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Off-Season Madness the 16th: Are we there yet? Are we there yet? Are we there yet?

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Old
01-09-2013, 11:33 PM
  #626
Hemskyfanboy83
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Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post
Which kind of goes to illustrate why I dislike the idea that some voters make players wait before getting voted in. That makes no sense. I understand the multiple years of eligibility in case a guy can't get in because there's too many good eligible players ahead of them. But What's the point of making a guy wait? Years from now only the most hardcore HOF followers are going to remember wait periods on guys before they get in. They'll only remember if a guy is in or out. I don't see the point of "sending a message" or "a guy deserving to wait" or whatnot. If it's someone like Blyleven where it wasn't a case of needing to wait as much as it was taking a while before people really looked at him and realized the true measure of his success, that's one thing. But if Craig Biggio deserves to get into the hall, and everyone knows it, he should be in this year.
I can actually live with it. I don't mind if they make a distinction between first-ballot guys and the rest of the HOF'er because the term first-ballot HOF'er has become popular.

I can live with Biggio waiting a year but my god, how the hell do you make Bonds and Clemens wait? Shame on the BBWAA.

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01-10-2013, 12:31 AM
  #627
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I don't think it has to make you that player on its own. If they don't really have any effect no one would take them. They messed up and this is the consequence. Bonds still made millions, not exactly like they gave him the chair for it. They just aren't outright rewarding him. Character is part of the ballot, and frankly bonds' character is as bad as they come. Shouldn't be in.
you need skill to still be good with PED's I'm willing to bet there has been more people that failed using PED's then had success using PED's

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01-10-2013, 08:40 AM
  #628
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Aaron Loup or Brett Cecil. Happ would be available too but he's more of a multi-inning guy than a lefty specialist.
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Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Cecil/Happ/Loup. Delabar kills lefties. Janssen is better against lefties as well.
I meant if Cecil gets moved for Morse, and Oliver doesn't return. I guess Loup then would be our best option.

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Old
01-10-2013, 10:43 AM
  #629
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I guess Clemens and Bonds will be added to the all-time greats, which includes Rose and Joe Jackson, that were excluded from the HOF.

I still cringe at the failure of including Jackson. My God.

In what world does a career .356/.423/.517 slash and +11 defensive runs exclude you?

Before anyone brings up the "Scandal", there is heavy against such a claim, which includes him being founded as "not guilty". For one, I know that if I bet against my team, I would not post a .375 BA, throw a runner out at the plate, and lead both teams in batting categories.

They really need to fix this "system" or whatever it is they have going because it's already begun to misrepresent and inadequately judge some very good baseball players, and for personal reasons too.

The beginning of Stark's ESPN article captures my thoughts perfectly:

Quote:
The votes are in. The earth is still rumbling. Now let's try to digest the magnitude of what just happened here:

A man who hit 762 home runs wasn't elected to the Hall of Fame.

A pitcher who won seven Cy Young Awards wasn't elected to the Hall of Fame.

A man who hit 609 home runs only got 12.5 percent of the vote.

A catcher who made 12 All-Star teams missed election by 98 votes.

Even a guy who got 3,060 hits found out Wednesday he didn't do enough to be a first-ballot Hall of Famer.

It boggles the mind. Doesn't it? We were just presented the most star-studded Hall of Fame ballot in maybe 75 years. And NOBODY got elected?

It's enough to make you wonder: What kind of Hall of Fame are we building here?

Do we really want a Hall of Fame that basically tries to pretend that none of those men ever played baseball? That none of that happened? Or that none of that should have happened?

Hey, here's a bulletin for you: It happened.

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01-10-2013, 01:36 PM
  #630
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More waiver moves by #BlueJays. They claim LHP Tommy Hottovy from #Rangers, DFA Chad Beck to make room on 40-man.

Weeeee more waiver stuff! He isn't any good and will probably get DFA'd later once Jays find someone better.

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01-10-2013, 01:41 PM
  #631
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Just add Rose, Clemens and Bonds damnit, who cares! Everyone juiced!

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01-10-2013, 01:46 PM
  #632
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Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Shi Davidi ‏@ShiDavidi
More waiver moves by #BlueJays. They claim LHP Tommy Hottovy from #Rangers, DFA Chad Beck to make room on 40-man.

Weeeee more waiver stuff! He isn't any good and will probably get DFA'd later once Jays find someone better.
Probably. Like that it's a lefty though.

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01-10-2013, 01:49 PM
  #633
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Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Shi Davidi ‏@ShiDavidi
More waiver moves by #BlueJays. They claim LHP Tommy Hottovy from #Rangers, DFA Chad Beck to make room on 40-man.

Weeeee more waiver stuff! He isn't any good and will probably get DFA'd later once Jays find someone better.


Hopefully one of these guys pan out.

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01-10-2013, 01:51 PM
  #634
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With all this HoF stuff it really depends how much weight one puts on "integrity" & "character" criteria.

Bonds, Clemens, etc. are true legends if you ignore the above two criteria but they took a risk and got caught which (to me) ruined their "character & integrity".

