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Lockout VI - Game On! Rejoice! Players to vote Saturday.

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Old
01-04-2013, 10:52 AM
  #351
The Magic Man
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sudsie View Post
Someone tell me again why these multi million dollar players need a pension? Must be rough.
Quote:
Originally Posted by meng666 View Post
I would think it was the lower tier guys that are most concerned. Assuming it's Sidney Crosby and Ovechkin is putting a spin on it.
You often hear people exclaim that the NHLPA is only trying to protect the superstars with the new CBA bargaining but the pension is one of many factors where all the players, especially the lesser names, are looking for the best deal possible.
I just wonder if Bettman is going to get a pension even though he makes $8 million a year?
Thank you meng, pretty much what I was going to say. The pension is more for Mike Brown, not Phil Kessel. If your smart about it, you should be making pension contributions from Working Day 1. And not just CPP. If Brown is gonna be a hockey player for 6-7 years (if he's lucky) he will need to make good contributions to his pension plan. At 30, with concussions, where is he to go when his hockey career is over. I hope these guys figure that out.

I think it may also be an argument over who's half pays for it. These sides are nickel and diming each other that much.

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01-04-2013, 10:56 AM
  #352
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f. View Post
the worst scenerio might be the best scenerio for canadians

-the NHL folds and Bettman's 30 team league concept with mostly American teams is history
-a new league is formed with 8 canadian teams and 8 american teams
-a 16 team league of mostly canadian/american players (euros would likely stay home)
-salary cap/revenue would be considerably less

can u dig?

CAN EAST
toronto
ottawa
montreal
quebec

AM EAST
philadelphia
pittsburgh
boston
new york

AM WEST
detroit
chicago
san francisco
los angeles

CAN WEST
vancouver
edmonton
calgary
winnipeg
San Fran ??

I wouldn't mind a 16 team hockey league however with the talent of 30 teams compressed into 16 to raise the talent and entertainment level accordingly for the price of admission.

Its not going to happen, but "blow it up" is still something I wouldn't mind seeing if it did happen none the less.

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01-04-2013, 11:02 AM
  #353
eyeball11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f. View Post
the worst scenerio might be the best scenerio for canadians

-the NHL folds and Bettman's 30 team league concept with mostly American teams is history
-a new league is formed with 8 canadian teams and 8 american teams
-a 16 team league of mostly canadian/american players (euros would likely stay home)
-salary cap/revenue would be considerably less

can u dig?

CAN EAST
toronto
ottawa
montreal
quebec

AM EAST
philadelphia
pittsburgh
boston
new york

AM WEST
detroit
chicago
san francisco
los angeles

CAN WEST
vancouver
edmonton
calgary
winnipeg
I've always wanted 10 Canadian and 10 American with a Canada vs US final every year (helps some people get involved on a different level if their own team is out). My problem has been finding a 5th Western team.

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:11 AM
  #354
p.l.f.
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10 and 10

toronto
hamilton
ottawa
montreal
quebec

vancouver
calgary
edmonton
winnipeg
regina (or seattle )

detroit
chicago
st.louis
los angeles
san francisco (gives los angeles a rival)

boston
philadelphia
pittsburgh
new york
washington

i'd rather fantasize about this than another 10 yrs of bettman's dream

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:13 AM
  #355
KuleminFan41
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Throughout this entire lock out, no one bugs me more than Doug MaClean . he's just been such a huge ****** throughout this entire thing. He sounds so bitter and just so against the players its ridiculous

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:23 AM
  #356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KuleminFan41 View Post
Throughout this entire lock out, no one bugs me more than Doug MaClean . he's just been such a huge ****** throughout this entire thing. He sounds so bitter and just so against the players its ridiculous
Again, I don't know how anyone can take a side in all this anymore. It seems ridiculous to think that one side is to blame now.

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01-04-2013, 11:23 AM
  #357
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KuleminFan41 View Post
Throughout this entire lock out, no one bugs me more than Doug MaClean . he's just been such a huge ****** throughout this entire thing. He sounds so bitter and just so against the players its ridiculous
True, but better than hearing about when he drafted Nash.

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:37 AM
  #358
eyeball11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f. View Post
10 and 10

toronto
hamilton
ottawa
montreal
quebec

vancouver
calgary
edmonton
winnipeg
regina (or seattle )

detroit
chicago
st.louis
los angeles
san francisco (gives los angeles a rival)

boston
philadelphia
pittsburgh
new york
washington

i'd rather fantasize about this than another 10 yrs of bettman's dream
Best I had come up with was Saskatoon but I don't really see any other Western team as viable population wise. Otherwise you hit my Canadian conference bang on. In terms of the US, my teams would only go so far south (means no LA or San Fran). My league would also have a shorter regular season and guaranteed home and home every year with every team (fans should get to see every team at least once per year). So something like this:

20 games vs other conference (guarantees home and home)
20 games vs other division (4 games against each team)
32 games vs own division (8 games against divisional rivals...increased animosity)

10 less games either knocks a month off the schedule or allows more time to recover between games.

