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Everything Canada (goaltending, coaching, future)

View Poll Results: ....
Yes 83 55.70%
No 41 27.52%
Maybe/Depends on the situation 25 16.78%
Voters: 149. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-05-2013, 05:14 PM
  #551
LiquidSnake
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
Well I won't discount the need to have skilled hockey players on the team...despite them being fairies...like Nuge and Strome and Rattie...but you absolutely must have men on the team and not just ON the team...but LEADING IT!

And I think you are hinting at agreeing with me here in that Canada needed a "grittier" group of men shall we say?
Not a single dman Canada who was playing against was looking over his shoulder going into the corner.

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01-05-2013, 05:22 PM
  #552
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Originally Posted by LiquidSnake View Post
Not a single dman Canada who was playing against was looking over his shoulder going into the corner.
I'm just going to retract this post because I don't really understand what you are trying to say here.


Last edited by Bomber0104: 01-05-2013 at 05:53 PM.
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Old
01-05-2013, 05:37 PM
  #553
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Originally Posted by sabresandcanucks View Post
In terms of team toughness I think we see eye to eye...but as someone very familiar with the US college system I can tell you they are well looked after. This isn't a social/cultural issue, it is a player selection/coaching issue.
Oh man.

Colton Sissons...Frankie Corrado...Derek Pouliot...Adam Lowry....Tom Wilson...


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01-05-2013, 06:00 PM
  #554
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Originally Posted by 17Kurri View Post
You might be right, but maybe not. Next year, guys like MacKinnon, Drouin, and probably McDavid will be leading the way and will be a step up from what we had this year, with the exception of RNH.

And if they want to have a selection process, they need to stick to merit, not reputations. Spott showed his glaring inability to be impartial by not even making any of the returness earn their spots and sticking with 3 OHL goalies. If it was on merit, our top 2 goalies would've been Brossoit and Patterson instead of Subban and Binnington, Corrado instead of Murphy, etc, imho.
When have they ever picked the team on merit? Mackinnon and/Drouin may be in the nhl next year and unavailable. McDavid will be very young still and most likely not that effective. Having a draft year with a dearth of top end Canadian forwards never seen before is going to hurt us.

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Old
01-05-2013, 06:03 PM
  #555
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Originally Posted by CanuckLuck View Post
14 of 30 players selected in the first round were Canadian. not a mathematician but that's just about half....yeah...so much trouble

Why don't you compare instead of nit-pick?

1st Round
1 Swedish
1 Russian forward
3 American forwards
5 Canadian forwards (not sure what you were looking at when you saw 3)

Looking even deeper...after 3 rounds, exactly half the players selected were Canadian.

I guess the question is do you really think Canada is spiraling down in hockey talent? Or do you think you might be over-reacting from a non-medal in the WJC?
Is Tanner Pearson eligible to play next year?

Not one Canadian forward in the top fifteen. Look at the likes of Wilson etc and where is the scoring going to come from?

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01-05-2013, 06:49 PM
  #556
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Is Tanner Pearson eligible to play next year?

Not one Canadian forward in the top fifteen. Look at the likes of Wilson etc and where is the scoring going to come from?
Like I thought..over-reacting.

Do me a favour and do an analysis of all the countries and where they stand for their forward group then tell me Canada doesn't match up will you?

Perhaps Canada is in a lull for top end offensive talent, but this country produces more than enough forwards to not be in trouble.

Canada willl once again be the favorite next year despite being 'in trouble' up front..

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01-05-2013, 07:05 PM
  #557
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Canada has difficulty on large ice surface. When Canada wins on large ice surface the goalie will be the best in the tournament. Since Price, there hasn't been a great goaltending performance by a Canadian goalie.

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01-05-2013, 07:09 PM
  #558
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Originally Posted by canucksfan View Post
Canada has difficulty on large ice surface. When Canada wins on large ice surface the goalie will be the best in the tournament. Since Price, there hasn't been a great goaltending performance by a Canadian goalie.
Yeah.

