HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Washington Capitals
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Capitals vs Canadiens (Doom & Gloom #3 Edition).1.24.13.7:00 PM EST

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-25-2013, 09:57 AM
  #676
BiPolar Caps
Emotionally Wounded!
 
BiPolar Caps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 5,773
vCash: 500
Positives:

Come TDL we won't be faced with that perennial dilemma this year of whether we should be buyers or sellers. Should we be sellers and f the playoffs or are we just missing one or two players that will get us deep in the playoffs, so we can end up picking this years version of Joe Corvo or the real Joe Corvo.

BiPolar Caps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 10:12 AM
  #677
swimmer77
Post Oates
 
swimmer77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: in water
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 3,395
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BTCG View Post
Well,

If I am on to something, or not... there's an old adage we had in the electronic servicing business:

Stick to the area of the problem. The customer's color isn't working... don't be looking in the vertical circuit for the problem. ETC.

Same thing here. The talking heads are all saying this... let's uncover who is deliberately under-performing. This is the root issue.
Just curious but can you honestly say there is a lack of effort?

swimmer77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 10:12 AM
  #678
BiPolar Caps
Emotionally Wounded!
 
BiPolar Caps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 5,773
vCash: 500
It's one thing to **** the bed and have a few players play horribly and perhaps you can blame that on learning a new system or the coaches, but these are professionals and at some point at least individually you should see someone's hockey IQ kick in or be on displayed and I've seen none of that.

My immediate reaction is that McPhee's head has to be on the chopping block. He's the architect of this team. Nothing against Ribeiro, but why bring in such a guy if you are not going to keep Semin, it just makes no sense. They would have complimented each other and strengthened the second line. Right now we would have been better off not making that trade only because Ribeiro will probably walk after this season due to lack of supporting cast.

McPhee needs to depart no later than the end of February in order to give the new GM time to assess the team and make some moves before the April 3rd TDL.

BiPolar Caps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 10:16 AM
  #679
BiPolar Caps
Emotionally Wounded!
 
BiPolar Caps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 5,773
vCash: 500
Sad commentary on this team is that Joe/Locker had Mike Green as player of the game. I guess they were evaluating his performance based on how it had improved from his game against Winnipeg.

BiPolar Caps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 10:40 AM
  #680
RandyHolt
Capitals Station
 
RandyHolt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: Poland
Posts: 24,577
vCash: 1300
maybe they chose green because there was no one else. Speaking of him, I think its time to try someone with a quicker hands and mind atopthebrella

You want Ovi to score? If he is not even getting good looks on the PP, don't expect much at even strength. PPGs get the confidence going and is the gateway to a player scoring more at ES. Goals largely come in waves; no 40G guy will score one every other game the entire year.

It's all mental. They players are trying up to their standard willingness to do so. It's just their brains appear overloaded, and there is no cohesion yet in the camp free season.

Oates should tell them to go play like Bruce did and enjoy overnight success.

RandyHolt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 10:46 AM
  #681
BTCG
Registered User
 
BTCG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,371
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by swimmer77 View Post
Just curious but can you honestly say there is a lack of effort?
Read it again..I didnt make the claim.

BTCG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 10:54 AM
  #682
BTCG
Registered User
 
BTCG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,371
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
maybe they chose green because there was no one else. Speaking of him, I think its time to try someone with a quicker hands and mind atopthebrella

You want Ovi to score? If he is not even getting good looks on the PP, don't expect much at even strength. PPGs get the confidence going and is the gateway to a player scoring more at ES. Goals largely come in waves; no 40G guy will score one every other game the entire year.

It's all mental. They players are trying up to their standard willingness to do so. It's just their brains appear overloaded, and there is no cohesion yet in the camp free season.

Oates should tell them to go play like Bruce did and enjoy overnight success.
Randy,

Oates himself said they're not "showing up."

In addition, the CSN crew reiterated it.

That's not being overwhelmed... stick to the area of the problem.

BTCG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:04 AM
  #683
BobRouse
Registered User
 
BobRouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,703
vCash: 500
As far as the "lack of camp" and "new coach/new system" excuse goes...

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the same issues effect the Habs?? Plus they were missing their best Dman. On top of it they were a terrible team last year and didn't make huge roster changes.

BobRouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:06 AM
  #684
I Am Score*
---BradD---
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Country: United States
Posts: 1,666
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobRouse View Post
As far as the "lack of camp" and "new coach/new system" excuse goes...

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't the same issues effect the Habs?? Plus they were missing their best Dman. On top of it they were a terrible team last year and didn't make huge roster changes.
They realized "hey we don't have Subban" and "hey Markov is back now" and actually gave an eff.

We might have to have Ovechkin get suspended to actually do something this season.

I Am Score* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:09 AM
  #685
RandyHolt
Capitals Station
 
RandyHolt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: Poland
Posts: 24,577
vCash: 1300
Oates is pinning it on the players effort level heh. Koken too. I tend to believe the opposite of anything a coach says, since they rarely take blame.

