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02-04-2013, 02:17 PM
  #551
Boom Boom Anton
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Originally Posted by Joe McGrath View Post
The larger issue is identifying the problem. Is it that they players aren't properly developed, or were they never that good to begin with, or a combination of the two.
I was going to say the same thing. Getting a useful NHL player after round 2 is pretty slim, so let's look at the Canes top 2 picks for the last 10 years.

2002: 1-Cam Ward, 2-no pick
2003: 1-Eric Staal, 2-Danny Richmond
2004: 1-Andrew Ladd, 2-Justin Peters
2005: 1-Jack Johnson, 2-Nate Hagemo
2006: 1-no pick, 2-Jamie McBain
2007: 1-Brandon Sutter, 2-no pick
2008: 1-Zach Boychuk, 2-Zac Dalpe
2009: 1-Philipe Paradis (Jiri Tlusty), 2-Brian Dumoulin
2010: 1-Jeff Skinner, 2-Justin Faulk, 2-Mark Alt
2011: 1-Ryan Murphy, 2-Victor Rask

Here's my view: guys they didn't have to do much to develop: Ward, Staal, Skinner, Faulk (although I'd argue they've done a good job with how they've handled Skinner and Faulk. Ward and Staal benefited from playing in the AHL during the last lockout).

Guys they traded before getting a chance to develop: Johnson, Paradis, Dumoulin, Alt

Guys they play some part in developing successfully: Sutter, McBain, Tlusty

Guys that I think they gave up on too soon: Ladd

Guys just not plain good enough: Richmond, Hagemo, Peters, Paradis

Jury is still out: Boychuk, Dalpe, Murphy, Rask

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02-04-2013, 02:24 PM
  #552
geehaad
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Replace the name "Dalpe" with "Bowman" and think about why Bowman is sticking and Dalpe isn't. There's nothing wrong with giving Dalpe more time in the AHL.

Jesus...first the complaint is that JR mismanages players because he rushes them, then when he doesn't rush them, he's mismanaging them because he won't give them more time with the big club, then it's Maurice's fault because he gives the kid 5 minutes on the 4th line...oh, but it's Muller now, and we don't hate Muller yet, so it can't be his fault.

Whiners find a way to whine. Or something like that...can't remember the exact phrase.

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Old
02-04-2013, 02:27 PM
  #553
Joe McGrath
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Originally Posted by geehaad View Post
Replace the name "Dalpe" with "Bowman" and think about why Bowman is sticking and Dalpe isn't. There's nothing wrong with giving Dalpe more time in the AHL.

Jesus...first the complaint is that JR mismanages players because he rushes them, then when he doesn't rush them, he's mismanaging them because he won't give them more time with the big club, then it's Maurice's fault because he gives the kid 5 minutes on the 4th line...oh, but it's Muller now, and we don't hate Muller yet, so it can't be his fault.

Whiners find a way to whine. Or something like that...can't remember the exact phrase.
Bowman is still up because he's one of the 3 guys on the team that might hit somebody (probably in the back). Seriously though, it's because he would have to clear waivers and Dalpe doesn't.

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02-04-2013, 02:34 PM
  #554
Anton Skinner
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Originally Posted by Joe McGrath View Post
Bowman is still up because he's one of the 3 guys on the team that might hit somebody (probably in the back). Seriously though, it's because he would have to clear waivers and Dalpe doesn't.
umm also, there is this thing.....neither have scored a goal yet, but Bowman has gotten DAMN close on a few occasions (M. T. Knett fiasco aside) and has actually shown a hunger for the puck, puck pursuit, decent physicality, ability to stay on his feet, and the ability to not, i dunno, just disappear into nowhere during a game.

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Old
02-04-2013, 02:40 PM
  #555
Joe McGrath
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Originally Posted by Joe McGrath View Post
Bowman is still up because he's one of the 3 guys on the team that might hit somebody (probably in the back). Seriously though, it's because he would have to clear waivers and Dalpe doesn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anton Skinner View Post
umm also, there is this thing.....neither have scored a goal yet, but Bowman has gotten DAMN close on a few occasions (M. T. Knett fiasco aside) and has actually shown a hunger for the puck, puck pursuit, decent physicality, ability to stay on his feet, and the ability to not, i dunno, just disappear into nowhere during a game.
Bowman's a more complete hockey player at this stage than Dalpe. He just needs to finish. He also kills penalties which Dalpe is never going to do at this level.

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Old
02-04-2013, 02:47 PM
  #556
Boom Boom Anton
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http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...medium=twitter

He looks to have some of the R/L positions mixed up, but Let the fun begin

Hurricanes lineup

Tlusty - E. Staal - Semin
Skinner - J. Staal - Dwyer
Larose - Jokinen - Bowman
Wallace - Brent - Westgarth

McBain - Pitkanen
Gleason - Faulk
Sanguinetti - Harrison

Ward

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Old
02-04-2013, 02:51 PM
  #557
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Originally Posted by Boom Boom Anton View Post
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sport...medium=twitter

He looks to have some of the R/L positions mixed up, but Let the fun begin

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Old
02-04-2013, 02:55 PM
  #558
wallym
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Is it wrong to think Joe Corvo is far better than Sanguinetti?

