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Senators Prospect Update 2012-2013 Part II

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03-19-2013, 10:02 AM
  #551
aragorn
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Originally Posted by playasRus View Post
What the heck is with so many of our prospects getting recognition?

A few years ago, I remember most of our draft picks were absolutely unheard of. These few years we have a player nominated for something every week.
Probably because we finally have a GM, Scouting Department & Management Team whose top priority is finding good players & player development from the second they are drafted or signed. Nice to see the prospects getting recognized & by extension the Sens organization.

They have also taken some risks that have paid off like drafting Stone & Z. Smith, trading for Turris, Anderson, Bishop & Methot & signing a couple of UFAs. And a number of picks are starting to put it all together, some it took a while & others earlier than expected. It's been a great yr to watch all of that developing before us in games with our young guys.


Last edited by aragorn: 03-19-2013 at 10:09 AM.
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Old
03-19-2013, 10:21 AM
  #552
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PUEMPEL, FANELLI SHARE RANGERS MVP HONOURS

http://www.therecord.com/sports/rang...rs-mvp-honours

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Old
03-19-2013, 10:38 AM
  #553
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Originally Posted by ErikMacNorrison View Post
PUEMPEL, FANELLI SHARE RANGERS MVP HONOURS

http://www.therecord.com/sports/rang...rs-mvp-honours
Great news! Can anyone comment on how Puempel is doing this year? Particularly how his strength and skating have come along.

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:19 PM
  #554
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Who are those Noeson and Puemple guys some are talking about? Never heard of them

Quote:
Originally Posted by Landru View Post
More proof that THN is full of it. Ranking Ceci out of the top 50 is ridiculous.
Maybe it was a mistake? They forgot about him? I don't see how they could back up that idea without looking totally biased or ********...

Ceci was on the top-5 list of the best scouting/drafting team in the NHL (or top-3 at least)

Big FAIL

Quote:
Originally Posted by starling View Post
Ohio State won CCHA quaterfinal series.
3-2 win tonight.
Dzingel 3 assists, McCormick 1 goal.
Looks like they are carrying this team right now.
Dzingel is going to raise soon through our prospects ranks like crazy. Always had some kind of gut feeling about him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by God Says No View Post
meh, i don't see this guy making the big show unless a substantial jump in development.

hoffman, pageau, stone, petersson, etc. are way ahead on the depth chart than this guy.
What are you talking about? Only Stone is over 6'0... others have NO CHANCE to make it


Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginKarlssonLehner View Post
Ottawa Senators Perfectly Set Up For The Future

I like the ring of that.
Yeah but if you read the article, it says :

"Jakob Silfverberg, Mika Zibanejad, and Kaspars Daugavins are all guys that have made somewhat of an impact this year"

lol lost most of its credibility when I read that


Last edited by Xspyrit: 03-19-2013 at 01:25 PM.
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Old
03-19-2013, 01:35 PM
  #555
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Originally Posted by Xspyrit View Post

"Jakob Silfverberg, Mika Zibanejad, and Kaspars Daugavins are all guys that have made somewhat of an impact this year"

lol lost most of its credibility when I read that
But he was on SportsCentre?!

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Old
03-19-2013, 02:11 PM
  #556
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Now you've put the stick in it er on it

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Old
03-20-2013, 08:08 AM
  #557
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picked up my copy of THN's future watch about an hour ago.

Top 50
Zibanejad - #17
Silfverberg - #18
Lehner - #24

team grades:
rank: #6
avg draft rank: #24
handicapped rank: #1 (second year in a row)
grade: A-

Cody Ceci got a mention on the sleeper prospects list.


sens page:

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Old
03-20-2013, 08:19 PM
  #558
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Which clubs were ranked higher than us?

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Old
03-20-2013, 08:24 PM
  #559
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Originally Posted by Fenix Rises 2026 View Post
Which clubs were ranked higher than us?
Absolute rank (handicapped rank)
1. Edmonton (12)
2. Anaheim (6)
3. Minnesota (10)
4. Florida (14)
5. Winnipeg (14)
6. Ottawa (1)
7. Buffalo (7)
8. St. Louis (3)
9. Chicago (5)
10. NYI (26)

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Old
03-20-2013, 08:28 PM
  #560
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Originally Posted by danishh View Post
Absolute rank (handicapped rank)
1. Edmonton (12)
2. Anaheim (6)
3. Minnesota (10)
4. Florida (14)
5. Winnipeg (14)
6. Ottawa (1)
7. Buffalo (7)
8. St. Louis (3)
9. Chicago (5)
10. NYI (26)
i'm fine with most of those but winnipeg?

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Old
03-20-2013, 08:40 PM
  #561
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Originally Posted by God Says No View Post
i'm fine with most of those but winnipeg?
trouba and sheifele were 10th and 14th overall. That probably pushed them higher than us. We were both A- teams.

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Old
03-20-2013, 08:52 PM
  #562
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What is the handicapped rank?

