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In-season Proposals, Rumors, Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics here) XXXI

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Old
02-04-2013, 09:50 PM
  #701
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Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
We need goalscoring in a bad way. It's frustrating to see us struggle to score, especially on the PP.

We probably need someone with a bit of goalscoring touch going forward. Until then, our best hope is that McGinn/Duchene/Landeskog/Jones/Parenteau/Stastny can at least be steady 20+ goal guys.
We need defense more. When we get O'Reilly/Landeskog back we'll be fine.

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02-04-2013, 09:56 PM
  #702
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We need goalscoring in a bad way. It's frustrating to see us struggle to score, especially on the PP.

We probably need someone with a bit of goalscoring touch going forward. Until then, our best hope is that McGinn/Duchene/Landeskog/Jones/Parenteau/Stastny can at least be steady 20+ goal guys.
Goalscoring would come if we had something resembling actual offense coming from the defense. It's painful when you realize that apart from Erik Johnson, we're relying on Shane O'Brien and Matt Hunwick to catalyze the offense.

Yes, the team needs more finish up front, but when you're relegated to being a slow, dump-and-chase team (not to mention a defense that's absolutely HORRID at holding it in the zone) you're easy to defend against, especially on the power play. Oh, right, this team was supposed to be "difficult to play against," right, Sherman?

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02-04-2013, 09:58 PM
  #703
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Goalscoring would come if we had something resembling actual offense coming from the defense. It's painful when you realize that apart from Erik Johnson, we're relying on Shane O'Brien and Matt Hunwick to catalyze the offense.
Exactly. This is keeping our forwards back, because there's no skill on defense to make the first pass or bring it to offensive zone.

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02-04-2013, 10:59 PM
  #704
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Originally Posted by Av-merican View Post
Goalscoring would come if we had something resembling actual offense coming from the defense. It's painful when you realize that apart from Erik Johnson, we're relying on Shane O'Brien and Matt Hunwick to catalyze the offense.

Yes, the team needs more finish up front, but when you're relegated to being a slow, dump-and-chase team (not to mention a defense that's absolutely HORRID at holding it in the zone) you're easy to defend against, especially on the power play. Oh, right, this team was supposed to be "difficult to play against," right, Sherman?
At least we got a 2nd rounder for Johnny Liles right

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02-04-2013, 11:00 PM
  #705
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At least we got a 2nd rounder for Johnny Liles right
People forget, that was used to get Varlamov

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Old
02-04-2013, 11:14 PM
  #706
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People forget, that was used to get Varlamov
He knows, that's why he used the sarcasm smiley.

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02-04-2013, 11:18 PM
  #707
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At least we got a 2nd rounder for Johnny Liles right
Alright, I'm sick of people saying how much we need JML. Don't get me wrong I liked JML but he was just not that good defensively. He was small and was easily pushed around.

I do think he would be nice to have as he brings something we don't have a which is a PMD. But the reason he was traded was because management saw we had Barrie and Elliott. And I think they thought at minimum 1 of the 2 of them would have progressed enough to be a regular playing the JML role by now. Obviously that hasn't happened.

Do I think we got short changed on JMLs worth when we traded him yeah a little, but at the time in management's eyes it was a decent move (which they turned into a better move, Varlamov), because they expected something to happen, certain players to develop, in the meantime which to this point hasn't happened which leaves us with a big hole. And not much wiggle room to fix it.

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02-04-2013, 11:38 PM
  #708
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Originally Posted by chet1926 View Post
Alright, I'm sick of people saying how much we need JML. Don't get me wrong I liked JML but he was just not that good defensively. He was small and was easily pushed around.

I do think he would be nice to have as he brings something we don't have a which is a PMD. But the reason he was traded was because management saw we had Barrie and Elliott. And I think they thought at minimum 1 of the 2 of them would have progressed enough to be a regular playing the JML role by now. Obviously that hasn't happened.

