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Why can't Czech Republic, Finland, Slovakia produce any great skaters anymore?

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Old
01-04-2013, 04:10 PM
  #76
Mehar
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Originally Posted by FiLe View Post
You know, technically they were actually, since both started out as British colonies.

In fact, they share more common ancestry than the Finns and the Swedes or the Czechs and the Slovaks, given how they've been self-identifying ethnic groups with their own languages and customs since at least the 16th century - no matter what Crown they served. Wheras by that time, there was no one who possibly be identified as an American or a Canadian, you were all Brits.

So it's no less far fetched than suggesting Finland and Sweden should combine, given how the Americans stopped bowing to the King of England after the Revolution, mere 40 years before the Finns and the Swedes departed. Your common ancestry is even more hemmed in by the fact that you Canadians still do so.
Do not get into technicalities my friend. Czech Republic and Slovakia was actually a nation called Czechoslovakia up until 1993. Finland was a part of the nation of Sweden (for 7 centuries, from the 12th century up until 1809). How can you equate this to the history of Canada and the US? Do not be stupid. Canada became a nation only in 1867. Sweden has been around since the Middle Ages. Sweden's Eastern Half (Modern day Finland) was lost to Russia during the war in 1809, otherwise Finland would still be a part of Sweden up until today. Finland was a part of Sweden for 7 centuries. I proposed a legitimate solution to this thread, and all the posters here are basically too close-minded and wrapped up in their flags, to ignore the fact that what i am proposing would be great for every hockey fan in the world.

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Old
01-04-2013, 04:41 PM
  #77
slovakiasnextone
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Do not get into technicalities my friend. Czech Republic and Slovakia was actually a nation called Czechoslovakia up until 1993. Finland was a part of the nation of Sweden (for 7 centuries, from the 12th century up until 1809). How can you equate this to the history of Canada and the US? Do not be stupid. Canada became a nation only in 1867. Sweden has been around since the Middle Ages. Sweden's Eastern Half (Modern day Finland) was lost to Russia during the war in 1809, otherwise Finland would still be a part of Sweden up until today. Finland was a part of Sweden for 7 centuries. I proposed a legitimate solution to this thread, and all the posters here are basically too close-minded and wrapped up in their flags, to ignore the fact that what i am proposing would be great for every hockey fan in the world.
Czechoslovakia was never actually one single nation in the way that people understand nation in these parts of Europe despie the inability of foreigners to realize it. In the interwar period there was a political attempt to create a single nations of Czehoslovaks, but it was purely political (and had clear motivations- to make up a clear majority of the population compared to the big German and Hungarian ethnic minorities). However Czechoslovakia has always been made up by TWO nations - Czechs and Slovaks, and this fact was officially acknowledged at least since 1968 by politicians as in that year Czechoslovakia became a federation, at least on paper. Itīs true that the nations are and have been extremely close and the languages are very similar, everybody has always reliazed that the state was made up by two nations who had their differences. Also actually the history that Czechs and Slovaks share together is counted alltogether much much shorter than the history that they spent apart. While both most have common ancestors in the old Slavs, Slovakia had been a part of Hungary for around 1000 years until the creation of Czechoslovakia in 1918 and Czechs had had their own kingdom/were a part of Austria during this time. During this period I think only between 1804-1867 both nations were governed from the same centre - Vienna that is, but it was followed by another 50 years where once again every nation was governed by somebody else, Czechs by Vienna and Slovaks by Budapest.

Also while they were no problems between Czechs and Slovaks during Czechoslovakia until the 1990s when a wave of nationalism sweeped through the country, at least in hokey it has always been believed by the Slovak players/hockey people that there was un unspoken limit of how many Slovaks could be on the team and all the time only max 5 Slovak players actually made the team. I donīt know what the exact reasons for that were, but every single history book/documentary/article/interview with former players never ceases to point out this fact, so I imagine that few people in Slovak hockey would actually show any interest in reuniting national team wise with the Czechs.

Also 20 years is quite a long time and I donīt believe that my generation of people, who have grown up only knowing the Czech/Slovak republics and seeing the relationship between the two countries as a brotherly rivalry, othing more could ever identify with a team composed with players from both countries. And soon the menīs teams will mostly be made up of players of this generation that donīt remember Czechoslovakia.

