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12'/13' Draft Thread: Something, Something... SETH JONES!

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Old
02-02-2013, 12:16 PM
  #676
LeafDangler
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
In games I see both play, Drouin simply looks better, I know Mackinnon was hyped more based on last year, but I really try to stay away from that stuff and focus on on ice play. Drouin is a magical player that has the 'it' factor. I'm with Mapes on this one, he has made me a believer and it wouldn't surprise me if he may be better than Mackinnon now. We keep expecting Mac to be better than Drouin but it hasn't happened yet this year.
Mac has been better than Drouin many times this year. How often do you watch them play from North York? It's a coin flip each night who is the most noticeable. You have no basis to speak with such certainty.

MacKinnon does so much more night in and night out in both ends of the ice that does not show up on the scoresheet. Could Drouin do it? Probably, but he hasn't yet. He gets to do things that open him up for offense that MacKinnon does not as he's working his ass off below both goallines.

That said today's NHL is so PP oriented. A guy with hands and finish like Drouin might be the most valuable commodity. He's not soft either.

Either way both kids are plus character and drive guys with elite skills. Either one would be this franchise's best prospect in a very long time.

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02-02-2013, 12:21 PM
  #677
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^well put. I agree with all points

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Old
02-02-2013, 12:24 PM
  #678
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Originally Posted by LeafDangler View Post
Mac has been better than Drouin many times this year. How often do you watch them play from North York? It's a coin flip each night who is the most noticeable. You have no basis to speak with such certainty.

MacKinnon does so much more night in and night out in both ends of the ice that does not show up on the scoresheet. Could Drouin do it? Probably, but he hasn't yet. He gets to do things that open him up for offense that MacKinnon does not as he's working his ass off below both goallines.

That said today's NHL is so PP oriented. A guy with hands and finish like Drouin might be the most valuable commodity. He's not soft either.

Either way both kids are plus character and drive guys with elite skills. Either one would be this franchise's best prospect in a very long time.
Point missed, I did say from the games I saw both of them play in and they were big showcase games.

Also there's a poster here that lives in Halifax that has seen them both play a lot more than probably any of us, and he has posted many times Drouin has been better.

You could have made a disclaimer on your post that you are a Mackinnon fan, because it sure sounds this way if you had seen them play in games that are nationally televised. But if you don't believe me, just watch the Mckenzie draft show again to know scouts have closed the gap on the Halifax duo.

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02-02-2013, 12:29 PM
  #679
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Point missed, I did say from the games I saw both of them play in and they were big showcase games.

Also there's a poster here that lives in Halifax that has seen them both play a lot more than probably any of us, and he has posted many times Drouin has been better.

You could have made a disclaimer on your post that you are a Mackinnon fan, because it sure sounds this way if you had seen them play in games that are nationally televised. But if you don't believe me, just watch the Mckenzie draft show again to know scouts have closed the gap on the Halifax duo.
I haven't seen them play more than about 8 times for Halifax but in what way is drouin "better"? He's got a lot of flash and I know for a fact kadri looked "better" than Tavares in London many nights. Similar situation maybe?

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02-02-2013, 12:31 PM
  #680
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Point missed, I did say from the games I saw both of them play in and they were big showcase games.

Also there's a poster here that lives in Halifax that has seen them both play a lot more than probably any of us, and he has posted many times Drouin has been better.
You said "We keep expecting Mac to be better than Drouin but it hasn't happened yet this year".

I've had season tickets in Halifax for the past two seasons. I know exactly what I'm talking about. I watched the Top Prospects game from the 7th row where MacKinnon was the best player on a poor Cherry team. I see your best bud Craig Button from time to time in the Metro Center because he certainly does not scout from Southern Ontario. I know he was in Chicoutimi and Baie Comeau Thursday and Friday because he understands the meaning of sample size outside of televised "showcase" games. I know that he has MacKinnon ranked ahead of Drouin as well.

