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Hall vs. Seguin (Better Player to Build Around)

View Poll Results: Who will have the best career?
Taylor Hall 89 40.09%
Tyler Seguin 133 59.91%
Voters: 222. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
01-07-2013, 05:18 PM
  #51
Sky04
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
This is why there were about 5-6 Oiler fans saying that we expected to miss the playoffs for every 1 Oiler fan saying that we'd make it.

People like you will make up garbage and try and pass it off like the entire fanbase is saying it.
Blowing things out proportion...like what you guys do with Taylor Hall...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MessierII View Post
Check the AHL scoring leaders. What was the point of your post? Oiler fans are one of the most knowledgable fan bases out there.
I forgot the Calder Cup was awarded to the top scorers. Weren't you guys the one who suggested 3 players could win you a team championship? hahah

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Old
01-07-2013, 05:55 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Spoked-B View Post
Being more physical is just as likely to mean that you take yourself out of the play. There's no doubt that Seguin could be more physical, which he showed improvement in last year's playoffs. But even at his current level, he's, at worst "decent" (if not good) defensively, using his speed and hockey IQ (anticipation) to break up plays and generate counter-offense on the back-check.
He is not "good" defensively. Remember, one of, these guys played the PK in JRs and one didn't, and it wasn't Seguin who did. Seguin went from really bad on D to passable. That's ok because his offense is elite.

Also, I don't see the "hockey IQ" you do. The kid excels because he has amazing wheels and a laser shot. He's tools more than anything else. In fact, he has better tools than Hall. Hall has more heart and a better hockey IQ.

While Seguin does do a nice job of using his speed to back check, he's still bad in his own end, still is lazy along the boards and cheats an awful lot (which I don't mind, because flying out of the zone with him is a great strategy).

Again, if you want to pick Seguin here, that's a totally valid pick. No problem. But you are picking him because he's the better offensive player, not for his defense.

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01-07-2013, 06:24 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sky04 View Post
Blowing things out proportion...like what you guys do with Taylor Hall...



I forgot the Calder Cup was awarded to the top scorers. Weren't you guys the one who suggested 3 players could win you a team championship? hahah
Mass generalizations are fun

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Old
01-07-2013, 06:34 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Quincy View Post
He is not "good" defensively. Remember, one of, these guys played the PK in JRs and one didn't, and it wasn't Seguin who did. Seguin went from really bad on D to passable. That's ok because his offense is elite.

Also, I don't see the "hockey IQ" you do. The kid excels because he has amazing wheels and a laser shot. He's tools more than anything else. In fact, he has better tools than Hall. Hall has more heart and a better hockey IQ.

While Seguin does do a nice job of using his speed to back check, he's still bad in his own end, still is lazy along the boards and cheats an awful lot (which I don't mind, because flying out of the zone with him is a great strategy).

Again, if you want to pick Seguin here, that's a totally valid pick. No problem. But you are picking him because he's the better offensive player, not for his defense.
I think you are in the minority who think that Hall has better Hockey IQ than Seguin. In almost every poll on here, it seems that it is Seguin touted for his hockey IQ (and Hall for his drive/physicality/leadership). Seguin is an excellent passer and sees the ice very well. I think his first NHL assist showed a lot of on-ice awareness, but you may think it was more luck. The video Bill Ladd put together shows his playmaking abilities already. I don't think that Julien would have him on what is essentially the Bruins' best "checking line" if the guy wasn't at least decent defensively.


Last edited by Spoked-B: 01-07-2013 at 06:40 PM.
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Old
01-07-2013, 06:47 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sky04 View Post
Blowing things out proportion...like what you guys do with Taylor Hall...
No.

There is a reason Eberle vs Hall has such drastically different results on HFGeneral compared to HFOil.

One group watches every game Hall and Eberle play. The other does not.

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01-07-2013, 06:47 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spoked-B View Post
I think you are in the minority who think that Hall has better Hockey IQ than Seguin. In almost every poll on here, it seems that it is Seguin touted for his hockey IQ (and Hall for his drive/physicality/leadership). Seguin is an excellent passer and sees the ice very well. I think his first NHL assist showed a lot of on-ice awareness, but you may think it was more luck. The video Bill Ladd put together shows his playmaking abilities already. I don't think that Julien would have him on what is essentially the Bruins' best "checking line" if the guy wasn't at least decent defensively.
Julien benched him for a bunch of games for his poor defense too, does that get factored into the equation?