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Old
02-04-2013, 02:57 PM
  #559
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Originally Posted by wallym View Post
Is it wrong to think Joe Corvo is far better than Sanguinetti?
Is it wrong to think that -insert terrible defenseman here- is better than both Corvo and Sanguinetti?

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02-04-2013, 03:01 PM
  #560
Novacane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wallym View Post
Is it wrong to think Joe Corvo is far better than Sanguinetti?
I tend to agree that Corvo is better than Sangs. Though as long as there's only one in the lineup at a time it's not as terrible as it could be.

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Old
02-04-2013, 03:03 PM
  #561
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Originally Posted by Novacane View Post
I tend to agree that Corvo is better than Sangs. Though as long as there's only one in the lineup at a time it's not as terrible as it could be.
Any time either one is on the ice I usually hold my breath and hope for nothing terrible to come from that shift. Luckily I haven't passed out yet.

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02-04-2013, 03:05 PM
  #562
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The only thing I get pissed off about is when Corvo is out on the ice for a PK. Seriously, it can't get worse than Corvo on the PK. Luckily, IIRC they haven't even tried Sangs yet so we've got that in our favor.


Edit: I must be misremembering things because Corvo has half the PK TOI/g than Sangs: 12 secs to 24 secs...

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Old
02-04-2013, 03:05 PM
  #563
Oenatzu
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That fourth line has potential to be a tough line to play against. But will Muller give them more than three minutes tonight?
And Dwyer on the second line really makes me wish we had another NHL level center.

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02-04-2013, 03:07 PM
  #564
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Originally Posted by Novacane View Post
The only thing I get pissed off about is when Corvo is out on the ice for a PK. Seriously, it can't get worse than Corvo on the PK. Luckily, IIRC they haven't even tried Sangs yet so we've got that in our favor.
I think I remember seeing a Corvo-Sanguinetti PK pairing once.

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02-04-2013, 03:08 PM
  #565
Obi Wan LaRosie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wallym View Post
Is it wrong to think Joe Corvo is far better than Sanguinetti?
Not at all. Sangs should NOT be in the lineup....EVER. Make a trade for anyone, literally, anyone. Can you imagine how much better we would feel about our D corps if Allen was still back there instead? And thats just Allen....not like Lidstrom.

The fact that they were starting Corvo and Sangs the first couple games and sitting McBain really makes me question some of the brain power in the front office/behind the bench.

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Old
02-04-2013, 03:12 PM
  #566
Anton Skinner
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i dont get it. sangs made some pretty bad decisions in his first game or 2, but since then all i have seen is decently solid play. hell, i personally think he has been better than gleason overall the last few games he has played. im not saying he has been perfect, or great, or awesome or whatever. just....serviceable and not horrible.

i think people on here tend to see one thing once or twice and expect its a trend and hang onto it, even when thats not the reality.

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02-04-2013, 03:48 PM
  #567
What the Faulk
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IIRC Nate Hagemo was looking like a pretty decent pick before injuries forced him to retire.

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02-04-2013, 04:02 PM
  #568
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Originally Posted by What the Faulk View Post
IIRC Nate Hagemo was looking like a pretty decent pick before injuries forced him to retire.
I remember that, didn't he then get hooked on pain killers too?

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02-04-2013, 04:05 PM
  #569
Boom Boom Anton
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He did have a number of drug and alcohol issues.

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02-04-2013, 04:08 PM
  #570
Novacane
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When you google his name, is that him? If so, damn. He looks like he had some issues.

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02-04-2013, 04:16 PM
  #571
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When you google his name, is that him? If so, damn. He looks like he had some issues.
He looks on board with "Do Meth for Seth".

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02-04-2013, 04:21 PM
  #572
geehaad
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Originally Posted by Anton Skinner View Post
i dont get it. sangs made some pretty bad decisions in his first game or 2, but since then all i have seen is decently solid play. hell, i personally think he has been better than gleason overall the last few games he has played. im not saying he has been perfect, or great, or awesome or whatever. just....serviceable and not horrible.

i think people on here tend to see one thing once or twice and expect its a trend and hang onto it, even when thats not the reality.
I agree with all of this...but I won't compare him to Gleason. Oh, and don't forget the fact that there are about 2 or 3 people on this board who know how to fairly evaluate a defenseman. And I'm not one of them.

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02-04-2013, 04:23 PM
  #573
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The only terrible play Sanguinetti's made since the first two games was either the second or third (I think second) goal in Philly where he made a terrible pinch that left Harrison alone for the umpteen on one. Other than that he hasn't been bad.

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02-04-2013, 05:22 PM
  #574
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The only terrible play Sanguinetti's made since the first two games was either the second or third (I think second) goal in Philly where he made a terrible pinch that left Harrison alone for the umpteen on one. Other than that he hasn't been bad.
Pretty sure he would have been fine on that play too except Dalpe pokechecked the puck right passed him, at least I think it was Dalpe's stick. I guess you could blame either one for poor communication.

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02-04-2013, 05:23 PM
  #575
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What's the other team if you don't mind me asking?
Atlanta Braves

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