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01-25-2013, 10:57 AM
  #101
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Originally Posted by Cspeirs4 View Post
Two words for next Neal type of deal: Blake Wheeler. 2.55m cap hit, RFA at end of season. Would be perfect fit on 87's line; great speed, good set of hands, get gritty against the opponents D, somewhat physical. A lot like Neal actually but with a right handed shot. Might be hard to pry out of Winnipeg though.
Winnipeg actually needs defense, even before considering what will be a contentious RFA negotiation with Bogosian.

Wheeler . . . he's the type I could see with Despres, where maybe you add a pair of kids like Jeffrey/Tangradi and send them somewhere where they'll get a chance and actually have the leash length to learn.

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01-25-2013, 10:58 AM
  #102
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I don't think Ottawa is going to get any better. I could see them moving one of Michalek or Alfie. They aren't UFAs though but at least in Alfredsson case who knows if they are able to give him another chance at the cup. The guy isn't getting any younger. Actually I could see the addition of one of those two guys and Phillips (as a #5 /strong PK guy) being a move that puts us over the top, although it may be a little pricey. Plus I think it's always nice to have those older guys that are hungry for that one last cup win.

Maybe I am thinking too ahead though. This might be a move for next season and not this season but just a few thoughts.

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01-25-2013, 10:59 AM
  #103
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I'm not following the narrative. I think they want playoff success now. Their biggest need is a partner for Pietrangelo. I think they'll move a forward to make it happen. Whether we have that D-man or not, we'll see.
They wouldn't do it with us, for Niskanen. They are not going to see Niskanen as that top pairing partner for Petro, the guy you go out of your way to make a deal to add.

IMO, the only Penguin defenseman who really would get their attention right now is Orpik. They won't want Martin, unless the Pens ate part of his salary.

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01-25-2013, 11:03 AM
  #104
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Winnipeg can't afford to lose Wheeler. As great as he'd be here, not even worth discussing IMO.

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01-25-2013, 11:09 AM
  #105
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The Blues have a Letang. His name's Pietrangelo.

People still don't buy Niskanen is a top 4 guy. Guess it'll take more games to convince the naysayers.
I see your point. At the same time, and I'm kind of going back on my own point here, that doesn't really affect his trade value. In other words you don't get more for a player because they happen to have something that compliments him better than other teams. Yeah, to be honest it will take me a few more games. I thought when he played more minutes due to injuries before it was a mixed bag. Some (most?) disagree, so we shall see.

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01-25-2013, 11:19 AM
  #106
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With Petro, Shattenkirk, Cole, Russell, and Berglund ALSO as impending RFA's (for a team with a budget), the immediate emergence of Tarasenko, and a **** load of offensive talent throughout the rest of their organization, I see Stewart as the expendable guy.

I still don't know about now. I still agree that a rental and then moving Stewart over the summer is a lot more likely.

I don't see why in the world the Blues ever would have interest in Tangradi. IF it were me and I were the Blues making an in season move with Stewart, I'd be interested in TK, Niskanen, and one of Maata or Harrington. You get a body to replace Stewart. You add depth to the defense right now and have a cap friendly deal for him where four of your defensive starters are RFA's (maybe even upgrade it a little). And, you get a defensive prospect of the caliber that is in relatively short supply in your organization.

Still don't see it, but not inconceivable.
In my eyes, Tangradi is a cheap option for them on the bottom six. Stewart is on the 3rd line and given his limited minutes, Tangradi has the potential to fill that role @ a very cheap cost for them. They're a very cost-conscious team and would believe that if they have the opportunity to save $$$, they will. Tangradi may be written off as a top 6 but he can still be an ideal bottom six player with size. I don't see him playing on our 3rd line with Sutter but as a 4th liner, he's a wasted asset. We'd be better off trading him than putting him there. Vitale is a perfect example of a 4th liner for us. Uher will probably end up there too eventually.