Do I think we got short changed on JMLs worth when we traded him yeah a little, but at the time in management's eyes it was a decent move (which they turned into a better move, Varlamov), because they expected something to happen, certain players to develop, in the meantime which to this point hasn't happened which leaves us with a big hole. And not much wiggle room to fix it.
I don't have any problem with management's decision to part with Liles, nor do I think we got short-changed in that trade. And I'm still one of JML's biggest fans. My gripe is who they ended up replacing him with. Hejda is only slightly cheaper than Liles and has been abysmal. What's more, the team has done NOTHING to address the puckmoving deficiencies of this blueline. And if management honestly believed a pair of 21-year-old defensive prospects would quickly fill the gap, Sherman and his band of merry men should be fired tomorrow.

In fact, I don't believe management did believe those prospects would be ready. If they did they wouldn't have re-signed O'Brien and signed Zanon. They would've guaranteed a spot for Elliot/Barrie instead. But filling the defense up with a bunch of slow defenders who have the combined puck skill of a drunken Jeff Shantz has been counterproductive. Instead of allowing the kids to start out the season in Lake Erie to further develop their skills, they're now under pressure to develop faster than ever since the Avs have no offensive punch whatsoever from the current defensive corps.

Give Chris Campoli's agent a call. He can't POSSIBLY be any worse than what we've got out there right now and at this point I can't imagine his contract demands are all that exorbitant. Then again the Avs have proven they can set the bar pretty low when it comes to what they deem "exorbitant."

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02-04-2013, 11:38 PM
  #709
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Originally Posted by chet1926 View Post
Alright, I'm sick of people saying how much we need JML. Don't get me wrong I liked JML but he was just not that good defensively. He was small and was easily pushed around.

I do think he would be nice to have as he brings something we don't have a which is a PMD. But the reason he was traded was because management saw we had Barrie and Elliott. And I think they thought at minimum 1 of the 2 of them would have progressed enough to be a regular playing the JML role by now. Obviously that hasn't happened.

Do I think we got short changed on JMLs worth when we traded him yeah a little, but at the time in management's eyes it was a decent move (which they turned into a better move, Varlamov), because they expected something to happen, certain players to develop, in the meantime which to this point hasn't happened which leaves us with a big hole. And not much wiggle room to fix it.
This evaluation was simply unacceptable. Our scouts should have been able to conclude that these guys aren't ready for the NHL yet and somehow Sherman had the green light that both Shattenkirk and Liles were expendable? Someone (or several someones) made some very poor evaluations of our prospects and our teams needs for both those guys to be dealt.

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02-04-2013, 11:43 PM
  #710
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Originally Posted by Av-merican View Post
I don't have any problem with management's decision to part with Liles, nor do I think we got short-changed in that trade. And I'm still one of JML's biggest fans. My gripe is who they ended up replacing him with. Hejda is only slightly cheaper than Liles and has been abysmal. What's more, the team has done NOTHING to address the puckmoving deficiencies of this blueline. And if management honestly believed a pair of 21-year-old defensive prospects would quickly fill the gap, Sherman and his band of merry men should be fired tomorrow.

In fact, I don't believe management did believe those prospects would be ready. If they did they wouldn't have re-signed O'Brien and signed Zanon. They would've guaranteed a spot for Elliot/Barrie instead. But filling the defense up with a bunch of slow defenders who have the combined puck skill of a drunken Jeff Shantz has been counterproductive. Instead of allowing the kids to start out the season in Lake Erie to further develop their skills, they're now under pressure to develop faster than ever since the Avs have no offensive punch whatsoever from the current defensive corps.

Give Chris Campoli's agent a call. He can't POSSIBLY be any worse than what we've got out there right now and at this point I can't imagine his contract demands are all that exorbitant. Then again the Avs have proven they can set the bar pretty low when it comes to what they deem "exorbitant."
I agree that if they don't want a rock bottom finish this season they need to go after these types of expendable players that can move the puck like Yannick Weber, Campoli, Jeff Schultz and waive/buyout/trade a couple of our pylons. But if they DO make a move they need to make sure its a guy who will be servicable and better than what we have in a bottom pairing role over the next season or two otherwise it's just a waste and following the Calgary philosophy.

