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Sheahan vs Coyle

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01-27-2013, 03:02 PM
  #1
newfy
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Sheahan vs Coyle

Whats the difference betweent hese 2 that makes some list Coyle as a very highly rated prospect and Sheahan doesnt get any at all? I'll start by saying I think both are most likely third liners in the NHL. In the NCAA their production was pretty similar, this year in the AHL its pretty much the exact same and Sheahan is better defensively. Sheahan was drafted higher in the same draft as well. Coyle produced big time on the most stacked offensively team in the CHL but I think most junior guys that size that were fist rounders would score at that rate with those guys

I'm not saying Sheahan is better, just that theyre comparable but I'm wondering what the difference is between the 2 that makes one get so much attention? What am I missing?

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01-27-2013, 03:11 PM
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Sheahan never scored very much at Notre Dame. Some have tried to claim that the Irish don't score much and that depresses his numbers. Frankly I disagree with that. Mario Lucia is hovering near a point per game for the Irish. Sheahan's numbers are 17-37 goal-games played, 22-40, 25-37.

Coyle had 26-37 as a freshman and 14-16 before leaving for Saint John.

Frankly for me there isn't too much to choose between them. Both are relatively the same size, big and skilled. Coyle showed better in his brief time in school, which is where I saw them mostly. Both have almost identical AHL numbers. I'd say they are fairly even but based on what I saw in college I'd take Coyle.

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01-27-2013, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Sheahan never scored very much at Notre Dame. Some have tried to claim that the Irish don't score much and that depresses his numbers. Frankly I disagree with that. Mario Lucia is hovering near a point per game for the Irish. Sheahan's numbers are 17-37 goal-games played, 22-40, 25-37.

Coyle had 26-37 as a freshman and 14-16 before leaving for Saint John.

Frankly for me there isn't too much to choose between them. Both are relatively the same size, big and skilled. Coyle showed better in his brief time in school, which is where I saw them mostly. Both have almost identical AHL numbers. I'd say they are fairly even but based on what I saw in college I'd take Coyle.
Until the point that Coyle left college the production was very close between the 2 again, Sheahan had a bad slump toward the end of the season. Do you think from what you saw in college that Sheahan could've put up the numbers Coyle did at St Johns?

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01-27-2013, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newfy View Post
Whats the difference betweent hese 2 that makes some list Coyle as a very highly rated prospect and Sheahan doesnt get any at all? I'll start by saying I think both are most likely third liners in the NHL. In the NCAA their production was pretty similar, this year in the AHL its pretty much the exact same and Sheahan is better defensively. Sheahan was drafted higher in the same draft as well. Coyle produced big time on the most stacked offensively team in the CHL but I think most junior guys that size that were fist rounders would score at that rate with those guys

I'm not saying Sheahan is better, just that theyre comparable but I'm wondering what the difference is between the 2 that makes one get so much attention? What am I missing?
How so?

I don't know much about Sheahan, but I always here that Coyle's game is very "translatable" to the NHL, so maybe Sheahan's isn't?

Not sure, haven't seen too many Riley Sheahan games.

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01-27-2013, 04:04 PM
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One department where I think it's indisputable that ND had a negative impact on Sheahan is goalscoring. Sheahan played the point on the PP at ND and was often used high in the slot, almost like a third defenseman. It shows in his goal totals; in three years at ND, Sheahan had 20 goals. Total.

In GR, Sheahan has 7 goals in his last 14 games. Sheahan will most likely finish this season with more goals than he ever scored in college. To me, that seems to show that Sheahan could have scored more goals in college if he was played in the right role for it.


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01-27-2013, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
How so?

I don't know much about Sheahan, but I always here that Coyle's game is very "translatable" to the NHL, so maybe Sheahan's isn't?

Not sure, haven't seen too many Riley Sheahan games.
I dont know how translatable Sheahans game will be to the NHL offfensively, we'll se because as a pro hes doing a lot more offensively then he ever did in college. But his defensive game is a borderline elite level for a prospect (not that he'll be elite at it in the NHL, but for a prospect its really good). He was a finalist for CCHA defensive forward of the year which he lost to Luke Glendening. Glendening is on his team now and Sheahan is better defensively, he was also called the msot mature defensive forward in his draft by scouts.

His offensive output is extremely questionable I dont know what to expect but his defensive game makes him a safe bet to be a solid third line shut down type. Hes really good on faceoffs, very strong (finished high in the combine) and it shows in his board work. As a 17 year old true freshmen he was the shut down guy on a top team in the country

I hope he can add the offense but I have a bad feeling it will never come around like it should

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01-27-2013, 06:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newfy View Post
Until the point that Coyle left college the production was very close between the 2 again, Sheahan had a bad slump toward the end of the season. Do you think from what you saw in college that Sheahan could've put up the numbers Coyle did at St Johns?
Probably close to it. I don't think Sheahan is quite as skilled as Coyle but they aren't really too far off from what I saw.

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01-27-2013, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newfy View Post
Whats the difference betweent hese 2 that makes some list Coyle as a very highly rated prospect and Sheahan doesnt get any at all? I'll start by saying I think both are most likely third liners in the NHL. In the NCAA their production was pretty similar, this year in the AHL its pretty much the exact same and Sheahan is better defensively. Sheahan was drafted higher in the same draft as well. Coyle produced big time on the most stacked offensively team in the CHL but I think most junior guys that size that were fist rounders would score at that rate with those guys

I'm not saying Sheahan is better, just that theyre comparable but I'm wondering what the difference is between the 2 that makes one get so much attention? What am I missing?
Not for nothing but the numbers will put it all into perspective. IMO, Coyle is the real deal. Sure he was with a "stacked team" in the Q, but if you saw him play you would know the guy belongs at the next level.

