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Old
01-04-2013, 06:26 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post

Harri Sateri


Michael Frolik

Just a simple hockey deal. Sharks get someone for their third line, Hawks clear a little cap and get someone to compete for the backup job. With Greiss and Stalock, Sateri seems expendable to me.
I'll take it

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Old
01-04-2013, 10:30 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by WTFetus View Post
"I think" doesn't make it any less of a personal guarantee in this case. In your previous post, you said yourself that you haven't seen enough of Greiss to judge his ceiling. Again, if that's the case, how do you know Greiss has a higher ceiling than Crawford? Your personal bias is getting in the way, which honestly isn't a surprise. You're putting him on a pedestal and you're giving Crawford the short end of the straw.
What is wrong with you? I think is not a personal guarantee of anything. It is an opinion. You want to keep making more out of something than what's there, you go right ahead but do it with yourself. And lo and behold, again you change what was actually said to take it out of context because you simply can't stick to what was there. You want to talk about personal bias. Look in the mirror, jack. Because your entire responses to me have been nothing but your own personal bias against me.

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Old
01-04-2013, 11:06 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
What is wrong with you? I think is not a personal guarantee of anything. It is an opinion. You want to keep making more out of something than what's there, you go right ahead but do it with yourself. And lo and behold, again you change what was actually said to take it out of context because you simply can't stick to what was there. You want to talk about personal bias. Look in the mirror, jack. Because your entire responses to me have been nothing but your own personal bias against me.
Why don't you actually answer my question then? First you say Greiss will replace Crawford. Then you say the sample size isn't big enough to accurately judge Greiss' ceiling. Circular reasoning much? If the latter is true, how do you know that Greiss will flourish and take the starting job? You don't know Greiss' ceiling, you don't know Crawford's ceiling, yet you still think that Greiss will win out. Now tell me, how is that not biased?

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01-05-2013, 11:24 AM
  #29
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I know alot of posters were concerned about SJ's team speed. Any interest in a Lombardi for Greiss deal? Lombardi's deal expires at the end of the year.

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01-05-2013, 11:26 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by WTFMAN99 View Post
I know alot of posters were concerned about SJ's team speed. Any interest in a Lombardi for Greiss deal? Lombardi's deal expires at the end of the year.
Nope. Lombardi is bad and injury prone.

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01-05-2013, 11:34 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Hatrick Marleau View Post
Nope. Lombardi is bad and injury prone.
I figured if you guys were willing to give up a 2nd for Moore, then Lombardi would be appealing, he had an arm injury....and before that a concussion which he sustained in Nashville.

I would not say he's bad either it's just he missed a lot of time from hockey and he's not on a great Leafs team.

I feel on a veteran team he would be able to contribute a bit.

If you don't want him that is fine as well.

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Old
01-05-2013, 06:28 PM
  #32
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Greiss for Frolik would be perfect

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Old
01-05-2013, 09:10 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WTFetus View Post
Why don't you actually answer my question then? First you say Greiss will replace Crawford. Then you say the sample size isn't big enough to accurately judge Greiss' ceiling. Circular reasoning much? If the latter is true, how do you know that Greiss will flourish and take the starting job? You don't know Greiss' ceiling, you don't know Crawford's ceiling, yet you still think that Greiss will win out. Now tell me, how is that not biased?
Why should I answer your question when it is clearly based on a false premise that you created by continuously and blatantly taking things out of context? The things you think I said is not actually what I said so I'm not going to bother when you can't even get things right with what I said. Come back to me when you process what was said accurately and stop grossly taking things out context.

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Old
01-05-2013, 09:46 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Why should I answer your question when it is clearly based on a false premise that you created by continuously and blatantly taking things out of context? The things you think I said is not actually what I said so I'm not going to bother when you can't even get things right with what I said. Come back to me when you process what was said accurately and stop grossly taking things out context.


Keep avoiding the question as usual. I don't even know why I'm bothering with replying, but I'll play your game. What premise? Call me out for saying you haven't seen enough of Crawford, but that's hardly the argument. My argument is about you showing your obvious bias towards Greiss, yet refusing to admit it. Let me sum up your ridiculous statements. Here's your full quotes, completely in context.

You said:
Quote:
Based on what I believe the ceilings are for both individuals and who would be better if given the same opportunities. I see more potential in Greiss than I do in Crawford.
I called you saying that's your personal bias since there's no way you can prove that statement and you responded with:
Quote:
Look, I know it's not the most logical argument based on statistics but goalies at their age isn't really about that. If anything, there hasn't been enough of Greiss to see his ceilings considering his sporadic usage by his coaches that are doing him a disservice since he's earned more than he's gotten with them.
So in your opinion, Greiss' ceiling > Crawford's ceiling, but there hasn't been enough of Greiss to judge his ceiling.
Great logic.