I'm not sure who I'd take. I've stated this several times. I'm a fan of both players. What I don't do is act like I'm an authority on guys I've only seen a couple times on television. If I'm going to passionately argue about a prospect it's going to be about a player I've seen many times and in person. This board would be a better place if more people adhered to that. Opinions are great but so is humility.


Last edited by LeafDangler: 02-02-2013 at 12:50 PM.
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02-02-2013, 12:57 PM
  #681
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Originally Posted by LeafDangler View Post
You said "We keep expecting Mac to be better than Drouin but it hasn't happened yet this year".

I've had season tickets in Halifax for the past two seasons. I know exactly what I'm talking about. I watched the Top Prospects game from the 7th row where MacKinnon was the best player on a poor Cherry team. I see your best bud Craig Button from time to time in the Metro Center because he certainly does not scout from Southern Ontario. I know he was in Chicoutimi and Baie Comeau Thursday and Friday because he understands the meaning of sample size outside of televised "showcase" games. I know that he has MacKinnon ranked ahead of Drouin as well.

I'm not sure who I'd take. I've stated this several times. I'm a fan of both players. What I don't do is act like I'm an authority on guys I've only seen a couple times on television. If I'm going to passionately argue about a prospect it's going to be about a player I've seen many times and in person. This board would be a better place if more people adhered to that. Opinions are great but so is humility.
Well put. I love talking prospects but I'm not about to act like I'm an authority on them. It'd be refreshing if people stopped acting like they're professional scouts on here.

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02-02-2013, 02:05 PM
  #682
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I have Drouin ahead of Mackinnon on my list, even before this week's action.
As do I. Better offensively, though ill admit Nate is more complete and is a center

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02-02-2013, 02:11 PM
  #683
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Bro we've been Leafs fans long enough to know that this team can fall off the face of the Earth anytime. I thought we were playoff bound until the hilarity that was February last year
















Yup. But I don't think they will be bottom 5 bad again. Leafs actually have a system in place

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02-02-2013, 02:15 PM
  #684
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Originally Posted by LeafDangler View Post
Mac has been better than Drouin many times this year. How often do you watch them play from North York? It's a coin flip each night who is the most noticeable. You have no basis to speak with such certainty.

MacKinnon does so much more night in and night out in both ends of the ice that does not show up on the scoresheet. Could Drouin do it? Probably, but he hasn't yet. He gets to do things that open him up for offense that MacKinnon does not as he's working his ass off below both goallines.

That said today's NHL is so PP oriented. A guy with hands and finish like Drouin might be the most valuable commodity. He's not soft either.

Either way both kids are plus character and drive guys with elite skills. Either one would be this franchise's best prospect in a very long time.
Very well said.

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02-02-2013, 02:28 PM
  #685
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Originally Posted by LeafDangler View Post
You said "We keep expecting Mac to be better than Drouin but it hasn't happened yet this year".

I've had season tickets in Halifax for the past two seasons. I know exactly what I'm talking about. I watched the Top Prospects game from the 7th row where MacKinnon was the best player on a poor Cherry team. I see your best bud Craig Button from time to time in the Metro Center because he certainly does not scout from Southern Ontario. I know he was in Chicoutimi and Baie Comeau Thursday and Friday because he understands the meaning of sample size outside of televised "showcase" games. I know that he has MacKinnon ranked ahead of Drouin as well.

I'm not sure who I'd take. I've stated this several times. I'm a fan of both players. What I don't do is act like I'm an authority on guys I've only seen a couple times on television. If I'm going to passionately argue about a prospect it's going to be about a player I've seen many times and in person. This board would be a better place if more people adhered to that. Opinions are great but so is humility.
Where have I have passionately argued against a prospect, I simply pointed out I have Drouin ahead of Macinnon at this moment of time. I don't think this is outrageous. I have Jones as the clear #1 people want to argue this too. That's my opinion based on seeing all 3 players play. As for humility, not sure what my post had to do with this? I post my opinions and like anyone here as yours, we are all entitled to them.

