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Is MPS an option on the 2nd line??

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Old
01-17-2013, 10:52 PM
  #1
BadMedicine*
 
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Is MPS an option on the 2nd line??

I think that MPS brings more to the table on the 2nd line than Hemsky does and should be considered as an option.I will outline why by comparing their skillsets.

Ales Hemsky
- elite speed
-very good possesion game
-elite o-zone entry via possesion
-very conservative decision making on both shot and pass
-very good passing ability
-excellent shot
-is one dimensional in his prime strength of possesion o-zone entry
-Must sacrifice many shooting lanes to stay outside and drive very deep into the zone to be effective in is entry tactic
-Is consistantly predictable to opposition d-men
-forces his linemates into specific areas and roles
-does not present a scoring threat on the rush or on the wraparound consistantly holds puck for pass
-Has size limitations nulified by elite speed but can be shut down with physicality.

MPS
-Very good speed
-very good possesion game
-developing two way threat entring o-zone using speed and size and has ability to retain possesion on half-wall and catalyse plays using size
-very conservative decison making on shot but very creative with passing
-above average passing ability
-excellent wrist shot but average allround
-is two dimensional in his ability to force the o-zone entry using size and speed and can bust in on speed alone allowing him to establish a half-walloffense at the NHL level
-stays true to shooting lanes on rushes ,is conservative with shots
-is able to project both a speed and physicality threat to d-men and because of his two way game and his newfound half-wall game he presents difficult reads to d-men
-opens up the ice with his size and style and allows teammates space to be creative
-does present a scoring threat on the rush by using his size to stay in proper lanes but is petrified to shoot
-has excellent size and above average speed and presents d-men with a two dimensional attack that is very hard to nullify completely


I am no pro so there are lots of things I have missed,but from these things i believe it looks to me like MPS might be a better fit to play with two potential shooters and present a line with a two dimensional shooting threat as opposed to hemsky and a line with a one dimensional shooting threat.Mps can anchor both Yak and Sam as shooters from the half-wall and defensivly cover for them,Hemmer sacrifices all his defense on one all-in move every time so he forces his line to be one dimensional and to depend on one shooter recieving his perfect pass from behind the net.

I believe MPS has evolved into something of a leader the last two years in OKC and has earned a shot at that 2nd line spot.I believe Hemmeris one dimensional and will be most effective with Smyth and Horcs on the 3rd line working with Whitney on the old Oilers fast break game.Our top two lines are both potentiall identical in design,wait till we see Hall working the half-boards this year with his passing.We need that same consistant two dimensional offensive threat from our first two lines to be sucessfull.And MPS fits into that top six.

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01-17-2013, 10:54 PM
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WeridAl
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I think you have the speed switched around, MPS has the elite speed. Also Hemsky is more likely to pass then shoot, been one of the biggest complaints about him.

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01-17-2013, 10:56 PM
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeridAl View Post
I think you have the speed switched around, MPS has the elite speed.

They both have elite speed. Hemsky has a much better offensive game though. And it isn't even really close. Substantially better goal scorer, passer, and a better defensive player.

I like MPS, I hope he works out here. But he isn't close to replacing Hemsky.

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01-17-2013, 10:58 PM
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I actually think Hemsky may leads this team again in scoring or at least be in the top three. Some may laugh.

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01-17-2013, 10:59 PM
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MPS will be an elite 3-LW player and a complementary 2-LW player in case of injuries.

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01-17-2013, 11:01 PM
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Nope.

Magnus is a great skater and I still think he's got a future in the league...but...his scoring instincts are simply not up to 2nd line standards.

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01-17-2013, 11:03 PM
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You're really overrating Paajarvi's abilities. He has some good size and speed, and is good defensively, but aside from that, there's not much else that's there. He has very limited hockey IQ, and doesn't have the will and fire to make up for it.

As for replacing Hemsky, not a chance. I don't think Paajarvi will ever get to Hemsky's level offensively. That's just the sad truth.

I like the kid, but he's simply not good enough to be considered a legitimate top 6 threat.

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01-17-2013, 11:13 PM
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If he is its probably somewhere else after the trade deadline. Paajarvi, Gagner, 1st for Stastny, Zanon, 3rd is something I'd consider.

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01-17-2013, 11:26 PM
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In OKC? Sure.

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01-17-2013, 11:27 PM
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plikestechno
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Um, yeah I'll go with the guy that has a proven NHL career and we paid 5 million dollars for this year, thanks.

Paajarvi seems to have all the tools, size and strength but doesn't seem to want to make the full sacrifice to put it together.

