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World Cup of Hockey Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

Roster Talk '13 — Canada V4.0 (Final Roster Named)

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Old
12-14-2012, 12:02 AM
  #801
newfy
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My guess for the PP is the top line.

Hub RNH Shifley

Rielly Hamilton

Second PP

Rattie Strome Ritchie

Murphy Ouellet

PK

Jenner Danault
Harrington Ouellet

Hudon Camara
Reinhart Wotherspoon

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12-14-2012, 12:04 AM
  #802
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fulcrum View Post
Average height for Russia is 6'1.6'' (so basically 6' 2'')
Average weight is 194 lbs

Bigger than last year. I wouldn't call it a slow team though.
You are including your entire roster I think and I was looking just at the forwards in my post. Unless there have been cuts from the roster already, the average height of forwards in camp is 6'1" and weight is 179 pounds.

If I included D from Canada, the averages would be much higher, as only 2 D are under 200 pounds and we have a 6'4" and a 6'5" D back there.

It's funny, but some of USA's biggest players are their goalies. 6'2", 6'3" & 6'5". 211, 222 & 230.

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12-14-2012, 12:04 AM
  #803
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There is 0 chance, and I mean zero chance Murphy isn't getting the most powerplay ice time out of any defensemen. I see no scenario in which Spott does not do that.

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12-14-2012, 12:08 AM
  #804
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Originally Posted by takehisheadoff View Post
Dumba should of made it over Reinhart. Any one who really sees these 2 (Or just doesn't watch youtube vids or internet opinions) knows who's better. Or sniffs glue.
I watch both quite often and personally I prefer Reinhart at this point.

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12-14-2012, 12:09 AM
  #805
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Very very solid team. They should generate a lot of offensive opportunities and they'll have a terrific transition game as well with all that speed and creativity up front. Perfect mix of grit with the likes of Danault, Jenner, Lipon, Camara who'll provide quite the aggression on the forecheck and on the Olympic ice surface it's so important to get your D involved in the play or the 4th man joining the rush/play and this D group will definitely be capable of that. It's important they adapt to the dzone quickly because it's not so much being physical but knowing where to be and how to rotate that stop chances. They have enough time with all the practices and 4 games before the first test to find the right combinations and right playing style and can't wait until they do. This team is definitely the most exciting Team Canada has sent in quite a while, at least potential wise since perhaps 2005 or 2008.

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12-14-2012, 12:13 AM
  #806
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
There is 0 chance, and I mean zero chance Murphy isn't getting the most powerplay ice time out of any defensemen. I see no scenario in which Spott does not do that.
Hamilton and Rielly are no slouches, I wouldnt bet on him getting much more, if more at all over those 2.

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12-14-2012, 12:14 AM
  #807
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Originally Posted by takehisheadoff View Post
Dumba should of made it over Reinhart. Any one who really sees these 2 (Or just doesn't watch youtube vids or internet opinions) knows who's better. Or sniffs glue.
Haha you have zero idea what you're talking about.

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Old
12-14-2012, 12:17 AM
  #808
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There were a few surprises among the cuts, but that happens every year. I had Corrado on the team over Wotherspoon. I would have gone with Wilson and McNeill over Drouin and Lipon. I certainly didn't expect that there would be three undrafted players, or two 1995-born players, or an undrafted 1993. (MacKinnon was the only undrafted player on my projected roster). Not in a lockout year, in which we have the best of the 1993-born talent.

At the same time, they obviously built this team with the big ice in mind. If this tournament is on regulation ice, McNeill and Wilson are likely there. But in Russia, you're going to want a fast, slick team that moves the puck quickly from the defence.

And with the talent we have available this year, the coaches can justify trotting out three potent offensive lines, as opposed to years when the tournament is in North America, and the third and fourth lines are built for energy, defensive play and a relentless forecheck, with the ability to produce some offence.