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02-02-2013, 02:37 PM
  #686
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As do I. Better offensively, though ill admit Nate is more complete and is a center
Exacly, people get all bent out of shape when Drouin is rated higher than Mac, its almost insulting to some to suggest it is so. Not really when both are good prospects and even Mckenzie said #2 is much more in doubt than who will go #1 this draft.

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02-02-2013, 02:38 PM
  #687
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
Exacly, people get all bent out of shape when Drouin is rated higher than Mac, its almost insulting to some to suggest it is so. Not really when both are good prospects and even Mckenzie said #2 is much more in doubt than who will go #1 this draft.
Correction, he said there a step below the Number one spot. However they can hound there. It's still a dog fight for number one between Jones and Mackinnon.

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02-02-2013, 03:10 PM
  #688
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Correction, he said there a step below the Number one spot. However they can hound there. It's still a dog fight for number one between Jones and Mackinnon.
Not disputing this, not sure why you brought it up. He clearly said if there is a change it is more likely to be at #2 than #1.

Jones has changed the dynamic to 7 to 3 from 3 to 7 post WJC and prospect game.

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02-02-2013, 03:29 PM
  #689
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Jones, MacK, Barkov, Drouin.... And then everyone else, IMO.

Those are your elite level players. Then there is a group of fantastic prospects like Lindholm, Ristolainen, Monahan, Shinkaruk, Nichushkin, and Nurse. I think Nichushkin falls (Unless Tampa picks in this range..), and Mantha has the chops to jump into that top grouping with his combo of size/speed/scoring ability.

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02-02-2013, 03:30 PM
  #690
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Only way I can see Mackinnon reclaim #1 now is if Portland meets Halifax at the memorial Cup and Mac outplays Jones significantly. Just don't see how he can reclaim it at this late stage of regular season games in either junior league. However, Drouin and Mackiinnon will wage their friendly battle of teammates until Halifax are no longer playing games this year. Making #2 much more in doubt, I do believe Mac has the advantage being a C in the real draft so Drouin will have to be much better than Mac if he wants #2.

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02-02-2013, 03:37 PM
  #691
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Only way I can see Mackinnon reclaim #1 now is if Portland meets Halifax at the memorial Cup and Mac outplays Jones significantly. Just don't see how he can reclaim it at this late stage of regular season games in either junior league. However, Drouin and Mackiinnon will wage their friendly battle of teammates until Halifax are no longer playing games this year. Making #2 much more in doubt, I do believe Mac has the advantage being a C in the real draft so Drouin will have to be much better than Mac if he wants #2.
There is still a ton of hockey to be played. MacKinnon could continue to be steady in all 3 zones, and lead his team to the Memorial Cup tournament, as they're one of the best by a good margin.

Portland are annual under-achievers, and an exit before the Mem. Cup is all it would take to allow MacKinnon to pass him, if his team advances further.

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02-02-2013, 03:40 PM
  #692
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I think he's a better and more polished Sam Gagner. Definitely not the player I would want to be taking with a top 3 pick, though.



Unfortunately, the Leafs need more than that to be good.



He could...



Those players will not return a first round pick, especially in this draft.

Lupul could have, and so could players like Kulemin or Gunnarson.
The guy who consistently gets screwed with playing time on his team and linemates and yet still put up 40 plus points? Gagner is pretty talented and was handled wrong. A better Gagner is pretty damn impressive in my mind.

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02-02-2013, 03:53 PM
  #693
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Well Barkov is official the youngest ever player to hit 40 points in the SM-Liiga. And one point off of Olli Jokinen's point record for points in a draft eligible season.

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02-02-2013, 03:58 PM
  #694
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Well Barkov is official the youngest ever player to hit 40 points in the SM-Liiga. And one point off of Olli Jokinen's point record for points in a draft eligible season.
While being nearly a calender year younger than when Olli accomplished those feats.

