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[NYM/TOR] Dickey/Thole/Nickeas for D'Arnaud/Syndergaard/Buck/Becerra (done deal)

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Old
12-20-2012, 12:15 PM
  #451
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Romero as a number 1. What's next? Reimer is an all star goalie?

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12-20-2012, 02:10 PM
  #452
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Romero as a number 1. What's next? Reimer is an all star goalie?
No kidding. Romero has always been a low strikeout, high walks, high homers pitcher. Basically it shouldn't come as a surprise that he imploded so terribly last season. He was never that good.

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12-20-2012, 04:39 PM
  #453
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Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
Just going threw the thread and landed on this little gem....

So if you have a good player, you'll be questionned if you acquire more good players to surround him?

So when the Yankees open up their check books to sign everyone and anyone, what does that say about the team... that they suck and need outside help to "stay alive"?

C'mon now
There's a difference between improving the team and making several acquisitions at one position.

If the Yankees got one pitcher it would say nothing about the current team. If the Yankees went out and got 3 I would say their rotation needed major help.

And it's not like they got these guys to complement or "surround" Romero as you say. Two of them -Dickey and Johnson- are indisputably better. They're improving on Romero, I think that's pretty clear.

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12-21-2012, 04:12 AM
  #454
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Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand View Post
No kidding. Romero has always been a low strikeout, high walks, high homers pitcher. Basically it shouldn't come as a surprise that he imploded so terribly last season. He was never that good.
He was 24th and 52nd (tied with Jered Weaver) in xFIP in 2010-11, let's not overdo it here. He was 33rd in the majors in WAR in 2010-11, ahead of guys like James Shields, Madison Bumgarner and Tim Hudson.

It shouldn't come as a surprise that a guy who had elbow surgery a few weeks after the season ended pitched terribly. If you projected his walk rate to jump by 60% then you should be in Vegas and not posting on this board.

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12-21-2012, 08:38 AM
  #455
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Originally Posted by Machinehead View Post
There's a difference between improving the team and making several acquisitions at one position.

If the Yankees got one pitcher it would say nothing about the current team. If the Yankees went out and got 3 I would say their rotation needed major help.

And it's not like they got these guys to complement or "surround" Romero as you say. Two of them -Dickey and Johnson- are indisputably better. They're improving on Romero, I think that's pretty clear.
No one said otherwise.

If you have someone solid and you can improve the position by adding a even better player(s), I don't see what the big deal is in all honesty.

At the end of the day, whatever deal you make is with the intention of improving your club, period... and that's exactly what the Jays did.

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12-21-2012, 09:59 AM
  #456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tortorella View Post
Kuroda might even be our best pitcher. So underrated.
Kuroda's fastball dropped last year, swinging strike dropped last year, LOB% was well above career average, is turning 38 before the season and is a right hander in Yankee stadium. I would set his ERA at 3.60 for next season as an over under.

Edit: His sinker is around the same, that's the problem with using fangraphs for velocities.

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12-21-2012, 10:13 AM
  #457
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Sabathia
Kuroda
Pineda
Pettite
Hughes

Dickey
Johnson
Morrow
Buehrle
Romero

Dickey and Sabathia will probably be a wash, both will throw a ton of innings and be similar ERA's if they perform. Depending on Johnson's fastball, Kuroda has the edge here in innings and performence. Morrow should destroy Pineda in both if he stays relatively healtthy, Buehrle and Petite are both similar pitchers but Buehrle is a safer bet for both. Romero is better than Hughes as long as he is career average like.

The Jays have a slightly better rotation capable of eating a lot more innings.

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Old
12-21-2012, 12:41 PM
  #458
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http://i.imgur.com/MbYee.gif

Epic, look at Thole's face hahaha

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Old
12-21-2012, 04:18 PM
  #459
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac View Post
Sabathia
Kuroda
Pineda
Pettite
Hughes

Dickey
Johnson
Morrow
Buehrle
Romero

Dickey and Sabathia will probably be a wash, both will throw a ton of innings and be similar ERA's if they perform. Depending on Johnson's fastball, Kuroda has the edge here in innings and performence. Morrow should destroy Pineda in both if he stays relatively healtthy, Buehrle and Petite are both similar pitchers but Buehrle is a safer bet for both. Romero is better than Hughes as long as he is career average like.

The Jays have a slightly better rotation capable of eating a lot more innings.
Michael Piñata is a HUGE question mark. Is he even going to start this year? I don't think there's anyway you can put him confidently in that rotation. I'm a Jays fan, but they clearly have an edge IMO.

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12-21-2012, 04:18 PM
  #460
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Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand View Post
No kidding. Romero has always been a low strikeout, high walks, high homers pitcher. Basically it shouldn't come as a surprise that he imploded so terribly last season. He was never that good.
He had an ERA under 3 the year before..

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12-21-2012, 04:21 PM
  #461
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Originally Posted by HabsByTheBay View Post
2010-11 435 innings with a 3.32 ERA. That's number one performance.

Hughes's best season was 176 innings with a 103 ERA+. Not really in the same league.
But but... Look at Hughes win loss record!!!! 18-8 in 2010!!!


