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Cherry: CHL should stop letting Americans and Europeans to play in CHL (merged)

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Old
01-06-2013, 09:26 PM
  #576
InfinityIggy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VilleLeino View Post
"I still say the Canadian Hockey League should be for Canadians, either that or change the name.Some Canadian guy spends thousands on sticks, travel, equipment, pays his taxes and his kid is cut from the CHL for some kid who's father never contributed a cent to Canada."

So my tax dollars dont go to protect Canada? Missle Defense isnt free so Mr Cherry dont be silly because Americans do give Canada tax dollars in a roundabout way.
I don't agree with Cherry, but is this a serious argument? If so,

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01-06-2013, 09:28 PM
  #577
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Sort of like Alex Galchenyuk with his multiple citizenships with his dad being Russian. Born in America could have played elsewhere, chose Canada.
Yes, elite international talents choose the CHL, still trying to figure out some Canadians' problem with this.

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01-06-2013, 09:33 PM
  #578
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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
You said help develop other nation's prospects. You didn't say North American prospects. Few North Americans grow to Europe because there isn't really an incentive to do it, but there's no restriction on it. The Russians, Czechs and Swedes all have foreign players in their junior league system. Adding two more Canadian players per team is going to have a completely negligible effect on the quality of Canadian hockey players. It wouldn't even hurt Europeans all that much and might actually be more beneficial to them. The only purpose it would serve is some sort of quasi moral victory.
That was my point, you got it, there is no incentive for a North American player to play oversees, it's not going to enhance their chances in making the NHL, I am only making the point that I understand where Cherry is coming from. If the Canadian Junior hockey league is the World Junior hockey league, then all this would be moot. But the CJHL has deemed this to be a global league, it wasn't always this way, and I do know this is not the first time Cherry has voiced his objections. Timing perhaps was ungracious. But Cherry is Cherry. Not afraid to speak his mind and I for one do not believe he is at all senile.

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01-06-2013, 09:36 PM
  #579
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Originally Posted by Crumblin Erb Brooks View Post
Yes, elite international talents choose the CHL, still trying to figure out some Canadians' problem with this.
Cherry's is these kids are taking spots from Canadian kids, and not giving anything back to Canadian Hockey.

I'm still debating this in my mind, what is the purpose of CJHL? I am only saying I understand where Cherry is coming from.

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01-06-2013, 09:38 PM
  #580
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As a Plymouth Whalers fan, I object.

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01-06-2013, 09:44 PM
  #581
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
That was my point, you got it, there is no incentive for a North American player to play oversees, it's not going to enhance their chances in making the NHL, I am only making the point that I understand where Cherry is coming from. If the Canadian Junior hockey league is the World Junior hockey league, then all this would be moot. But the CJHL has deemed this to be a global league, it wasn't always this way, and I do know this is not the first time Cherry has voiced his objections. Timing perhaps was ungracious. But Cherry is Cherry. Not afraid to speak his mind and I for one do not believe he is at all senile.
You'd have a point if large numbers of Canadian players were actually getting bounced from league, but with a 2 import limit, it's hardly getting overrun with foreigners.

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01-06-2013, 09:52 PM
  #582
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Cherry's is these kids are taking spots from Canadian kids, and not giving anything back to Canadian Hockey.

I'm still debating this in my mind, what is the purpose of CJHL? I am only saying I understand where Cherry is coming from.
To some level, you can understand his reasoning, but it is undoubtedly shortsighted. To say they give nothing back to Canadian hockey seems faulty as well. They improve the talent level and these teams make money off of these players. Especially considering imports tend to be higher level players. Euros are less likely to take advantage of CHL benefits as well, like the CIS scholarship thing.

The purpose of the CHL is a good place to start.
1. Does the CHL exclusively operate in Canada?
2. How much of the CHL is subsidized by Hockey Canada/Canadian govts?
3. What other junior leagues (other sports as well: Soccer, BBall, etc) have rules like this?

As others have said, just because it may knock the worst Canadian off of the bench, it makes little sense to me to ban elite international talent. If this is the logic Canadians are using, embrace the competition, dont run away from it.

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01-06-2013, 10:40 PM
  #583
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Cherry's is these kids are taking spots from Canadian kids, and not giving anything back to Canadian Hockey.

I'm still debating this in my mind, what is the purpose of CJHL? I am only saying I understand where Cherry is coming from.
Cause better players in a league makes the rest of the league better, so yes, by having good international players helps your players develop too.

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01-06-2013, 11:52 PM
  #584
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I've never been a fan of Cherry, far from it, but this time I kind of agree with him. Not with the reasons but the idea of having pretty independent development in each country. My reason is that one of the things I love about hockey is the different playing styles that each country uses (at least used to?). These playing styles will partly disappear and uniformity will reign if young top players development is more and more centralized in one country. It would be terribly more boring to follow the game if everybody played in same style. We have already seen a lot of that when the trap became popular on the club level and even with many national teams.

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01-06-2013, 11:59 PM
  #585
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UvBnDatsyuked View Post
If you're talking personal, my daughter would kick your daughters ass up and down the court all day long.

If you are talking what is happening now, look on USCHO.com and see how many roster spots are taken by Canadian residents.

It's happening. Quit acting like there will be some upset people the day it does happen when it already is
A. How would you have any idea how good a basketball player my daughter is, especially in comparison to yours?

B. My daughter doesn't play basketball.

C. You can send as many Americans up here as you want, and a bunch of Russians and Swedes, too. We are still going to beat all of you in the majority of best on best tournaments for the next five hundred years anyway, and you know it.

