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Paul Martin Trade or Buyout? (if there's a season)

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Old
01-08-2013, 11:44 PM
  #326
Captain Hook
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Originally Posted by alcanalz View Post
I don't think I'd be a fan of Letang and Niskanen as a pairing. Despres, sure, I'll give him a shot.

I like having Letang with Orpik or even Martin because you can have them out there at any time of the game. I like when that line is the go-to line offensively and defensively.
Not sure Shero is either. That's why there were so many rumors that they were looking for a D-Man to play with Letang on the trade market over the summer but I guess he never found anything he liked.

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01-08-2013, 11:45 PM
  #327
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The only thing that makes sense in this scenario, is if the Pens have a trade lined up for an experienced top pairing Dman. And sorry people, but the only guy in the league who that could be is J-Bo. So let's break this down...


Martin and Orpik were the two candidates to play with Letang on the top pairing, because they're the only 2 proven guys who can play big minutes. So who does Letang play with on the top pairing then?


I've been a fan (and still am) of Niskanen and Engelland, and the only other guy I have pencilled into my top-6 is Bortuzzo. I just don't think any of those 3 guys are ready yet to be top-pairing Dmen, and of them, only Niskanen is beter on the left side. And, even if he was in consideration, I don't think Despres is ready to be a full-time top-pairing guy just yet either. This is why I think a trade could happen.


Is there something I'm missing? Is anyone else seeing this differently?

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01-08-2013, 11:48 PM
  #328
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Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
The only thing that makes sense in this scenario, is if the Pens have a trade lined up for an experienced top pairing Dman. And sorry people, but the only guy in the league who that could be is J-Bo. So let's break this down...


Martin and Orpik were the two candidates to play with Letang on the top pairing, because they're the only 2 proven guys who can play big minutes. So who does Letang play with on the top pairing then?


I've been a fan (and still am) of Niskanen and Engelland, and the only other guy I have pencilled into my top-6 is Bortuzzo. I just don't think any of those 3 guys are ready yet to be top-pairing Dmen, and of them, only Niskanen is beter on the left side. And, even if he was in consideration, I don't think Despres is ready to be a full-time top-pairing guy just yet either. This is why I think a trade could happen.


Is there something I'm missing? Is anyone else seeing this differently?
What makes J-Bo the only option in the league?

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01-09-2013, 12:12 AM
  #329
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Originally Posted by LetsGoPens70 View Post
What makes J-Bo the only option in the league?

He's the only guy who has been rumoured to be on the block, although I don't think CGY trades him, because it looks like they may make one last run for it. But if they start off slow, would they consider a one-for-one swap for a guy like Despres or Dumoulin, so they get younger and shed some cap space? That would allow the Pens to trade or buy out Martin in the summer.


I'm not saying this will happen, but there is no other Dman out there that you could say is a clear-cut top-pairing guy, and who could play close to 25-30 mins per night with Letang, without totally emptying the farm system. And there are other teams that may offer more (Ken Holland is probably the best in the business, and DET is known to have interest in JBo, so suck on that to all the people here who think they know better than him). So we may just have to ride it out this year with the people we have, and then see. But this is the only guy out there right now -- unless someone like Despres or Dumoulin really steps it up to another level in this organization, and they aren't even invited to camp -- who could possibly fit that role.


Whatever the case: I desperately want our team to win this season, and I think we have put ourselves in a good position to do so, the best of which move of that is to get Vokoun as a plan-B in net, but we need to very carefully balance competing now with not giving away our future. I have no problem trading a guy like Maatta in a trade for a winger. But it would be stupid to trade guys like BB, Dumoulin, Despres or Harrington now, because they could have a HUGE impact as early as next season. And I wouldn't trade Pouiot or Morrow just becaue of upside, so our options are very limited.

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01-09-2013, 12:26 AM
  #330
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Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
He's the only guy who has been rumoured to be on the block, although I don't think CGY trades him, because it looks like they may make one last run for it. But if they start off slow, would they consider a one-for-one swap for a guy like Despres or Dumoulin, so they get younger and shed some cap space? That would allow the Pens to trade or buy out Martin in the summer.
Oh i see. If they consider trading him, that would be great. And if we could just do a swap like you mentioned, that would be ideal. I'm not too high trading this years 1st round pick. From pick 1 to 30 there are high end forwards and with that being an organizational need, it's a great draft for us. But, whatever it takes to win is what I'm ok with(I would trade the pick I'd we could get Iggy in the deal for example). I like the options the pens have, and the best part is that with our prospect depth, we can give up some of those guys to help us win, without totally sacrificing the future.

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01-09-2013, 07:00 AM
  #331
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SOO Martin who is soft as **** gets teamed up with Orpik who runs around like a chicken with his head cut off.

Genius Bylsma again

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01-09-2013, 07:29 AM
  #332
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I actually like this. Letang is our best defender, but I also think he's our lowest maintenance defender as well. I think we can pair him up with just about anyone and he'd perform at a reasonably high level. Heck, he even showed he could play pretty well as a left defenseman when we had to use him there last season. Both Orpik and Martin need to find their games again. Together perhaps that'll happen. And at least on the surface, having them as your shutdown pairing frees Letang up for more offense, which is good.

I like the idea of pairing Letang with Despres, Strait, Engelland or Bortuzzo. Not as much of a fan of pairing him with Niskanen.

I'm ready to see what Martin can do on the right side again. I think this helps his overall value, too. Hopefully, this works. Anything is better than Martin-Letang, imo.

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01-09-2013, 07:41 AM
  #333
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The problem with pairing letang with anybody like Strait, Bortuzzo, Despres or Engelland is that none of those guys are going to jump right in and play the kind of ES minutes Letang plays. If Martin and Orpik is a pair, we are going to either see a trade or we are going to see a rotation of players beside Letang. At least for the first few weeks until someone separates themselves from the pack and proves they can play those minutes against harder opponents.

