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ATD 2013 - Draft Thread I

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01-21-2013, 04:01 PM
  #251
Hawkey Town 18
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If I were Bubba I would've taken the chance that Stevens would still be there for my second round pick, but I guess if you want your guy you gotta make sure.

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01-21-2013, 04:01 PM
  #252
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This draft has gone wild.

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01-21-2013, 04:03 PM
  #253
tony d
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No offense to Bubba here but Stevens is a great defenseman and I had him on my short list for Round 2. Still if he wanted to build with defense there are 5 or 6 right now that I would pick before Stevens.

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01-21-2013, 04:09 PM
  #254
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vecens24 View Post
This draft has gone wild.
I like it. Before you could pretty much calculate where players would go but now you never know when a player will get taken, except when the usual suspects picks.

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01-21-2013, 04:14 PM
  #255
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I like it as well. Good for the new gm for taking somebody "off the board" Stevens is a great leader and you can't find too many guys who are tougher.

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01-21-2013, 04:16 PM
  #256
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkrx View Post
I like it. Before you could pretty much calculate where players would go but now you never know when a player will get taken, except when the usual suspects picks.
Yeah I like it as well that it's not like clockwork where guys go.

I certainly wouldn't have gone with Stevens, but that doesn't make it wrong by any means. Outside of REALLY going outside of the box, I think it's just about impossible to lose a draft in the first round.

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01-21-2013, 04:28 PM
  #257
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkey Town 18 View Post
Just wanted to remind you since this is your first ATD...make sure you send a PM to the next GM on the list after you pick to let him know it's his turn.
I did.

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Old
01-21-2013, 04:37 PM
  #258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony d View Post
No offense to Bubba here but Stevens is a great defenseman and I had him on my short list for Round 2. Still if he wanted to build with defense there are 5 or 6 right now that I would pick before Stevens.
I really wanted Bobby Clarke....taken
Next was Larry Robinson....picked right before me.

I like defense, where championships are made.

There was a short list for me at D that I was fussing over and some of them I really REALLY like, but I chose Stevens because:
- He DID have the offensive skills.
- He DID take care of business in his own end.
- He DID have a mean streak, something I covet, espceially in the slot.
- He DID lead.
- He DID win the Cup, multiple times.
- He DID win a Conn Smythe.

My short list had a lot of the same qualities, some better offensively, one better defensively, (by a nose), but not all that Stevens had. The only other one I would've picked didn't win the Cup and that was the tipping point for me.

I saw him play and I hated him but he was very, VERY good at his job.

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01-21-2013, 04:45 PM
  #259
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vecens24 View Post
This draft has gone wild.
Bizzaro world:

Quote:
7. papershoes & SchultzSquared - Kenora Thistles - Nicklas Lidstrom, D
8. DoMakc - HC Donbass - Stan Mikita, C
9. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens - Raymond Bourque, D
10. Hobnobs - Seattle Eskimos - Denis Potvin, D
11. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings - Eddie Shore, D
12. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers - Bobby Hull, LW
13. Murphy & gmm - Edmonton Mercurys - Maurice Richard, RW
14. jkrx & KingForsberg - Philadelphia Firebirds - Bryan Trottier, C
15. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionares - Red Kelly, D/C
16. tony d - Baltimore Blades - Bobby Clarke, C
17. BraveCanadian - Guelph Platers - Jaromir Jagr, RW
All so congenial. Not a single 'bad pick' or criticism comment on the board. Then again, not a lot of substantive argument either. Looking forward to some bios to justify some of those pick positions.

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Old
01-21-2013, 05:07 PM
  #260
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university of alaska selects RW Guy Lafleur.

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Old
01-21-2013, 05:08 PM
  #261
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Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Bizzaro world:


All so congenial. Not a single 'bad pick' or criticism comment on the board. Then again, not a lot of substantive argument either. Looking forward to some bios to justify some of those pick positions.
Which pick is ''bizarre''?

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Old
01-21-2013, 05:24 PM
  #262
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Originally Posted by Sturminator View Post
I don't think Morenz is overrated at #18, and I would draft him before Clarke and Trottier, but after Mikita. So I guess that means I've got him 5th among the centers. .
I would have said the exact same thing.

It would take a lot of convincing at this point for me to think of Morenz over Mikita.

Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander View Post
Bizzaro world:


All so congenial. Not a single 'bad pick' or criticism comment on the board. Then again, not a lot of substantive argument either. Looking forward to some bios to justify some of those pick positions.
I'll throw some criticism into the mix, then:

- Lidstrom over Bourque??
- Mikita over the Hull/Richard twosome?
- Potvin over Shore??

Though I really like:

- How close Jagr has gotten to Hull and Richard
- That when someone finally took a goalie, they didn't blow it

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Old
01-21-2013, 05:30 PM
  #263
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Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
I would have said the exact same thing.

It would take a lot of convincing at this point for me to think of Morenz over Mikita.
I don't really have an opinion on Mikita vs. Morenz yet necessarily. But I did research Morenz's two-way game and it seems he was a good two-way player, as shown by what's in his bio so far if you want to take a look (there's lots of undrafteds in there, so look at your own peril).

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Old
01-21-2013, 05:56 PM
  #264
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Whats actually wrong with Potvin over Shore? I just dont see the thing that puts Shore over the top.