Did anyone ask him why he had Riberio out for a critical early game PK FO? We are not scoring much so he should focus on doing all he can on the PK. Which sucks arse instead.

I suspect Oates didn't touch on complexity of the systems changes he is implementing, the volume of changes, nor the limited amount of time to implement them. He will never touch on the ability of individuals to digest said changes. The players may not see things his way just yet. Did he mean mental effort? Maybe its mental capacity at this point.

I suspect there was no admission about his questionable use of personnel on the PK to start the game, the timeout etc. A fragile team not scoring, giving up an early goal, its a back breaker.

I call bunk on effort. Its too easy a talking point. Like Bruce yelling at the players, JUST OUT WERK EM... it rings hollow and rings of a coach desperate to keep his job.


Last edited by RandyHolt: 01-25-2013 at 11:15 AM.
RandyHolt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:10 AM
  #686
tycoonheart
Registered User
 
tycoonheart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,717
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
You want Ovi to score? If he is not even getting good looks on the PP, don't expect much at even strength.
THIS! THIS! THIS AND THIS!

He was rendered useless on the PP because our PP design is awful. They pass the pack around on the other side and that is it. I see Ovi moving around trying to find space on the left side, but there wasn't anything he could do because our PP system does not create any space for Ovi to take a shot.

It was kinda sad watching Ovi wait by himself while the puck is getting pass around between Nicky and Green, back and forth... back and forth... back and forth.

Fix the PP, fix the PK. This team would probably more competitive.

tycoonheart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:12 AM
  #687
I Am Score*
---BradD---
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Country: United States
Posts: 1,666
vCash: 500
When you rely so heavily on one player for so long and he ends up not producing, it's hard to win games.

If Stamkos suddenly stopped scoring Tampa would be one of the worst teams in the league. Pittsburgh has two stars, which makes it easier if one slacks. If Giroux stopped, Flyers would be that much worse.

You're missing the key "excitement" the Caps used to play with. That's because Ovechkin no longer makes disgusting goals, Green no longer shoots top shelf above the glove, and Backstrom no longer sets up complete destruction in passes to his teammates.

The young guys that were supposed to make a difference are not producing, the defensive corp is weak and our forwards are below average in general. You move your young 2nd line center to the 1st wing after replacing him and refuse to even use him as a third line center.

And the goalie that was supposed to be hyped as one of the NHLs next best, plays awful. His backup doesn't play much better, but when he does the defense eventually folds.

Then everyone blames it on the goalie.

I Am Score* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:14 AM
  #688
Langway
Moderator
Intangibles
 
Langway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,869
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BTCG View Post
The core group wishes to be rid of George McPhee.
I think we need to back up first to the what before the why. The players themselves also ripped their own effort so it's been set up on a tee for writers and talking heads to amplify. I don't see any signs of Hunter's defensive systems, be it man at 5v5 or the PK. I see the same slow, lazy and generally ineffective forecheck and that's about it. I don't think dogging it in solidarity with your supposed leader is tolerable under any circumstance. In any event, even if McPhee were to be fired I tend to doubt the general philosophy behind their moves would change a whole lot as most of that 'vision' is dictated by Leonsis.

More likely IMO: this core group doesn't care about the consequences of not putting in the necessary work to win. They're used to the regular season largely coming easy to them thanks to deep rosters once compiled by McPhee. Not having a deeper skilled lineup has changed the bent of the roster which hasn't been smoothed over at all by better habits. They have long been less than the sum of their parts even with those deeper teams and will continue to be as long as they don't respect the game. McPhee trying to compensate for that by adding marginal grinders left and right just complicates the issue further.

What impact players they do have don't appear to hold one another truly accountable for being prepared and focused. (Perhaps because to talk in such a manner credibly above mere frustration it must first be applied to yourself.) The longer this goes on and Ovechkin doesn't at least produce offensively the more he becomes an organizational distraction. He is the elephant in the room. Regardless of any other dysfunction it's on him to be supremely prepared and lead. He isn't doing that. As an organization they have babied that guy his entire career and are reaping the consequences of it. They have challenged him now and then half-heartedly but they have utterly failed to spur any on-ice maturation whatsoever. It's a two-way street, of course, but it's headed down the wrong path. Putting him back at LW is like throwing up their hands.

I don't think there's an easy answer aside from the core group taking responsibility for their game and making a positive consistent impact. I don't expect a true 100% effort any time soon under the circumstances. That first requires a higher level of preparation than they've shown and this has the look of a team that's almost beaten before they step on the ice.

Langway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:15 AM
  #689
Capitlols
Registered User
 
Capitlols's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 10,574
vCash: 500
If your truly a great player, a generational talent, you don't just stop scoring. Frankly, OV looks like he lost his passion for the game.

Capitlols is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:16 AM
  #690
Chimaera
same ol' Caps
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: La Plata, Maryland
Country: United States
Posts: 21,900
vCash: 500
Be rid of McPhee? The core of posters maybe. But I don't think any of the players care one hoot who the GM is.

