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In-season Proposals, Rumors, Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics here) XXXI

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Old
01-19-2013, 02:08 PM
  #126
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Originally Posted by Foppa2118 View Post
Purely speculation, but I've got a strong hunch Barrie is being showcased. I wouldn't be shocked to see an O'Reilly+Barrie package for something as early as tonight if Barrie doesn't look too out of place.
Interesting theory. Wonder who could be interested?

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01-19-2013, 02:12 PM
  #127
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Think it's more that he earned his spot, like Shattenkirk/Duchene/O'Reilly did before him.

Barrie has been lights out for Lake Erie. I think he's going to have a good year in the NHL.

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01-19-2013, 02:22 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by ChibiPooky View Post
Interesting theory. Wonder who could be interested?
My guess is Phoenix and Florida still are the most likely if a trade does happen. Despite the trade for Lombardi, and the signing of Kulikov.

I said it a few days ago, but I think an O'Reilly, Wilson, and Barrie for Hanzal and Gormley type deal could be had. I'd bet something similar was the deal on the table, that the other team (I'm guessing Col) backed away from.

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01-19-2013, 02:28 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Foppa2118 View Post
My guess is Phoenix and Florida still are the most likely if a trade does happen. Despite the trade for Lombardi, and the signing of Kulikov.

I said it a few days ago, but I think an O'Reilly, Wilson, and Barrie for Hanzal and Gormley type deal could be had. I'd bet something similar was the deal on the table, that the other team (I'm guessing Col) backed away from.
O'Reilly, Wilson, and Barrie for Hanzal and Gormley? Are you sure you are not a Yotes fan?

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01-19-2013, 02:34 PM
  #130
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O'Reilly, Wilson, and Barrie for Hanzal and Gormley? Are you sure you are not a Yotes fan?
Nope. Just don't think the Avs end up getting a deal they're in love with at this point.

Hanzal is a great 30-40 point 3rd line center with size, great D, and an edge to his game. He's also on a great 5 year deal ($3.1M per), and there's no reason to think Gormley can't be better than Barrie and Wilson at this point. If Gormley continues to progress, it could end up being a decent deal for the Avs brought upon by necessity.


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01-19-2013, 02:40 PM
  #131
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Remember when Daniel Alfredsson held out and then was traded by Ottawa?

Trading O'Reilly isn't a necessity, it's fan overreaction.

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01-19-2013, 02:44 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Remember when Daniel Alfredsson held out and then was traded by Ottawa?

Trading O'Reilly isn't a necessity, it's fan overreaction.
I meant necessity figuratively, not literally. I don't remember what Alfredsson was holding out for, but I would hazard a guess it wasn't like O'Reilly asking for a rumored $5M on a long term deal at 21 with one good season, and with a two year KHL deal that require matching. Not to mention Ottawa is a different team.

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01-19-2013, 02:50 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Foppa2118 View Post
Purely speculation, but I've got a strong hunch Barrie is being showcased. I wouldn't be shocked to see an O'Reilly+Barrie package for something as early as tonight if Barrie doesn't look too out of place.
Yup and nope. He could very well be showcased but I doubt very much that any team would bite after just one game.

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Originally Posted by Gabriel Landeskog 92 View Post
When is this season's trade deadline?
I believe it's April 3rd.

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Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
Think it's more that he earned his spot, like Shattenkirk/Duchene/O'Reilly did before him.

Barrie has been lights out for Lake Erie. I think he's going to have a good year in the NHL.
I agree that he earned his spot but it doesn't change the fact that he may very well be trade bait.

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Originally Posted by Foppa2118 View Post
Nope. Just don't think the Avs end up getting a deal they're in love with at this point.

Hanzal is a great 3rd line center with size, and there's no reason to think Gormley can't be better than Barrie and Wilson at this point. If Gormley continues to progress, it could end up being a decent deal for the Avs brought upon by necessity.
I don't see them making a deal like this especially not for Gormley who is a complete unknown quantity at the NHL level. How many high profile, high draft picks players have looked great out of junior and good out of the AHL only to flop in the NHL?? There have been lots.