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01-25-2013, 11:21 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Cspeirs4 View Post
Two words for next Neal type of deal: Blake Wheeler. 2.55m cap hit, RFA at end of season. Would be perfect fit on 87's line; great speed, good set of hands, get gritty against the opponents D, somewhat physical. A lot like Neal actually but with a right handed shot. Might be hard to pry out of Winnipeg though.
Not a fan of Wheeler, always found him to be on the lazy side. Also Bruins fans always said he was far from physical

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01-25-2013, 11:23 AM
  #108
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I see your point. At the same time, and I'm kind of going back on my own point here, that doesn't really affect his trade value. In other words you don't get more for a player because they happen to have something that compliments him better than other teams. Yeah, to be honest it will take me a few more games. I thought when he played more minutes due to injuries before it was a mixed bag. Some (most?) disagree, so we shall see.
My point was that Pietrangelo could use someone who can help get him going offensively. Niskanen is a guy who knows how to play with a #1. He did it in Dallas and is doing it again here. He can match up with top lines, play on the PP and is at a small caphit. He could be retained at an affordable contract for the Blues as well.

I agree that it'd take more than just him to nab Stewart. Adding a guy like TK to help replace the offense lost in the bottom six. And another D prospect like Harrington would get DA thinking pretty hard IMO.

I think Niskanen is well on his way to proving alot of people who called him an average 3rd pairing guy to be dead wrong.

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01-25-2013, 11:23 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by SprootsMasterFlex View Post
In my eyes, Tangradi is a cheap option for them on the bottom six. Stewart is on the 3rd line and given his limited minutes, Tangradi has the potential to fill that role @ a very cheap cost for them. They're a very cost-conscious team and would believe that if they have the opportunity to save $$$, they will. Tangradi may be written off as a top 6 but he can still be an ideal bottom six player with size. I don't see him playing on our 3rd line with Sutter but as a 4th liner, he's a wasted asset. We'd be better off trading him than putting him there. Vitale is a perfect example of a 4th liner for us. Uher will probably end up there too eventually.
Okay so you're the Blues GM. I'll try to sell you on Tangradi. Here goes:

"Yeah I know he had a hard time in the top 6 but that was just an experiment! Sure his first few strides are horrible, and frankly he doesn't put up any points so far and rarely hits, but we like him a lot for your bottom 6! So how about Tangradi as a little sweetener to put this deal over the edge?! Eh? EH?"

Convinced?

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01-25-2013, 11:25 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
My point was that Pietrangelo could use someone who can help get him going offensively. Niskanen is a guy who knows how to play with a #1. He did it in Dallas and is doing it again here. He can match up with top lines, play on the PP and is at a small caphit. He could be retained at an affordable contract for the Blues as well.

I agree that it'd take more than just him to nab Stewart. Adding a guy like TK to help replace the offense lost in the bottom six. And another D prospect like Harrington would get DA thinking pretty hard IMO.

I think Niskanen is well on his way to proving alot of people who called him an average 3rd pairing guy to be dead wrong.
Stewart's had an interesting, checkered career so far with injuries and production. I actually like Perron better than him but I'm not completely sold on that. I'd rather have Perron at this point though. Seems like most people like Stewart though.

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01-25-2013, 11:26 AM
  #111
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Okay so you're the Blues GM. I'll try to sell you on Tangradi. Here goes:

"Yeah I know he had a hard time in the top 6 but that was just an experiment! Sure his first few strides are horrible, and frankly he doesn't put up any points so far and rarely hits, but we like him a lot for your bottom 6! So how about Tangradi as a little sweetener to put this deal over the edge?! Eh? EH?"

Convinced?
Sold how about a conditional 7th Ray?

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01-25-2013, 11:29 AM
  #112
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Stewart's had an interesting, checkered career so far with injuries and production. I actually like Perron better than him but I'm not completely sold on that. I'd rather have Perron at this point though. Seems like most people like Stewart though.
Both would be a Godsend. I just think Shero is looking for Sid's Neal, ideally. Stewart fits that description perfectly. And he'd slide right onto our PP as the net front presence.

