HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Business of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The Business of Hockey Discuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Topics may include the CBA, work stoppages, broadcast contracts, franchise sales, and NHL revenues.

Lou Lamoriello on NHL lockout: 'I'm embarrassed for the game'

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
12-27-2012, 01:00 PM
  #26
GordieHoweHatTrick
Registered User
 
GordieHoweHatTrick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 13,138
vCash: 500
I think he's embarrassed because Bettman and Fehr pretty much have the autonomy to do whatever they like and are both holding the league hostage to get whatever they like and the 'just end the lockout crowd' has no say in the matter

GordieHoweHatTrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 01:03 PM
  #27
santiclaws
Registered User
 
santiclaws's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,971
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GordieHoweHatTrick View Post
I think he's embarrassed because Bettman and Fehr pretty much have the autonomy to do whatever they like and are both holding the league hostage to get whatever they like and the 'just end the lockout crowd' has no say in the matter
The two guys in charge of the respective sides have no regard for the game of hockey. If they did, this mess would have been over long ago. It is indeed embarrassing that the league is about to cancel a second season in less than a decade. Good job, everyone!

santiclaws is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 01:04 PM
  #28
Ari91
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,468
vCash: 500
Guys with a shred of decency on either side should feel embarrassed for the game and what their collective antics in this process are doing to it.

Ari91 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 01:51 PM
  #29
DL44
Registered User
 
DL44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Left Coast
Posts: 6,108
vCash: 139
- Wasn't Lou against the Kovy contract? I thought he wasn't the architect of that contract.

Anyways... Way too much speculation and attempts to micro analyze his statement which seems like an obvious statement of fact of how everyone involved should feel.

But why not add to it...

Maybe Lou isn't as involved because..

- He's too old and too wise to waste any of his twilight yrs in a boardroom when there are many other capable guys to do so.

- As a guy who worked closely with Bettman during the 94 lockout, perhaps he hasnt been as involved since due to possibly supporting the movt to give up the CBA fight that yr to the dismay of Bettman at the time.

DL44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 02:58 PM
  #30
Colin226
NJ Devils STH
 
Colin226's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Flemington, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 3,138
vCash: 500
Well I recently ran into Rich Krezwick, president of Devils Arena Entertainment (so he runs the building and works with Lou) and he said the players are crazy if they don't accept this offer.. I'm guessing he knows some of the inner details of this thing since he's in on a lot of high level meetings with Vanderbeek and Lou.. Take it fwiw

Colin226 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 03:32 PM
  #31
joshjull
Moderator
 
joshjull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hamburg,NY
Country: United States
Posts: 33,869
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greschner4 View Post
The guy said he was embarrassed for the sport.

The fact that the league isn't playing games at this point given the small differences between the sides is, in fact, an abject embarrassment.

So, yeah.

It's best sometimes not to overcomplicate things.
My thoughts as well. But some will try to read into it what they want.

joshjull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 03:48 PM
  #32
Fugu
Administrator
HFBoards
 
Fugu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Pac NW
Posts: 30,759
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Lamoriello went 150 mph while Holland, Bowman and others went 90 mph. Sure, they all were technically speeding but Lamoriello went far over the line despite being warned and was punished for it. Lamoriello holding a press conference flaunting it in the leagues face before the league had reviewed the contract probably didn't work in his favor either.

I have no doubt another GM would have tried to push an equally absurd contract though had not Lamoriello done it.

The Parise, Suter and Weber contracts are completely different because it is clearly defined what is allowed and is not these days.
Speeding is speeding. 90 mph and 150 mph will land you in jail in most places.

I think the Parise and Suter contracts are optically worse because Leipold knew the NHL's strategy in going into the lockout. He's on the negotiating committee, so he will know what's going to be proposed, why, and which hill the league would pick to die on.

I'm leaning towards that not being the reason Lou isn't involved. He's done nothing worse than several others, imo.


Quote:
Originally Posted by NJDevs26 View Post
Why does everyone assume Lou's not involved because the league's mad at him? Maybe he's mad at THEM, for their outrageous punishment of the Devils for a contract that got disallowed anyway? Not to mention the blatant and unpunished public tampering by the Wild with Parise?
This may be possible too, and/or that he's not on the same page wrt some of the issues.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MoreOrr View Post
I'd speculate that he's not part of the negotiation process because his views are not held by the majority or by those who ultimately control the direction the owners are presenting. I think that's the simplest answer. And perhaps he was part of some of the concessions that the owners gave into last time, and this time they're not going to make such concessions.

He says he's embarrassed by the sport, because he thinks all of these lockouts are bad for the sports reputation. I don't think that means he is against the lockout, but just that it's shameful that it's happening yet again, that the League can't get its house in order and not keep needing these lockouts to try to resolve things.
I personally think it's the bold section above.