Even our big boys struggle on the bigger ice surfaces in the Olympics it seems ... gold in Salt Lake City and Vancouver ... not so great in Nagano and other international size ice surface Olympics.

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01-05-2013, 07:26 PM
  #559
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Originally Posted by Soundwave View Post
Yeah.

Even our big boys struggle on the bigger ice surfaces in the Olympics it seems ... gold in Salt Lake City and Vancouver ... not so great in Nagano and other international size ice surface Olympics.
Salt Lake was played on international ice.

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01-05-2013, 07:28 PM
  #560
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Originally Posted by 86Habs View Post
Salt Lake was played on international ice.
Shh the facts always ruin any good excuse

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01-05-2013, 07:30 PM
  #561
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Originally Posted by Atomos2 View Post
Spott said he didn't speak to the Team in a post game interview after the USA game and in hindsight it might have been a mistake. So he admitted his poor coaching strategy in front of the world

In a short tournament like this, its the ending that will be remembered, not the journey. With a star studded line up Spott couldn't coach the team to the gold medal. Some of the onus goes to the players, but after this tournament, most of them will still end up being great players with the talent capable of dominating this tournament. It was the fact that Spott couldn't use each of the players as effectively and to showcase that very same talent.

And finally, would you put Murphy and Rielly on the same pairing. I mean honestly, would you put both your pure offensive defencemen on the same line against the russians. It was a mistake, that costed him in overtime.

I get that you want to take away as much blame for Murphy as possible, and in this time you actually have a case, in which most of the blame falls on Spott. The d pairings in general were overall not that great, and it really showed. But on the final OT goal, Rielly 19% blame, Murphy 19% blame, Subban 8% blame, Spott 54% blame IMO.
That's not what he said. He said he didnt' give a fiery pre-game speech and though that with how the team played he probably should have. But that has nothing to do with prepared, and we still don't know what happened in the locker room during that time regardless of us knowing one detail; the fact he did not give a fiery pre-game speech. I have a feeling Sweden's coach didn't either against Russia.

People have to realize a coach doesn't has much effect on how a team plays, you can't lay the blame on someone when you can't even pinpoint more than one key issue (And they key issues you can name aren't guarentee to even be issues). That's the definition of a scapegoat. Just because we have the best team does not mean they're going to play the best. The effort needs to come from the players and that's who you blame.

A coach is not responsible for what a player does on the ice unleses he tells them to do something. If a player has a turnover, that is not the coaches fault, that is the players fault. It's extremely common practice to put your top two offensive defensemen on the ice in overtime, it's about risk and reward. Besides, you can't guarentee a different outcome, Harrington and Hamilton failed to protect eachother all the time, and Harrington was supposedly the most steady defensemen on this team.

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Originally Posted by Imagine17 View Post
Good on him for showing up when the only thing the could win was a Bronze Medal, would have been nice if he could have done it when it really mattered. Clearly he was inspired:



I agree that Rielly is also to fault on the final play but IMO Murphy was in a good position to start off but made a Poor defensive read. Nichuskin walked around him like he was a peewee player. Murphy can't defend & putting him on a pairing with Rielly is a head shaker of a move if there was one.... however Murphy making the team in the first place was the first indication of head shaking moves to come.

Murphy wouldn't be getting this hate if Spott didn't shove him down our throats the entire tournament when he did absolutely nothing to deserve the ice time he got... nothing till the last game.
Murphy had an outstanding game today, had a great game against Russia and a good game against the US. His first two were below-average. So that's three good games and two you could consider bad, though he didn't cost Canada anything in those games. People were on his back because he didn't score, and today when he gets three points (Should have had four, but for some reason he didn't get one on the first goal when he was the second last to touch the puck) people are on him for not stopping the Russian who made an excellent play.

