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Who do the Oilers buyout? (If anyone)

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01-03-2013, 10:40 AM
  #126
Reimer
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Cause Horcoff is a decent 3rd liner and they need someone in that spot. Too bad you can't do that.
By what metric?

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01-03-2013, 10:45 AM
  #127
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By what metric?
I dunno, what metrics do you need? He is pretty good at faceoffs, responsible defensively, can skate decently well and is the captain. He can even chip in some points. I don't see how he isn't decent for a 3rd liner, he's just been overpaid and overplayed.

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01-03-2013, 10:46 AM
  #128
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By what standard? No offense?

If that's the case then Horcoff had an albatross of a season and then it multiplies 100 fold when you take into account of $'s/suck.

Belanger is like pennies/suck and Horcoff is about millions/suck.
i meant statistically, the guy hasnt been under 35pt a year since he played in LA 2003. he had 16 last year. put him on a line with Jones and Harty and he will be just fine offensively as well as be counted on the guy to play solid defence unlike last year when he was second fiddle to horcrap.

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01-03-2013, 10:53 AM
  #129
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i meant statistically, the guy hasnt been under 35pt a year since he played in LA 2003. he had 16 last year. put him on a line with Jones and Harty and he will be just fine offensively as well as be counted on the guy to play solid defence unlike last year when he was second fiddle to horcrap.
Ummm... hasn't Horcrap been, at worst, a 35 pt/year guy for the last decade as well? In fact most years scoring closer to 50 point pace (last year being by far his worst at 34pts over 77 games)?

Can't all the same arguments be applied to Horcoff?

(and didn't I see Belanger on the point of our powerplay for months?)


Last edited by bucks_oil: 01-03-2013 at 10:55 AM. Reason: had to add that pp point
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01-03-2013, 10:59 AM
  #130
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i meant statistically, the guy hasnt been under 35pt a year since he played in LA 2003. he had 16 last year. put him on a line with Jones and Harty and he will be just fine offensively as well as be counted on the guy to play solid defence unlike last year when he was second fiddle to horcrap.
You have some type of Horcoff hatred syndrome. Belanger was horrendous last season, much worse than Horcoff.

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01-03-2013, 11:02 AM
  #131
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Originally Posted by bucks_oil View Post
Ummm... hasn't Horcrap been, at worst, a 35 pt/year guy for the last decade as well? In fact most years scoring closer to 50 point pace (last year being by far his worst at 34pts over 77 games)?

Can't all the same arguments be applied to Horcoff?

(and didn't I see Belanger on the point of our powerplay for months?)
Yeah - playing the most minutes with the best players. This clown has led our team in TOI since 06-07.

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01-03-2013, 11:02 AM
  #132
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I dunno, what metrics do you need? He is pretty good at faceoffs, responsible defensively, can skate decently well and is the captain. He can even chip in some points. I don't see how he isn't decent for a 3rd liner, he's just been overpaid and overplayed.
So other than less offense last year how isn't Belanger a better option if you choose those metrics as being adequate for a 3rd liner?

Because to me winning for a hockey team starts from the captain down and leading by example. So tbh Horcoff doesn't have much example to lead by when he blames the teams losses on other players and leads the league in the minus column. He is a poison and needs to be purged from the team, until such time this team will continue to dwindle their young guns elc's.

As for the overplayed part, I'd expect a guy who is making 5.5 per season to be able to handle 20 minutes a night at a decent level. Horc can't even handle 15 minutes a night.

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01-03-2013, 11:04 AM
  #133
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You have some type of Horcoff hatred syndrome. Belanger was horrendous last season, much worse than Horcoff.
No - not really. Belanger was much better on the dot and much better on the PK. Neither was very good on offense.

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01-03-2013, 11:05 AM
  #134
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You have some type of Horcoff hatred syndrome. Belanger was horrendous last season, much worse than Horcoff.
It's not really a htred once you're able to see how terrible the guy is at playing hockey and then you compound matters with his contract and the problem can't even be fixed with TNT.

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01-03-2013, 11:06 AM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Reimer View Post
So other than less offense last year how isn't Belanger a better option if you choose those metrics as being adequate for a 3rd liner?

Because to me winning for a hockey team starts from the captain down and leading by example. So tbh Horcoff doesn't have much example to lead by when he blames the teams losses on other players and leads the league in the minus column. He is a poison and needs to be purged from the team, until such time this team will continue to dwindle their young guns elc's.

As for the overplayed part, I'd expect a guy who is making 5.5 per season to be able to handle 20 minutes a night at a decent level. Horc can't even handle 15 minutes a night.
Horcoff can easily handle 15 mins. What do you base that off of? I already said he was overpaid, this is about wishing we could buy him out then sign him for much less.

Belanger had 0 offense, he was awful. Horcoff does what Belanger can do but even whiffcoff can make things happen offensively at least semi-regularly.

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01-03-2013, 11:06 AM
  #136
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Originally Posted by bucks_oil View Post
Ummm... hasn't Horcrap been, at worst, a 35 pt/year guy for the last decade as well? In fact most years scoring closer to 50 point pace (last year being by far his worst at 34pts over 77 games)?

Can't all the same arguments be applied to Horcoff?