I love how nationalistic you all get about this topic, and yet you criticize Cherry to no end for doing the same. Hypocritical.

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01-07-2013, 02:35 AM
  #586
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Cherry sounds like a wuss. Oh wah I was the last kid cut from the team. It's no fair that Russian kid gets to play instead even though he's better than me. I was born here!

Just be better so you won't be the last one cut. I don't feel any sympathy for the "2 Canadian kids who get their spot taken by some import".

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01-07-2013, 02:50 AM
  #587
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
You'd have a point if large numbers of Canadian players were actually getting bounced from league, but with a 2 import limit, it's hardly getting overrun with foreigners.
Some posters don't seem to realise that in many cases the Canadians are the foreigners.

The only way you can come to the conclusion that a Canadian player is getting bounced is if you argue that the purpose of the American teams in the CHL is to develop Canadian players, which completely beats the original point about players having to develop in their own country.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DethOfDragnz View Post
The flip side is that Canadian training/coaching is the best in the world
Is there any evidence whatsoever to support that claim?

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01-07-2013, 05:49 AM
  #588
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god, please do!

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01-07-2013, 06:11 AM
  #589
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Don Cherry is a ****** anyway. He's extremely Pro-Canada and Anti-Euro and Anti-American and its borderline ridiculous. He's always teetering on the line of outright unacceptable and offensive.

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01-07-2013, 06:19 AM
  #590
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I took particular enjoyment from the fact that all five American goals were scored by the NCAA players. Some goals from the Russian Youth League too.

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01-07-2013, 06:34 AM
  #591
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So do the people who agree with this think all Canadian athletes shouldn't be allowed to go abroad to develop in all other sports? fly4apuckguy?

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01-07-2013, 06:40 AM
  #592
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
You'd have a point if large numbers of Canadian players were actually getting bounced from league, but with a 2 import limit, it's hardly getting overrun with foreigners.
This. There's PLENTY of room for talented Canadians. The only Canadians missing out are the ones who would never sniff the national team anyway.

24 pages. lol.

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01-07-2013, 08:06 AM
  #593
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Originally Posted by Sigh View Post
This. There's PLENTY of room for talented Canadians. The only Canadians missing out are the ones who would never sniff the national team anyway.

24 pages. lol.
what an incomprehensibly dumb argument by cherry. we love the imports in the CHL!

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01-07-2013, 08:50 AM
  #594
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Originally Posted by 732DevilsFan View Post
Don Cherry is a ****** anyway. He's extremely Pro-Canada and Anti-Euro and Anti-American and its borderline ridiculous. He's always teetering on the line of outright unacceptable and offensive.
He most certainly isn't anti-American (except maybe in hockey), he's supported them in war issues publicly. He also doesn't hate every European, he's said several times how he likes certain players, like Ovie, Selšnne and Sundin.

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01-07-2013, 09:00 AM
  #595
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Don Cherry and Russian fans agree that Europeans don't belong in the CHL. Strange allies.

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01-07-2013, 09:06 AM
  #596
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Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
He most certainly isn't anti-American (except maybe in hockey), he's supported them in war issues publicly. He also doesn't hate every European, he's said several times how he likes certain players, like Ovie, Selšnne and Sundin.
Just because he likes one or two Europeans, it doesn't mean he isn't anti-European.

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01-07-2013, 09:29 AM
  #597
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If anyone has been paying attention there is no restiction whatsoever on American players in the CHL.

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01-07-2013, 09:48 AM
  #598
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Originally Posted by black charger View Post
If anyone has been paying attention there is no restiction whatsoever on American players in the CHL.
does that fact come with a point though? there are not that many americans in the league, they're rightfully prioritized on erie and plymouth. certainly it has no impact on canadian development, particularly high level player slots. if integration is negative in any way don't you think hockey canada would be the first to stop it?

a lot of canadians playing against some imports and americans does nothing but improve the league and all of its players, regardless of nationality.

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01-07-2013, 10:07 AM
  #599
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Originally Posted by cloak View Post
does that fact come with a point though? there are not that many americans in the league, they're rightfully prioritized on erie and plymouth. certainly it has no impact on canadian development, particularly high level player slots. if integration is negative in any way don't you think hockey canada would be the first to stop it?

a lot of canadians playing against some imports and americans does nothing but improve the league and all of its players, regardless of nationality.
Point is that the USA and Canada are equal trading partners in more than goods.Canadian athletes are fully welcomed into US college programs,as are Americans into Canadian programs.It is just that most American athletes usually persue the NCAA route for an education as well as sports and Canadian ones would choose the CHL route first and NCAA second.


Last edited by black charger: 01-07-2013 at 10:10 AM. Reason: add info
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01-07-2013, 10:24 AM
  #600
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Cherry's an idiot.

The CHL model isn't about developing players. It's business first and foremost. Player development does come out of it, but it's a secondary consideration. CHL teams certainly develop players - players come out at 19 better than they were at 16 - but the first goal of the teams is to win.

The biggest reason for the two-import restriction is an artificial means of keeping costs down. A free-for-all on imports would drive some of the smaller market teams out of business and, as much as the Prince Alberts and Moose Jaws of the world are annoying, watching teams go defunct is bad for business too.

But the bottom line is this: if Cherry thinks teams should stop bringing in imports because of "development", then he should also argue that the CHL season should be reduced in length, that teams practice more skills and less systems and that winning not be the primary driver of the teams.

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