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MLS vs. NHL Going Forward?

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Old
12-30-2012, 09:04 PM
  #326
Jonimaus
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Originally Posted by du5566 View Post
Ah, yes..... Because sound doesn't travel and it's not as loud on the field in these bowl stadiums with everyone facing towards and screaming at these players. Are you serious? I mean are you really serious?
We clearly see it very different, so let's leave it at that. Apparantly my arguments sound just as redicilous to you as yours do to me. This conversation just made me so glad we don't have that sport in europe.

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12-30-2012, 09:05 PM
  #327
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This conversation just made me so glad we don't have that sport in europe.
Oh yes you do. NFL Europe.

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12-30-2012, 09:06 PM
  #328
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Oh yes you do. NFL Europe.
First google link: http://www.nfl.com/nfl-europa-closes

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12-30-2012, 09:07 PM
  #329
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Oh yes you do. NFL Europe.
Did you know there is an NFL Canada. I first came across the office about 15 years ago. No idea what it does and how long it's been there.

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12-30-2012, 09:08 PM
  #330
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We clearly see it very different, so let's leave it at that. Apparantly my arguments sound just as redicilous to you as yours do to me. This conversation just made me so glad we don't have that sport in europe.
Haha that's fine but you're missing the whole point of how important communication is between the QB and the rest of the offense.

Unfortunately we have soccer in NA

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12-30-2012, 09:08 PM
  #331
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We clearly see it very different, so let's leave it at that. Apparantly my arguments sound just as redicilous to you as yours do to me. This conversation just made me so glad we don't have that sport in europe.
[Mod] It may not be my favorite sport but I appreciate and respect European football, if for nothing else because of the history of the sport and the passion of the fans.

Oh and by the way, London's calling........

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...time-nfl-team/

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100...or-an-nfl-team

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100...-of-uk-project


Last edited by Killion: 12-30-2012 at 09:31 PM. Reason: not reqd...
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12-30-2012, 09:09 PM
  #332
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LMAO

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12-30-2012, 09:10 PM
  #333
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Still, that's American football being played in Europe up until relatively recently so you can't act like it's presence in Europe is unheard of.

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12-30-2012, 09:11 PM
  #334
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Did you know there is an NFL Canada. I first came across the office about 15 years ago. No idea what it does and how long it's been there.
There's the CFL.....ever heard of it? Been around since the 1950s.

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12-30-2012, 09:15 PM
  #335
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There's the CFL.....ever heard of it? Been around since the 1950s.
That's a silly way to refer to the CFL. Is that really what the place is?

Edit to add: What are you talking about? NFL Canada seems to be talking about NFL teams.

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12-30-2012, 09:16 PM
  #336
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This Year 47,000 at Rogers



Same game........something was going on

If I'm not mistaken, those pics are from the CONACAF Champions Leauge Quarter final against the LA Galaxy.

This was more of the David Beckham effect. In the Semi final game against Santos Laguna, it had to moved back to BMO field with under 19,000.

MLS has made some in roads for sure, it still has a long way to until the NHL sees it in the rear view mirror

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12-30-2012, 09:19 PM
  #337
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Originally Posted by Stix and Stones View Post
That's a silly way to refer to the CFL. Is that really what the place is?
Probably not. More likely it's a marketing office for the NFL. Then again, the NFL is in a partnership with the CFL now and has been for a few years. NFL Network now broadcasts CFL games fwiw.

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12-30-2012, 09:22 PM
  #338
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Originally Posted by Stix and Stones View Post
That's a silly way to refer to the CFL. Is that really what the place is?

Edit to add: What are you talking about? NFL Canada seems to be talking about NFL teams.
The NFL has offices in Toronto and they have for years, I assume its main function is to promote the game up north. The NFL has always wanted to put a team in Toronto.

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12-30-2012, 09:25 PM
  #339
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[Mod] It may not be my favorite sport but I appreciate and respect European football, if for nothing else because of the history of the sport and the passion of the fans.
I've managed to watch half of the super bowl each year for several years now, so I try my hardest. I mean it more like I am sure many americans uninterested in football are happy the sport is not big there, because they are not interested in hearing about it. For me personally it'd just be another sport the news has to report about I do not want to hear, it's simply out of selfish reason I am happy we do not have it.