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Old
12-21-2012, 04:57 PM
  #462
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Originally Posted by mapes View Post
He had an ERA under 3 the year before..
ERA is a terribly flawed stat. Romero being a perfect example.

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12-21-2012, 04:59 PM
  #463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason MacIsaac View Post
Sabathia
Kuroda
Pineda
Pettite
Hughes

Dickey
Johnson
Morrow
Buehrle
Romero

Dickey and Sabathia will probably be a wash, both will throw a ton of innings and be similar ERA's if they perform. Depending on Johnson's fastball, Kuroda has the edge here in innings and performence. Morrow should destroy Pineda in both if he stays relatively healtthy, Buehrle and Petite are both similar pitchers but Buehrle is a safer bet for both. Romero is better than Hughes as long as he is career average like.

The Jays have a slightly better rotation capable of eating a lot more innings.
Disagree with the last two, but you're spot on with the others. Hughes <= Romero on a good day, Pettitte > Buehrle based on career and last season only. I like the Yankees rotation more, but I think if things click right, the Jays could have a chance to be as good.

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12-21-2012, 05:02 PM
  #464
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Originally Posted by GIN ANTONIC View Post
Michael Piñata is a HUGE question mark. Is he even going to start this year? I don't think there's anyway you can put him confidently in that rotation. I'm a Jays fan, but they clearly have an edge IMO.
I wouldn't put Pineda in the rotation either. His arm is very fragile and he lost a ton of velocity.

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12-21-2012, 06:23 PM
  #465
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Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand View Post
ERA is a terribly flawed stat. Romero being a perfect example.
In 2011 he had a very good season, doesn't matter which stats you use. Gotta love how "terrible" he is after 1 bad season but previous years don't mean anything

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12-21-2012, 06:44 PM
  #466
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In 2011 he had a very good season, doesn't matter which stats you use. Gotta love how "terrible" he is after 1 bad season but previous years don't mean anything
30th in the AL in K/BB is hardly very good. He did eat up a lot of innings, which is good, but to say he was "very good" is pushing it. He was decent and looks better than he was because of his ERA.

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12-21-2012, 06:53 PM
  #467
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Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand View Post
30th in the AL in K/BB is hardly very good. He did eat up a lot of innings, which is good, but to say he was "very good" is pushing it. He was decent and looks better than he was because of his ERA.
He was pretty good though. 30th in the AL despite not being a strikeout pitcher isn't bad. His command was waaaay off last year though. After May (or so) he could never locate the strike zone. Not sure what the issue was

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12-21-2012, 06:54 PM
  #468
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Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
No one said otherwise.

If you have someone solid and you can improve the position by adding a even better player(s), I don't see what the big deal is in all honesty.

At the end of the day, whatever deal you make is with the intention of improving your club, period... and that's exactly what the Jays did.
Of course. I think what the Jays did was great. My point was simply that I don't think Romero has ever been a true #1.

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12-21-2012, 07:29 PM
  #469
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He was pretty good though. 30th in the AL despite not being a strikeout pitcher isn't bad. His command was waaaay off last year though. After May (or so) he could never locate the strike zone. Not sure what the issue was
He couldn't find the strike zone the year before either. He's always had ****** control. In his so called "very good year" as you put it, he was walking over 3 batter per 9 innings. Only 6 AL pitchers were worse. He's a guy who doesn't strike anybody out, and gives all sorts of free passes. He was never an ace pitcher and always lived dangerously. He's a good number 3 when he is on, and the worst pitcher in the league when things go slightly wrong.

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12-21-2012, 07:36 PM
  #470
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The worst in the league??

He obviously could find it the year before, he had a pretty good year. Even the start of last year he wasn't bad

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12-21-2012, 07:38 PM
  #471
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you've gone from "very good" to "pretty good".

i think if fots keeps at you, you'll agree with him after a while

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12-21-2012, 07:43 PM
  #472
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He couldn't find the strike zone the year before either. He's always had ****** control. In his so called "very good year" as you put it, he was walking over 3 batter per 9 innings. Only 6 AL pitchers were worse. He's a guy who doesn't strike anybody out, and gives all sorts of free passes. He was never an ace pitcher and always lived dangerously. He's a good number 3 when he is on, and the worst pitcher in the league when things go slightly wrong.

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12-21-2012, 07:50 PM
  #473
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Good call.

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Old
12-21-2012, 07:54 PM
  #474
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The worst in the league??

He obviously could find it the year before, he had a pretty good year. Even the start of last year he wasn't bad
The only pitcher even close to as bad as Romero last year was Ubaldo, and even the mighty Ubaldo couldn't match Romero's suckiness.

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12-21-2012, 07:59 PM
  #475
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The only pitcher even close to as bad as Romero last year was Ubaldo, and even the mighty Ubaldo couldn't match Romero's suckiness.
We all know how bad he was last season. A 100 year old women has more control over her bowels than Ricky had over the baseball. It's 1 year. Can we talk about something else please. You know, like something involving the players in this deal. Talk about beating a dead horse.


Last edited by Everlong: 12-21-2012 at 08:05 PM.
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