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Old
03-20-2013, 08:54 PM
  #563
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Originally Posted by danishh View Post
trouba and sheifele were 10th and 14th overall. That probably pushed them higher than us. We were both A- teams.
Problem with Winnipeg is that after Trouba and Scheifle, there is literally almost nothing in that farm system. Depth is scary-bad.

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Old
03-20-2013, 09:02 PM
  #564
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Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
Problem with Winnipeg is that after Trouba and Scheifle, there is literally almost nothing in that farm system. Depth is scary-bad.
O'Dell is looking pretty good. Definititely not a blue chipper. We have like 9-10 O'Dells.

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Old
03-20-2013, 09:15 PM
  #565
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Originally Posted by Bileur View Post
What is the handicapped rank?
THN calculated the average position of the first pick each team had in the 2009-2012 drafts and assigned each team an average draft rank (ADR). For example edmonton's ADR was 1, Philly's was 30. Then they subtracted the teams' prospect rank from their ADR, and created a list ranking these 'handicapped scores'. For example, ottawa's ADR of 24 - their prospect rank of 6 gave them a handicapped score of +18, which was tops in the league. Dallas' ADR of 6 - their prospect rank of 22 gave them a handicapped score of -15, worst in the league.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BonkTastic View Post
Problem with Winnipeg is that after Trouba and Scheifle, there is literally almost nothing in that farm system. Depth is scary-bad.
Yeah, THN may be overrating the depth of their farm. 3rd place in their system is paul freaking postma.



back to ottawa. Expect the sens to take a huge dive on the list next year, with four of our top 5 prospects (Zibby, Silfverberg, Lehner, and Wiercioch) expected to graduate, including two top-50 prospects. We only fell from 5th to 6th this year, but no significant prospects graduated. Next year will hurt our rankings, but also provide an opportunity for the 'rebuild' prospects to shine (remember that all our top prospects up until this year have actually been before we started the rebuild).


Last edited by danishh: 03-20-2013 at 09:23 PM.
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Old
03-20-2013, 09:30 PM
  #566
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
THN calculated the average position of the first pick each team had in the 2009-2012 drafts and assigned each team an average draft rank (ADR). For example edmonton's ADR was 1, Philly's was 30. Then they subtracted the teams' prospect rank from their ADR, and created a list ranking these 'handicapped scores'. For example, ottawa's ADR of 24 - their prospect rank of 6 gave them a handicapped score of +18, which was tops in the league. Dallas' ADR of 6 - their prospect rank of 22 gave them a handicapped score of -15, worst in the league.


Yeah, THN may be overrating the depth of their farm. 3rd place in their system is paul freaking postma.



back to ottawa. Expect the sens to take a huge dive on the list next year, with four of our top 5 prospects (Zibby, Silfverberg, Lehner, and Wiercioch) expected to graduate, including two top-50 prospects. We only fell from 5th to 6th this year, but no significant prospects graduated. Next year will hurt our rankings, but also provide an opportunity for the 'rebuild' prospects to shine (remember that all our top prospects up until this year have actually been before we started the rebuild).
Noesen, Stone, Prince, Puempel, Ceci Wikstrand, Pageau, DaCosta etc...

We're not gonna be as good but shouldn't drop below top 10.

I expect Noesen and Stone to get a lot of hype. Both are legitimate top prospects, with an additional year they'll be more seasoned and playing strong pro games.

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Old
03-20-2013, 10:59 PM
  #567
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
THN calculated the average position of the first pick each team had in the 2009-2012 drafts and assigned each team an average draft rank (ADR). For example edmonton's ADR was 1, Philly's was 30. Then they subtracted the teams' prospect rank from their ADR, and created a list ranking these 'handicapped scores'. For example, ottawa's ADR of 24 - their prospect rank of 6 gave them a handicapped score of +18, which was tops in the league. Dallas' ADR of 6 - their prospect rank of 22 gave them a handicapped score of -15, worst in the league.


Yeah, THN may be overrating the depth of their farm. 3rd place in their system is paul freaking postma.



back to ottawa. Expect the sens to take a huge dive on the list next year, with four of our top 5 prospects (Zibby, Silfverberg, Lehner, and Wiercioch) expected to graduate, including two top-50 prospects. We only fell from 5th to 6th this year, but no significant prospects graduated. Next year will hurt our rankings, but also provide an opportunity for the 'rebuild' prospects to shine (remember that all our top prospects up until this year have actually been before we started the rebuild).


Thanks

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Old
03-21-2013, 08:14 AM
  #568
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
THN calculated the average position of the first pick each team had in the 2009-2012 drafts and assigned each team an average draft rank (ADR). For example edmonton's ADR was 1, Philly's was 30. Then they subtracted the teams' prospect rank from their ADR, and created a list ranking these 'handicapped scores'. For example, ottawa's ADR of 24 - their prospect rank of 6 gave them a handicapped score of +18, which was tops in the league. Dallas' ADR of 6 - their prospect rank of 22 gave them a handicapped score of -15, worst in the league.