Last edited by Killion: 12-30-2012 at 09:33 PM. Reason: qtd edit...
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Old
12-30-2012, 09:36 PM
  #340
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Originally Posted by Jonimaus View Post
I've managed to watch half of the super bowl each year for several years now, so I try my hardest. I mean it more like I am sure many americans uninterested in football are happy the sport is not big there, because they are not interested in hearing about it. For me personally it'd just be another sport the news has to report about I do not want to hear, it's simply out of selfish reason I am happy we do not have it.
Point taken.... Cheers to football always being the biggest sport in Europe and North America.

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12-30-2012, 09:38 PM
  #341
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I've managed to watch half of the super bowl each year for several years now, so I try my hardest. I mean it more like I am sure many americans uninterested in football are happy the sport is not big there, because they are not interested in hearing about it. For me personally it'd just be another sport the news has to report about I do not want to hear, it's simply out of selfish reason I am happy we do not have it.
Have you tried watching the Grey Cup? It's usually more fun and has less "fluff" associated with it than the Super Bowl.

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12-30-2012, 09:41 PM
  #342
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Unless the MLS club is willing to at least double the salaray, you won't see any top talent within the next 50-100 years.
It's worth noting that unofficial calculations have put MLS salaries at about 27% of revenue(not including DP costs borne directly by the clubs). Doubling up is not a big deal. Currently most teams are saddled with greater than normal debt as a result of the stadium construction boom. As it gets paid off we should see a significant increase in expenditures.

The league has publicly stated its intention to become a "top 10" league by 2022(as part of the failed attempt to get the 2022 world cup). While the bid failed, the roadmap has continued. The question is will this make MLS a greater part of the american cultural fabric? I think these are 2 variables that are not necessarily related.

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12-30-2012, 09:49 PM
  #343
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Who is more popular in LA? The Galaxy or the Kings?

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Old
12-30-2012, 09:54 PM
  #344
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That's your opinion. What is fact is another matter however. There's no way that soccer passes hockey in North America where hockey has a long and rich history. Is the NHL one of the "big 4" anymore? No but Soccer isn't even on the radar behind Nascaar, MMA, PGA and Tennis.
Neither is hockey so there you go.

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12-30-2012, 10:05 PM
  #345
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Neither is hockey so there you go.
Hockey is behind MMA, PGA and tennis now?

When will we see the WNBA vs. the NHL going forward thread?

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12-30-2012, 10:47 PM
  #346
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Im seeing many posters in this thread speaking in absolutes and I think this makes for somewhat silly statements and arguments. No one can make meaningful claims about the long term state of hockey and soccer in the us and canada in this way. The mls may overtake the nhl in some cities or even across north america at some point. It might not. They might flip flop back and forth over time. Its difficult to say, but certainly an honest, fair conversation can be had on the topic. Speaking in these absolutes does not make for a productive conversation, though.

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12-31-2012, 12:43 AM
  #347
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Now that the MLS has made it mandatory for each team to have a developmental academy system in place you should(in theory) see the level of play raise over the next decade as better younger players are identified earlier on and funneled into MLS teams.

Also, the more MLS players that make the National team it brings in more viewers to the MLS as a whole as the players are more closely watched.

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12-31-2012, 02:13 AM
  #348
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Anyone who thinks that baseball is somehow dying is simply out of their mind. The difference between football and baseball is that one is a national sport while the other is a regional sport. What I mean by that is that NFL fans will watch out of market games no matter who is playing while baseball fans generally will not. But within smaller geographic regions, baseball is just as popular as football. Add all those individual regions up and you have a sport that is still incredibly popular and shows no sign of sliding. TV ratings for individual teams remain strong.
Yes, a lot of teams draw huge ratings locally. And those are still largely driven by older people. Baseball's popularity with Generation X and the millenials is by and large on the wane... denying that is like denying that one day North Carolina will eclipse Ohio in population, it's a simple matter of looking at the trends and doing the math.

I have no doubt that baseball will never be topped by basketball, hockey or soccer in this country, at least not in those markets where it's currently the top dog anyway, do not misunderstand. But the future for baseball is an inevitable spiral. Unless 25 year olds magically start caring about it out of the blue before that median age ticks up to 70 anyway.

