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Old
01-18-2013, 01:18 PM
  #151
Ricky Bobby
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Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
Trade him. He's the type of guy who's essentially replaceable every year via free agency, and is replaceable internally by JVR or Kadri.

Potential winger free agent targets if we even wanted to add another winger (Ashton should be a 3rd liner next year, so should Frattin): Horton, Ryder, Clarkson, Dupuis, Morrow, Clowe, Prospal, etc.

I think getting a ~1st round pick (especially in this draft) does more benefit than losing MacArthur. It arguably won't even hurt us without even adding a free agent.
Agree completely except I don't think we'll be getting a 1st rounder for him since he's a pending UFA and this is a deep draft.

CMac represents what we already have to much of which is defensively average to below average forwards who excel off the rush and he'll be getting paid at the top end of what a player of his skillset brings to the table.

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01-18-2013, 01:19 PM
  #152
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starsfan17:
Toronto fans are like vultures whenever an all-star player is in the midst of being signed or traded. Lets hope benn and GM joe can settle this today


aint that the truth

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01-18-2013, 01:23 PM
  #153
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Agree completely except I don't think we'll be getting a 1st rounder for him since he's a pending UFA and this is a deep draft.

CMac represents what we already have to much of which is defensively average to below average forwards who excel off the rush and he'll be getting paid at the top end of what a player of his skillset brings to the table.
I don't personally think he's worth a 1st, but Gaustad got a 1st last trade deadline. Prices get pretty ridiculous at that time of year, which is why we SHOULD be sellers this year.

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Old
01-18-2013, 01:40 PM
  #154
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Question for you all - if the MGK line starts firing liking '10-'11, and we are playing like crap (bottom 10), would you deal Mac or keep him?

Keeping him would mean you get 2 really good scoring lines, and dealing him would mean you can get an additional first round pick.

Personally, I would give him a 3 year contract at around the same salary. If Frattin shows he's ready for the party, I'd then move Mac the following deadline.
Deal him. Slide JvR into his slot. If we want to re-sign Lupul (which I would over Mac) and stand a chance at Getzlaf and Perry, we have to clear a bit of room. If Mac is sitting at a 20g-50pt pro rated pace at the deadline, we'll get a first for him.

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01-18-2013, 01:41 PM
  #155
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Deal him. Slide JvR into his slot. If we want to re-sign Lupul (which I would over Mac) and stand a chance at Getzlaf and Perry, we have to clear a bit of room.
Lupul - Bozak - Kessel
JVR - Grabo - Kule
Frattin - Kadri - Komarov

.. That third line is intriguing, a ton of speed and aggressiveness on the forecheck

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Old
01-18-2013, 01:49 PM
  #156
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lets get elliot!
(if blues prefer halak)
he's only 27

frattin scrivens and a 2nd rounder

its worth the gamble

halak otherwise.
he probably has a higher market value

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01-18-2013, 01:54 PM
  #157
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Originally Posted by BertCorbeau View Post
Lupul - Bozak - Kessel
JVR - Grabo - Kule
Frattin - Kadri - Komarov

.. That third line is intriguing, a ton of speed and aggressiveness on the forecheck
JvR-Kadri-Komarov

That third line is more intriguing. Kadri's playmaking ability will mesh with JvR's scoring, and Kadri's ability to get under peoples skin will mesh with Komarov.

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01-18-2013, 01:54 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Chandrashekhar Limit View Post
Question for you all - if the MGK line starts firing liking '10-'11, and we are playing like crap (bottom 10), would you deal Mac or keep him?

Keeping him would mean you get 2 really good scoring lines, and dealing him would mean you can get an additional first round pick.

Personally, I would give him a 3 year contract at around the same salary. If Frattin shows he's ready for the party, I'd then move Mac the following deadline.
I would try to package Mac with Franson to a playoff contender for a first round pick

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01-18-2013, 02:00 PM
  #159
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I would try to package Mac with Franson to a playoff contender for a first round pick
I'd rather trade each of them for mid round 2nds then both of them for a late first.

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01-18-2013, 02:02 PM
  #160
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I would try to package Mac with Franson to a playoff contender for a first round pick
Mac was worth a 1st round pick by himself last year according to sources. Franson could fetch you a 1st round as well. So, we would trade both for a late 1st rounder (playoff team)? No thank you. Both are worth more to this team than what you would want back imo.

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Old
01-18-2013, 02:09 PM
  #161
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I would try to package Mac with Franson to a playoff contender for a first round pick
If Mac has a strong season a package of him and Franson would be worth well more than a 25th overall pick.