Fugu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 03:57 PM
  #33
NJDevs26
Moderator
Status quo
 
NJDevs26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 24,725
vCash: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuklaNation View Post
Lou had a role in creating the situation we see before us today (concessions that had 'unintended' consequences). What makes a good GM does not necessarily make a good negotiator for a league. What they need is some corporate finance deal makers to step in here.
That's actually the problem with these negotiations in a nutshell. Too many lawyers and people with personal vendettas in the room, not enough people that know about and love the game or are willing to compromise.

NJDevs26 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 03:58 PM
  #34
Dado
Guest
 
Country:
Posts: n/a
vCash:
Quote:
Originally Posted by DL44 View Post
- Wasn't Lou against the Kovy contract? I thought he wasn't the architect of that contract.
That was widely reported/speculated at the time.

Perhaps what he is saying is "I'm totally embarrassed by my side talking about greedy ungiving players when it was my own damn boss who made me sign Kovalchuck to a cap-circumventing retardo contract".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu
I think the Parise and Suter contracts are optically worse because Leipold knew the NHL's strategy in going into the lockout. He's on the negotiating committee, so he will know what's going to be proposed, why, and which hill the league would pick to die on.
Honest to god, what the hell was he thinking? The only reasonable explanation is that he actually believed there was a giant rollback coming.

  Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 04:04 PM
  #35
Freudian
No Guenin, No cry
 
Freudian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: Sweden
Posts: 30,943
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
I'm leaning towards that not being the reason Lou isn't involved. He's done nothing worse than several others, imo.
Mirtle disagrees with your conclusion:

"Fallout over Kovalchuk situation has pushed Lamoriello out of inner circle a bit."

Freudian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 05:39 PM
  #36
Ari91
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,468
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Mirtle disagrees with your conclusion:

"Fallout over Kovalchuk situation has pushed Lamoriello out of inner circle a bit."
If the rumours are true that Lou didn't want to give that contract to Kovalchuk and his owner basically forced him to, then I would think if he has been pushed out of the inner circle, it's by extension of his boss. His boss isn't intimately involved in the negotiations either, right?

Ari91 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 05:58 PM
  #37
MoreOrr
B4
 
MoreOrr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Mexico
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,124
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyCrazed101 View Post
If the rumours are true that Lou didn't want to give that contract to Kovalchuk and his owner basically forced him to, then I would think if he has been pushed out of the inner circle, it's by extension of his boss. His boss isn't intimately involved in the negotiations either, right?
If the Kovalchuk issue has anything to do with it, then his "exclusion" has to be due to your explanation, not directly due to anything about Lou himself. But hey, multiple issues could potentially be involved... there are plenty of GMs and even owners that we're hearing very little or nothing from or about their involvement in the negotiation process (or lack thereof).

MoreOrr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 06:01 PM
  #38
TieClark
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 4,102
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyCrazed101 View Post
If the rumours are true that Lou didn't want to give that contract to Kovalchuk and his owner basically forced him to, then I would think if he has been pushed out of the inner circle, it's by extension of his boss. His boss isn't intimately involved in the negotiations either, right?
I don't think anyone really doubts Lou didn't want to give that contract out, or make the trade for him (despite it ending up being nothing substantial). He's a notoriously cheap GM that refuses to give out big contracts or make big trades. That deal was the exact opposite of why a typical Lou deal is.

TieClark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 06:03 PM
  #39
Freudian
No Guenin, No cry
 
Freudian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: Sweden
Posts: 30,943
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyCrazed101 View Post
If the rumours are true that Lou didn't want to give that contract to Kovalchuk and his owner basically forced him to, then I would think if he has been pushed out of the inner circle, it's by extension of his boss. His boss isn't intimately involved in the negotiations either, right?
Lamoriello is one of the few GMs that is a governor and that is why he would have been the one from Devils that may have been involved with the negotiations and not the owner.

Freudian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 06:12 PM
  #40
seanlinden
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18,554
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by leaffansince1961 View Post
Interesting.

Didn't Bettman make statements to the effect that he was disappointed in the 94-95 discussions because the owners made concessions?

Is this a labour negotiation or a power struggle? I believe that Lou would be a great asset for a negotiation.
Power struggle.... that's all it ever is.

The league knows the players lose money by being locked out. They see it as an opportunity to knock their overall compensation down a few notches.

As for why Lou's not in negotiations... maybe he's just sick of it? The guy is old a f### and has been around forever. He probably just wants to manage his hockey team, fire the coach right before the playoffs so he can coach, and until an environment is set up for him to manage his team, he doesn't want to hear about it?

seanlinden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 06:17 PM
  #41
jkrdevil
UnRegistered User
 
jkrdevil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Maryland
Country: United States
Posts: 30,646
vCash: 500
Personally I think it was nothing quote that got blown up. If you ask either side involved they would probably say it is embarassing that they are playing and then blame the other side for it (of course Lou doesn't go that far since he isn't involved). Being embarassed isn't the same as saying you should budge.

