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2012 CBA/Lockout talk Part VII..Will a deal get done..

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12-28-2012, 01:32 PM
  #376
Habaneros
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Originally Posted by cat400 View Post
Nick Kypreos‏@RealKyper

"Good sign #NHL owners aren't willing to burn season but latest offer not close 2 getting deal done. #NHLPA counter offer already in works"
if I'm the players knowing owners don't want a burnt season, i go for the juggler now.......make a counter offer to make them squirm

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12-28-2012, 01:40 PM
  #377
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Allan Walsh has become one of those people I follow on twitter just so I don't miss anything ridiculous that he may say.

Holy hell is he obnoxious.

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12-28-2012, 01:51 PM
  #378
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Originally Posted by DarrenBanks56 View Post
i dont really care about the *. i just wanna see playoff hockey.
short seasons just worry me though.
if there is a season and we start off like last season- see ya later. youre done
you mean like after the first 10 they went 21-0-1 (somthing like that?) i think we'll be just fine

something tells me the Bruins are silently itching to get back together and rip other teams up...

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12-28-2012, 01:54 PM
  #379
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you mean like after the first 10 they went 21-0-1 (somthing like that?) i think we'll be just fine

something tells me the Bruins are silently itching to get back together and rip other teams up...
hopefully under pre "Looch steamrolling Miller" rules and not post LSM rules.

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12-28-2012, 01:54 PM
  #380
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Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
if I'm the players knowing owners don't want a burnt season, i go for the juggler now.......make a counter offer to make them squirm
Don, is that you? This is exactly the attitude Fehr has, and why we don't have an NHL season.

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12-28-2012, 01:54 PM
  #381
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Just get a deal done already. I'm sick of hearing about it.

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12-28-2012, 01:58 PM
  #382
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Just get a deal done already. I'm sick of hearing about it.
fear not michelle...tuukka will be stoppin' pucks cold as ice for the Bruins in a matter of weeks.

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12-28-2012, 02:10 PM
  #383
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Originally Posted by Kate08 View Post
Allan Walsh has become one of those people I follow on twitter just so I don't miss anything ridiculous that he may say.

Holy hell is he obnoxious.
He's a major tool. I don't follow him, but I'm subjected to his tweets thanks to my followers re-tweeting everything he says. Like he's an actual news source or something.

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12-28-2012, 02:11 PM
  #384
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Originally Posted by OrrOverGretzky View Post
Here you have it: 300 pages reduced in point form

http://espn.go.com/blog/nhl/post/_/i...ec-27-proposal

Last CBA was 600 pages. This is a pretty definitive and descriptive proposal by the league
Whoops, looks like it's 10% variance based off the first year. That's actually better for the players.

Looks like owners gave ground on variance, escrow, contract terms, and amnesty? Still steadfast in regards to length of CBA (why is this even a sticking point for the PA), and transition period. Be interesting to see what the counter is. If the PA pushes back too hard I can see frustration just taking completely over.


Last edited by Kaoz: 12-28-2012 at 02:25 PM.
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12-28-2012, 02:15 PM
  #385
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Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
if I'm the players knowing owners don't want a burnt season, i go for the juggler now.......make a counter offer to make them squirm
who is that? Have I missed something in these negotiations?

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12-28-2012, 02:19 PM
  #386
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Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
if I'm the players knowing owners don't want a burnt season, i go for the juggler now.......make a counter offer to make them squirm
Yeah, that strategy will surely support resolving this situation.

Hey, I know, why not get a horse head and stick it in Bettman's bed?
It worked in the movies too.

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12-28-2012, 02:25 PM
  #387
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Originally Posted by Gee Wally View Post
Yeah, that strategy will surely support resolving this situation.

Hey, I know, why not get a horse head and stick it in Bettman's bed?
It worked in the movies too.
I'm torn at what the correct move is here for the NHLPA. I'm more inclined to say just sign the deal and get to work, but I'm just not sure. From the little information I've read and understood, it doesn't seem like either party was ever bargaining in good faith during this dispute. For that reason I wouldn't be surprised to see the players/Fehr push for me. It seems like it's come down to pride and personal feelings now, as opposed to finding a reasonable middle ground in order to get back to work as soon as possible. It's been a poorly handled negotiation from day one imo

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12-28-2012, 02:32 PM
  #388
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Originally Posted by chuckdobbins View Post
I'm torn at what the correct move is here for the NHLPA. I'm more inclined to say just sign the deal and get to work, but I'm just not sure. From the little information I've read and understood, it doesn't seem like either party was ever bargaining in good faith during this dispute. For that reason I wouldn't be surprised to see the players/Fehr push for me. It seems like it's come down to pride and personal feelings now, as opposed to finding a reasonable middle ground in order to get back to work as soon as possible. It's been a poorly handled negotiation from day one imo
From my experience, when you are close, you make small counters or even consider going for a vote.
You sure as hell don't look to go for the 'juggler'. Unless you have already decided that what you want is complete abolishment of the union, anti-trust challenge, and basically a new league when all is said and done.
I don't see that happening.

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12-28-2012, 02:46 PM
  #389
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lol how hilarious would it be if Eklund got the scoop on what ended up being the offer that saved the season?!

