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2012-13 Lockout Discussion Part X: Is There Any Hope? Edition

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Old
12-28-2012, 11:04 AM
  #426
Jabroni
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Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper
Good sign #NHL owners aren't willing to burn season but latest offer not close 2 getting deal done. #NHLPA counter offer already in works.

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12-28-2012, 11:05 AM
  #427
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Originally Posted by KreiMeARiver View Post
When do we have to sign these guys (McD, DZ, Steps)? After this current (albeit abbreviated) season or before the season even starts? This was their last year under contract, correct? The cap is 60mm for the proposed abbreviated season? I know this is probably a stupid question, but I forget.

If this is the case... kill me.
del zotto is a RFA right now and must be signed immediately...stepan, mcdonagh and hagelin become RFAs when the season is over.

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12-28-2012, 11:07 AM
  #428
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Originally Posted by Jabroni1994 View Post
Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper
Good sign #NHL owners aren't willing to burn season but latest offer not close 2 getting deal done. #NHLPA counter offer already in works.
LOL of course.

Fehr counters with: No contract term-limits. Demands $400 million make-whole, and unrestricted free-agency at age 23 with a 5 year CBA coupled with a PA option to terminate in years 3, 4, and 5 But still has the balls to claim he "worked off" the NHL's offer, and is negotiating in good faith

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12-28-2012, 11:11 AM
  #429
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LOL of course.

Fehr counters with: No contract term-limits. Demands $400 million make-whole, and unrestricted free-agency at age 23 with a 5 year CBA coupled with a PA option to terminate in years 3, 4, and 5 But still has the balls to claim he "worked off" the NHL's offer, and is negotiating in good faith
to be fair on the flipside if the nhlpa comes back and says 'we'll accept everything you offered but cap next year needs to be 60.1 mil instead of 60 mil' bettman will storm out of the room screaming 'this isn't a negiotations, we are looking for a yes or no'

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12-28-2012, 11:12 AM
  #430
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He is The Cap Master. Along with Wolfgaze. Agreed. But on the previous page at the bottom I kind of drew it up if ya wanna see...
Nice informative layout. Yeah... cap @ 60 means Gabby is likely a casualty. Here's to hoping we get a good return and that Nash fits in well!

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12-28-2012, 11:15 AM
  #431
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We just traded the house to get a guy not as good as Gaborik, so he better not be a "casualty"

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12-28-2012, 11:18 AM
  #432
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Originally Posted by Antithesis View Post
We just traded the house to get a guy not as good as Gaborik, so he better not be a "casualty"
You dont think Nash is as good as Gaborik? Youre going to be in for a nice treat whenever they start playing again.

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12-28-2012, 11:27 AM
  #433
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Originally Posted by CM PUNK View Post
to be fair on the flipside if the nhlpa comes back and says 'we'll accept everything you offered but cap next year needs to be 60.1 mil instead of 60 mil' bettman will storm out of the room screaming 'this isn't a negiotations, we are looking for a yes or no'

Fehr: "Hey, Gary, it's early in the morning, can your secretary get me a cup of coffee?"

Bettman: "This is an outrage. This is spending outside of the agreed upon pool. The owners have sacrificed so much. We gave you water even though we didn't have to. Half the owners were against me in giving you water. Look at their disturbed faces. After I gave you water, Jacobs was sitting in the corner crying like a scared little girl. And now you want coffee too? Is there no limit to how much you will ask? This isn't a negotiation. Sure, it may be called "CBA negotiations", but hell, we aren't negotiating, we want a yes or a no? We didn't hear a yes, so therefore, we'll go to our basement and play with ourselves for the next 3 weeks, refusing to acknowledge your presence."


Last edited by Beacon: 12-28-2012 at 11:35 AM.
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Old
12-28-2012, 11:27 AM
  #434
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Originally Posted by Antithesis View Post
We just traded the house to get a guy not as good as Gaborik, so he better not be a "casualty"
Not as good as Gaborik? Not sure if serious..

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12-28-2012, 11:34 AM
  #435
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Originally Posted by Antithesis View Post
We just traded the house to get a guy not as good as Gaborik, so he better not be a "casualty"
There are few guys in this league that can turn a game around by themselves, Nash is one of them. How many guys have scored at least 30 goals a season almost every year since they've been in the league?

Getting back on topic, this is the way a deal is going to get done. Low key negotiations outside of the scope of the media. Fingers crossed.

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12-28-2012, 11:37 AM
  #436
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Nash isn't as good as Gaborik as far as being a goal scorer goes. I wanted Nash but not at Gab's expense

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12-28-2012, 11:41 AM
  #437
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If the Rangers can turn Gaborik into a nice package in return and free up 7.5 million in cap space I am all for it. Nash is the superior overall player and has less health concerns.

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12-28-2012, 11:43 AM
  #438
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
If the Rangers can turn Gaborik into a nice package in return and free up 7.5 million in cap space I am all for it. Nash is the superior overall player and has less health concerns.
Overall I can agree with. Our problem has always been scoring. If we lose Gaborik, Nash better score more than 30 in a full season in 2014

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12-28-2012, 11:46 AM
  #439
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
If the Rangers can turn Gaborik into a nice package in return and free up 7.5 million in cap space I am all for it. Nash is the superior overall player and has less health concerns.
It is going to be extraordinarily difficult to get a nice package and clear significant cap space.

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12-28-2012, 11:50 AM
  #440
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To collapse the cap by over $10 is a mistake. It will cause too many players to be available for nothing or next to nothing. It's like saying to half the teams, "you must allow one of your first liners to be a UFA." Yeah, that will be good for league stability.