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01-18-2013, 02:12 PM
  #162
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Originally Posted by calcal798 View Post
JvR-Kadri-Komarov

That third line is more intriguing. Kadri's playmaking ability will mesh with JvR's scoring, and Kadri's ability to get under peoples skin will mesh with Komarov.
I like that line too .. Hoping JVR can break out

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Old
01-18-2013, 02:24 PM
  #163
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I like that line too .. Hoping JVR can break out
I hope so especially since hes being given a shot at top six minutes.

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Old
01-18-2013, 03:00 PM
  #164
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I would try to package Mac with Franson to a playoff contender for a first round pick
Under the circumstances I'm talking about, Mac would net a first rounder himself.

I would move him in that situation only if the team offering the first would appear to be in the 16-20 range.

Other than that, I would keep him for an additional year, and deal him at the deadline with 2.5 years left on his deal. If he continues to produce at a 50-60 pt pace, he would get a 1st + decent prospect or a good prospect with time left on his deal.

Mac's pretty safe to score 20 goals again. If Kulemin can get going again, I think it will be for good (meaning Kuly will score 50ish pts perenially), in which case Mac can bump up his production to the 50-60 pt range anually.

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01-18-2013, 03:10 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Chandrashekhar Limit View Post
Under the circumstances I'm talking about, Mac would net a first rounder himself.

I would move him in that situation only if the team offering the first would appear to be in the 16-20 range.

Other than that, I would keep him for an additional year, and deal him at the deadline with 2.5 years left on his deal. If he continues to produce at a 50-60 pt pace, he would get a 1st + decent prospect or a good prospect with time left on his deal.

Mac's pretty safe to score 20 goals again. If Kulemin can get going again, I think it will be for good (meaning Kuly will score 50ish pts perenially), in which case Mac can bump up his production to the 50-60 pt range anually.
Optimistically, we have 3 offensively solid lines and a junk 4th line:

lup-Bozak-Kes
Mac-Grab-Kul
KVR-Kad-Koma
Brown-McClem-Orr

Say what you want, but the 4th line can't play. The top 3 though - I think we won't have a problem scoring goals. Not sure if we'll finish top-10 again in goals with Carlyle's system, but we definitely won't pull and LA (in both regards).

Defense and tending makes or breaks this season. If Dion gets back to playing a meaner brand of hockey and Komi can stay in the lineup we may have a solid blueline. But if Komi plays like he has, Liles continues where he left off at the end of last year, and Holzer struggles at all, and not to mention Reimer struggles, we're in for a bottom-5 finish. I'm ok with that too.

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01-18-2013, 03:14 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by dubplatepressure View Post
Optimistically, we have 3 offensively solid lines and a junk 4th line:

lup-Bozak-Kes
Mac-Grab-Kul
KVR-Kad-Koma
Brown-McClem-Orr

Say what you want, but the 4th line can't play. The top 3 though - I think we won't have a problem scoring goals. Not sure if we'll finish top-10 again in goals with Carlyle's system, but we definitely won't pull and LA (in both regards).

Defense and tending makes or breaks this season. If Dion gets back to playing a meaner brand of hockey and Komi can stay in the lineup we may have a solid blueline. But if Komi plays like he has, Liles continues where he left off at the end of last year, and Holzer struggles at all, and not to mention Reimer struggles, we're in for a bottom-5 finish. I'm ok with that too.
Brown and McClement can't play? News to me.

Orr will have to surprise me, but I've heard positive things from camp. We'll see.

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Old
01-18-2013, 03:17 PM
  #167
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@ dubplate - Yea, I'm really not too worried about the outcome of this season. No matter where we finish, the franchise will still be in pretty good shape. With the quality of prospects we have been able to draft with late 1sts, and late picks, I'm confident our staff will do a good job of drafting no matter where we finish.

This seems like a good evaluation year. How does Kadri do in a full season? Is Reimer the real deal? Which Phaneuf is the consistent one? Can the team do well with a different system? Can Lupul keep up his first line caliber play?

If most of those answers are positive, we are looking at playoffs. If most is negative, we are looking at another top 5 pick.

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Old
01-18-2013, 03:20 PM
  #168
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Originally Posted by Chandrashekhar Limit View Post
Under the circumstances I'm talking about, Mac would net a first rounder himself.

I would move him in that situation only if the team offering the first would appear to be in the 16-20 range.

Other than that, I would keep him for an additional year, and deal him at the deadline with 2.5 years left on his deal. If he continues to produce at a 50-60 pt pace, he would get a 1st + decent prospect or a good prospect with time left on his deal.

Mac's pretty safe to score 20 goals again. If Kulemin can get going again, I think it will be for good (meaning Kuly will score 50ish pts perenially), in which case Mac can bump up his production to the 50-60 pt range anually.
That's what I was going for. I think people are highly overvaluing Franson, don't think he would net anything higher than a 3rd at the deadline. I'd rather have a guaranteed 1st over a conditional 1st+3rd.