As for Lou not being involved, I do think it was because of the Kovalchuk deal. He had more to do with it than some think. No doubt Vanderbbek, the Devils owner said he wanted to and willing to do whatever it took to re-sign him, but the way that deal was structured had Lou's and the Devils cal guy's figure prints all over it.

And yes, the Richards, Weber and Minnesota deals are worse than that deal. They got through because the league codified things, but it does show the league has an inability to see future consequences for some of their decision makings.

jkrdevil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 06:51 PM
  #42
NJDevs26
Moderator
Status quo
 
NJDevs26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 24,725
vCash: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Lamoriello is one of the few GMs that is a governor and that is why he would have been the one from Devils that may have been involved with the negotiations and not the owner.
Especially since the owner may not be long for this (hockey) world anyway.

NJDevs26 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 07:02 PM
  #43
SMantzas
Church of Corsi
 
SMantzas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Mount Laurel, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 3,252
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
I can tell Lou why he isn't involved.

A) He will be retiring soon, and the people that will have to deal with whatever rules are in the new CBA should be the ones with the most input.

B) He either missed some major loopholes in the last go around, or he designed them in so he could take advantage of them.
Yeah, he designed a loophole that he used five years later. Not to mention he was against the Kovy signing. And let's not forget half the teams used the Loup-hole

SMantzas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 07:28 PM
  #44
Fugu
Administrator
HFBoards
 
Fugu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Pac NW
Posts: 30,759
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Mirtle disagrees with your conclusion:

"Fallout over Kovalchuk situation has pushed Lamoriello out of inner circle a bit."
Fallout over the Kovy contract, but none over the ludicrous signings on the eve of the lockout by a negotiating committee member, knowing FULL WELL what was going to be on the NHL's hill?

That's got to be the most selective fallout ever.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jkrdevil View Post
Personally I think it was nothing quote that got blown up. If you ask either side involved they would probably say it is embarassing that they are playing and then blame the other side for it (of course Lou doesn't go that far since he isn't involved). Being embarassed isn't the same as saying you should budge.

As for Lou not being involved, I do think it was because of the Kovalchuk deal. He had more to do with it than some think. No doubt Vanderbbek, the Devils owner said he wanted to and willing to do whatever it took to re-sign him, but the way that deal was structured had Lou's and the Devils cal guy's figure prints all over it.

And yes, the Richards, Weber and Minnesota deals are worse than that deal. They got through because the league codified things, but it does show the league has an inability to see future consequences for some of their decision makings.
It's not about the deal structure, but being part of a strategy committee that was codifying the NHL's lockout plan.

Fugu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 07:29 PM
  #45
EagleBlack87
Score ze goals
 
EagleBlack87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 272
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGuy276 View Post
And hows that working out for us?
Not good. LA beat you in the Finals. You lost your captain, and will be losing your franchise goalie in a year or so. And the only thing you have to show for a team is Kovalchuk and Henrique.

EagleBlack87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 07:36 PM
  #46
KINGS17
Smartest in the Room
 
KINGS17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 15,829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SMantzas View Post
Yeah, he designed a loophole that he used five years later. Not to mention he was against the Kovy signing. And let's not forget half the teams used the Loup-hole
Yeah, I was thinking more of the player he buried over in Europe to avoid the cap hit.

Definitely not in the spirit of the CBA, but Uncle Lou knew all the tricks.

KINGS17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 07:39 PM
  #47
NJDevs26
Moderator
Status quo
 
NJDevs26's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 24,725
vCash: 214
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
Fallout over the Kovy contract, but none over the ludicrous signings on the eve of the lockout by a negotiating committee member, knowing FULL WELL what was going to be on the NHL's hill?

That's got to be the most selective fallout ever.
Welcome to the NHL: The National Hypocrisy League.

NJDevs26 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 07:59 PM
  #48
Brick City
Ignore me!
 
Brick City's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: New Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 728
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EagleBlack87 View Post
Not good. LA beat you in the Finals. You lost your captain, and will be losing your franchise goalie in a year or so. And the only thing you have to show for a team is Kovalchuk and Henrique.
Not sure if JerseyGuy276 was suggesting that the Kovy contract is working out for us or not - his question can be read either way. Nonetheless, you have to be joking with your response. The Devils made it to the Stanley Cup Finals and Kovy had an enormous role in getting us that far while playing through an injury. There is more to the Devils than Kovy and Henrique, but with them leading the way along with hopefully Larsson, I think things are working out so far.


Last edited by Brick City: 12-27-2012 at 08:05 PM.
Brick City is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 09:06 PM
  #49
atomic
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 287
vCash: 500
Lou is the person who ruined the league hiring all those coaches that played the trap. Even when they were winning all the time they still had trouble filling their arena. And the stupid contracts he has offered to get around the cap.

atomic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
12-27-2012, 09:10 PM
  #50
thom
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 2,107
vCash: 500
Jacques learned the trap from bowman's canadiens club in the 1970's it was a variation but it was a trap

thom is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:21 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.