What makes it even more identifiable that you have to give credit to Nichushkin, as he made a similar play on Jones; one of the best defensemen defensively to come up in the draft in a long time. Does that mean Jones sucks? Murphy is 5'11, Nichushkin is 6'4, possibly even 6'5. When you've got speed and size like that, it's hard to stop him. Rielly should have got over once Nichushkin went around Murphy get he didn't.

Murphy was a virtual lock to make the team regardless of Spott, he was a 19 year old who was one of the top defensemen in the OHL (On both sides of the puck). I don't understand why people think he wasn't, he was one of the last cuts for the past two years, Dave Cameron admitted that Murphy and Murray deserved to be on the team as 17 year olds but he went with older players instead. Hockey Canada indirectly criticized Hay's choice to go with tough, large and traditional defenders instead of more skilled defensemen.

And while he may not have earned that ice time, he didn't deserve to get less. Hamilton and Harrington were the cause of more goals then Murphy and his rotating pairing mate. The offensive defensemen who was going to get more ice time was Rielly, who after the first two good games from him, virtually disappeared against Russia and the US while Murphy had much better games. People were going to hate him regardless of what happened anyway.

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01-05-2013, 07:47 PM
  #562
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Sue me but I thought murphy played really well this game. Its just IDIOTIC to put our two weakest D defensively (and physically) on the same pair. That was just asking for disaster and this is not the hindsight in me talking. Everyone and their mother knew things would eventually go wrong with those two on the ice at the same time on even strength.

4 on 4 is not a powerplay!

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Old
01-05-2013, 07:49 PM
  #563
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Originally Posted by Beleafer4 View Post
Sue me but I thought murphy played really well this game. Its just IDIOTIC to put our two weakest D defensively (and physically) on the same pair. That was just asking for disaster and this is not the hindsight in me talking. Everyone and their mother knew things would eventually go wrong with those two on the ice at the same time on even strength.

4 on 4 is not a powerplay!
These are my thoughts exactly. What a terrible decision to put two guys who need the puck to be succesful together.

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01-05-2013, 07:51 PM
  #564
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Originally Posted by Bomber0104 View Post
I called this is the now locked "Canada using artificial light" thread.

Bunch of spoiled little Canadian brats who need chicken nuggets and Heinz ketchup flown in from Canada to go with their tanning lights.

These kids are being held back by whoever is changing their diapers.

They need real MALE influence.

Men with beards.

Men with balls.

Men without feelings.

This is a cultural problem here in Canada, and I really fear for our future generations going forward.
I will say the Canadian WJC team is coddled in a way that is unique in that part of the hockey world. It's almost like they are conditioned to believe the hype and expect to win by just showing up.

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01-05-2013, 08:34 PM
  #565
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I will say the Canadian WJC team is coddled in a way that is unique in that part of the hockey world. It's almost like they are conditioned to believe the hype and expect to win by just showing up.
I'm pissed. They keep taking these pansy boys from the CHL instead of taking more Boone Jenner types.

The kinds that didn't go to private schools!

The kinds that worked on ****ing farms!

The kinds that know what hard work is!

The kinds that know what sacrifice is!

I'm PISSED!

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01-05-2013, 08:52 PM
  #566
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Originally Posted by Brewsky View Post
Subban, great athlete, weak mentally, when it counts, he ***** the bed.

Murphy, just horrible, HORRIBLE defensively.

Spott, dumb coaching, bring back Quinn.

Drouin, nice coming out party, only guy that was impressive.

RNH, you should be a man amongst boys even though you struggle to grow facial hair.

Hamilton, suppose to be a #1 d-man, dude was invisible.

Missing anything?
Huberdeau could have stepped up and Scheifele was too busy trying to draw penalties.


Last edited by Steve Holt: 01-05-2013 at 09:36 PM. Reason: spelling
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01-05-2013, 08:59 PM
  #567
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Brendan Gaunce should definitely make the team next year. He's lighting up the OHL on Belleville's top line.