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01-18-2013, 03:35 PM
  #169
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Brown and McClement can't play? News to me.

Orr will have to surprise me, but I've heard positive things from camp. We'll see.
You heard it here first. McClement I'd give the pass, but Orr and Brown... I mean, just compare the quality of our 4th against the LA's 4th line...

For as much fun as I have watching Orr and Brown on the ice they really don't do anything for us. I'm sad to see Orr fight now given he's seriously jeopardizing his long-term health with the risk of head injury, and for all the fun it is watching Brownie's 5 shifts and 3 hits, 1 of which may or may not be decent, he just doesn't bring anything else IMO.

You can't play them against other teams' top-2 lines, so you're really just stuck playing 4th vs 4th line, which again, just doesn't do much.

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01-18-2013, 03:41 PM
  #170
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Mcclement can play, and he will, but almost exclusively on every PK. The fourth line will not see much time imo.

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01-18-2013, 03:48 PM
  #171
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Mcclement can play, and he will, but almost exclusively on every PK. The fourth line will not see much time imo.
McClement was specifically brought in so Carlyle could use him in match-up situations. I bet he plays around 17 minutes.

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Old
01-18-2013, 03:49 PM
  #172
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I know that we've been down the Colin Wilson road before but...

If we are truly going the way of youth, which it certainly appears that we are, shouldn't we really take a hard look at this 23 year old with huge top 6 upside? Hear me out.

With the exception of our pall Hall and that other guy that they have on D, not one of their Dmen have a full year under their belts. I'm assuming that they still consider themselves a playoff contender so they may have a use for one of our eight Dmen. Liles would be a good veteran for their blue line.

Wilson not unlike Kadri is a natural C who can play wing so he could be slotted in the 1C or 2W spot that we need. Of course it's well documented that he has been in Trotz' doghouse but maybe he needs a change if scenery with more ice time.

I'm not sure if we could land him with Liles but if it's anything close to that it's rather risk free for potential huge reward. They would probably be looking for more I know but he is relatively unproven. They may want a third or something just for the salary that they are taking on.

Some may ask;won't this make our D weaker? A week D plus unproven netminders will result in a lot of GA!

Players don't tank, organizations do.

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Old
01-18-2013, 03:51 PM
  #173
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McClement was specifically brought in so Carlyle could use him in match-up situations. I bet he plays around 17 minutes.
Ya I don't see skating with Brown and Orr very long if at all. These lineups that people are posting are just guesses obviously.

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01-18-2013, 03:59 PM
  #174
KlattNazty
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I know that we've been down the Colin Wilson road before but...

If we are truly going the way of youth, which it certainly appears that we are, shouldn't we really take a hard look at this 23 year old with huge top 6 upside? Hear me out.

With the exception of our pall Hall and that other guy that they have on D, not one of their Dmen have a full year under their belts. I'm assuming that they still consider themselves a playoff contender so they may have a use for one of our eight Dmen. Liles would be a good veteran for their blue line.

Wilson not unlike Kadri is a natural C who can play wing so he could be slotted in the 1C or 2W spot that we need. Of course it's well documented that he has been in Trotz' doghouse but maybe he needs a change if scenery with more ice time.

I'm not sure if we could land him with Liles but if it's anything close to that it's rather risk free for potential huge reward. They would probably be looking for more I know but he is relatively unproven. They may want a third or something just for the salary that they are taking on.

Some may ask;won't this make our D weaker? A week D plus unproven netminders will result in a lot of GA!

Players don't tank, organizations do.
I just dont think we have the type of player they are looking for right now sadly. Unless Wilson himself takes some major steps forward, and we feel that Gardiner is worth moving for him then I dont see a fit.

They would likely want an offensively gifted player back ala Kadri, or they would want a very good defenseman. And I dont think we are in a position to do either of those things right now despite how badly I would like to add Wilson to the fold.

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01-18-2013, 04:19 PM
  #175
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I just dont think we have the type of player they are looking for right now sadly. Unless Wilson himself takes some major steps forward, and we feel that Gardiner is worth moving for him then I dont see a fit.

They would likely want an offensively gifted player back ala Kadri, or they would want a very good defenseman. And I dont think we are in a position to do either of those things right now despite how badly I would like to add Wilson to the fold.
We could go three quarters of the way there for both. Offensively gifted, MacA.....almost. 20G a season. Very good Dman, Liles...almost. Give them both.



Seriously though, they need more of a vet on D. They wouldn't bite on the above either because they are at the cap floor already, I don't think that they want to add 5 mil to their salary (including the 2 mil subtraction from Wilson's salary)

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