Goaltending will be a concern at the start. I hope it's not a concern when the medal round begins. Subban struggled during camp, but I'd still go with him in the first two games, because of the big ice factor. He's used to it. The ice dimensions don't just change the complexion of the game for defencemen and forwards; it's also a big deal for goalies. It's rare for Canada to go into a tournament in Europe with a goalie who is used to big ice; it's an opportunity we have to take advantage of.

I wouldn't have gone with Dumba. Obviously, he's a polarizing defenceman. There are some people who really think highly of him; others want to distance themselves from him. He's a high-risk, high-reward proposition. With Murphy and to a lesser extent Reilly on the team, there were two defencemen already who can be risky players. I don't want three defencemen on the team who have that label in their scouting report.

I like Murphy for that seventh defenceman/PP specialist role, but I'm hopeful his even strength ice time will be kept to a minimum.

I wouldn't be surprised if Nugent-Hopkins breaks Canada's tournament scoring record. It's been a long, long time since we've had a 19-year-old of his calibre play for us at the tournament. And it's been even longer since we've had a 19-year-old of his calibre have teammates like he has. He's also a guy who should have a relatively seamless transition to the big ice.

I know a lot of people expect Canada to cruise at this tournament, like we did in Grand Forks. We won't. The class of 1993 is a good one for Canada, but it's not great or memorable like our class of 1985. And a lot of countries have good to strong 1993-born talent, whereas the 85-born talent for a lot of nations wasn't overwhelming. The tournament will also be held on big ice. Canada should win, but don't expect a repeat of 2005. If this team takes victory for granted, then they'll be in for a disappointing result.

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Old
12-14-2012, 12:23 AM
  #809
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Over last two years:
Subban: 40-21-3-0, 2.36 GAA, .927 SV%, 5 SO
Brossoit: 54-17-4-6, 2.54 GAA, .911 SV%, 3 SO
Binnington: 38-23-1-3, 2.72 GAA, .916 SV%, 4 SO
Paterson: 29-30-2-4, 3.45 GAA, .903 SV%, 2 SO

This year:
Subban: 15-7-3-0, 2.17 GAA, .932 SV%, 2 SO
Brossoit: 12-4-2-3, 2.73 GAA, .901 SV%, 0 SO
Binnington: 17-6-1-2, 2.31 GAA, .930 SV%, 3 SO
Paterson: 11-12-2-1, 3.49 GAA, .901 SV%, 1 SO

Subway Series Statistics:
Subban: 7 Shots, 7 Saves, 0 GA (small sample but he did his job)
Brossoit: 43 Shots, 40 Saves, 3 GA
Binnington: 18 Shots, 16 Saves, 2 GA
Paterson: 9 Shots, 8 Saves, 1 GA

*Don't remember quality of goals but regardless no one really edges Subban out here since he didn't have to do much and stopped what he had to stop.

Canada-Russia Challenge:
Subban: 49 Shots, 45 Saves, 4 GA (.918 SV%)
Brossoit: 27 Shots, 21 Saves, 6 GA (.778 SV%)

*Brossoit was terrible while Subban played strong against an excellent Russian team.

I'm tired of the crap about it being about the name and the media and all this ****. Malcolm Subban earned his spot through his incredible play for the last few seasons. He has been great this year and a bad 30 minutes isn't enough to overshadow that.

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Old
12-14-2012, 12:24 AM
  #810
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Glad that they're taking both MacKinnon and Drouin. Over the course of our current 3 year drought we've left off guys like RNH, Seguin and Skinner just because they were young (in their draft years). These guys went on to be solid to excellent NHLers less than a year later, they should have made it. Had they left MacKinnon and Drouin off this team, they'd just be adding to those mistakes, so I'm psyched they've seen the error of their ways.

On the flip side, and somewhat in contrast to what I just said, I'm pretty surprised that they cut Tom Wilson. He's huge, he's mean, and I think he's underrated offensively. I don't like a whole team of grinders, but one big mofo to scare everyone seems like a good idea. Wilson would be physically dominant to the max in this tournament, I figured he was a lock for the 4th line.

