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Old
02-01-2013, 10:36 AM
  #801
Mr Forever
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^of those players listed, only Dubinsky is an upgrade over Gagner. Personally, I think we need to move Hemsky and add size to the top 6 in his spot. It looks like Gagner is proving he can be the guy to play 2C.

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02-01-2013, 10:40 AM
  #802
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Originally Posted by devils4cup View Post
Even Pittsburgh had to trade some of their top talent at some point. Ryan Whitney (as the time he was still good), Alex Goligoski, Jordan Staal. You can't really keep everybody forever. Chicago signed Hossa to a multi year while being able to keep their core.

I agree looking closer at the numbers, that maybe Corey Perry is a big ticket item that would squeeze out a significant player at some point. However, i would argue that the Oilers need a guy like Perry if they are going to have success in the playoffs.
That's insane, the Hawks had to move good pieces out because of signings like that. It's why they were less competitive after their cup.
Pens gave up Goligoski for Neal(which one would you rather on your team?), Staal was moved for picks and prospects and a #3C because he would have left for nothing when he became UFA to go to Carolina and he was stuck in the #3C hole in Pitt.

Sure the Oilers will need some size and grit but not at 7m a pop. I'm interested to see the price tag for Ryane Clowe this summer.
Personally I want the Oilers to compete for a decade not for 1 cup run and that means keeping this core together.

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Old
02-01-2013, 10:46 AM
  #803
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gooilgo View Post
That's insane, the Hawks had to move good pieces out because of signings like that. It's why they were less competitive after their cup.
Pens gave up Goligoski for Neal(which one would you rather on your team?), Staal was moved for picks and prospects and a #3C because he would have left for nothing when he became UFA to go to Carolina and he was stuck in the #3C hole in Pitt.

Sure the Oilers will need some size and grit but not at 7m a pop. I'm interested to see the price tag for Ryane Clowe this summer.
Personally I want the Oilers to compete for a decade not for 1 cup run and that means keeping this core together.
This. I'm interested in having RNH, Hall, Eberle, Yak, Smid, Schultz and Perty locked up together for a while, the interchangeable parts and role players can come and go.

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02-01-2013, 10:48 AM
  #804
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Originally Posted by Tarus View Post
He probably is.

But he has a tiny contract that really doesn't make much sense to use a compliance buyout on. If montreal wants him, they can probably get him for a mid round draft pick and it shouldn't upset their cap structure much.
HIGHLY doubt it. Belanger is a heavy lifter on this squad. Taking the most d-zone faceoffs, PKing some nights more than Horcoff, playing against tough line matchups.

If they deal him, they'll need somebody more adept than just Lander to come in. His departure would open a few holes.

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02-01-2013, 10:52 AM
  #805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
^of those players listed, only Dubinsky is an upgrade over Gagner. Personally, I think we need to move Hemsky and add size to the top 6 in his spot. It looks like Gagner is proving he can be the guy to play 2C.
I am coming to the same conclusion about Hemsky. It's no slight on his ability but I'm not sure he fits in our top 6 any more. Replacing him with a winger with size could round out the top 6.

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02-01-2013, 10:53 AM
  #806
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San Jose lacks a game breaker like Hall or Hemsky, so it's not an insane idea, but Pavelski would probably take Hemsky + 1st + Klefbom

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02-01-2013, 10:55 AM
  #807
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
This. I'm interested in having RNH, Hall, Eberle, Yak, Smid, Schultz and Perty locked up together for a while, the interchangeable parts and role players can come and go.
People sure are going to be sad when they realize those forwards won't have what it takes to win the cup.

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Old
02-01-2013, 10:56 AM
  #808
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gooilgo View Post
I am coming to the same conclusion about Hemsky. It's no slight on his ability but I'm not sure he fits in our top 6 any more. Replacing him with a winger with size could round out the top 6.
IMHO Hemsky became sort of redundant when Yak was drafted. Keep him around for a year or two but once yak matures we have to let Hemsky go and replace him with a power forward.

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:00 AM
  #809
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
People sure are going to be sad when they realize those forwards won't have what it takes to win the cup.
exactly.

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:05 AM
  #810
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Quote:
Originally Posted by devils4cup View Post
exactly.
It's quite funny. Some sort of thinking that we are going to go on a dynasty run or something. We win one cup we should be damn happy, because the odds of it happening again are slim to none.