I think size is as important as skill in our top 6. Why I'd prefer Stewart.

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01-25-2013, 11:40 AM
  #113
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Winnipeg can't afford to lose Wheeler. As great as he'd be here, not even worth discussing IMO.
Yah I mentioned this in the trade thread... Winnipeg has plenty of space and are probably looking to buy / further upgrade their team, not sell off big offensive pieces of their roster.

Wheeler is one of their best (if not the best considering last year's performance) offensive player. Although not necessarily the most skilled. He's the only power forward type they have. He's going to stay there for as long as he continues to play well and as long as the finances are OK.

We have a better chance of trading for someone like Ryan or Clowe (even though neither of those are likely either). Those teams are deep enough and have potential need for some of our young assets, that it's at least plausible though not likely as mentioned. With Wheeler it's not even plausible IMO. Not because he's untouchable talent or anything but because it would be a guaranteed case of swapping a smaller problem for a bigger one in Winnipeg's case. We can't give them anyone that would come close to replacing Wheeler while giving them the D assets they need at the same time.

I continue to think EDM is the very best and most likely trading partner out there. They have a glut of young forward talent including 4 guys who may end up all-star caliber players on big contracts, and they also have a dearth of defensive depth. They're still building and they have cap space too. There are a number of ways we could make a trade with EDM. Don't know if that would mean Hemsky or MPS or a much bigger payment for someone like Hall (them thinking they won't be able to pay all four of them big money and keep a deep roster a few years down the road), but I think they're the ones we'll trade with, if it happens.


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01-25-2013, 11:41 AM
  #114
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Both would be a Godsend. I just think Shero is looking for Sid's Neal, ideally. Stewart fits that description perfectly. And he'd slide right onto our PP as the net front presence.

I think size is as important as skill in our top 6. Why I'd prefer Stewart.
I still think Stewart is a deal more likely to happen this summer than this season. Then, with Petro, Shattenkirk, Cole, Russell, and Berglund as RFA's (not to mention Stewart), they'll probably look to move Stewart in exchange for affordable organizational depth on defense. That's when Stewart centered around something like Despres would interest them, IMO.

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01-25-2013, 11:41 AM
  #115
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Both would be a Godsend. I just think Shero is looking for Sid's Neal, ideally. Stewart fits that description perfectly. And he'd slide right onto our PP as the net front presence.

I think size is as important as skill in our top 6. Why I'd prefer Stewart.
Agreed about Stewart, maybe last year Shero should have been more aggressive since he was in Hitchcock's dog house

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01-25-2013, 11:42 AM
  #116
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Agreed about Stewart, maybe last year Shero should have been more aggressive since he was in Hitchcock's dog house
About Stewart or just in general?

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01-25-2013, 11:42 AM
  #117
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Yah I mentioned this in the trade thread... Winnipeg has plenty of space and are probably looking to buy / further upgrade their team, not sell off big offensive pieces of their roster.

Wheeler is their best offensive player (although not necessarily the most skilled / highest upside) right now, and he's the only power forward type they have. He's going to stay there for as long as he continues to play well and as long as the finances are OK.
You don't consider Evander Kane a power forward for them?

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01-25-2013, 11:42 AM
  #118
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My point was that Pietrangelo could use someone who can help get him going offensively. Niskanen is a guy who knows how to play with a #1. He did it in Dallas and is doing it again here. He can match up with top lines, play on the PP and is at a small caphit. He could be retained at an affordable contract for the Blues as well.

I agree that it'd take more than just him to nab Stewart. Adding a guy like TK to help replace the offense lost in the bottom six. And another D prospect like Harrington would get DA thinking pretty hard IMO.

I think Niskanen is well on his way to proving alot of people who called him an average 3rd pairing guy to be dead wrong.
I think a package involving TK & Niskanen would be sufficient to get Stewart. Adding a prospect like Harrington is massive overpayment unless they're sending something else back our way like Rattie. Harrington and Rattie are of equal value in my opinion. If I had the choice, I'd rather give up Maatta than Harrington.