Like the choices in general though.

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Old
12-14-2012, 12:25 AM
  #811
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post
Goaltending will be a concern at the start. I hope it's not a concern when the medal round begins. Subban struggled during camp, but I'd still go with him in the first two games, because of the big ice factor. He's used to it. The ice dimensions don't just change the complexion of the game for defencemen and forwards; it's also a big deal for goalies. It's rare for Canada to go into a tournament in Europe with a goalie who is used to big ice; it's an opportunity we have to take advantage of.
Subban's familiarity on the big ice is another great point.

I'd imagine they will split the first two games seeing how they are against Germany and Slovakia. I'd imagine the determined starter (which I imagine will be Subban) will get the USA and Russia. Will be interesting to see things unfold.

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12-14-2012, 12:28 AM
  #812
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
Glad that they're taking both MacKinnon and Drouin. Over the course of our current 3 year drought we've left off guys like RNH, Seguin and Skinner just because they were young (in their draft years). These guys went on to be solid to excellent NHLers less than a year later, they should have made it. Had they left MacKinnon and Drouin off this team, they'd just be adding to those mistakes, so I'm psyched they've seen the error of their ways.

On the flip side, and somewhat in contrast to what I just said, I'm pretty surprised that they cut Tom Wilson. He's huge, he's mean, and I think he's underrated offensively. I don't like a whole team of grinders, but one big mofo to scare everyone seems like a good idea. Wilson would be physically dominant to the max in this tournament, I figured he was a lock for the 4th line.

Like the choices in general though.
that use to make upset when they left them really good players off the team cause there a year younger

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Old
12-14-2012, 12:32 AM
  #813
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
Glad that they're taking both MacKinnon and Drouin. Over the course of our current 3 year drought we've left off guys like RNH, Seguin and Skinner just because they were young (in their draft years). These guys went on to be solid to excellent NHLers less than a year later, they should have made it. Had they left MacKinnon and Drouin off this team, they'd just be adding to those mistakes, so I'm psyched they've seen the error of their ways.

On the flip side, and somewhat in contrast to what I just said, I'm pretty surprised that they cut Tom Wilson. He's huge, he's mean, and I think he's underrated offensively. I don't like a whole team of grinders, but one big mofo to scare everyone seems like a good idea. Wilson would be physically dominant to the max in this tournament, I figured he was a lock for the 4th line.

Like the choices in general though.
How somebody turns out later has no bearing on whether they should be picked at the time.

Dumba could be as good as any D on the team today.

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Old
12-14-2012, 12:36 AM
  #814
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
Glad that they're taking both MacKinnon and Drouin. Over the course of our current 3 year drought we've left off guys like RNH, Seguin and Skinner just because they were young (in their draft years). These guys went on to be solid to excellent NHLers less than a year later, they should have made it. Had they left MacKinnon and Drouin off this team, they'd just be adding to those mistakes, so I'm psyched they've seen the error of their ways.

On the flip side, and somewhat in contrast to what I just said, I'm pretty surprised that they cut Tom Wilson. He's huge, he's mean, and I think he's underrated offensively. I don't like a whole team of grinders, but one big mofo to scare everyone seems like a good idea. Wilson would be physically dominant to the max in this tournament, I figured he was a lock for the 4th line.

Like the choices in general though.
I think if the tournament is in Canada or the United States, Wilson is on the team. However, I think the big ice plays a role in this decision. The huge guys that go out there and hit are limited when playing on big ice, and if they cannot skate that well, they get themselves into a lot of trouble (not really familiar with Wilson's skating ability).