The man-child is for real.

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02-02-2013, 03:58 PM
  #695
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There is still a ton of hockey to be played. MacKinnon could continue to be steady in all 3 zones, and lead his team to the Memorial Cup tournament, as they're one of the best by a good margin.

Portland are annual under-achievers, and an exit before the Mem. Cup is all it would take to allow MacKinnon to pass him, if his team advances further.
They won't hold an early exit if this even happensagainst Jones unless he plays bad, and at this stage him looking bad is slim and slim has left town.

True there are meaningful games to go but not a lot other than the playoffs, if they don't meet head to head, Mackiinnon will have to play out of wordly to top Jones IMO.

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02-02-2013, 04:04 PM
  #696
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They won't hold an early exit if this even happensagainst Jones unless he plays bad, and at this stage him looking bad is slim and slim has left town.

True there are meaningful games to go but not a lot other than the playoffs, if they don't meet head to head, Mackiinnon will have to play out of wordly to top Jones IMO.
I think Portland had a better roster 2-3 years ago, all-around, and they couldn't get the job done. I'm not saying Jones isn't vital, but it's going to take a lot more than just him, to get them to the show.

I think it's going to be Saskatoon (hosts), Portland, Halifax, and London/Owen Sound in the Mem.Cup

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02-02-2013, 05:59 PM
  #697
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How has Pulock been the second half of the season?

Haven't seen much about him lately. Where's he projected to go these days?

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02-02-2013, 06:13 PM
  #698
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How has Pulock been the second half of the season?

Haven't seen much about him lately. Where's he projected to go these days?
Injury has taken a toll, so he fell and is in the middle of hte pack now.

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02-02-2013, 10:11 PM
  #699
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Anyone have a good scouting report on Wennberg because this is what Bobby Mac had to say about him on TSN:

Can play all three forward positions. Excellent skater who has a free and easy stride with excellent quickness and a change of pace is capable of keeping defenders on their heels. He can open up ice and space for himself with his skating. In traffic, he has the ability to 'slice' through tight areas and with very good balance, can be difficult to deter. Very smart with and without the puck and he is quick to see opportunity in all areas to take advantage. Good puck skills and can make plays, can shoot, can hold puck and isn't a 'one-trick' pony. He competes and will battle in every situation.

He seems like he has top line potential but I'm a bit weary because he could be another one of those intriguing Swedes who sky rocket like Josefson and MPS

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02-03-2013, 05:31 AM
  #700
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Anyone have a good scouting report on Wennberg because this is what Bobby Mac had to say about him on TSN:

Can play all three forward positions. Excellent skater who has a free and easy stride with excellent quickness and a change of pace is capable of keeping defenders on their heels. He can open up ice and space for himself with his skating. In traffic, he has the ability to 'slice' through tight areas and with very good balance, can be difficult to deter. Very smart with and without the puck and he is quick to see opportunity in all areas to take advantage. Good puck skills and can make plays, can shoot, can hold puck and isn't a 'one-trick' pony. He competes and will battle in every situation.

He seems like he has top line potential but I'm a bit weary because he could be another one of those intriguing Swedes who sky rocket like Josefson and MPS
Paajarvi and Josefson were among the very best of their age groups at 15, Wennberg was virtually unknown a year ago. Many thought they'd go higher, they weren't exactly sky rocketing. Wennberg plays like none of those guys, he's more of a playmaker than a scorer but he can really snipe it. His skating is phenomenal, not just his speed but also his quickness.

Last season he only scored one goal in the J20 league but he somehow got invited to play for the U18 national team and he scored a hat-trick against Russia in his first game. He got selected for the U18 WJC team and was one of the best forwards in the whole tournament. Wennberg made the WJC team this season and had a really good tournament. He was supposed to play on the bottom lines for Djurgården or on their J20 team this season but now he is on their top line and perhaps their most important forward.


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