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01-27-2013, 07:37 PM
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it's mostly because Coyle played in juniors for a while and got to put up some big numbers physically dominating some kids

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01-27-2013, 08:55 PM
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Most of the "kids" were same aged.

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01-27-2013, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
Most of the "kids" were same aged.
Coyle was one of the oldest players in the CHL, whereas when he was in the NCAA he was one of the youngest. It's a fairly obvious difference.

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01-27-2013, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Dr Jan Itor View Post
How so?

I don't know much about Sheahan, but I always here that Coyle's game is very "translatable" to the NHL, so maybe Sheahan's isn't?

Not sure, haven't seen too many Riley Sheahan games.
Sheahan is definitely better defensively. That's not really arguable imo. Both of their games are very translatable though

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01-27-2013, 10:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Coyle was one of the oldest players in the CHL, whereas when he was in the NCAA he was one of the youngest. It's a fairly obvious difference.
Riley was THE youngest player in college his freshman year

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01-27-2013, 10:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Coyle was one of the oldest players in the CHL, whereas when he was in the NCAA he was one of the youngest. It's a fairly obvious difference.
I'm not saying his time in the NCAA wasn't an advantage, but he wasn't some 20 year old playing against mostly 17 and 18 year olds. All of the teams had a lot of 19 and 20 year olds themselves.

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01-27-2013, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by the banks View Post
Riley was THE youngest player in college his freshman year
I don't believe I was discussion Sheahan at all in my post.

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01-28-2013, 12:05 AM
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Sheahan struggled offensively at Notre Dame, that really is the big difference in their value when we are being honest. That and Coyle had the chance to represent his country in the World Junior and help build his name there. I am pretty high on both guys.

Since arriving in the AHL, Sheahan plays a more vital role as a center. He is defensively about as elite as it gets for prospects. Chances are if Canada brings him to Buffalo for the WJC instead of making him the last cut, they have a gold medal that year and his value is much larger.

He doesn't play the body as often as Coyle, but he is a boarderline elite skater for his size and uses that to stay in position. Sheahan has a heavy shot and fairly quick release. Coyle has a much more lethal shot especially in terms of accuarcy, but doesn't hide it as well something that will be interesting when he gets up another level where that split second release is that much more important.

Coyle is good defensively, but he isn't asked to play the high man role a whole lot although Houston plays a defense first philosophy which might impact his numbers also.

I don't think there is a huge difference, they will likely be asked to play different roles though. They are second third line tweeners, with a lot of size and good skating.

The other interesting thing with Sheahan is that this is going on about two months now. With different linemates and not just Nyquist and Tatar. He looks to be a very good special teams guy. Reminds me of Jarret Stoll.

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01-28-2013, 12:06 AM
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Sheahan's offense in the AHL is very impressive. He doesn't even play on the top line with Tatar and Nyquist. Sheahan is the offensive engine on his line with Ferraro. He's been playing lights out and he's pretty much been unstoppable. Not only is he doing really well with offense (2nd ine?), he is also doing good with faceoffs and plays a strong defensive game.

I've been saying it for awhile Sheahan wil be the better player between Coyle and Saad.

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01-28-2013, 12:08 AM
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One other note on Sheahan, is that is usually one of the first rumored names and then the Wings immediately sour on whatever deal in trade rumors. I think his value in NHL circles is higher than to average fans.

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01-28-2013, 11:32 AM
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The difference is Coyle hasn't been a drunk driving Teletubby recently. Sheahan has.


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01-28-2013, 11:57 AM
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Maybe cus there wasn't until lately Sheahan showed he's a capable offensive player, at least not in my mind. He hadn't put up numbers since junior B four years ago, while Coyle put up CHL and WJC numbers as late as last season. It's very hard to value numbers from different leagues against each other and then try to estimate upside on the next level.

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01-28-2013, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blink View Post
The difference is Coyle hasn't been a drunk driving Teletubby recently. Sheahan has.

The sad part about that is right after that incident is when he took off. I'm pretty sure he had a couple goals or a hatrick his first game back from that. A wake up call like that may be a blessing in disguise for him

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01-28-2013, 02:39 PM
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The difference is Coyle hasn't been a drunk driving Teletubby recently. Sheahan has.

Lol you beat me to it.

Coyle is more likely to reach his offensive upside imo.. Sheahan has the tools, we'll see. Played pretty well in A lately, hope he can keep this up.

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01-28-2013, 02:47 PM
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...may be a blessing in disguise for him
Haha, please tell me that was pun intended.

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01-28-2013, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blink View Post
The difference is Coyle hasn't been a drunk driving Teletubby recently. Sheahan has.

Seems to have been a wake up call for Sheahan.

On the flip side, have we ever figured out why Coyle left BU?

The rumors swirled around that for a while and it wasn't just his choice if I remember right. Ran with the crowd of guys that kept getting in trouble was a team wide problem, Nicastro won't talk about it to the media in GR either.

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01-28-2013, 03:05 PM
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Think it was the other night GR was losing 1-0 with a minute left, the coach made sure Sheahan was on the ice for the dying minutes. That speaks volumes on what they expect from the kid...

He's scoring goals like a machine lately.

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