I don't see the Avs as having the same sense of urgency to make a trade. There's a season and our young core will still get the chance to progress and develop with or without Omega Red.

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01-19-2013, 03:04 PM
  #134
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Yup and nope. He could very well be showcased but I doubt very much that any team would bite after just one game.
It's not really after one game though. I'm sure teams have a generally idea about him based on scouting him in his draft year, his games with Colorado last year, and this year with Lake Erie. Tonight would just be a refresher to see how he looks with NHLers right now, and because Colorado was probably waiting until at least one game into the season to give a mild impression like they don't have to move O'Reilly before the season.

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I don't see them making a deal like this especially not for Gormley who is a complete unknown quantity at the NHL level. How many high profile, high draft picks players have looked great out of junior and good out of the AHL only to flop in the NHL?? There have been lots.
This is true, but I don't think there's any reason to believe there's a big risk factor in Gormley not being at least as good as Barrie, or that he's that much bigger of a question mark than Barrie. And that's an at worst type of scenario IMO.

I think a good middle ground is he becomes a solid second pairing guy who's good in his own zone, a good skater, and can contribute 25-30 points on a season. What they would hope for is he can be a 40+ point all around guy that can play with EJ.

The question mark in Gormely is offset by what they are getting in Hanzal, and that he replaces pretty much everything O'Reilly does with a little dip in offensive production. He's an established 3rd line center on a great contract for five years, and IMO is the prototypical 3rd line center. 6'6" 236 lbs with an edge to his game. That's something the center ice position was lacking in Colorado. Plus he's got decent hands and can put up 30-40 points a year. I'd bet he'd mesh real well with Hejduk Downie.

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I don't see the Avs as having the same sense of urgency to make a trade. There's a season and our young core will still get the chance to progress and develop with or without Omega Red.
I don't think there's a real sense of urgency, or that they should have one in terms of saving this season. I think making the right deal is more important.

That said, I think the Avs are probably the most likely team in the league to make a deal early, instead of screwing around and dragging it out, and causing a distraction and possibly bad PR for them.

That's just how they operate. They don't screw around too much with anything, whether it's offers to players, or offers to other teams on trades. When they decide to do something, they do it rather than trying to be tricky. They don't sign long term fancy cap avoiding deals, they offer more or less take it or leave it type deals to players and teams in trade talks, ship out players that appear like they don't want to be here, and put a high priority on not getting bad PR from the media.

I think it's doubtful this situation doesn't get resolveld fairly quickly, one way or another. Whether that's the best plan or not, is another question.


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01-19-2013, 03:21 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Foppa2118 View Post
It's not really after one game though. I'm sure teams have a generally idea about him based on scouting him in his draft year, his games with Colorado last year, and this year with Lake Erie. Tonight would just be a refresher to see how he looks with NHLers right now, and because Colorado was probably waiting until at least one game into the season to give a mild impression like they don't have to move O'Reilly before the season.



This is true, but I don't think there's any reason to believe there's a big risk factor in Gormley not being at least as good as Barrie, or that he's that much bigger of a question mark than Barrie. And that's an at worst type of scenario IMO.

I think a good middle ground is he becomes a solid second pairing guy who's good in his own zone, a good skater, and can contribute 25-30 points on a season. What they would hope for is he can be a 40+ point all around guy that can play with EJ.



I don't think there's a real sense of urgency, or that they should have one in terms of saving this season. I think making the right deal is more important.

That said, I think the Avs are probably the most likely team in the league to make a deal early, instead of screwing around and dragging it out, and causing a distraction and possibly bad PR for them.

That's just how they operate. They don't screw around too much with anything, whether it's offers to players, or offers to other teams on trades. When they decide to do something, they do it rather than trying to be tricky. They don't sign long term fancy cap avoiding deals, they offer more or less take it or leave it type deals to players and teams in trade talks, ship out players that appear like they don't want to be here, and put a high priority on not getting bad PR from the media.