Yeah, THN may be overrating the depth of their farm. 3rd place in their system is paul freaking postma.



back to ottawa. Expect the sens to take a huge dive on the list next year, with four of our top 5 prospects (Zibby, Silfverberg, Lehner, and Wiercioch) expected to graduate, including two top-50 prospects. We only fell from 5th to 6th this year, but no significant prospects graduated. Next year will hurt our rankings, but also provide an opportunity for the 'rebuild' prospects to shine (remember that all our top prospects up until this year have actually been before we started the rebuild).
It is a little surprisng that Ottawa is ranked 6th behind Winnipeg. Yes Trouba (10) and Scheilfle (14) are top notch players, but the Sens have 3 in the top 25, and 4 in the top 70 (last ranked is 75th I believe). After that Winnipeg can't hold a candle to Ottawa's depth.

Grybya, Wiercioch, Stone, Da Costa, Grant, DZ, Boroweicki have all seen time in the NHL and that does not even include Ceci, Peumple, Prince, Sdao, Wickstrand etc.

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Old
03-21-2013, 08:32 AM
  #569
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danishh View Post
back to ottawa. Expect the sens to take a huge dive on the list next year, with four of our top 5 prospects (Zibby, Silfverberg, Lehner, and Wiercioch) expected to graduate, including two top-50 prospects. We only fell from 5th to 6th this year, but no significant prospects graduated. Next year will hurt our rankings, but also provide an opportunity for the 'rebuild' prospects to shine (remember that all our top prospects up until this year have actually been before we started the rebuild).
Nope.

At least not on HF where the mark is 65 games for a prospect to graduate. This dumb season is only 48 games. Zibby, Silfverberg, Wiercioch won't have played 65 games. Actually, none of our rookies will graduate on HF (Lehner as well, IIRC it's 45 games for a goalie prospect)

Or maybe you meant exclusively to THN? I don't know about their criterias though

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03-21-2013, 11:16 AM
  #570
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xspyrit View Post
Nope.

At least not on HF where the mark is 65 games for a prospect to graduate. This dumb season is only 48 games. Zibby, Silfverberg, Wiercioch won't have played 65 games. Actually, none of our rookies will graduate on HF (Lehner as well, IIRC it's 45 games for a goalie prospect)

Or maybe you meant exclusively to THN? I don't know about their criterias though
ya, i meant THN, since that's the list we were discussing.

THN uses ~50 games by january of the current season (when they put together the list), not a hard line though, they use discretion when it's obvious whether a player is still a prospect or an NHLer. They should all hit it except lehner, but if he spends the first couple months of the season on the NHL roster as expected, THN will surely exclude him.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:26 PM
  #571
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xspyrit View Post
Nope.

At least not on HF where the mark is 65 games for a prospect to graduate. This dumb season is only 48 games. Zibby, Silfverberg, Wiercioch won't have played 65 games. Actually, none of our rookies will graduate on HF (Lehner as well, IIRC it's 45 games for a goalie prospect)

Or maybe you meant exclusively to THN? I don't know about their criterias though
The list is done by THN, HF has nothing to do with it. Would be shocked if we were still top-10 next year.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:33 PM
  #572
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Old
03-21-2013, 01:53 PM
  #573
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Can be. If one of them becomes a 70+ point player, which 2 could manage to become, then that's top-line potential and on par/better with the 2nd best defender on the team.
Im expecting zibanejad hoffman puempel noesen to mostly be 20/20 guys.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:59 PM
  #574
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Im expecting zibanejad hoffman puempel noesen to mostly be 20/20 guys.
You are severely underrating Zibanejad. Zibanejad will be a star.

In his rookie year, this year, as a 19 year old, he is on par with those numbers. 11 goals 9 assists half a season. Basically 20/20 over full year.

Zibanejad has 30/30 potential and more.

The rest I can agree or say they have lesser shot at hitting it except Noesen. Noesen is my favourite prospect right now. Very underrated but he will be loved by everyone when they get to see him play in the pro game.

Noesen has 50-60 potential while playing a gritty, excellent 2 way game.

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Old
03-21-2013, 02:10 PM
  #575
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Yea, Zib is on pace for like 20/15 in his rookie season, no training camp, and that whole month of injuries. He has potential to score 35-40. Topping out at 20/20 is not very likely.

I think Puempel is a huge boom or bust. If he makes it, hes gonna score 25-30, if he doesn't, he will score like 10 goals and be out of the league like Butler is doing. I think its about 60/40 bust to boom for him.

Hoffman is most likely never gonna make the top 6, but he has the skill, iq, and positioning to be a 3rd liner. I see 15/15-20 as the most likely scenario. Quality player, just that every organization has a guy like that.

I agree with Noesen though. I love the kid, but people tend to hype his offensive upside too much imo. Hes going to be a 3rd liner at least, and maybe make a 2n line for reasons other than scoring like speed, grit, competitiveness, physicality, and defense. I see a solid, consistent 20-20 guy, with maybe a year or two of 25/30 in his prime. That's still a super valuable player, and one you win with, but a secondary player.

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