Heck, you even said it's not the most logical argument. So if you can't base it on logic, and you can't base it on statistics, how is that opinion not completely biased?


Last edited by WTFetus: 01-05-2013 at 09:59 PM.
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Old
01-05-2013, 10:03 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by WTFetus View Post


Keep avoiding the question as usual. I don't even know why I'm bothering with replying, but I'll play your game. What premise? Call me out for saying you haven't seen enough of Crawford, but that's hardly the argument. My argument is about you showing your obvious bias towards Greiss, yet refusing to admit it. Let me sum up your ridiculous statements. Here's your full quotes, completely in context.

You said:
I called you saying that's your personal bias since there's no way you can prove that statement and you responded with:
So in your opinion, Greiss' ceiling > Crawford's ceiling, but there hasn't been enough of Greiss to judge his ceiling.
Great logic.

Heck, you even said it's not the most logical argument. So if you can't base it on logic, and you can't base it on statistics, how is that opinion not completely biased?
Keep taking things out of context and you wonder why I refuse to answer your questions. You can't even keep straight was said because you're too busy bolding certain things and leaving out others that are sort of part of what is being said there. So either you're not capable of understanding what is said or you are purposely leaving it out. Either way, you're simply not worth answering when you ask silly questions.

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Old
01-05-2013, 10:05 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Keep taking things out of context and you wonder why I refuse to answer your questions. You can't even keep straight was said because you're too busy bolding certain things and leaving out others that are sort of part of what is being said there. So either you're not capable of understanding what is said or you are purposely leaving it out. Either way, you're simply not worth answering when you ask silly questions.
What are you even talking about? I quoted your entire post.
Great reply though. I've seen you use that excuse a number of times when you've dug yourself in too deep of a hole.

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Old
01-06-2013, 09:29 AM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WTFetus View Post
What are you even talking about? I quoted your entire post.
Great reply though. I've seen you use that excuse a number of times when you've dug yourself in too deep of a hole.
You quote the whole post and bold a particular part then ignore everything else in said quote. Your entire premise has been some assumed certainty when I never said as such. The reason why you keep believing so is because of that tactic you've been using to take things out of context. Like I said, you either have a comprehension issue or are purposely attempting to be misleading. Either way, it's not worth going further with that discussion. I said what I thought and nothing more and not with any level of certainty. You don't want to take it for what it is? That's your problem but stop trying to make it out like I am saying it like it's a fact.

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Old
01-06-2013, 04:20 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
You quote the whole post and bold a particular part then ignore everything else in said quote. Your entire premise has been some assumed certainty when I never said as such. The reason why you keep believing so is because of that tactic you've been using to take things out of context. Like I said, you either have a comprehension issue or are purposely attempting to be misleading. Either way, it's not worth going further with that discussion. I said what I thought and nothing more and not with any level of certainty. You don't want to take it for what it is? That's your problem but stop trying to make it out like I am saying it like it's a fact.
You're guilty of doing that exact same thing. Ignore the whole certainty point, that wasn't even close to my main point of the argument. If you think it is, then you have the comprehension problem. Or you're purposely ignoring it since your two posts contradict each other. I wouldn't be surprised if it's the latter, you do have a habit of doing that.

Let me dumb it down for you so you understand your ridiculous argument:

You said you think Greiss has higher potential (ie a higher ceiling).
You then said there hasn't been enough of Greiss to see his ceiling.

So which is it? There's no certainty issue there. There's nothing out of context there. Why do you think Greiss has more potential if you don't even know his potential yet?

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Old
01-06-2013, 07:19 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WTFetus View Post
You're guilty of doing that exact same thing. Ignore the whole certainty point, that wasn't even close to my main point of the argument. If you think it is, then you have the comprehension problem. Or you're purposely ignoring it since your two posts contradict each other. I wouldn't be surprised if it's the latter, you do have a habit of doing that.

Let me dumb it down for you so you understand your ridiculous argument:

You said you think Greiss has higher potential (ie a higher ceiling).
You then said there hasn't been enough of Greiss to see his ceiling.

So which is it? There's no certainty issue there. There's nothing out of context there. Why do you think Greiss has more potential if you don't even know his potential yet?
What a surprise, you took a comment out of context again. I didn't say there hasn't been enough of Greiss. I said 'if anything' to precede that comment. That 'if' is kind of key there, bro. Keep up your nonsense. You don't even know when you're taking things out of context. That's how silly you've made this.

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Old
01-06-2013, 07:24 PM
  #40
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I don't think Greiss is truly an improvement over Emery or Crawford and Sateri might be another Hawks goaltending bust.

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01-06-2013, 07:43 PM
  #41
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Greiss for Frolik? Sign me up.