He has improved leaps and bounds defensively. Like I said, he's passable now. He may one day become good defensively, but he still fails to compete and even Brickley and Beers have pointed it out.

He's an amazing offensive player who has an incredibly bright future. I picked him as the better option here (mostly because of Hall's injuries). I'm sorry if I see him as an elite offensive player but not a very good defensive player. I'm fine with that as there are all time great HOFers with that breakdown. But I'm not going to be convinced that he's any better than average right now defensively, and I think that is stretching it.

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01-07-2013, 06:53 PM
  #57
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Hall by virtue of not having a tattoo of his own name.

And being a better hockey player.

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Old
01-07-2013, 06:57 PM
  #58
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Seguin.

Smarter and more complete player.

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Old
01-07-2013, 07:58 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Quincy View Post
He is not "good" defensively. Remember, one of, these guys played the PK in JRs and one didn't, and it wasn't Seguin who did. Seguin went from really bad on D to passable. That's ok because his offense is elite.
Seguin played on the PK for Biel for what that's worth. Not sure how much but he played some.

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Old
01-07-2013, 11:36 PM
  #60
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I really, really, really like Hall. The kid is just so explosive and fun to watch. But you really have to take the safe pick here and go with Seguin.

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Old
01-07-2013, 11:37 PM
  #61
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they will never admit it, but i think most edmonton fans secretly wish seguin was picked 1st overall

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01-07-2013, 11:43 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by VeteranNetPresence View Post
they will never admit it, but i think most edmonton fans secretly wish seguin was picked 1st overall
I can safely say no we really, REALLY don't.
As i said earlier in the thread, Seguin might turn out to be the slightly better player but Hall is a perfect fit for Edmonton and will be their next captain.

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Old
01-08-2013, 01:07 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by VeteranNetPresence View Post
they will never admit it, but i think most edmonton fans secretly wish seguin was picked 1st overall
I know you'll never admit it, but I think you know absolutely nothing of what Edmonton wishes.

Although Vancouver fans will never admit it, I think they secretly know the Sedin's are twin sisters

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Old
01-08-2013, 07:54 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by NordicBruin91 View Post
Habs fan choosing Segs, poll over
He is the better player at the moment. I don't care which teams players play for, I'm not going to vote against a Bruins player just because I don't like them. I find it sad that people actually do that

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01-08-2013, 08:26 AM
  #65
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What makes Seguin better when they're both healthy?

Sure, he has a slightly better higher IQ, slightly better better vision, a slightly better better passer and has a slightly better shot....but they still put up points at the same rate and Hall is the significantly better goal scorer. Seguin has the better overall game? Why? Because he's a little better defensively? What about hitting? Or willingness to get hit? And I know you can't measure heart and determination but no one should argue against Hall having more. Would Seguin drop to his knees while in the crease and try and block an empty net goal while already down by 2 goals in a meaningless game right after returning from having someone step on his face? We all know Seguin doesn't win battles in the corners like Hall does and isn't even close to as good of a puck retriever. Grit isn't included in overall game?

IMO Seguin is the better player on paper but that just isn't the case in reality. It's definitely splitting hairs between the two but I think Hall is the better player.

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01-08-2013, 08:32 AM
  #66
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Right now it's Seguin

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01-08-2013, 08:41 AM
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CupofOil View Post
I can safely say no we really, REALLY don't.
As i said earlier in the thread, Seguin might turn out to be the slightly better player but Hall is a perfect fit for Edmonton and will be their next captain.
That's something that Oilers fans see in Hall but others might not fully understand. Sure, there are guys out there will score more goals than Hall and put up more points but they won't have the same impact on a team, organization or city. When Hall is out of the line up the Oilers look like a completely different team. I don't know what kind of voice he has in the locker room at 20 years old but he carries the team on the ice already.

To me, picking Seguin over Hall is like picking Henrik Sedin over Claude Giroux. He might be the captain of his team, have a better career high, have a better +/-...but you still would rather go to war with Giroux. I know Seguin already has a cup ring but Hall is the guy I'd want on my playoff run.


