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The Flyers roster will transition along with new NHL

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02-16-2005, 09:57 PM
  #1
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The Flyers roster will transition along with new NHL

I guess this goes without saying.
When the NHL does resume, which is going to be in time for a full season in '05/'06, the Flyers roster is going to be very different.

I know everyone is very upset right now, and stunned, even those who were pesimistic, I feel the same way.
I can't help but think how different the Flyers roster will be when hockey resumes, and how no season now, will effect that even more.

So, for you diehard nerds, let's break it down.

Let's start with the obvious departures:

John LeClair - Was gone before, now the buyout will be cheaper.

Tony Amonte - See LeClair

Claude Lapointe - Hope the guy has gotten his life in order.

Sean Burke - Was gone anyway, would be a free agent now.

Bubble guys:

Alexei Zhamnov - I like Zhamnov alot, and feel he is the playmaker at center we lacked for years.
Unfortunately, with the season cancelled, I am not sure it would be wise to bring him back. Possible though imo.

Vlad Malakhov - Had a great playoff run for us. He and Markov paired together was a joy to watch. He won't be back though at this point, not imo.

Jeremy Roenick - With Carter and Richards a year older, and only one year to buy out now, I doubt JR comes back.

Eric Desjardins - Would be a free agent, a big year older, and was already declining. Tough call there.

Marcus Ragnarrson - Kind of the same boat as Rico, except he is better imo, and I hope they'd bring him back. You have to have some vets on your defense. Tough call though for Clarkie I guess.

Donald Brashear - I love the guy, everyone on the board knows I am a Brashear supporter, and I would hate to see him go.
How in the world though, can you pay a third/fourth liner 2.25 million dollars with a definite cap coming. He does only have one year left though, and Fedoruk and Eager just don't cut it as a top enforcer. I doubt he goes, but you never know.

Now, let's take a different angle, and look at guys who would have only one year remaining on their deals after '05/'06.

Kim Johnsson - It is a stone cold mortal must that we bring him back.
Danny Markov - It's a must that we bring him back.
Donald Brashear - See above.
Mike Knuble - Kind of hard to figure where he fits in long term.
Turner Stevenson - See Mike Knuble

Basically, in the next two years we could go through a MAJOR transition period in Flyerland. Not exactly a rebuilding non-playoff stage, but a different team for sure.

We don't know what rules exactly the league will be under next year.
I guess we have an idea after the last two days.
The cap will be somewhere in the 40-46 million dollar range.
There will be no linkage.
In other words, team won't have to sell off half their roster, but the Philly's, Toronto's, New York's, and Detroit's of the world will have to make decisions and go in other directions.
The fact of the matter is though, the next year or two the entire NHL will in a transition mode.
Teams will go through major roster overhauls, and get used to the new NHL.
I think there will be a number of new rules, which everyone will have to get used to.
Basically, today marks the end of the NHL as we know it, and the Flyers organization and team, as it has been for about 10 years now.

So, I ask you, where do they go from here, where do we go from here.
It's way too early and too cloudy to get into a bunch of specifics, but the bottom line is, get used to guys like Handzus, Gagne, Johnsson, Markov, Pitkanen, Carter, Richards, Esche, and Primeau being the faces of the Flyers.
No longer will it be LeClair, Recchi, Roenick, Desjardins, etc etc.
The nucleus will be young, hungry, and determined to make their mark, and filled with question marks, just as the new NHL will be.

Again, specifics are tough right now, but this could easily be our roster next season:

Gagne - Handzus - Radivojevic
Knuble - Carter - Free agent
Kapanen - Primeau - Stevenson
Brashear - Richards - Sharp
Somik, Fedoruk??

Ruzicka, Umberger, and even Eager could possibly factor in as well.

Johnsson
Markov
Pitkanen
Ragnarsson??
Seidenberg??
Timander??
Free agent/s??

Esche
Frank Nitty.

So yeah, as you can see, as much confusion and development and change the NHL is about to see over the next year to two years, the Flyers will be doing the same thing.
I am upset right now, but part of me TRULY believes at this point, it is better to tear it down to a large degree, and transition for about 2 years, so that in the long run everything can be fixed.
This could also hold true for the Flyers and be a blessing in disguise.

Thoughts??

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Old
02-16-2005, 10:27 PM
  #2
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too heavy to ponder at the moment... but interesting topic.

they will play next year, as morganti said on DNL, the owners were prepared to sit out this year... it will be tough for them to do this again... reality will continue to set in for the players. some sort of deal will get done.

other aspect of all this... hard to know what will happen with prospects the longer this goes.

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02-17-2005, 07:35 AM
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Good points but I really, really hope Brashear joins Burke, Amonte and LeClair on the way out.

You cant pay a goon who doesnt like to fight over $2m in the capped NHL.

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02-17-2005, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve L
Good points but I really, really hope Brashear joins Burke, Amonte and LeClair on the way out.

You cant pay a goon who doesnt like to fight over $2m in the capped NHL.
i agree, why pay $2 million when we're got fedoruk chepaer and its not like brash was dropping the gloves much anyways. i think he and domi must have the same therapist as they must think they are "complete" players, not the role guys they really are.