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02-05-2013, 12:07 AM
  #711
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Since Hejduk will probably retire and Kobasew might be let go at the end of the season, I was thinking about some UFAs we could look up to shore up the top 6 depth.

Mason Raymond
Eric Nystrom
Boyd Gordon
Victor Stalberg

are all guys that I would be interested in though for different reasons. There are a couple other options too but I just gave capgeek a cursory scan.


On D we need more quality. I'm going to assume we can't get a top pairing D without moving one of our 3 centers, because lets face it, what other valuable pieces can we move? But there are a couple good UFA D in Smid and Streit that we should target if they make it to July 1 though other teams will go after them hard as well. I think it's unlikely to get either one however and there's really nothing else out there.

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02-05-2013, 12:11 AM
  #712
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Originally Posted by chet1926 View Post
Alright, I'm sick of people saying how much we need JML. Don't get me wrong I liked JML but he was just not that good defensively. He was small and was easily pushed around.

I do think he would be nice to have as he brings something we don't have a which is a PMD. But the reason he was traded was because management saw we had Barrie and Elliott. And I think they thought at minimum 1 of the 2 of them would have progressed enough to be a regular playing the JML role by now. Obviously that hasn't happened.

Do I think we got short changed on JMLs worth when we traded him yeah a little, but at the time in management's eyes it was a decent move (which they turned into a better move, Varlamov), because they expected something to happen, certain players to develop, in the meantime which to this point hasn't happened which leaves us with a big hole. And not much wiggle room to fix it.
pretty wrong.

we need JML badly. got an insanely bad return for him, and have no one to replace him. Barrie/Elliot will never be better than he is, they probably wont even get as good as he is.

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Old
02-05-2013, 12:23 AM
  #713
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Originally Posted by Nihiliste View Post
Since Hejduk will probably retire and Kobasew might be let go at the end of the season, I was thinking about some UFAs we could look up to shore up the top 6 depth.

Mason Raymond
Eric Nystrom
Boyd Gordon
Victor Stalberg

are all guys that I would be interested in though for different reasons. There are a couple other options too but I just gave capgeek a cursory scan.


On D we need more quality. I'm going to assume we can't get a top pairing D without moving one of our 3 centers, because lets face it, what other valuable pieces can we move? But there are a couple good UFA D in Smid and Streit that we should target if they make it to July 1 though other teams will go after them hard as well. I think it's unlikely to get either one however and there's really nothing else out there.
It's not outside the realm of possibility but I would be shocked if the Canucks parted ways with Mason Raymond. It's far more likely they let Malhotra walk. A shame, he hasn't been the same player since the eye injury, and probably won't be ever again. Still, I would hope the Avs would take a look at either him or Jeff Halpern to fill a defensive role. Both players would help to address some serious needs in that department.

As far as defensemen, I think there are a lot of interesting possibilities. Many have already been named so I won't rehash that, but one thing's for sure--the excess baggage has to be removed. If it were me, I'd find takers for Zanon, O'Brien, Hunwick, and find any means necessary to get Jan Hejda the hell off the roster. I'd also sign O'Byrne to an extension.

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Old
02-05-2013, 12:31 AM
  #714
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Originally Posted by Av-merican View Post
If it were me, I'd find takers for Zanon, O'Brien, Hunwick, and find any means necessary to get Jan Hejda the hell off the roster. I'd also sign O'Byrne to an extension.
I agree with the first three, but Hejda is a far better defenseman than O'Byrne. I will be furious if they sign O'Byrne to an extension, especially if none of these other defensemen are traded.

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02-05-2013, 12:34 AM
  #715
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I agree with the first three, but Hejda is a far better defenseman than O'Byrne. I will be furious if they sign O'Byrne to an extension, especially if none of these other defensemen are traded.
Personally I think O'Byrne's been great as a depth defender, and good on the PK for the most part. And unlike Hejda he doesn't fancy himself a puckmover...largely because his puck skills are nonexistent. But yeah, I'd rather have him and Wilson in the 6/7 spots and just get rid of Hejda. Unlike O'Byrne, I think Hejda's mistakes are just plain stupid ones, and he just doesn't seem to learn from them.