Letting them into the HoF on the first ballot just sends the wrong msg to all your kids who look up to these guys.

This is how it works in real life, if you cheat and get caught, you must expect to face consequences.

I don't think its the steroids that made them legends (they still worked their ass off), but i think it is the steroids that disqualified by failing two criteria (character & integrity).

Imagine you are an investment banker and work all your life for one bank, make them millions of dollars, make a good living yourself but somewhere along the line you get caught for "skimming a little extra" for yourself throughout the years. Do you think anyone will consider you were a "legend" at the bank or will you be remember as that guy who did so well for himself but still found the need to "steal".

---

As for Biggio...i got no idea what the writers were thinking.

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01-10-2013, 02:15 PM
  #635
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Originally Posted by Nasty Nazem View Post
Shi Davidi ‏@ShiDavidi
More waiver moves by #BlueJays. They claim LHP Tommy Hottovy from #Rangers, DFA Chad Beck to make room on 40-man.

Weeeee more waiver stuff! He isn't any good and will probably get DFA'd later once Jays find someone better.
Sucks for Beck. he was a Jay again for like a week and now he's gone.

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01-10-2013, 02:42 PM
  #636
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Word is that Jack Norris has been contacted to take Ashby's spot in the booth. He's a bit of an old fart in terms of his view of the game, but his play-calling and radio voice should be pretty good.

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Old
01-10-2013, 03:09 PM
  #637
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Word is that Jack Norris has been contacted to take Ashby's spot in the booth. He's a bit of an old fart in terms of his view of the game, but his play-calling and radio voice should be pretty good.
I read that first as Jack Morris. I was going to ask what has he done to suggest he'd be good as a broadcaster (seriously, btw...I really wasn't sure at first whether he had broadcasting experience).

I've honestly never heard of Jack Norris, though.

Seems like I'm not the only one, as the top Jack Norris results on google after some medical doctor guy is Jack Norris the hockey goalie.

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01-10-2013, 03:25 PM
  #638
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I read that first as Jack Morris. I was going to ask what has he done to suggest he'd be good as a broadcaster (seriously, btw...I really wasn't sure at first whether he had broadcasting experience).

I've honestly never heard of Jack Norris, though.

Seems like I'm not the only one, as the top Jack Norris results on google after some medical doctor guy is Jack Norris the hockey goalie.
Wow I can't believe I did that. It's indeed Jack Morris. Yes, that Jack Morris. Typo, my bad.

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01-10-2013, 03:32 PM
  #639
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Wow I can't believe I did that. It's indeed Jack Morris. Yes, that Jack Morris. Typo, my bad.
Then my original question stands. What suggests that Jack Morris has what it takes to be a good broadcaster? Has he been one before?

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01-10-2013, 06:53 PM
  #640
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Then my original question stands. What suggests that Jack Morris has what it takes to be a good broadcaster? Has he been one before?
He's been the colour analyst for the Twins. For how long I'm not quite sure. He does have some level of broadcasting experience though.

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01-10-2013, 07:37 PM
  #641
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He's been the colour analyst for the Twins. For how long I'm not quite sure. He does have some level of broadcasting experience though.
Bert Blyleven has that job.

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Old
01-10-2013, 07:50 PM
  #642
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Upton rejects trade to the Mariners

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Old
01-10-2013, 08:07 PM
  #643
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Upton rejects trade to the Mariners
Upton has a no trade list of 4 teams and the blue jays are on the list...

That's just comedy

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Old
01-10-2013, 08:10 PM
  #644
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Then my original question stands. What suggests that Jack Morris has what it takes to be a good broadcaster? Has he been one before?
You won't know till you find out.

And it would be kinda nice to bring back a guy from both our world series wins. Funny enough, I remember my great-aunt (A massive Blue Jays fan) having a Jack Morris jersey.

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01-10-2013, 11:26 PM
  #645
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Upton has a no trade list of 4 teams and the blue jays are on the list...

That's just comedy
Not really, the list hasn't been updated since the beginning of spring, IIRC, definitely before winter though. So not wanting to come to a team where taxes are a bit higher (though overblown by media), and where he's playing on turf for about 90 games a year (TB included there), it's not hard to see why they'd be on his no-trade list.

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01-11-2013, 04:42 AM
  #646
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so what can you guyz tell me about the Dickey extension ??

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01-11-2013, 06:27 AM
  #647
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fill me in

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Old
01-11-2013, 07:22 AM
  #648
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Upton has a no trade list of 4 teams and the blue jays are on the list...

That's just comedy
supposedly its the mariners, redsox, jays and cubs on the list

i had also yeard that the yankees were a team he'd reject but I'm unsure about that

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01-11-2013, 07:51 AM
  #649
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So, J.P blocked me on twitter even though I've never tweeted him ever. There's that.

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01-11-2013, 08:58 AM
  #650
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so, j.p blocked me on twitter even though i've never tweeted him ever. There's that.
hahahahhahaha

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