(and didn't I see Belanger on the point of our powerplay for months?)
except we are paying and were asking horcoff to be a 1st/2nd line C for a cap hit of 5.5. i will take belanger at his price for what he brings over horcoff/hisprice and what he brings anyday. Im not sure what you are argueing but are you saying you would rather have horcoff?

the whole premise was if we buyout horcoff who can we replace him with? the answer is already on our team with a 3.75m less cap hit

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01-03-2013, 11:09 AM
  #137
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Originally Posted by Insta View Post
You have some type of Horcoff hatred syndrome. Belanger was horrendous last season, much worse than Horcoff.
except one has a giant price tag that is absurd to what he does for the team while the other one had one bad season out of his last 12-13 and he is making 3.75m less, is better on faceoffs, still has the vet presence and can do everything horcoff can.

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01-03-2013, 11:09 AM
  #138
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He is pretty good at faceoffs
No - not really. Used to be, but not really anymore. He hasn't been over 50% in 3 years.

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responsible defensively
Used to be. But -53 the last 3 years.

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can skate decently well
Used to be why he was good defensively and on the PK - but he's slowed down tremendously and is always a step behind

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and is the captain
And THAT is very sad. Teflon Shawn.

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He can even chip in some points
With 20 minutes/night, top PP minutes, playing with the best players? Pathetic production considering the opportunities.

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01-03-2013, 11:11 AM
  #139
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Horcoff can easily handle 15 mins. What do you base that off of? I already said he was overpaid, this is about wishing we could buy him out then sign him for much less.

Belanger had 0 offense, he was awful. Horcoff does what Belanger can do but even whiffcoff can make things happen offensively at least semi-regularly.
The 15 minutes was really just hyperbole.

I know what this is about and if Horcoff would resign as $5million added to the Oilers cap I wouldn't take him.

Horcoff does what Belanger does?

So Belanger at 55.3% on the dot & Horc at 49.4% is doing it just as well?

Oh and Horc must feel real proud of placing 888 out of 894 players in +/- last year.

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01-03-2013, 11:11 AM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Insta View Post
Horcoff can easily handle 15 mins. What do you base that off of? I already said he was overpaid, this is about wishing we could buy him out then sign him for much less.

Belanger had 0 offense, he was awful. Horcoff does what Belanger can do but even whiffcoff can make things happen offensively at least semi-regularly.
we cant do that and you seem to be the only one wishing we could, horcoff has been the leader of this team since what 08? we havent sniffed the playoffs since he was the captain, he needs to go, thanks for everything shawn but you will can be used somewhere else on a 4th line like ethan moreau

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01-03-2013, 11:15 AM
  #141
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Best case scenario, the cap is 65M. That's what the PA is pushing for, the NHL wants 60M.

The Oilers need to re-sign or replace Hartikainen, Smid, Whitney, Jones, Gagner and fill their back-up Goaltender and two defenseman (one preferably a top-4 defenseman) line-up holes.That puts us pretty close to the cap, with 48.5M already spent.

Seems like they should buyout Horcoff and fill the position in free agency.

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01-03-2013, 11:16 AM
  #142
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we cant do that and you seem to be the only one wishing we could, horcoff has been the leader of this team since what 08? we havent sniffed the playoffs since he was the captain, he needs to go, thanks for everything shawn but you will can be used somewhere else on a 4th line like ethan moreau
He has been the TOI leader amongst forward on this team since 06-07. The last time he was NOT the TOI leader is when we made the playoffs in 05-06.

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01-03-2013, 11:18 AM
  #143
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The 15 minutes was really just hyperbole.

I know what this is about and if Horcoff would resign as $5million added to the Oilers cap I wouldn't take him.

Horcoff does what Belanger does?

So Belanger at 55.3% on the dot & Horc at 49.4% is doing it just as well?

Oh and Horc must feel real proud of placing 888 out of 894 players in +/- last year.
Don't kid yourself. Give Belanger the minutes horc had and he woulda blown him out of the water in minuses. Belanger was bad enough in limited minutes.

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01-03-2013, 11:20 AM
  #144
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I wouldn't bother with Potter as he has a 2-way so he wouldn't count against the cap in the minors would he?
Is he two-way? Although I don't think it matters as it's only suppose to be guys over 1mil that will count against cap.

Could just be a money save type move though.

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01-03-2013, 11:22 AM
  #145
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You have some type of Horcoff hatred syndrome. Belanger was horrendous last season, much worse than Horcoff.
For 4mil less I'll take Belanger everday

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01-03-2013, 11:22 AM
  #146
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Don't kid yourself. Give Belanger the minutes horc had and he woulda blown him out of the water in minuses. Belanger was bad enough in limited minutes.
Probably not since Belanger would have won a lot more faceoffs in the defensive zone.

But no you're right Horc is the man for the job. I haven't seen someone so hell bent on being convinced that a lemon is actually gold.

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01-03-2013, 11:24 AM
  #147
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Is he two-way? Although I don't think it matters as it's only suppose to be guys over 1mil that will count against cap.

Could just be a money save type move though.
I'm pretty sure it was a two-way deal but either way as you said the cap counting in the minors was only for higher paid players anyhow.

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01-03-2013, 11:29 AM
  #148
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so I hear the NHL is suggesting two compliance buyouts for the 2013/14 year in regards to the 60 million cap.
that would make it easier.

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01-03-2013, 11:31 AM
  #149
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so I hear the NHL is suggesting two compliance buyouts for the 2013/14 year in regards to the 60 million cap.
that would make it easier.
Yeah but there are doubts the Oilers would exercise this as a chance to buyout Horcoff.

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01-03-2013, 11:33 AM
  #150
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I think the only way they buyout Horcoff is if they need the cap space and they think they have a better option at 3C, not including Belanger. Belanger is a 4C at best if he plays like last year.

So they need to either acquire someone through free agency or have someone take a big leap in develop this year (i.e. Lander).

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