All the teams that have won recently also made additions to their team in order to win.



But no somehow Edmonton is going to be the exception to the rule.

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:17 AM
  #811
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
It's quite funny. Some sort of thinking that we are going to go on a dynasty run or something. We win one cup we should be damn happy, because the odds of it happening again are slim to none.

All the teams that have won recently also made additions to their team in order to win.



But no somehow Edmonton is going to be the exception to the rule.
Let's examine the five most recent Stanley Cup winners:

2011-12: LA Kings
2010-11: Boston Bruins
2009-10: Chicago Blackhawks
2008-09: Pittsburgh Penguins
2007-08: Detroit Redwings

4 of these 5 teams were primarily built through the draft (Boston being the exception because of Chara). None of these 4 teams traded significant members of their drafted core. Despite his draft pedigree Jack Johnson, wasn't significant, neither were Schenn and Simmonds. Pittsburgh did everything they could to keep Staal.

If any of the three 1st overall picks, or Eberle disappoint one or two of them may be moved. If they stay on track there is almost no way to improve a team by moving them, especially if they all sign for $6 million or under.

Additions need to be made to this team but not through trading the core and overpaying for a big ticket free agent amounts to trading one of the core.

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:25 AM
  #812
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Horseradish View Post
HIGHLY doubt it. Belanger is a heavy lifter on this squad. Taking the most d-zone faceoffs, PKing some nights more than Horcoff, playing against tough line matchups.

If they deal him, they'll need somebody more adept than just Lander to come in. His departure would open a few holes.
Agreed. I've been a big Belanger supporter since the signing. His offense hasn't been there like we've hoped, but he's been fantastic defensively and gives us a guy we can put out and be confident will win the draw. That's pretty damn good for a 4th liner, and his absence would be huge. Especially if we're buying out Horcoff (can we essentially negotiate a new deal, buy him out, and then get another team to sign him and trade him back for a 7th or something?)

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:34 AM
  #813
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Quote:
Originally Posted by worraps View Post
Let's examine the five most recent Stanley Cup winners:

2011-12: LA Kings
2010-11: Boston Bruins
2009-10: Chicago Blackhawks
2008-09: Pittsburgh Penguins
2007-08: Detroit Redwings

4 of these 5 teams were primarily built through the draft (Boston being the exception because of Chara). None of these 4 teams traded significant members of their drafted core. Despite his draft pedigree Jack Johnson, wasn't significant, neither were Schenn and Simmonds. Pittsburgh did everything they could to keep Staal.

If any of the three 1st overall picks, or Eberle disappoint one or two of them may be moved. If they stay on track there is almost no way to improve a team by moving them, especially if they all sign for $6 million or under.

Additions need to be made to this team but not through trading the core and overpaying for a big ticket free agent amounts to trading one of the core.
Nobody said anything about trading the core. You add what you need to win. After you win you deal with with the issues as best you can.

If you add a few pieces in the off season you can have a 2 year run, maybe even 3. Then if a guy like Yakupov or Petry or Gagner starts asking for 5,6,7 million you decide if that player is worth keeping or you trade that player for another need. Such as the Staal for Sutter or Goligoski for Neal trades.

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:37 AM
  #814
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
People sure are going to be sad when they realize those forwards won't have what it takes to win the cup.
You don't know that. At all. They went up against the hottest team in hockey, after flying in from playing the night before and played them straight up and almost equal the whole game. And they are still babies. You have no idea how good they can become. Saying they don't have what it takes at this point is pessimistic guessing.

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Old
02-01-2013, 11:41 AM
  #815
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So I guess Loktionov has asked for a trade. He would look pretty decent as a 3rd line C

Harti/RNH/Eberle
Hall/Gagner/Hemsky
MPS/Loktionov/Yakupov
Smyth/Belanger/Petrell

This is assuming Horcoff is out for a long time

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02-01-2013, 11:51 AM
  #816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
People sure are going to be sad when they realize those forwards won't have what it takes to win the cup.
what an absolutely ridiculous comment

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Old
02-01-2013, 12:06 PM
  #817
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
People sure are going to be sad when they realize those forwards won't have what it takes to win the cup.
True because in the NHL I find that Elite Talent is rarely any kind of key to success or winning

Wow

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02-01-2013, 12:12 PM
  #818
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Originally Posted by gooilgo View Post
That's insane, the Hawks had to move good pieces out because of signings like that. It's why they were less competitive after their cup.
Pens gave up Goligoski for Neal(which one would you rather on your team?), Staal was moved for picks and prospects and a #3C because he would have left for nothing when he became UFA to go to Carolina and he was stuck in the #3C hole in Pitt.