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02-17-2005, 09:29 AM
  #5
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No contracts will run out after July 1. All player contracts are frozen. If not you would see 600 lawsuits for deviations from binding contracts.

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02-17-2005, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by go kim johnsson
No contracts will run out after July 1. All player contracts are frozen. If not you would see 600 lawsuits for deviations from binding contracts.
Eh? that goes against everything Ive seen everywhere.

The contracts are from date to date rather than length of time.

Its written in the contracts that they expire on July (or is it June, cant remember) 1st and thats exactly what they will do.

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02-17-2005, 11:16 AM
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I thought KJ got a one year deal at arbitration, in which case would his contract be up as well, not after 05/06?

Likewise, I thought Gagne accepted the Flyers' tender offer, which I believe is a one year deal as well.

Or are contracts signed pursuant to Group II free agency treated differently?

Anyway, to answer your question: I think the only thing I'd do differently is sign Desjardins back ahead of Rags. I think we definitely need to do something to shore up our defense, because I feel that it will be a major weak spot in a few years. Rags would be nice though, simply because he is a little younger than Desj. Still, I'd rather have Desjardins tutor young guys.

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02-17-2005, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve L
Eh? that goes against everything Ive seen everywhere.

The contracts are from date to date rather than length of time.

Its written in the contracts that they expire on July (or is it June, cant remember) 1st and thats exactly what they will do.
I, too, believe that players - absent some negotiation to the contrary once a CBA is in place - will lose a year on their contracts. However, are you sure they run date-to-date, as opposed to season-to-season. I was debating with someone as to whether the contract states discrete dates (i.e., October 1, 2005 - July 31, 2006 vs. simply 2005-2006). Any help, links, etc. you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

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02-17-2005, 11:58 AM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve L
Eh? that goes against everything Ive seen everywhere.

The contracts are from date to date rather than length of time.

Its written in the contracts that they expire on July (or is it June, cant remember) 1st and thats exactly what they will do.
It will be decided when the new CBA is written.

When Yashin held out for a full season, he didn't lose a year on his contract, it was pushed back another year. The same could happen here.

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02-17-2005, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
It will be decided when the new CBA is written.

When Yashin held out for a full season, he didn't lose a year on his contract, it was pushed back another year. The same could happen here.
Yashin is a different animal. he was an employee in breach of contract, thus he still owed service to his employer.

these contracts are dying out. one of the writers on philly.com noted it at the end of his column. they are date to date, they end at their date. if that wasn't the case, what pressure is there really on the players? none.

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02-17-2005, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
It will be decided when the new CBA is written.

When Yashin held out for a full season, he didn't lose a year on his contract, it was pushed back another year. The same could happen here.
It doesnt matter, the contracts were signed in the last CBA so the rules from there apply. That is that the contracts expire without an extra year added otherwise why would Nolan have a specific clause written into his contract to have an added year for a cancelled season if everyone was going to get an extra year anyway?

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02-17-2005, 01:21 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve L
It doesnt matter, the contracts were signed in the last CBA so the rules from there apply. That is that the contracts expire without an extra year added otherwise why would Nolan have a specific clause written into his contract to have an added year for a cancelled season if everyone was going to get an extra year anyway?
I didn't say that they will automatically get the extra year, but that issue has yet to be decided.

I had the same thoughts as you that the deals would lose a year and I wrote a PM to Bob McKenzie, at the same time I was asking what the status of Carter/Richards would be if they didn't get a deal done by June.

I've since deleted the PM, but Bob's basic response is that as of yet it's unknown, and will be decided in the new CBA. The ruling in the Yashin case, does provide the players with a leg to stand on if they went to court.

The players didn't strike or holdout, they were denied the right to fufill their contract. It isn't as cut & dried as it appears to be.

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02-17-2005, 02:43 PM
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Well unless theres something totally unexpected, the contract will expire as they are from a set date to set date and the Flyers will keep the rights of Carter/Richards as the Flyers have to sign them before 2 drafts pass and not 2 years pass.

No CBA = no draft = no loss of prospects.

Im sure teams will have at least a couple of weeks before any draft happens after the new CBA comes into effect

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02-17-2005, 03:04 PM
  #14
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Does the Turner Stevenson signing make much sense without getting rid of Brashear?

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02-17-2005, 06:42 PM
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What about guys like Picard/Ruggeri/Printz for the 6th spot on D, I'm not sold on Seidenberg yet. Our D definetly lacks toughness after Markov and Ragnarson

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02-17-2005, 08:19 PM
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http://www.nhlcbanews.com/faq.html

Player Contracts

Q: What happens with players who have remaining years left on contracts?

That will be a matter that is determined in collective bargaining.

Q: What happens with players who would have become free agents (restricted or unrestricted) on July 1, 2005?

That will be a matter that is determined in collective bargaining.

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02-18-2005, 06:48 AM
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Thats just an answer to give them the power to do anything they want, its a totally non committal laywer answer.

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02-20-2005, 08:17 PM
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awesome avatar Steve L

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02-21-2005, 07:56 AM
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awesome avatar Steve L
Thank you, I was wondering if I would be allowed to keep it but noone seems to have got uptight about it yet.

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