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:40 AM
  #359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f. View Post
the worst scenerio might be the best scenerio for canadians

-the NHL folds and Bettman's 30 team league concept with mostly American teams is history
-a new league is formed with 8 canadian teams and 8 american teams
-a 16 team league of mostly canadian/american players (euros would likely stay home)
-salary cap/revenue would be considerably less

can u dig?

CAN EAST
toronto
ottawa
montreal
quebec

AM EAST
philadelphia
pittsburgh
boston
new york

AM WEST
detroit
chicago
san francisco
los angeles

CAN WEST
vancouver
edmonton
calgary
winnipeg
Very doubtful that Edmonton/Ottawa/Winnipeg/QC make it in uncapped league.,, Edmonton and Ottawa were 2 market desperate for cap in league. Both if you recall were saved by the much despised Bettman (Funny how everyone forgets)

And San Fransisco wont work as an NHL city nor have they shown interest. San Jose is were hockey is popular in bay area

And NHL will never fold ,, No matter how much it is hurt and Montreal/Toronto/etc cant leave NHL

NHL owns the property rights of the names

Maple Leafs , Canucks , et will never be involved in another league so that is simple pipedream as is a NHL made up of majority or half teams in Canada

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:49 AM
  #360
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Originally Posted by eyeball11 View Post
I've always wanted 10 Canadian and 10 American with a Canada vs US final every year (helps some people get involved on a different level if their own team is out). My problem has been finding a 5th Western team.
Don't see why it would need to be Canadian/American...I guess I don't buy into the patriotic ********.

I think best case scenario for the league would be a 28 team league with four divisions of 7 teams. Top 8 teams from each conference make the playoffs with division champs in the 1 and 2 spot.

Divisions would be Atlantic, Great Lakes, Central, Western

Atlantic
Washington
New York Rangers
Boston
Philly
Pittsburgh
New Jersey
Brooklyn Islanders (formerly New York Isles)

Great Lakes
Quebec City (formerly Tampa Bay)
Montreal
Ottawa
Toronto
Toronto II (Markham) (formerly Columbus)
Buffalo
Detroit

Central
Dallas
St. Louis
Minnesota
Colorado
Winnipeg
Nashville
Chicago

Western
LA
San Jose
Anaheim
Vancouver
Edmonton
Calgary
Seattle (formerly Phoenix)

Teams lost: Florida, Carolina

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:50 AM
  #361
p.l.f.
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if the americans pull out interest and would rather show college hoops or nascar then so be it
a lesser financed league with predominantly canadian teams is a nice dream
saskatchewan blackhawks has a nice ring to it too

i would rather see:
saskatchewan vs winnipeg with lots of patriotic top canadian players
than:
columbus vs nashville with watered down lineups and 50% euros that are here just for the money

and that's the worst case scenario ?


Last edited by p.l.f.: 01-04-2013 at 11:56 AM.
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Old
01-04-2013, 11:55 AM
  #362
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Originally Posted by Cool Hand Luke View Post
Don't see why it would need to be Canadian/American...I guess I don't buy into the patriotic ********.
I don't either in terms of teams but a lot of people get into that.

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:56 AM
  #363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Very doubtful that Edmonton/Ottawa/Winnipeg/QC make it in uncapped league.,, Edmonton and Ottawa were 2 market desperate for cap in league. Both if you recall were saved by the much despised Bettman (Funny how everyone forgets)
There's a difference when your bigest problems are caused by dollar differences than actual interest.

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Old
01-04-2013, 03:23 PM
  #364
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KuleminFan41 View Post
Throughout this entire lock out, no one bugs me more than Doug MaClean . he's just been such a huge ****** throughout this entire thing. He sounds so bitter and just so against the players its ridiculous
I think he actually used the phrase "are you kidding me" more than he used the line "I drafted Rick Nash" in 2012

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Old
01-04-2013, 03:57 PM
  #365
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http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=412797

Quote:
Several NHL players are disappointed in the way the National Hockey League presented the latest definition of hockey related revenue (HRR) during talks this week.

"Basically, they changed the definition, where there would be no accountability in terms of HRR accounting," Senators team representative Chris Phillips told The Ottawa Sun on Friday. "So they could basically give us whatever number they wanted to.
I think it was a great move by Bettman to try and sneak a change into the discussions.

Just makes clear that neither side should be trusting anything previously agreed to.

Greed is good.

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Old
01-04-2013, 05:31 PM
  #366
p.l.f.
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Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun 1hr
Mediator about to meet with NHL now

Dan Rosen ‏@drosennhl 50m
Still waiting to find out if NHL, NHLPA will hold a full committee negotiating session tonight. Each has been meeting w/the mediator today.

Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper 30m
Believed #NHLPA has already received 75% needed votes to file disclaimer to #NHL once again. As of now, no internal date has been set.

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Old
01-04-2013, 05:53 PM
  #367
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never understood the people who want contraction that wont make the game better. people say the game is so diluted today but the gap between the best players and weakest players are alot closer today then 20 years ago.

the reason scoring is down from 20 years ago is because of 4 major reason's

1) Coaching is alot better
2) Defensemen are alot better
3) Goaltending is alot better
4) the gap between best and worst is alot smaller now.

if you contract all you do is increase these 4 things even more. it's not really a coincidence that the NHL was at an all time high in goals for in the 80's right after a major expansion when they brought in the WHA teams.