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01-05-2013, 09:23 PM
  #568
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Speaking as an Avs fan, they should've invited Siemens. IMO one of the best shutdown Ds and didn't even get an invite. One reason why Canada lost.

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01-05-2013, 09:26 PM
  #569
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Speaking as an Avs fan, they should've invited Siemens. IMO one of the best shutdown Ds and didn't even get an invite. One reason why Canada lost.
He has had been injured and didn't get much of a look, but he would have been nice out there.

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01-05-2013, 09:28 PM
  #570
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Originally Posted by Faidh ar Rud Eigin View Post
That's not what he said. He said he didnt' give a fiery pre-game speech and though that with how the team played he probably should have. But that has nothing to do with prepared, and we still don't know what happened in the locker room during that time regardless of us knowing one detail; the fact he did not give a fiery pre-game speech. I have a feeling Sweden's coach didn't either against Russia.

People have to realize a coach doesn't has much effect on how a team plays, you can't lay the blame on someone when you can't even pinpoint more than one key issue (And they key issues you can name aren't guarentee to even be issues). That's the definition of a scapegoat. Just because we have the best team does not mean they're going to play the best. The effort needs to come from the players and that's who you blame.

A coach is not responsible for what a player does on the ice unleses he tells them to do something. If a player has a turnover, that is not the coaches fault, that is the players fault. It's extremely common practice to put your top two offensive defensemen on the ice in overtime, it's about risk and reward. Besides, you can't guarentee a different outcome, Harrington and Hamilton failed to protect eachother all the time, and Harrington was supposedly the most steady defensemen on this team.
Bold: Right, that was his mistake and if he had given a speech, it may have yielded a better outcome. Obviously we have no way of knowing but atleast to him (and also to a lot of Canadian fans) it was in the realm of possibility.

If you are thinking in basic literal terms, then you're right, a coach is not responsible for how a player plays on the ice. But if you factor in the choice of players, the mode of preparation, the assigned lineups and d pairings, then its easy to see that a coach has a lot to do with the success of the team.

One NHL coach (I prefer him to remain nameless, but if you prefer to know the name I will tell it to you along with the link in the response) said as a coaching staff, they have to take responsibility because they didn't prepare the hockey club to go out and compete. Whether he deserves it or not, Hockey Canada and Spott know that he must take a huge share of the responsibility, especially with the talent he had in his possession. You can't possibly believe Hockey Canada will hire him next year.

As for putting the two top offensive dmen on during OT, what about during the game? He had them together for every game in the tourney. Why would you have that same risk and reward mentality all through the tournament? I'll agree that we cannot expect any better resultfrom a Harrington defensive partner. But it would be much less of a gamble logically and at least the pairing wouldn't look like an accident waiting to happen, which inevitably it ended up being. This is an elite competition and Spott should of had someone to defend the net at an elite level at all times. Because Spott never considered that, the defence was left exposed, to the Russians.


Last edited by Atomos2: 01-05-2013 at 09:40 PM.
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Old
01-05-2013, 09:48 PM
  #571
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I think Pat Quinn would be a good coach for the world junior team he did well with 2009 squad and to my knowledge has no prior coaching duties that would interfere with him being able to coach this team. Plus he s coached in the pressure pot that is Toronto.

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01-05-2013, 09:59 PM
  #572
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Canadian players go down south and have American kids who could play hockey.

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01-05-2013, 10:03 PM
  #573
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Will there be naturally occuring ice south of the 54th in 2030?

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01-05-2013, 10:14 PM
  #574
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Oh man...

Just taking this all in after a few beers...

Wow..

I mean WOW....

Embarrassing.

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01-05-2013, 10:16 PM
  #575
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I'm glad to see the taunting afterwards, that should inspire for next year.

Too bad they couldn't reach over and connect with one of their heads, but it should act as decent bulletin board material next time around.

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