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Old
01-07-2013, 12:10 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
What a surprise, you took a comment out of context again. I didn't say there hasn't been enough of Greiss. I said 'if anything' to precede that comment. That 'if' is kind of key there, bro. Keep up your nonsense. You don't even know when you're taking things out of context. That's how silly you've made this.
You realize that "if anything" doesn't change your argument. Adding "if anything" does nothing and I can't believe you're using this as the base of your rebuttal.
If anything, it makes your argument look even more ridiculous. Now you're saying "I have nothing to support my argument, I just think Greiss is better than Crawford because I like Greiss more".

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Old
01-07-2013, 05:24 AM
  #43
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just would want to know if you guys don't like Greiss or like Frolik that much

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01-07-2013, 06:04 AM
  #44
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Greiss isn't bad, but he'll never get the chance to shine on the Sharks. They have a ton of goalies in the pipeline with talent so he's stuck with the short straw unfortunately. He has the right tools to be successful if given the chance though. If he does get traded to Chicago, he'll do a good job pushing Crawford to do better because Greiss has done fairly well during his limited starts. I'm not convinced he's better than Crawford, but I do think he could be a capable starter if Crawford never gets his act together, and he certainly has the work ethic and skills to improve.

It's not that I like Frolik, but I do like the idea of trading from an area of strength (goalies in the system) for a need (3rd liner depth). Not sure how we could fit him in with future cap issues, but otherwise I wouldn't mind doing the trade.

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01-07-2013, 08:32 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by WTFetus View Post
You realize that "if anything" doesn't change your argument. Adding "if anything" does nothing and I can't believe you're using this as the base of your rebuttal.
If anything, it makes your argument look even more ridiculous. Now you're saying "I have nothing to support my argument, I just think Greiss is better than Crawford because I like Greiss more".
You really just don't get it, do you? The bottom line here is that you simply could not handle that I was giving a simple opinion. You twisted a simple opinion with your own assumptions into something that you believe was said with a high level of certainty when that simply wasn't the case.

All I said was that if Greiss was given the opportunity to compete for the starting job with Crawford, that I believe he will win it. That's not a statement that needs to be supported by statistics. It's one person's opinion. Why is that so difficult for you to understand?

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01-07-2013, 01:46 PM
  #46
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just would want to know if you guys don't like Greiss or like Frolik that much
Neither, really. The Sharks have a surplus of goalies and need more speed in their top-9. The trade meets a need.

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01-07-2013, 01:54 PM
  #47
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Greiss for Frolik? Sign me up.
Send the paperwork..............please.

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01-07-2013, 04:36 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
You really just don't get it, do you? The bottom line here is that you simply could not handle that I was giving a simple opinion. You twisted a simple opinion with your own assumptions into something that you believe was said with a high level of certainty when that simply wasn't the case.

All I said was that if Greiss was given the opportunity to compete for the starting job with Crawford, that I believe he will win it. That's not a statement that needs to be supported by statistics. It's one person's opinion. Why is that so difficult for you to understand?
Let me summarize this argument if I can:
PF thinks Greiss has a potentially higher ceiling than Crawford.
Fetus asks why despite evidence pointing otherwise, and asks if this is just personal bias.
PF sees this as a personal attack and focuses on that instead of answering directly. Cue back and forth arguing useless semantics taken out of context from both sides, one where PF tries and argues that it is just his opinion but doesn't outright say it, and one where Fetus continually asks if PF has any supporting data or if it is purely based on bias, still hung up on the first point prior to all the antagonism.

I think it boils down to Fetus asking for evidence of PF's opinion, which he asked mainly preemptively because the topic would surely come up from Chicago fans. Instead of PF just saying "yes, it is just my personal bias because I'm a sharks fan" (which is not wrong to say), we instead get over a page of passive aggressive posts until now when PF comes out and directly says it's his opinion and is not based on any evidence. That would have saved a lot of time if it was said on page 1. Everyone has a right to their own opinion, but don't take it personal when someone asks for a reason for it.

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01-07-2013, 04:36 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
All I said was that if Greiss was given the opportunity to compete for the starting job with Crawford, that I believe he will win it. That's not a statement that needs to be supported by statistics. It's one person's opinion. Why is that so difficult for you to understand?
Because when I asked you if there was any way to support your opinion, you tried to play it off as if there was some supernatural method showing that Greiss was better than Crawford, when in reality, it's just because you like Greiss more. I called you out on your biased opinion, but you were too stubborn to admit it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryU View Post
Send the paperwork..............please.
Seems like this trade works for both teams (moreso for the Sharks), but sadly isn't too plausible without sending salary the other way. From what I can tell, the Sharks aren't in much of a position to be adding 2.5 million in salary (Frolik +100k from Stalock). Though it might work if they traded Boyle in the off-season, not too sure. I'm too lazy to do the math.

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01-07-2013, 04:39 PM
  #50
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then Greiss for Frolik makes a lot of sense

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