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12-14-2012, 12:39 AM
  #815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
Glad that they're taking both MacKinnon and Drouin. Over the course of our current 3 year drought we've left off guys like RNH, Seguin and Skinner just because they were young (in their draft years). These guys went on to be solid to excellent NHLers less than a year later, they should have made it. Had they left MacKinnon and Drouin off this team, they'd just be adding to those mistakes, so I'm psyched they've seen the error of their ways.

On the flip side, and somewhat in contrast to what I just said, I'm pretty surprised that they cut Tom Wilson. He's huge, he's mean, and I think he's underrated offensively. I don't like a whole team of grinders, but one big mofo to scare everyone seems like a good idea. Wilson would be physically dominant to the max in this tournament, I figured he was a lock for the 4th line.

Like the choices in general though.
It's still a 19-year-old's tournament. Canada didn't lose in the last three years because we didn't take Seguin. We lost to a tremendous U.S. team in Saskatoon, but let's also remember that due to injuries we played with five defencemen in the gold medal game. (Hamonic and de Haan were both injured). And that was one of the worst years for Canada having junior-aged guys in the NHL.

We lost in Buffalo because we suffered a monumental, team-wide collapse. (And I'm sure you'll remember that the Russians had one player on that team who wasn't 19. That was a big reason why the Russians were so resilient; they had a lot of guys who had experience). And we lost in Alberta because we picked a bad time for a bad effort against a Russian team that we should have defeated handily.

This is a tournament for 19-year-olds. That's not to say that a 17-year-old shouldn't be going to Ufa. Like I said before, MacKinnon was on my projected roster from the outset. I'm worried Drouin is going to get exposed. I've seen a lot of players who went on to be great NHLers struggle in this tournament at age 17. There haven't been many thrive for Canada at this tournament at 17.

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12-14-2012, 12:46 AM
  #816
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Originally Posted by Nash View Post
You are including your entire roster I think and I was looking just at the forwards in my post. Unless there have been cuts from the roster already, the average height of forwards in camp is 6'1" and weight is 179 pounds.

If I included D from Canada, the averages would be much higher, as only 2 D are under 200 pounds and we have a 6'4" and a 6'5" D back there.

It's funny, but some of USA's biggest players are their goalies. 6'2", 6'3" & 6'5". 211, 222 & 230.
It sounds like you got your numbers from the official (FHR) list of the roster, it's very outdated information for most players. They don't bother updating the numbers and some of them go way back to U18. Just check what they have for Kucherov, he's gained almost 20 pounds since that list.

I have my own db with latest from KHL, VHL and MHL and it comes out to 190lbs to Forwards and 194 for D, as well as 6'1.6''...

Anyway, it doesn't really matter- you can tell by looking, there is no way that Russian team averages 178 lbs. There are some sizeable guys on this team.

fyi, Shenfeld is out injured.


Last edited by Fulcrum: 12-14-2012 at 12:52 AM.
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12-14-2012, 12:47 AM
  #817
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Originally Posted by God Bless Canada View Post

This is a tournament for 19-year-olds. That's not to say that a 17-year-old shouldn't be going to Ufa. Like I said before, MacKinnon was on my projected roster from the outset. I'm worried Drouin is going to get exposed. I've seen a lot of players who went on to be great NHLers struggle in this tournament at age 17. There haven't been many thrive for Canada at this tournament at 17.
Agreed. Mackinnon can hold his own though... He has the size, skill, and speed of a 19 year old so I see him in that way, drouin not so much, not that he needs to play sheltered minutes but TC should be cognizant of where and who he plays with so there will be maximum reward with minimal risk

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12-14-2012, 12:48 AM
  #818
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Excited to see what they do with the PP.

In my opinion/viewings, no one on this team runs a PP as well as Rielly, not even Murphy. Unfortunately, Murphy's probably got the leg up on the 1st unit QB spot because Spott knows him and probably also needs to justify bringing him as the 7th d-man...if he's not going to play big PP minutes, what is he doing there?

Either way, I just hope the PP minutes are distributed based on merit and not for justifying someone making the team.