Let's make it $70.2 the first year and set the floor of the second year at $65 unless 50% is above that.

For the Rangers, it would mean that the "casualties" would be two of Boyle, Rupp and Pyatt, who'd be replaced with a rookie like Miller, Jean or Hrivik. Turnovers like this would be ok for the league. It would be far preferable to having a sudden waterfall of guys like Gaborik on the market for little-to-no return (remember: supply and demand, as well as desperation, sets the price).

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12-28-2012, 11:55 AM
  #441
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
It is going to be extraordinarily difficult to get a nice package and clear significant cap space.
There will be teams who have cap space available and who are looking to deal for a player like Gaborik. There will be other players who are available as well. How about a package from SJ like Clowe + for Gaborik? (I realize SJ has quite a few high contracts as is, just an example of a player who may be available).

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12-28-2012, 11:55 AM
  #442
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Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
He is The Cap Master. Along with Wolfgaze. Agreed. But on the previous page at the bottom I kind of drew it up if ya wanna see...
I think you are confusing me with someone else... I literally know nothing about the cap, lol. : )

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12-28-2012, 11:57 AM
  #443
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
If the Rangers can turn Gaborik into a nice package in return and free up 7.5 million in cap space I am all for it. Nash is the superior overall player and has less health concerns.
Would like to try and land a nice forward prospect... Willing to add a pick to the trade if that's what it takes to get the job done.

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12-28-2012, 11:58 AM
  #444
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Originally Posted by Lundsanity30 View Post
Overall I can agree with. Our problem has always been scoring. If we lose Gaborik, Nash better score more than 30 in a full season in 2014
Hopefully, you can get back a soon-to-be NHL forward in return for Gaborik +. Like the Burns trade Minnesota got back Coyle +. That is the type of deal I would hope for.

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Old
12-28-2012, 11:58 AM
  #445
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
There will be teams who have cap space available and who are looking to deal for a player like Gaborik. There will be other players who are available as well. How about a package from SJ like Clowe + for Gaborik? (I realize SJ has quite a few high contracts as is, just an example of a player who may be available).
Thats an awfully rosy outlook.

The truth is there will be 29 other teams in the league that know the Rangers will likely have no other choice but to deal Gaborik. Thats not exactly dealing from a position of strength.

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12-28-2012, 12:03 PM
  #446
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It's not dealing from a position of strength if that's what the belief is, no... but it's not that bad if there are multiple suitors betting against each other.

Also, this assumption is based on the cap going down to $60M. We don't know that to be a sure thing yet. A $64M-$65M cap likely means we can keep him.

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12-28-2012, 12:03 PM
  #447
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Man, I'd really hate to lose Gaborik over this. Even when he's not producing points he's a force. Lightens the load for everybody else, plus Richards and Nash. C'mon now.

I don't think the league would lower the cap so low the first year. It's just a negotiation chip, I believe. No way would they allow half the league to be thrown into a position where they need to trade one of their stars or buy them out. I think it'll be doable if it was $65 mill from the start. I'd be okay with that.

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Old
12-28-2012, 12:03 PM
  #448
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Thats an awfully rosy outlook.

The truth is there will be 29 other teams in the league that know the Rangers will likely have no other choice but to deal Gaborik. Thats not exactly dealing from a position of strength.
There will be multiple teams who would line-up for Gaborik's services. I would highly doubt there wouldn't be significant interest in a 40 goal scorer and that is all that it would take. (2) teams or more and it doesn't matter what situation the Rangers are in.

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Old
12-28-2012, 12:08 PM
  #449
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If the cap were to stay at 65 million (which is where I believe it will be), the Rangers should be able to keep Gaborik:

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Rick Nash ($7.800m) / Brad Richards ($6.667m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m)
Chris Kreider ($1.325m) / Derek Stepan ($2.200m) / Ryan Callahan ($4.275m)
Carl Hagelin ($1.500m) / Brian Boyle ($1.700m) / Taylor Pyatt ($1.550m)
Mike Rupp ($1.500m) / Arron Asham ($1.000m)
Micheal Haley ($0.600m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Ryan McDonagh ($4.000m) / Dan Girardi ($3.325m)
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Michael Del Zotto ($2.250m)
Anton Stralman ($1.700m) / Michael Sauer ($1.300m)
Stu Bickel ($0.750m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Martin Biron ($1.300m)
BUYOUTS
Chris Drury ($1.667m)
------

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $65,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $64,758,334; BONUSES: $637,500
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $879,166

Please note Drury's buyout will no longer be valid either, so there is another 1.67 million to use anywhere you want.

MDZ - 2.25 million
McDonagh - 4 million
Sauer - 1.3 million
Hagelin - 1.5 million
Stepan - 2.2 million

I should also note that these are pretty good contracts for players just off of their ELC's (except Sauer who is coming off a severe injury). Also does not account for any young players making the team on their ELC which will only help the situation.

Halpern and Eminger let go.

That shows Haley and Bickel still with the team and a need for a 4th line center.

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12-28-2012, 12:09 PM
  #450
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Thats an awfully rosy outlook.

The truth is there will be 29 other teams in the league that know the Rangers will likely have no other choice but to deal Gaborik. Thats not exactly dealing from a position of strength.
There ya go...

If 3 of those teams have significant interest then there's your market.

I think a team like Minnesota would make sense. They want to contend and they have a top notch and deep talent pool. They can afford to move a couple of quality guys (outside of Granlund and Brodin). I wouldn't mind prying a couple of those guys away.

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