IndigoBuffalo made a good post in another thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by indigobuffalo View Post
As for the people saying that the NHL should go down to 24 teams and all those people wanting to cast-off the Sunbelt Teams...

The NHL should actually add more teams. It's good that they are going up to 32 teams, but I would like to see them jump upwards towards 42 within the next few years.

Why? Because more teams means more exciting hockey. Less teams would only further stagnate the lack of scoring and make hockey a boring, unappealing game. Most people think that condensing the talent pool means "All-Star"-like hockey scores like 10-8 or 12-9, whereas it's actually quite the opposite.

An overlooked fact about the All-Star games is that goalies aren't really trying (they're asked not to to increase goals and make the gamemore enjoyable to fans) and the defensemen are told not to lay anyone out and they also don't try as hard, at least not defensively.

If the league was condensed to 24 or fewer teams, the games would mostly finish in SO/OT with scores of 1-0. That's because the defenses would be stacked, every team would have a great goaltender/defensive pairing.

By contrast, 42 NHL teams means that placed like Halifax, Saskatoon, Quebec City, and a few others in the US like Seattle, Hartford, Kansas City, Las Vegas and more can have NHL teams too.

And having those teams means that while the NHL will still have it's Sidney Crosbys and Alex Ovechkins, the overall quality of their opponents will massively decrease. Many of the "career AHLers" or even ECHLers would suddenly be getting into the NHL because there just wouldn't be enough legit NHLers to fill the benches.

That means that Phil Kessels would be dekeing out Mike Kostkas and sniping pucks past Jussi Rynnas'.

There is a historical precedent for this too.

When the NHL started expanding in the 60's through the 70's, the quality of players league-wide decreased. At the same time, the WHA started up in the 70s and further decreased the average quality of players. Add in a superstar like Wayne Gretzky, and badabing-badaboom you get a player averaging 2PPG or better. Even **** players like Gary Leeman can hit 50-goal seasons if you dilute the talent pool enough.

In short, less teams makes boring hockey. More teams makes exciting hockey.

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Old
01-04-2013, 06:38 PM
  #368
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owners are in room #1
players are in room #2
the mediator is being used to take information from one room to the other (according to tsn radio)

so they are negotiating


Last edited by p.l.f.: 01-04-2013 at 06:47 PM.
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Old
01-04-2013, 06:43 PM
  #369
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Pathetic babies. Man up, talk face to face, meet in the middle, and get it done. What a bunch of no-good, worthless, rich plugs. I hate them all.

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01-04-2013, 06:59 PM
  #370
The Magic Man
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p.l.f. View Post
owners are in room #1
players are in room #2
the mediator is being used to take information from one room to the other (according to tsn radio)

so they are negotiating
WTF is wrong with this picture. So god damn childish.

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Old
01-04-2013, 07:02 PM
  #371
p.l.f.
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WTF is wrong with this picture. So god damn childish.
tsn update:
supposedly theyve been making progess the last few hrs with both sides offering some wiggleroom

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Old
01-04-2013, 07:12 PM
  #372
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Originally Posted by KuleminFan41 View Post
Throughout this entire lock out, no one bugs me more than Doug MaClean . he's just been such a huge ****** throughout this entire thing. He sounds so bitter and just so against the players its ridiculous
He's the ying to that bonehead Kypreos' yang.

Quote:
Originally Posted by -DeMo- View Post
4) the gap between best and worst is alot smaller now.
Yet the difference in their paychecks is skyrocketing, and will probably get worse with the new CBA.

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01-04-2013, 07:15 PM
  #373
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Originally Posted by p.l.f. View Post
the worst scenerio might be the best scenerio for canadians

-the NHL folds and Bettman's 30 team league concept with mostly American teams is history
-a new league is formed with 8 canadian teams and 8 american teams
-a 16 team league of mostly canadian/american players (euros would likely stay home)
-salary cap/revenue would be considerably less

can u dig?

CAN EAST
toronto
ottawa
montreal
quebec

AM EAST
philadelphia
pittsburgh
boston
new york

AM WEST
detroit
chicago
san francisco
los angeles

CAN WEST
vancouver
edmonton
calgary
winnipeg
Who would this be good for? The players who would make much less money under a considerably lower cap? The game, that would have to be put on hold for years until the new league gets its infrastructure worked out? I'm sure that'll help establish a fanbase.

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01-04-2013, 07:23 PM
  #374
The Magic Man
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Yet the difference in their paychecks is skyrocketing, and will probably get worse with the new CBA.
Wow. I have a flu. Don't try and do cap math and figures whilst running a 103 fever. Something isn't ticking right in my overheated brain. Fingers don't work like they normally do.

Any way I was gonna say, players will now demand the max if it's just 5 year limits, leaving less of the pie to the other players.

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01-04-2013, 08:01 PM
  #375
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tsn radio update 9pm: "marathon mediation continues...

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