Sure the Oilers will need some size and grit but not at 7m a pop. I'm interested to see the price tag for Ryane Clowe this summer.
Personally I want the Oilers to compete for a decade not for 1 cup run and that means keeping this core together.
Totally agree

Quote:
Originally Posted by dustrock View Post
San Jose lacks a game breaker like Hall or Hemsky, so it's not an insane idea, but Pavelski would probably take Hemsky + 1st + Klefbom
Lets be realistic, this is not going to happen and Klefbom is to improtant to the future of this team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
People sure are going to be sad when they realize those forwards won't have what it takes to win the cup.
Its going to be a hard fact to swallow for some fans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nugie Boy View Post
So I guess Loktionov has asked for a trade. He would look pretty decent as a 3rd line C

Harti/RNH/Eberle
Hall/Gagner/Hemsky
MPS/Loktionov/Yakupov
Smyth/Belanger/Petrell

This is assuming Horcoff is out for a long time
What part did you miss about the Oilers needing size and for Loktionov to be effective he would have to be a top 6 player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jadeddog View Post
what an absolutely ridiculous comment
Nothing ridiculous about it, the Oilers are going to need size up front to compete in the Western Conference and they're going to need a least 2 top 6 forwards. Someone will have to go, Hemsky will be one and most likely Gagner. I'll get flamed for this one, but Yakupov could be another.

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Old
02-01-2013, 12:16 PM
  #819
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Originally Posted by dustrock View Post
San Jose lacks a game breaker like Hall or Hemsky, so it's not an insane idea, but Pavelski would probably take Hemsky + 1st + Klefbom
Marleau? Havlat?

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02-01-2013, 12:38 PM
  #820
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Lucic or Horton.... Thats what the Oilers need. All this other pavelski or X small forward is garbage.

I'd trade Hall straight up for Lucic. Would Boston, doubtful.. call me crazy.

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02-01-2013, 12:39 PM
  #821
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Originally Posted by Uncle Grouchy Smurf View Post
Lucic or Horton.... Thats what the Oilers need. All this other pavelski or X small forward is garbage.

I'd trade Hall straight up for Lucic. call me crazy.
That's beyound crazy, it's a solid way to set your Franchise back.

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Old
02-01-2013, 12:44 PM
  #822
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That's beyound crazy, it's a solid way to set your Franchise back.

I dont agree... Discuss

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02-01-2013, 12:46 PM
  #823
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
People sure are going to be sad when they realize those forwards won't have what it takes to win the cup.
Are you serious? I would take a huge bet that this Core wins a cup within 5 years.

If that group of forwards when mature are not capable of winning a cup than no team is........

Let me guess you want guys who are all 6'6 and 240.......Sharks are the biggest team in the NHL and they are perinial playoff flops.

People on this board think there is some perfect mix for Cup winners.....sadly there is not.....there is a reason no team has defended their Cup in over 12 years.

Oilers have to find a way to beat teams with the core we have and tweak the small pieces.

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Old
02-01-2013, 12:52 PM
  #824
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We have to keep what we have and start after this season to replace players that are redundent. Management has to realize that we need some size in the top 6 and more grit in the bottom 6. Harti has been playing very well the last few games in that role. When Jones comes back that will add the depth to the bottom 6. Hemsky is good but not what we need in the top 6. Gagner is really proven himself but again he is not what we need in the top 6. The best thing is hopefully after this season both Hemsky and Gagner are at an all time high for trade. You then look at trading for the type of players that we need in our top 6.

I am actually happy with our dmen. I think it is time for Whitney to carry on as we can't afford to pay him what he will want. Need a dman to play with Fistric and of course resign him and Smid and I will be happy with or dmen.

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Old
02-01-2013, 12:54 PM
  #825
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Originally Posted by Uncle Grouchy Smurf View Post
I dont agree... Discuss
You're trading an ELITE talent, team leader and game breaker for a complimentry player.

Lucic has size and can score, but doesn't bring close to what Hall brings on a nightly basis.

This would be similar to trading Justin Schultz for Dion Phaneuf because you like Celine's "physicality"

It would set your franchise back, no question. It's beyond a terrible idea.

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