Chimaera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:19 AM
  #691
I Am Score*
---BradD---
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Country: United States
Posts: 1,666
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Langway View Post
I think we need to back up first to the what before the why. The players themselves also ripped their own effort so it's been set up on a tee for writers and talking heads to amplify. I don't see any signs of Hunter's defensive systems, be it man at 5v5 or the PK. I see the same slow, lazy and generally ineffective forecheck and that's about it. I don't think dogging it in solidarity with your supposed leader is tolerable under any circumstance. In any event, even if McPhee were to be fired I tend to doubt the general philosophy behind their moves would change a whole lot as most of that 'vision' is dictated by Leonsis.
.
McPhee is the one who put the whole "lets suck and just draft all our players and not do any worthwhile offseason moves"

In comparison with the NFL, the same is with the Pittsburgh Steelers. They draft their players nonstop, win a championship or get close to one, then when everyone ages or not producing they fall off the wagon.

Then they refuse to pick up any young players to help and continue with mediocracy. They don't pick up young guys, they plug the holes with veterans.

The Steelers did this with Plaxico Burress and the OT from the Dallas Cowboys who did not make an impact at all.'
The Capitals are doing this with guys like Roman Hamrlik and Eric Fehr. The difference between these teams are that the Capitals do not win when it matters. They had their chance and now it's slipping away.

GMGM is just lucky Brouwer worked out or he would already be gone.

I Am Score* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:23 AM
  #692
tycoonheart
Registered User
 
tycoonheart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,717
vCash: 500
That directive came from Ted. He is the one who told McPhee he'd like to build a team from the draft and not spend money on free agents. He's having Ernie Grunfeld do the same with the Wizards.

Edit: Oops, meant Ernie.

tycoonheart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:24 AM
  #693
I Am Score*
---BradD---
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Country: United States
Posts: 1,666
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tycoonheart View Post
That directive came from Ted. He is the one who told McPhee he'd like to build a team from the draft and not spend money on free agents. He's having Eddie Jordan do the same with the Wizards.
I wonder how that's working with the Wizards.

I'm just saying, it's his job to fix the holes and not just plug them with silly putty.

You're right that the directive came from Ted, but I mean that the "no tolerance" for outside young players is being still driven by McPhee. If he actually gave a **** about keeping his job he would realize that and stop picking up guys like Roman Hamrlik.

I don't know if it's his pride or what. You can bring in young guys and build them, it's not that hard. Clearly our team is better with Brooks Laich. Guess where came from? Oh, a trade. Take note GMGM, make worthwhile moves again damnit.

I Am Score* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:25 AM
  #694
bib
#believe
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 3,488
vCash: 500
It's always a bad sign when a team is getting sorely outplayed, and the coach freezes up on the bench.

I suspect that the Caps brass (and a few of its players) didn't know how good they had it under Boudreau.




Oh well, you live you learn. Oates has a long way to go.

bib is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:27 AM
  #695
tycoonheart
Registered User
 
tycoonheart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,717
vCash: 500
The players had stopped playing for Bruce though. You have two options at that point: 1) Get rid of the coach, 2) Get rid of the core of the team.

The easiest option is 1, because you still have a talented team. Option 1 is also the only option they had because they are not interested in letting go of the core.

tycoonheart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:28 AM
  #696
I Am Score*
---BradD---
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Country: United States
Posts: 1,666
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tycoonheart View Post
The players had stopped playing for Bruce though. You have two options at that point: 1) Get rid of the coach, 2) Get rid of the core of the team.

The easiest option is 1, because you still have a talented team. Option 1 is also the only option they had because they are not interested in letting go of the core.
That's the problem though.

Spoiled ****ing brats in my mind.

I Am Score* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:30 AM
  #697
Capitlols
Registered User
 
Capitlols's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Country: United States
Posts: 10,574
vCash: 500
Speaking of the coaches, Calle Johasson in particular looks like he's in over his head.

Capitlols is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:31 AM
  #698
BobRouse
Registered User
 
BobRouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 6,703
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tycoonheart View Post
The players had stopped playing for Bruce though. You have two options at that point: 1) Get rid of the coach, 2) Get rid of the core of the team.

The easiest option is 1, because you still have a talented team. Option 1 is also the only option they had because they are not interested in letting go of the core.
Doesn't look like they are playing for Oates either eh?

Constantly blaming coaches entrenches the players in their mindset and sends a bad message IMO.

Besides..who brought all these coaches aboard?? Who's bright idea was it to hire an inexperienced coaching staff for a team in our position?

BobRouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:32 AM
  #699
tycoonheart
Registered User
 
tycoonheart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 4,717
vCash: 500
Was Calle even coaching before they hired him here? What was he doing, anyone know?

tycoonheart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-25-2013, 11:32 AM
  #700
IkeaMonkey*
HF Hall of Famer
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: derderderderderderde
Country: Sao Tome e Principe
Posts: 12,073
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capitlols View Post
Speaking of the coaches, Calle Johasson in particular looks like he's in over his head.
What group is he coaching again?

IkeaMonkey* is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:44 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.