Last edited by Wheatking: 01-08-2013 at 08:47 AM.
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Old
01-08-2013, 09:07 AM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheatking View Post
What makes Seguin better when they're both healthy?

Sure, he has a slightly better higher IQ, slightly better better vision, a slightly better better passer and has a slightly better shot....but they still put up points at the same rate and Hall is the significantly better goal scorer. Seguin has the better overall game? Why? Because he's a little better defensively? What about hitting? Or willingness to get hit? And I know you can't measure heart and determination but no one should argue against Hall having more. Would Seguin drop to his knees while in the crease and try and block an empty net goal while already down by 2 goals in a meaningless game right after returning from having someone step on his face? We all know Seguin doesn't win battles in the corners like Hall does and isn't even close to as good of a puck retriever. Grit isn't included in overall game?

IMO Seguin is the better player on paper but that just isn't the case in reality. It's definitely splitting hairs between the two but I think Hall is the better player.
Hall is a significantly better goal scorer? What? Pure talent alone Id wager there are only a handful of players in the entire league that are "significantly" better goal scorers than Tyler Seguin. Hall certainly isnt, despite his higher pace last year with a smaller sample size. It can be argued that hes better, hes very talented, but "significantly" is a little misguided IMO.

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01-08-2013, 09:08 AM
  #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilers1084 View Post
I know you'll never admit it, but I think you know absolutely nothing of what Edmonton wishes.

Although Vancouver fans will never admit it, I think they secretly know the Sedin's are twin sisters
just be happy if any of your young guns have half of the career as either of the "sisters"

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Old
01-08-2013, 09:25 AM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Tim Vezina Thomas View Post
Hall is a significantly better goal scorer? What? Pure talent alone Id wager there are only a handful of players in the entire league that are "significantly" better goal scorers than Tyler Seguin. Hall certainly isnt, despite his higher pace last year with a smaller sample size. It can be argued that hes better, hes very talented, but "significantly" is a little misguided IMO.
Hall had 2 less goals in 20 less games. He scored at a 36 goal pace. You and I both know there is a lot more than just 7 goals separating a 29 goal scorer from a "36 goal scorer".

Hall also had 24 goals in his final 43 games last season(Seguin had 29 goals in 81 games last season). That went all the way back to mid November. That's a 46 goal pace. Considering he was on a 4 game goal scoring streak when he got hurt, it's probably safe to say he wasn't slowing down any time soon. Had his season not been cut short, his GPG would have been a lot higher.

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Old
01-08-2013, 09:51 AM
  #71
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Taylor Hall.

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Old
01-08-2013, 10:00 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeteranNetPresence View Post
they will never admit it, but i think most edmonton fans secretly wish seguin was picked 1st overall
There is nothing to admit to. I am glad we chose Hall, he's our future captain.

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Old
01-08-2013, 10:22 AM
  #73
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Hall has more passion, i mean he plays every shifts like its his last and he is his biggest critic when he makes mistakes...he wants to be the best player out on the ice just not every game but every shift, he wants to be the difference maker and he wants to lead by example....He is the future Captin of this team IMO but it will either be Ebs or Hallsy both are great choices, Taylor can take over a game and is the best players on the Oilers on most nights even if the team is ****ing the bed Hallsy is getting chances and creating something. People say injuries hes going no where, well he wont be injury prone mark my words he had a lingering Shoulder injury and finally took care of it and it is back to 100%, and he got in a fight protecting himself and got a fluky injury in the process...and the reason he fought is because of how much passion he ouzzis i mean in the OHL with the Spits he got in 3 or 4 fights because he dosent want his teammates to be his bodygaurd he wants players to know that he isnt a push over and if need be he will drop em, There both going to be stars and who knows what the futures holds for both Tyler and Taylor but there both Dynamic players that bring fans to the edge of their seats everygame and having either one of these players will help your clubs...

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Old
01-08-2013, 11:43 AM
  #74
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If your gonna build around a player it might as well be a center so I chose Seguin. They are both fantastic players and I would want either on my team in a second.

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Old
01-08-2013, 11:45 AM
  #75
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Oilers fan choosing Seguin but its close. Hall could be the best of the RNH/Ebs/Hall trio.

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