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Young players who lack vision and hockey IQ

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Old
12-12-2012, 01:38 AM
  #76
Hennig
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Old
12-12-2012, 02:05 AM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
People are forgetting a couple of things here IMO.

1st the pace of the game is so much quicker today than it ever has been, the abilities to make plays at top speed has always separated the better (hockey vision or IQ) players from the less talented ones.

In the past, ie the 80's teams played much looser defense and there was much more time and space for elite players, those with IQ and vision to make plays as well.

Vision can't be taught but reaction time can be as evidenced by simulation "games" and techniques.

There are many skilled players today with great vision and IQ, it just is less an advantage than it used to be with less time and space out there.
I think it's the opposite. You need to be smarter and a quicker thinker because those seams and lanes close in seconds now. You need to know what you're doing before you even begin to do it. In the past, you had more time to make your play. It's more an advantage now than it ever has been.

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Old
12-12-2012, 05:50 AM
  #78
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Old
12-12-2012, 06:53 AM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bored Man View Post
*looks at username*

*looks at user title*

No bias here.
Interesting observation...so I'm assuming you are the only unbiased poster on the boards

When True North bought the Thrashers, it was probably the one team I followed the least and knew next to nothing about the team. I was lucky enough to get ST and set out watching this team closely. After the first few months one thing became abuntantly clear and that was Bogosian skill set is off the charts and he makes more good decisions on the backend then anyone except maybe Enstrom and early on he became Jets top shutdown d-man. IMO defenseman making good decisions in their own end usually fits in with hockey IQ. Over the season there was pretty much universal concenses on the Jets boards that Bogo will soon be the Jets best player.

If you don't believe me go post there that Bogo lacks...or will never be...etc.

But expect the same reaction if someone posted on the Oilers board the same thing about one of your young guns.

And Bogo does stand for Buy One Get One, and since Winnipigers love a good deal I thought it was a good fit.

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Old
12-12-2012, 06:54 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Mouse21 View Post
thread screams Matt Duchene.
all the talent in the world but no hockey IQ and doesnt know how to use team mates
Funny how Duchene and Kane have the same traits. Kane has got great tools (speed, shot, size) and "IF" he ever learns how to do a give and go he could be unreal.. Hockey IQ is a big ? For now we will plug our nose, take his 30 goals and hope that part of his game develops in time "?" not sure if Matt battles the same ahhhhh "Maturity" issues as Kane does either

I watched Bogosian in every game as a Jet and hockey IQ is not a problem as long as he is playing with confidence which he was last season.

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Old
12-12-2012, 07:36 AM
  #81
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This thread screams Dustin Brown. He's an excellent physical presence and can absolutely bury the puck, but he lacks chemistry with every linemate he's ever had.

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Old
12-12-2012, 07:40 AM
  #82
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Old
12-12-2012, 09:16 AM
  #83
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Old
12-12-2012, 10:18 AM
  #84
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Old
12-12-2012, 10:48 AM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordic View Post
I think he's got a hockey IQ, his problem is being half the size of Theo Fleury.
No, it's true. He lacks true hockey sense, just like Niclas Bergfors. He's very skilled and tenacious though.

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Old
12-12-2012, 11:20 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by AfroThunder396 View Post
Not sure if he qualifies as young (27), but David Clarkson.
What? Explain this to me. He may not have any passing abilities but he wouldn't have scored 30 goals with his skillset if he didn't have hockey sense.

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Old
12-12-2012, 11:47 AM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Missionhockey View Post
What? Explain this to me. He may not have any passing abilities but he wouldn't have scored 30 goals with his skillset if he didn't have hockey sense.
Or if he didn't have Sykora & Elias ricochet shots off his ass/thigh/shin pad.
Don't get me wrong, Clarkson's ability to hold onto the puck and help make a play has improved.... but his hockey sense is still severely lacking.
He's great at crashing the net, which is invaluable... but the only thing eliminating him from this thread's discussion is that he's not "young" (relatively)

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Old
12-12-2012, 11:58 AM
  #88
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For the Wild, here are some prospects I'd say have skills but can't put it together:

Tyler Cuma, awesome skater and at one point looked like a great defensive prospect but has shown absolutely nothing in the AHL.

Brett Bulmer, big, fast, somewhat tough, good hands, great shot but is awful now that he's in the AHL.