I also wanted to mention that I recall St. Louis being the team that was most interested in acquiring/signing Kennedy during his contract dispute with the Pens. Should that be the case, I would assume that they'd still be interested and an offer involving TK & Niskanen could make Armstrong bite.

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01-25-2013, 11:43 AM
  #119
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You don't consider Evander Kane a power forward for them?
Nah, Kane's a cash money forward to them.

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01-25-2013, 11:45 AM
  #120
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About Stewart or just in general?
Stewart especially. Looking back at the last deadline and the ridiculous price's being asked by teams I could understand why Shero didn't move but now were still at that same place and needing of a top 6 winger so it's just a matter of time Ray has no choice now

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01-25-2013, 11:46 AM
  #121
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Stewart especially. Looking back at the last deadline and the ridiculous price's being asked by teams I could understand why Shero didn't move but now were still at that same place and needing of a top 6 winger so it's just a matter of time Ray has no choice now
I thought there was no choice last year, so I'll just hope you're right now and leave it there.

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01-25-2013, 11:51 AM
  #122
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After skimming through the Blues forum, it seems that they have a need for a 3rd line center rather than at wing (since they have an overload of wingers). Therefore, perhaps Jeffrey would have to be included in a package deal rather than Kennedy?

Despres (or Niskanen) + Jeffery + (a conditional pick or mid prospect)?

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01-25-2013, 11:52 AM
  #123
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Stewart especially. Looking back at the last deadline and the ridiculous price's being asked by teams I could understand why Shero didn't move but now were still at that same place and needing of a top 6 winger so it's just a matter of time Ray has no choice now
I agree but luckily for Shero, the premium is more on D (specifically top 4 or yound cheap D) than any other position.

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01-25-2013, 11:53 AM
  #124
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I think a package involving TK & Niskanen would be sufficient to get Stewart. Adding a prospect like Harrington is massive overpayment unless they're sending something else back our way like Rattie. Harrington and Rattie are of equal value in my opinion. If I had the choice, I'd rather give up Maatta than Harrington.


I also wanted to mention that I recall St. Louis being the team that was most interested in acquiring/signing Kennedy during his contract dispute with the Pens. Should that be the case, I would assume that they'd still be interested and an offer involving TK & Niskanen could make Armstrong bite.
I'd be fine with Niskanen+Kennedy+Harrington for Stewart. If he continues his pace to start the season, that's what it'll take.

From a Blues perspective, they can slide D'Agostini into Stewart's spot, have TK on their 4th line, get a guy to pair with their #1 and a high end D prospect to give their organization some depth at that position.

Makes sense to me. Again, unless they can get their top 4 guy via picks and futures, I'm not seeing a whole lot of other options for them.

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01-25-2013, 11:56 AM
  #125
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You don't consider Evander Kane a power forward for them?
Wheeler has 3 or 4 inches and probably 25-30 lbs on Kane (not sure what their current weights are but that's my guess). While Kane is an aggressive player, the times I've watched him he's more likely to try and motor through a defense with moves and dekes, than he is a power forward who tries to muscle up on people around the net or down low.

He's not big enough to do that (even though he's strong on his skates), as most top pairing NHL D are bigger than he is. But there aren't too many guys out there comparable to his style either, I'll say that.

Bottom line: Wheeler (and Kane) are going to be there for a long time. That's the core of their offense right now. Basically a two man core with some veteran skill guys (Ladd, Little) and spare parts. They're not going to be traded for defensive depth and picks. Simple as that. I could see them trading someone like Burmistrov possibly as he's starting to flirt with "needs a change in venue" territory, but he's not a sure thing for us either / might end up in the AHL because he doesn't do the defensive stuff well enough to not be a scorer on this roster. He's strictly a one-way player what I've seen of him and not a consistent one.

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