I think it's doubtful this situation doesn't get resolveld fairly quickly, one way or another. Whether that's the best plan or not, is another question.
I get what you're saying but I would expect the Avs to get an excellent return for RoR and one that wouldn't come with as much risk as you're suggesting. It's very possible that Pracey and his staff are extremely high on Gormley (I am not by the way, I see a Wade Redden kind of player, top 4 but not top pairing) and that would facilitate what you're suggesting.

I also understand what you're saying about them not screwing around and generally, I agree with you. However, with this particular circumstance, I think that they are going to make him sleep in the bed that he made. Apparently, he's prepared to stay the whole season there...go for it dude. Why should they make his life easier, make a deal (perhaps a deal that is rushed) and pave the way for players to try and squeeze management in the future?? No, I don't see it. I think if he's traded, it will be either at the draft and if its before, it will be for a Kings ransom!!

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01-19-2013, 03:28 PM
  #136
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I get what you're saying but I would expect the Avs to get an excellent return for RoR and one that wouldn't come with as much risk as you're suggesting. It's very possible that Pracey and his staff are extremely high on Gormley (I am not by the way, I see a Wade Redden kind of player, top 4 but not top pairing) and that would facilitate what you're suggesting.

I also understand what you're saying about them not screwing around and generally, I agree with you. However, with this particular circumstance, I think that they are going to make him sleep in the bed that he made. Apparently, he's prepared to stay the whole season there...go for it dude. Why should they make his life easier, make a deal (perhaps a deal that is rushed) and pave the way for players to try and squeeze management in the future?? No, I don't see it. I think if he's traded, it will be either at the draft and if its before, it will be for a Kings ransom!!
You could be right, and I'm by no means high on Gormley. I have very similar concerns myself in terms of his game translating to the NHL, but I also haven't seen a ton of him so it's not a huge concern for me. If the Avs scouts are high on him, that's good enough for me at my limited viewing.

If they do wait, and I think they will have to if they don't think the type of deal I suggested is enough, they will probably have to wait until the draft or next off season. Any deal coming around the deadline is likely to include picks, further off prospects than Gormley, and/or maybe a character winger or center. None of which are something the Avs really need.

It's very unlikely a team gives us the kind of #2 defenseman we all hope for at the deadline if they're making a playoff run.

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01-19-2013, 03:45 PM
  #137
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Barrie won't get traded. His season will look something like:

46 GP, 7 G, 19 A, 26 PTS, -11

But with better hair.

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01-19-2013, 03:54 PM
  #138
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I sure hope our FO isn't as shortsighted as some of the people in this thread. Trading Barrie or Elliott right now would be beyond dumb.

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01-19-2013, 04:19 PM
  #139
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Remember when Daniel Alfredsson held out and then was traded by Ottawa?

Trading O'Reilly isn't a necessity, it's fan overreaction.
With Lacroix in whatever management capacity he is in it's a possibility. There is some history to it with this organization.

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01-19-2013, 04:27 PM
  #140
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With Lacroix in whatever management capacity he is in it's a possibility. There is some history to it with this organization.
Of course it's a possibility. But taking a defeatist position when we have pretty much no information on anything (how the front office views things/how O'Reilly views things/what differences there are in negotiations) is silly.

There is also a possibility that everyone involved will put on their big boy pants once this is settled.

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01-19-2013, 04:29 PM
  #141
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I sure hope our FO isn't as shortsighted as some of the people in this thread. Trading Barrie or Elliott right now would be beyond dumb.
Remember when he paid for the salaries out of his pocket, for his teammates? How selfish.

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01-19-2013, 04:35 PM
  #142
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You could be right, and I'm by no means high on Gormley. I have very similar concerns myself in terms of his game translating to the NHL, but I also haven't seen a ton of him so it's not a huge concern for me. If the Avs scouts are high on him, that's good enough for me at my limited viewing.