If there's an undertone of me not liking Spott in this post, it's because I don't like Spott. (former Rangers season ticket holder too)

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12-14-2012, 12:54 AM
  #819
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Originally Posted by maplehawk View Post
In my opinion/viewings, no one on this team runs a PP as well as Rielly
Rumour has it there is a player on this team who quarterbacked the third best power play in the NHL last season

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12-14-2012, 12:58 AM
  #820
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Originally Posted by maplehawk View Post
Excited to see what they do with the PP.

In my opinion/viewings, no one on this team runs a PP as well as Rielly, not even Murphy. Unfortunately, Murphy's probably got the leg up on the 1st unit QB spot because Spott knows him and probably also needs to justify bringing him as the 7th d-man...if he's not going to play big PP minutes, what is he doing there?

Either way, I just hope the PP minutes are distributed based on merit and not for justifying someone making the team.

If there's an undertone of me not liking Spott in this post, it's because I don't like Spott. (former Rangers season ticket holder too)
I agree. Rielly's powerplay looks more dangerous than Murphy's, but Spott will definitely go with Murphy. I was surprised Spott shook Murphy's hand when giving him the news, rather than giving him a full out hug and whispering "you finally did it buddy" in his ear.

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12-14-2012, 01:03 AM
  #821
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Rumour has it there is a player on this team who quarterbacked the third best power play in the NHL last season
He won't be quarterbacking the pp anymore with Schultz there so you might as well put him in a position where he can be the most effective.

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12-14-2012, 01:04 AM
  #822
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Agreed. Mackinnon can hold his own though... He has the size, skill, and speed of a 19 year old so I see him in that way, drouin not so much, not that he needs to play sheltered minutes but TC should be cognizant of where and who he plays with so there will be maximum reward with minimal risk
I think MacKinnon would have had a bigger impact this year if the lockout were resolved. He likely would have had top-six ice time, and he likely would have been one of the team's top scorers.He'll be fine this year. I'm worried about Drouin. I get why he was chosen - chemistry, direction of the third/fourth line (depending on your perspective). Ask me in three weeks if it was a right move, a wrong move, or an inconsequential move. (As it turned out in Saskatoon, having the Spitfire line on the team was the wrong move, it was Willie DesJardins biggest mistake, but that wasn't the biggest reason we lost).

I'll be really interested to see how Lipon does. What Tanner Pearson pulled off last year was a really big deal. It's very, very rare for an undrafted 19-year-old to play for Canada. I think what Lipon has done is even more impressive, because we have our choice of everybody, and our 1993-born forwards are impressive. (The 1994-born forwards, well, that's another story). By all accounts, he brought some grit to camp, and that helped him make the team. I'm less worried about him being exposed than Drouin, but I think Lipon's big ice experience would be minimal. (He would have seen the big ice in Sask AAA when Regina visited Notre Dame). We can get away with one of them struggling. We can't get away with both of them struggling.

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12-14-2012, 01:06 AM
  #823
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He won't be quarterbacking the pp anymore with Schultz there so you might as well put him in a position where he can be the most effective.
What?

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12-14-2012, 01:09 AM
  #824
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maplehawk View Post
Excited to see what they do with the PP.

In my opinion/viewings, no one on this team runs a PP as well as Rielly, not even Murphy. Unfortunately, Murphy's probably got the leg up on the 1st unit QB spot because Spott knows him and probably also needs to justify bringing him as the 7th d-man...if he's not going to play big PP minutes, what is he doing there?

Either way, I just hope the PP minutes are distributed based on merit and not for justifying someone making the team.

If there's an undertone of me not liking Spott in this post, it's because I don't like Spott. (former Rangers season ticket holder too)
What about the kid who ran the #3 PP in the NHL?

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12-14-2012, 01:11 AM
  #825
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The Russians are smiling at their fortune here. They just watched the Canadian starter get lit up by a University team, they have to be chomping at the bit.

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