He thinks he's already top 6 NHL quality and he isn't but to be fair the Oilers hyped him to be on the same level as Eberle and Hall a couple of years back.

If he couldn't crack the top 6 without all the talent we have now, how will he do it know?

I said a couple of years ago his ceiling is a Mike Grier type of career and now I'm praying for that at this point. 40 points a year on the third line and can check and work the corners against top lines. He just has to put in the work and change his attitude to make it happen.

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01-17-2013, 11:32 PM
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The guy with 4 goals in the AHL is an option on the second line?

MPS has a lot to figure out before becoming a fixture on the forwards corps...let alone the top-six.

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01-17-2013, 11:57 PM
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Nope, not a chance, he's gonna play in the NHL but limited to pk and third liner. He could play in emergencies but he just doesn't have the scoring touch

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01-17-2013, 11:58 PM
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IMHO MPS ceiling at this point is Radek Dvorak/Mike Grier.

Very useful utility player, can do spot duty on the 2nd line, but not someone you want to count on in the top 6.

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01-18-2013, 12:10 AM
  #14
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After who is there now, Smyth and Hartikainen - I'd imagine he'd be next in line for that spot.

I just don't like his production at any level to play in that hole, and we have at least 7 guys who I expect can do more.

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01-18-2013, 12:18 AM
  #15
ChadSC
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Ales Hemsky often doesn't get the respect he deserves. Statistically, over his career he is one of the best players from a point production standpoint. Not elite but top end.

Over his career, he has scored at a rate of 2.76 Points Per 60 Min Played - which is good for 42nd among active NHLers with over 100 career points. This is higher then Parise, Perry, Eric Staal, Brad Richards and a lot of other big names.

Last season was his worst in terms of point production (1.78 points per 60 min) and his shooting percentage was 4% lower than his career average and his first ever below 10%. His shooting rates (shots per game and shots per 60 min) last year were identical to his career numbers.

Assuming he is planted on the second line with Gagner and Yakupov, instead of with Horcoff, I expect an increase in his production this year.

Long story short, you've got to be kidding me to suggest that MPS (1.42 career points per 60) is a better choice over Hemsky.

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01-18-2013, 12:36 AM
  #16
plikestechno
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I'm more excited to see our 2nd line this year than our 1st line. We already know how awesome our top line will be but I think Yak is really going to ramp things up for gagner and hemsky.

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01-18-2013, 12:44 AM
  #17
WeridAl
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People are forgetting that Hemsky has always been a pass first type of player and not a true goal scorer.

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01-18-2013, 12:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perfect_Drug View Post
IMHO MPS ceiling at this point is Radek Dvorak/Mike Grier.

Very useful utility player, can do spot duty on the 2nd line, but not someone you want to count on in the top 6.
Ummmm.... I'm not sure if I see similarities here.

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01-18-2013, 12:55 AM
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Utter disrespect to Hemsky. It would not surprise me to see that 2nd line out-score the 1st line in ES scoring this year. Not because they're necessarily more offensively gifted, but they'll be facing much weaker competition, and historically that 1st line has had trouble scoring at ES, especially on the road.

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01-18-2013, 12:57 AM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
Utter disrespect to Hemsky. It would not surprise me to see that 2nd line out-score the 1st line in ES scoring this year. Not because they're necessarily more offensively gifted, but they'll be facing much weaker competition, and historically that 1st line has had trouble scoring at ES, especially on the road.
The Hemsky disrespect is earned, by his less than stellar play. For someone who harps on Hall's alleged poor hockey sense, its quite ironic that you would be such a huge Hemsky fan.

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01-18-2013, 01:04 AM
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Soliloquy of a Dogge
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Other than last season has Hemsky's play really been "less than stellar"?

Seems people are confusing a couple injury prone seasons for another matter entirely.

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01-18-2013, 01:18 AM
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plikestechno
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If Hemsky had hockey sense he would be a superstar. Hall to me is Hemsky with more motivation, hockey sense be damned. Hall's still young enough to hopefully develop a defensive game one day. They both drive me nuts trying the same moves over and over again and turning over the puck at will but if they both can stay healthy I think we might be able to sneak into 8th.

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01-18-2013, 01:18 AM
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I am kinda breaking it down into dynamic results ,if both of them at the end of the day can execute an o-zone entry and then make a pass and thats all they do then we have a baseline.At this point that seems to be all they both do and i dont see hemsky being so much better than MPS at getting that job done.