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12-28-2012, 03:11 PM
  #390
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lol how hilarious would it be if Eklund got the scoop on what ended up being the offer that saved the season?!
It would say that Ed Sinder has much to do with this deal. Eklund is normally spot on with philly sources and nothing else

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12-28-2012, 03:12 PM
  #391
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I'm waiting for Fehr to blow this all up by asking for something ridiculous.

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12-28-2012, 03:13 PM
  #392
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Originally Posted by Gee Wally View Post
From my experience, when you are close, you make small counters or even consider going for a vote.
You sure as hell don't look to go for the 'juggler'. Unless you have already decided that what you want is complete abolishment of the union, anti-trust challenge, and basically a new league when all is said and done.
I don't see that happening.
I think it still goes about another week- Fehr can see how much sand is in the hour glass, and there is still a good week as far as he is concerned; plenty of time to look combo- optimisitic, disheveled, and a tad frustrated one more time for the public to see

I'd put it at 50/50 done by next Friday January 4th and 95/5 by January 11th.

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12-28-2012, 03:16 PM
  #393
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Originally Posted by Crossfire View Post
I'm waiting for Fehr to blow this all up by asking for something ridiculous.
oh he'll ask for something and it will have everyone looking like the family dog is missing, but by late next week its all but done and they start mid Jan and play 100 days and 48 to 50 games

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12-28-2012, 03:20 PM
  #394
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I think it still goes about another week- Fehr can see how much sand is in the hour glass, and there is still a good week as far as he is concerned; plenty of time to look combo- optimisitic, disheveled, and a tad frustrated one more time for the public to see

I'd put it at 50/50 done by next Friday January 4th and 95/5 by January 11th.
I'm with you DKH.

It's less than ideal for fans, but this proposal will tell Fehr he has the owners in a good spot here. He's not likely to give them any credit for this proposal, but instead see it as a sign of weakness. He'll play this out until the bitter end, probably score a bit more in a few areas, then we'll probably see a deal in 7-10 days.

And a note - we all might dislike that approach, but it's his job. At this point he has to see he's got some leverage, and he wouldn't be doing his job if he just accepted this latest offer. his job is to push until he can't push anymore, and this very offer gives him confidence he can keep pushing.

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12-28-2012, 03:32 PM
  #395
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I'm with you DKH.

It's less than ideal for fans, but this proposal will tell Fehr he has the owners in a good spot here. He's not likely to give them any credit for this proposal, but instead see it as a sign of weakness. He'll play this out until the bitter end, probably score a bit more in a few areas, then we'll probably see a deal in 7-10 days.

And a note - we all might dislike that approach, but it's his job. At this point he has to see he's got some leverage, and he wouldn't be doing his job if he just accepted this latest offer. his job is to push until he can't push anymore, and this very offer gives him confidence he can keep pushing.
I slightly disagree here.

His job is to know what that tipping point is. Any schmuck can come in and push and push and push, until off the cliff everyone goes. Knowing when to stop and get the best deal possible for your people is just as, if not more, important IMO.

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12-28-2012, 03:34 PM
  #396
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I'm with you DKH.

It's less than ideal for fans, but this proposal will tell Fehr he has the owners in a good spot here. He's not likely to give them any credit for this proposal, but instead see it as a sign of weakness. He'll play this out until the bitter end, probably score a bit more in a few areas, then we'll probably see a deal in 7-10 days.

And a note - we all might dislike that approach, but it's his job. At this point he has to see he's got some leverage, and he wouldn't be doing his job if he just accepted this latest offer. his job is to push until he can't push anymore, and this very offer gives him confidence he can keep pushing.
Couldn't disagree more, A good Businessman\Negotiator will let you believe that you are the one controlling the situation.

The NHL know exactly were they are now and were they will be wen all will be said and done, and they know that before the last playoff's started.

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12-28-2012, 03:36 PM
  #397
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You know, when you can lose 800m in salary to gain 300m in make whole improvement... you just gotta do that deal everyday.

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12-28-2012, 04:03 PM
  #398
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Dan...how many times have you moved your expected target date?

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12-28-2012, 04:08 PM
  #399
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I slightly disagree here.

His job is to know what that tipping point is. Any schmuck can come in and push and push and push, until off the cliff everyone goes. Knowing when to stop and get the best deal possible for your people is just as, if not more, important IMO.
Well of course, but he's proven that he can wait out the NHL and they will come back to him with a better offer. It's happened a few times already now. So while he's not actively "pushing", his stalling has the effect of pushing, and it's working.

End of the day nobody will be better off for this lockout, but as of today the players have a better offer on the table than their last one. If he perceives he'll be able to get an even better one in the time allowed to seal it before the season is lost, he's probably best to sit tight and try to make that happen.

I mean I hate Fehr as much as the next fan, but this perception that the owners are presenting their best offer each time, and have a few "hills they'll die on", and blah blah blah is being exposed. Bettman went off the rails a few weeks ago and you sensed the owners were only going to be taking from their offer, not adding to it. The players walked away, waited, and got a better offer. If you're Fehr, you learn from that and try to see how much more they have to give.

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12-28-2012, 04:19 PM
  #400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habaneros View Post
if I'm the players knowing owners don't want a burnt season, i go for the juggler now.......make a counter offer to make them squirm
"Don't want" and "Won't accept" are two different things. If the players get stupid then the season won't start. What is required now is sensible, rational thought and an effort at achieving common ground...in other words, compromise. Not juggler, er...jugular.

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