Tyler Graovac, I see him as similar to Bulmer except not as physical. Someone compared him to Jason Spezza without a brain.

Kris Foucault, another high skill guy who can't put it together in the AHL.

Christoph Bertschy, late round pick in 2012, supposed to be a small skill guy but doing nothing at all in the Swiss leagues.

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Old
12-12-2012, 12:06 PM
  #89
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Old
12-12-2012, 12:11 PM
  #90
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Old
12-12-2012, 12:12 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Missionhockey View Post
What? Explain this to me. He may not have any passing abilities but he wouldn't have scored 30 goals with his skillset if he didn't have hockey sense.
Clarkson is a good goal scorer with an underrated shot. I wouldn't be surprised to see him getting a few more 25 goals seasons.

But he's called Mr Clarkaround for a good reason, and honestly he's the finest definition of puck hog. It's fair to say that he hasn't a good hockey sense.

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Old
12-12-2012, 01:38 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manilaNJ View Post
Or if he didn't have Sykora & Elias ricochet shots off his ass/thigh/shin pad.
Don't get me wrong, Clarkson's ability to hold onto the puck and help make a play has improved.... but his hockey sense is still severely lacking.
He's great at crashing the net, which is invaluable... but the only thing eliminating him from this thread's discussion is that he's not "young" (relatively)
Wouldn't that be the definition of somebody that has a hockey sense? Knowing when to crash the net? Soft spots for rebounds? Where you need to be to cycle the puck? Knowing the right place to be at the right time? Vision is lacking, but I disagree on hockey IQ.

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Old
12-12-2012, 01:59 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by KnightofBoston View Post
Blake Wheeler
Definitely not.

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Old
12-12-2012, 03:31 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarick View Post
For the Wild, here are some prospects I'd say have skills but can't put it together:

Tyler Cuma, awesome skater and at one point looked like a great defensive prospect but has shown absolutely nothing in the AHL.

Brett Bulmer, big, fast, somewhat tough, good hands, great shot but is awful now that he's in the AHL.

Tyler Graovac, I see him as similar to Bulmer except not as physical. Someone compared him to Jason Spezza without a brain.

Kris Foucault, another high skill guy who can't put it together in the AHL.

Christoph Bertschy, late round pick in 2012, supposed to be a small skill guy but doing nothing at all in the Swiss leagues.
You forgot Granlund.

Just kidding, fellas.

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Old
12-12-2012, 04:16 PM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Missionhockey View Post
Wouldn't that be the definition of somebody that has a hockey sense? Knowing when to crash the net? Soft spots for rebounds? Where you need to be to cycle the puck? Knowing the right place to be at the right time? Vision is lacking, but I disagree on hockey IQ.
I love Clarkson, and I'm not trying to trash him... but there's a difference between knowing to plant yourself in front of the net when guys like Elias & Kovalchuk have the puck... and knowing how to create and anticipate plays.

Clarkson is a better player than he used to be, but hockey sense is the very thing he is lacking.

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Old
12-12-2012, 04:23 PM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manilaNJ View Post
I love Clarkson, and I'm not trying to trash him... but there's a difference between knowing to plant yourself in front of the net when guys like Elias & Kovalchuk have the puck... and knowing how to create and anticipate plays.

Clarkson is a better player than he used to be, but hockey sense is the very thing he is lacking.
Agree to disagree. I don't believe you can produce as much as Clarkson does if you don't have a feel for where the puck is going to be. It's not as easy as planting yourself in front of the net, otherwise everyone would do it.


Last edited by Missionhockey: 12-12-2012 at 04:55 PM.
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Old
12-12-2012, 04:28 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by KnightofBoston View Post
Blake Wheeler
Going to have to respectfully strongly disagree with you KnightofBoston. After game 19 last year he was an absolute beast for the Jets and carried us on his back many nights. when he plays with confidence he is a force physically and also very creative with the puck. Blake displayed a high hockey IQ last season for the Jets.

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Old
12-12-2012, 04:28 PM
  #98
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Old
12-12-2012, 05:10 PM
  #99
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Taylor Hall
Again, this simply isn't true

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Old
12-12-2012, 05:20 PM
  #100
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Very shocked to see people mentioning Taylor Hall in this thread.

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