I do think that Hemskys lack of shooting is caused by his small size and need for speed and deep zone penetration force him to sacrifice all those shot opportunitys we want him to take but he doesnt because he is avoiding the shooting lanes where the d-men are zeroing from.In order to remain an elite o-zone transition player hemmer cannot adjust much.

I think MPSs lack of shooting comes from the fact that he is more concerned with his defense and the puck going the other way that he is more headmanning the puck than creating with it,something he apparently solved in OKC by developing a half-board game.MPS can easily add more straight up shooting to his game because his size and speed force him to take those shooting lanes hemsky avoids and Magnus doesnt require the deep zone positioning Hemmer needs.Magnus can be ordered to shoot and he can do so without sacrificing the core of his game.

I am not looking for Hemsky to add goals to the 2nd line as Gagner and yakupov are moe than enough firepower,they need another bigger dimension on the ice more as a decoy than a factor,MPS and his huge frame and long reach can force opposition defenses to spread out even if he bails out of big hits and stays shallow and this opens up the ice for our snipers. Hemmer cant do this.


Hemmer has one trick and thats it so defenses can lock out his side and we are easier to handle,MPS brings a better give and go and a better ability to spread out the defense and make their nights long.It is really MPSs defensive awareness we need,Gagner and yakupov can take a full lines share of risks to gain premium shooting advantages because MPS isnt a natural shooter and can constantly support them,adding hemsky to the two snipers already there is overkill and a waste of offense that Hemmer could be contributing to the 3rd line,hemmer has to do the same thing to the defenses on any line he plays on so he just becomes more lethal the slower the defenses he faces ,putting him on the 3rd line should actually up his personal goal totals and seeing as all we need him to do now is shoot its a perfect fit.

If Ralph Krueger decides to go with predominantly a fastbreak system then the collective speed of this line makes sense,but even so Hemmer will be sending Yakupov suicide passes from behind the net and that alone forces Hemmer out of that spot,even in a fastbreak system yakupov needs someone who can get him the puck sooner and from different areas. Hemmer hitting a stationary Hartikainen or Smyth in front of the net makes sense and hatri ripping up the middle is tailormade for Hemmers pass because Harti comes down the middle with bad intentions and his head up naturally,a huge 3rd line offensive punch,and knowing Hartikainen is constantly tearing down the middle forces the tenders to watch him closer opening up hemmers only real secondary offensive move the wraparound.

Hartikainen and
MPS seem to be competing for a spot but and are diametric opposites,Harti is a one dimensional bull down the middle and Magnus is a multi-dimensional two way threat.I dont even think Hemmer breaks into the 2nd line because of the pure offense he can surely bring to the 3rd line and like Harti he is one dimensional,a natural fit for Horcoff in the middle another one dimensional defensive player.

I

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01-18-2013, 01:25 AM
  #24
plikestechno
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You're really doing a disservice to Ales Hemsky. Do you watch Oilers games?

MPS will be an NHLer when he grows some balls and changes his game to being a 3rd line checking winger that's willing to go in the tough areas to contribute offensively. He hasn't got top 6 NHL skill and hasn't realized it yet.

Lander and Pitlick have realized it and are adapting their games. He will have to as well if he doesn't just end up going back to Sweden at some point.


Last edited by plikestechno: 01-18-2013 at 01:30 AM.
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01-18-2013, 01:27 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
Utter disrespect to Hemsky. It would not surprise me to see that 2nd line out-score the 1st line in ES scoring this year. Not because they're necessarily more offensively gifted, but they'll be facing much weaker competition, and historically that 1st line has had trouble scoring at ES, especially on the road.

I agree the 2nd line will equal or better 1st line points production ,but without Hemmer there.This is another issue with me,I think the difference between the number of goals Hemmer can give us this year between the 2nd and 3rd line positions is negligable,we dont need a potential and gifted goal scorer who wants to be a passer like hemmer on the 2nd line,we need goals from all lines to be a championship team,so if we want balanced scoring we put specialists like Hemmer on the third line and green light him all year long and watch hid wreak havoc on bottom defensive pairings with his 1st line speed.We need to wring goals out of Hemsky one way or another,we have more than enough dishers now,we need triggermen even if we need to force them into it like we do with Hemmer---funny thing is that Hemmer will shoot if he has a high percentage opportunity so on the 3rd line his trigger finger should naturally be happier facing lesser d-man pairings where he can get the halfstep it takes to trigger his mental cannon

Sometimes it hard to face the changing times but it seems Hemmer is being pushed down by our recent influx of elite passers more than anything else,if Hemsky wants to give the team the most he can he needs to work the 3rd line and bury his rushes all year long because we have more than enough stickyhands now,we need triggers.

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