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02-05-2013, 12:38 AM
  #716
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I think O'Byrne might be ok as a #6 if you pair him with someone that is good at puck retrieval and passing. Pair him with Zanon and they're likely to be pinned in our zone.

O'Byrne is brutal this year, no doubt. Rusty and not very skilled is a bad combination.

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02-05-2013, 12:45 AM
  #717
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I think O'Byrne might be ok as a #6 if you pair him with someone that is good at puck retrieval and passing. Pair him with Zanon and they're likely to be pinned in our zone.

O'Byrne is brutal this year. Rusty and not very skilled is a bad combination.
I agree, he's not been good, but just like you said here, he enjoyed his best success alongside Liles. In many ways they complemented one another perfectly. But then the Avs seemingly forgot this and just littered the roster with more defensemen just like O'Byrne instead of properly replacing Liles and Shattenkirk.

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02-05-2013, 12:52 AM
  #718
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I think O'Byrne might be ok as a #6 if you pair him with someone that is good at puck retrieval and passing. Pair him with Zanon and they're likely to be pinned in our zone.

O'Byrne is brutal this year, no doubt. Rusty and not very skilled is a bad combination.
Not very skilled is just bad

How the hell did he make it into Junior hockey with his hands?

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02-05-2013, 12:58 AM
  #719
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Not very skilled is just bad
He's useful on the PK, hitting and blocking. He's a pretty decent skater for a guy his size.

He's limited but not useless normally. But he better lose the rust and play decently soon or Avs let him walk this summer.

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02-05-2013, 01:04 AM
  #720
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Originally Posted by Nihiliste View Post
This evaluation was simply unacceptable. Our scouts should have been able to conclude that these guys aren't ready for the NHL yet and somehow Sherman had the green light that both Shattenkirk and Liles were expendable? Someone (or several someones) made some very poor evaluations of our prospects and our teams needs for both those guys to be dealt.
I disagree. It's my opinion (though I'm sure minority) that Barrie is ready right now. I think he'll make an impact this season. It's frustrating that he's not getting the games under his belt, but I suspect they're looking for him to adjust to the speed of the NHL game in practice instead of under pressure.

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02-05-2013, 01:47 AM
  #721
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We need defense more. If we get O'Reilly/Landeskog back we'll be fine.
fixed

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02-05-2013, 06:48 AM
  #722
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Liles has been mediocre in Toronto too. O'Byrne hasn't been terrible, but he's been exposed a lot for being slow this year, whereas last season we didn't rely on the defense as heavily to provide offensive support.

I honestly think we're in part missing Wilson, he has a decent outlet pass compared to our defense. We also need Elliott, he's better than Barrie in the pros and more confident offensively. But injured, no?

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02-05-2013, 07:15 AM
  #723
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Has anyone actually watched liles this year? I live in Toronto and he has been nothing but mediocre. Shattenkirk is exactly what we need.

Avs pp sucks because we got no pp specialists on the blue line.

Heck they might as well inquire about MAB in Tampa to run the pp. useless every other situation but still better than Matt friggin Hunwick!

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02-05-2013, 07:42 AM
  #724
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I wish we could just hose some team. I wish we could trade SOB, ROB and Jones for Silfverberg, Karlsson and Cowan.

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02-05-2013, 08:01 AM
  #725
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I wish we could just hose some team. I wish we could trade SOB, ROB and Jones for Silfverberg, Karlsson and Cowan.
McGinn, Sgarbossa for Winnik, Galiardi isn't hosing some team?

Granted it's not a blockbuster, but we've got two guys with top 6 talent and San Jose has a bottom 6 energy forward that can't seem to reach the next level in his development and a UFA that left the team (even having stayed we'd have won).

I do agree though, we could really use a classic Sherman/Pracey trade where we get some unheralded guy that comes in and lights the world on fire. But we can't keep relying on them to do that every season. Especially because we'd be inviting someone to come to the team and then get a serious injury that nearly ends their career...

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