As for Sweden/Finland, Iīd hope you would know that despite being part of the same country, they have always been two totally different nations with absolutely different ethnic origin and language (except for the Swedish speaking minority)... Actually the players on a SWE/FIN team would probably have to speak English to each other. Swedish is compulsary in Finnish schools AFAIK, but from almost all the Finnish people I met they hate this fact and despite learning it several years they donīt remember much if any of Swedish after school.

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01-04-2013, 04:59 PM
  #78
LOFIN
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Originally Posted by slovakiasnextone View Post
As for Sweden/Finland, Iīd hope you would know that despite being part of the same country, they have always been two totally different nations with absolutely different ethnic origin and language (except for the Swedish speaking minority)... Actually the players on a SWE/FIN team would probably have to speak English to each other. Swedish is compulsary in Finnish schools AFAIK, but from almost all the Finnish people I met they hate this fact and despite learning it several years they donīt remember much if any of Swedish after school.
True. Even if we are technicaly a bilingual country, you don't really need Swedish in your everyday life, unless you live in an area with Swedish speaking population. English however, is very much needed starting from internet, TV and movies (ofcourse they are subtitled but you get BIG exposure), etc. Also, Finnish people tend to have a "little brother" complex towards Sweden, and that also adds to the fact that people don't like to learn Swedish.

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01-04-2013, 05:35 PM
  #79
FiLe
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Originally Posted by Mehar View Post
How can you equate this to the history of Canada and the US?
Easily. Once, Swedes and Finns formed one country under the Swedish crown. The Czechs and Slovaks formed a country called Czechoslovakia. But as ethnic people with their own customs and whatnot, they've existed far longer than their separate nation-states. Whereas once upon a time, the people of US and Canada were English people living overseas. Subjects of a single crown, mostly sharing single language, ethnicity, and customs as well.

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Canada became a nation only in 1867.
Uh-huh. And Finland became an independent nation in 1917. But because they used to be Swedish subjects more than a century ago from that, you figure it's perfectly fine to suggest they should rejoin, but think it's stupid when I suggest that Canada and US shouldn't join because they were both born out of territories colonized by the Brits?

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Sweden's Eastern Half (Modern day Finland) was lost to Russia during the war in 1809, otherwise Finland would still be a part of Sweden up until today.
And if the colonists living in the original thirteen colonies of the United States hadn't rebelled, otherwise what is now known as USA and Canada today would still be considered subjects of the British Empire. So, your point was?

No, you're the one being stupid. You talked yourself into the bag and now you're trying to talk yourself out by muddling the issue. Sweden and Finland share a plenty of Nordic history, that is true. As do the Czechs and Slovaks, Slavic history. But so do the Canadians and Americans. Yours is British history, and even by today, your ties to the country your nation was borne out of are far tighter than those shared by the Swedes and the Finns or the Czechs and the Slovaks.

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I proposed a legitimate solution to this thread, and all the posters here are basically too close-minded and wrapped up in their flags, to ignore the fact that what i am proposing would be great for every hockey fan in the world.
And how are you not wrapped up in your flag when you don't see that if the Americans and Canadians rejoined the British Empire, there would not be stopping the national team born out of it?

Unless, of course, your argument is that they're both doing fine in the hockey world on their own, which means the sole reason for your proposal is to rejoin a pair of very different nations because they could play better hockey?

I take my words back, that's not stupid. It's mental.

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Old
01-04-2013, 06:35 PM
  #80
Mehar
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Originally Posted by FiLe View Post
And how are you not wrapped up in your flag when you don't see that if the Americans and Canadians rejoined the British Empire, there would not be stopping the national team born out of it?

Unless, of course, your argument is that they're both doing fine in the hockey world on their own, which means the sole reason for your proposal is to rejoin a pair of very different nations because they could play better hockey?

I take my words back, that's not stupid. It's mental.
You make good points man. I take back my comment. I did not mean to offend anyone. I started talking about Czechoslovakia being a world power today, and i drifted towards talking about Finland being part of Sweden until 1809, which i should not have. The thing is that Canada got its independence with the blessing of the British, who wanted Canada to stand on its own two feet to be an independent nation, and we did not have to rebel like the States. So that is why Canada differs from the States that way. Anyways, i should not have talked about Finland becoming a part of Sweden, and that is my mistake. I apologize if anyone got offended again.

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