And JayBo is not the only option for a trade. He is the most obvious, but not the only.

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01-09-2013, 08:25 AM
  #334
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JBo and Paul Martin on this team going into the playoffs. Yikes.

We'd need to infuse the bottom pair with some real physicality if that's the case.

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01-09-2013, 08:27 AM
  #335
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JBo and Paul Martin on this team going into the playoffs. Yikes.

We'd need to infuse the bottom pair with some real physicality if that's the case.
We'd also have to get used to more crappy wingers ad infinitum.

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01-09-2013, 08:30 AM
  #336
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We'd also have to get used to more crappy wingers ad infinitum.
Depends how much of JBo's salary Calgary would eat.

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01-09-2013, 08:39 AM
  #337
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Depends how much of JBo's salary Calgary would eat.
As per the new CBA, they can only share the cap hit and salary no? I thought it was a 50/50 split if teams decide to move salary in trade? I thought I read that somewhere in the new CBA.

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01-09-2013, 08:58 AM
  #338
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I brought JayBo into the conversation as an example of the "worst contract for a defender" instead of Martin. I don't know how we got to signing JayBo as an answer to anything.

JayBo is Jack Johnson terrible and overrated. Lets end it.

Also Martin will not be moved or bought out.

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01-09-2013, 09:01 AM
  #339
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Originally Posted by wgknestrick View Post
I brought JayBo into the conversation as an example of the "worst contract for a defender" instead of Martin. I don't know how we got to signing JayBo as an answer to anything.

JayBo is Jack Johnson terrible and overrated. Lets end it.

Also Martin will not be moved or bought out.
when did jack johnson become terrible?

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01-09-2013, 09:06 AM
  #340
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I don't think Jack Johnson is terrible. I think he has played on some terrible teams though. Johnson needs to be coached...that's what he needs. He never had to rely on position to be effective because he was always so much better than everyone else.

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01-09-2013, 09:27 AM
  #341
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Originally Posted by wgknestrick View Post
I brought JayBo into the conversation as an example of the "worst contract for a defender" instead of Martin. I don't know how we got to signing JayBo as an answer to anything.

JayBo is Jack Johnson terrible and overrated. Lets end it.

Also Martin will not be moved or bought out.
So who so you think will be playing with Letang? Will. A trade be made of will it be Niskanen?

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01-09-2013, 09:43 AM
  #342
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What are the possibilities of trading for and signing Keith Yandle. The Pens have room for his contract under the cap. What would it take to get him away from Phoenix? 2 prospects +?

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01-09-2013, 09:45 AM
  #343
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Phoenix would be looking for a top end forward. They have no need for defense prospects.

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01-09-2013, 09:47 AM
  #344
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If Orpik is going to play with Martin, then Shero is probably working on getting another top 4 d-man to play with Letang.

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01-09-2013, 09:47 AM
  #345
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I know we could use a guy on the point for the powerplay, but first and foremost I think any d-man brought in needs to be very good defensively.

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01-09-2013, 09:55 AM
  #346
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Have to think there's a trade on the horizon. No idea what team would give up a top 4 D-man for prospects but I guess we'll see.

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01-09-2013, 10:07 AM
  #347
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I would think we will be making a minor trade at least. Tangradi, Jeffery, Bortuzzo and Strait all need to pass thru waivers and they most likely wont. By themselves they aren't worth much but they are definitely guys that can be added to a higher end prospect, draft pick etc to get something back.

Maybe Shero has something totally out of left field like a poster mentioned yesterday like when the Kunitz trade happened. It's just going to be tough cause we don't have a lot to trade off the roster

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01-09-2013, 10:07 AM
  #348
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I'd rather have Bouwmester on this team. Paul Martin is pretty bad. I struggle to remember a Dman who played for the pens with a worse shot. Melichar had a better shot with one shoulder. Slegr would boom slapshots into the glass but man they sounded impressive.

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01-09-2013, 10:13 AM
  #349
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Genius Blysma & Cohorts with another Brilliant Plan like the PP rover! only thing it did was confuse the **** out of the other 4 players on the PP

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01-09-2013, 10:27 AM
  #350
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As per the new CBA, they can only share the cap hit and salary no? I thought it was a 50/50 split if teams decide to move salary in trade? I thought I read that somewhere in the new CBA.
You can have up to three contracts at any one time on your roster where you can eat up to 50% of the cap/salary hit (same percentage for both), provided that your total eaten dollars is not more than 15% of the upper limit threshold.

I wondered if it was trade year only or life of the deal, but the example LeBrun gave was Komisarek, who has a year on his deal.

Some may laugh about it, but here's a thought: Cammallerri, J-Bo, and Kiprusoff have a combined cap hit of 18.425M. All of them are under contract through the end of next season. What if Calgary decided to rebuild and Paul Holmgren said 'I'll take all three, empty to prospect vault to do it, but I need you to eat half the cap hit'?

He'd get those three at 9.213M, especially beneficial going into next year. He'd have them for two playoff runs. Oh, and here's the real kicker: He can buy out Briere and the nut case in goal, save about 3M in cap space in the process, and THEN have that 9.213M open up after the 2013-2014 season.

It will be Holmgren or someone else (maybe Sather). BUT, someone with the balls to exploit it is going to make a deal like that.

J-Bo at 3.3M. Cammy at 3M. Kipper at 2.8M. Tell me who would be hotter trade prospects.

****, imagine what the market for Nash would've been like IF Columbus would've eaten a third of the cap/payroll hit.

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