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12-31-2012, 02:29 AM
  #349
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Yes, a lot of teams draw huge ratings locally. And those are still largely driven by older people. Baseball's popularity with Generation X and the millenials is by and large on the wane... denying that is like denying that one day North Carolina will eclipse Ohio in population, it's a simple matter of looking at the trends and doing the math.

I have no doubt that baseball will never be topped by basketball, hockey or soccer in this country, at least not in those markets where it's currently the top dog anyway, do not misunderstand. But the future for baseball is an inevitable spiral. Unless 25 year olds magically start caring about it out of the blue before that median age ticks up to 70 anyway.

Thank God somebody else realizes it...

Some 40,000,000 would watch the World Series in the Early '80s. Now it's down to somewhere around 15,000,000. And that's with a population increase of over 100,000,000.

Not to mention they skew to the 50+ demographic farm more than any other sport.

In my opinion Bud Selig has done a terrible job adapting to the new sports world and is very content with keeping the game in the 80s. Until a salary cap is in place and they figure out ways to speed up the game, it's gonna continue that trend.

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12-31-2012, 08:41 AM
  #350
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Originally Posted by Brodie View Post
Yes, a lot of teams draw huge ratings locally. And those are still largely driven by older people. Baseball's popularity with Generation X and the millenials is by and large on the wane... denying that is like denying that one day North Carolina will eclipse Ohio in population, it's a simple matter of looking at the trends and doing the math.

I have no doubt that baseball will never be topped by basketball, hockey or soccer in this country, at least not in those markets where it's currently the top dog anyway, do not misunderstand. But the future for baseball is an inevitable spiral. Unless 25 year olds magically start caring about it out of the blue before that median age ticks up to 70 anyway.
Some truth to that but not totally. People tend to "rediscover" baseball as they get older perhaps because it is the most fan and family friendly of all sports: by that I mean that it is the easiest for young families to financially attend (although becoming prohibitive even there), is associated with summer, is easiest for people to get tickets for (because there are so many games), etc. I'm always amazed when I scan the crowds on television for NFL, EPL, and even NHL games how few kids there are compared to baseball. The demographics of baseball has changed and much of increases in baseball attendance (has gone down some due to the recession but was increasing each year before that) has been driven by families taking their kids to games. It is also what drives attendance in the minor leagues. Kids absorb baseball in this way. Sure, they also become big fans of other sports especially in their teens and twenties, but many, many, also keep a fond spot for baseball and return to it later when they themselves become parents. I really don't see this changing.

Also, it seems as if much of the stats revolution in baseball (WAR, etc) is driven by younger more tech savvy people.

All I'm saying is that baseballs death has been foretold many times and it never happens and I don't think ever will. Here in the New York City area, baseball talk goes on all year and even in the heart of the football season, is a prime topic and mover on all sports radio stations.

Further, for many Hispanic/Latinos who are changing the electoral face of America, baseball (as well as soccer) is part of their sports cultural heritage.

Perhaps the biggest obstacle to the growth of soccer ever attaining a top 3 or top 4 ranking in American teams sports is that none of them (well with the exception of the self-inflicted wounds in the NHL) are really in long-term difficulty. All are thriving, some like basketball and football on both the pro and college level, hockey in Canada on the junior level, and baseball because of all the reasons above. It is darn hard for soccer to carve out a place in North American sports because our sports calendar is so crowded: overlapping seasons, never a time or place for soccer to exploit as its own. Soccer is also out of sync with the passage of the seasons in North America. Baseball is associated with spring and summer, football got its start as a college sport associated with the start of school in the fall, basketball was invented as an indoor winter sport, hockey is by nature a winter sport. The European soccer season (mid August to the end of April/beginning of May), makes no logical sense to Americans used to seasonal sports. Of course the idea of soccer in North America (aside for Florida, SoCal, etc) in the dead of winter just doesn't work. So MLS is left to kind of mimic the baseball season and this is a problem for it (starts in March when the NCAAs are going, baseball is starting up, NBA and NHL seasons are climaxing and playoffs starting, continue in the summer when baseball is king, and ending in November just after the World Series has ended, NBA and NHL are starting again, and the NFL is in full mid-season swing). To me, this is part of the glass ceiling the soccer faces in North America.

Anyway......people have been forecasting the demise of baseball for years. It has adapted, its demographics have changed, but its hold on America goes on.

And....by the way, have you been in a place like Charlotte, NC lately?

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