If they do wait, and I think they will have to if they don't think the type of deal I suggested is enough, they will probably have to wait until the draft or next off season. Any deal coming around the deadline is likely to include picks, further off prospects than Gormley, and/or maybe a character winger or center. None of which are something the Avs really need.

It's very unlikely a team gives us the kind of #2 defenseman we all hope for at the deadline if they're making a playoff run.
I think we'd be hard pressed to find that kind of deal anytime now that the season has started. I don't imagine many GMs would give up a roster player of that caliber, or young player with that kind of potential, for the rights to a player playing in Russia. That kind of move makes more sense in the off-season where there's more time to address the matter. I think picks and prospects are the best offers we'd receive, and I don't think that's something the team should take at this time. I'm guessing the team will try to sign him up until the drop dead date (whatever that is/if there is one), then re-evaluate in the off-season.

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01-19-2013, 04:42 PM
  #143
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Remember when he paid for the salaries out of his pocket, for his teammates? How selfish.
Who?

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01-19-2013, 04:46 PM
  #144
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Who?
Alfie

I hate the sens but he really is their Sakic. He has my utmost respect.


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01-19-2013, 04:50 PM
  #145
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I sure hope our FO isn't as shortsighted as some of the people in this thread. Trading Barrie or Elliott right now would be beyond dumb.
For the sake of argument, what has Barrie or Elliott done to believe they will be better than Gormley.

Given the makeup of the Avs D, the fact that Elliott and Barrie likely fill similar roles if they stick in the NHL, how would including one of them in a package for something of need be "beyond dumb?"

People act as if they can fill holes on a team, and make trades without giving up anything of worth. I would package one of Barrie or Elliott with O'Reilly in a nanosecond to get a better player than what O'Reilly will bring in by himself. I don't see a strong need for both of them as prospects, especially if the return is a defenseman.

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01-19-2013, 04:53 PM
  #146
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For the sake of argument, what has Barrie or Elliott done to believe they will be better than Gormley.

Given the makeup of the Avs D, the fact that Elliott and Barrie likely fill similar roles if they stick in the NHL, how would including one of them in a package for something of need be "beyond dumb?"

People act as if they can fill holes on a team, and make trades without giving up anything of worth. I would package one of Barrie or Elliott with O'Reilly in a nanosecond to get a better player than what O'Reilly will bring in by himself. I don't see a strong need for both of them as prospects, especially if the return is a better defenseman.
Barrie/Elliott/Gormley are all unproven.

Here's a wild idea. How about we see what we have in them before trading them to fill a need? There might be a chance that Barrie and Elliott may fill a need for us.

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01-19-2013, 04:58 PM
  #147
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Just curious guys with O'Reilly holding out are you in the mood to trade Stastny's contract? If he(O'Reilly) resigns isn't Statsny your third line center?

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01-19-2013, 05:01 PM
  #148
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Barrie/Elliott/Gormley are all unproven.

Here's a wild idea. How about we see what we have in them before trading them to fill a need? There might be a chance that Barrie and Elliott may fill a need for us.
I'm not proposing trading O'Reilly for Gormley. I'm proposing the likely best deal the Avs can get right now would be a deal like O'Reilly, Wilson, and Barrie for Hanzal and Gormley. Gormley being left handed, less raw, having more value, and being more likely to develop into a solid second, or top pairing D than either Elliott or Barrie.

I'll match your sarcastic question, with a wild question of my own. Do you really believe giving up one of Barrie or Elliott, and getting Gormley back in the same deal is a bad thing, or a risk because they're not 26 and fully established? Are you kidding me? You're more interested in keeping Barrie or Elliott than Gormley?

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01-19-2013, 05:03 PM
  #149
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With O'Reilly being out I'm guessing we won't see any stupid "Trade Duchene" posts. He can spin and do whatever the hell he wants.

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01-19-2013, 05:05 PM
  #150
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Just curious guys with O'Reilly holding out are you in the mood to trade Stastny's contract? If he(O'Reilly) resigns isn't Statsny your third line center?
When O'Reilly signs, he'll be the third line center. This would be the worst time to trade Stastny.

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