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01-21-2013, 06:03 PM
  #265
Hawkey Town 18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Whats actually wrong with Potvin over Shore? I just dont see the thing that puts Shore over the top.
I think it's quicker (or fairer) for you to tell us what puts Potvin over the top...or even tied?


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Old
01-21-2013, 06:17 PM
  #266
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
I would have said the exact same thing.

It would take a lot of convincing at this point for me to think of Morenz over Mikita.
I realize that there is a strong statistical case for Mikita, but he just didn't get the praise of his contemporaries in the same way Morenz did, possibly because he was somewhat overshadowed by Bobby Hull.

For ATD purposes though, Mikita is really easy to build around.

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Old
01-21-2013, 06:35 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
I realize that there is a strong statistical case for Mikita, but he just didn't get the praise of his contemporaries in the same way Morenz did, possibly because he was somewhat overshadowed by Bobby Hull.

For ATD purposes though, Mikita is really easy to build around.
Now that we're all aware that Howie was also a premiere puck distributer, he should be considered fairly easy to build around as well.

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01-21-2013, 07:13 PM
  #268
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Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Whats actually wrong with Potvin over Shore? I just dont see the thing that puts Shore over the top.
Being the best player of his generation?

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01-21-2013, 07:15 PM
  #269
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Originally Posted by nik jr View Post
university of alaska selects RW Guy Lafleur.
This was the guy I was talking to when referring to Jagr.While Jagr has deserved to be ranked higher than Lafleur , I think Lafleur has gotten underrated in an ATD sense since I've been around as a GM.I don't recall Lafleur making any noise whatsoever but people shouldn't forget how dominant Lafleur was and that he was above all a great champion and a very clutch player.

As much as I respect and love guys like Clarke and Trottier , I think everybody I ever talked to who watched all these players almost invariably rank Lafleur higher than them.

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01-21-2013, 07:16 PM
  #270
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Originally Posted by Jafar View Post
This was the guy I was talking to when referring to Jagr.While Jagr has deserved to be ranked higher than Lafleur , I think Lafleur has gotten underrated in an ATD sense since I've been around as a GM.I don't recall Lafleur making any noise whatsoever but people shouldn't forget how dominant Lafleur was and that he was above all a great champion.

As much as I respect and love guys like Clarke and Trottier , everybody I ever talked to who watched the NHL in the 70s is of the opinion Lafleur was a greater player.
I rank Jagr over Lafleur on a list of "the best RWs of all-time." I'm not sure if I would draft Jagr first in this format, all things considered.

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01-21-2013, 07:18 PM
  #271
Nalyd Psycho
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jafar View Post
This was the guy I was talking to when referring to Jagr.While Jagr has deserved to be ranked higher than Lafleur , I think Lafleur has gotten underrated in an ATD sense since I've been around as a GM.I don't recall Lafleur making any noise whatsoever but people shouldn't forget how dominant Lafleur was and that he was above all a great champion and a very clutch player.

As much as I respect and love guys like Clarke and Trottier , I think everybody I ever talked to who watched all these players invariably rank Lafleur higher than them.
For his six year peak. That's the problem with Lafleur, he was really only an all-time great for a small amount of time.

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01-21-2013, 07:22 PM
  #272
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Originally Posted by Nalyd Psycho View Post
For his six year peak. That's the problem with Lafleur, he was really only an all-time great for a small amount of time.
Maybe but 6 years + all these playoffs is a decent enough sample for such domination.Lafleur was clearly one notch higher than both Trottier and Clarke that I never heard anybody really arguing that Lafleur wasn't the best between the people who actually watched those guys regularly.I can't rank ap layer above another if they played against each other and one of them was a clear notch above.Not if the notch above player happened to dominate for 6 complete years and 4 conne smythe type performances

I think we're at a point where prime is undervalued with Lafleur in the last few years.

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01-21-2013, 07:26 PM
  #273
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Originally Posted by Jafar View Post
Maybe but 6 years + all these playoffs is a decent enough sample for such domination.Lafleur was clearly one notch higher than both Trottier and Clarke that I never heard anybody really arguing that Lafleur wasn't the best between the people who actually watched those guys regularly.I can't rank ap layer above another if they played against each other and one of them was a clear notch above.Not if the notch above player happened to dominate for 6 complete years and 4 conne smythe type performances

I think we're at a point where prime is undervalued with Lafleur in the last few years.
Plus, Bobby Clarke himself was basically only playing at a superstar level for 7 seasons (1971-72 to 1977-78). But he was able to rely on his elite other skills after his offense declined.

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01-21-2013, 07:27 PM
  #274
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jafar View Post
Maybe but 6 years + all these playoffs is a decent enough sample for such domination.Lafleur was clearly one notch higher than both Trottier and Clarke that I never heard anybody really arguing that Lafleur wasn't the best between the people who actually watched those guys regularly.I can't rank ap layer above another if they played against each other and one of them was a clear notch above.Not if the notch above player happened to dominate for 6 complete years and 4 conne smythe type performances

I think we're at a point where prime is undervalued with Lafleur in the last few years.
I don't know, I just feel like his career has a lot of weak points. And for a guy who is little more than a pure offensive player, not having a longevity problem would be nice. I don't have a problem with him here, but I just don't see him as a top 20 player.

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01-21-2013, 07:35 PM
  #275
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For his six year peak. That's the problem with Lafleur, he was really only an all-time great for a small amount of time.
Yeah, Lafleur is a lot like Orr in that way.

Great peak but that's it.

At this point, if we're considering career value, Jagr is lapping him.

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