hard-lined and more concerned with money than the overall well-being of the union and the game. They come from a time when chaos and greed ruled the players’ association and still believe the union conceded too much after the 2004-05 lockout.

Read more at: http://nesn.com/2009/08/kelly-firing...l-never-learn/
Ahh yes. That group...

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12-10-2012, 10:40 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by LickTheEnvelope View Post
The PA must really want the 8 year deals instead of 5 year deals since they just gave up about $150 mil over the weekend.

Interesting since it barely affects any of them...
The fans need a 10 year CBA so we don't have to do this again in 6 years.

The league needs 10 year CBA so it can rebuild itself and it's support.

The owners need a 10 year CBA so it they build healthy teams.

The players needs a 10 year CBA to let things cooldown and hire a guy to work on building positiive relations with the owners, let a lot of old militants retire, not lose another year to more lockout/strikes.

10 years is good for everyone.

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